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Pellissier
2011-05-19, 07:08
Welcome to the discussion thread for AnoHana, Episode 6.

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tsunade666
2011-05-19, 14:01
Cool episode. Enjoyed it a lot. Ginta back to school and Anaru story.

Ginta your cool man but adding unnecessary lines is just digging up your own grave :heh: :heh: specially the one who will throw you in the grave is sitting behind you :heh:

EDIT:

Menma crying again. It didn't give much impression than before but it sad. Her state and her mom's state. But the bigger impact will probably Ginta's nosebleed :D

the last line wasn't needed unless you want flying can to hit you

Yukiatsu despite the hate for Ginta also knew him better than the others. Maybe those 2 are just the same in a way.

shibakun
2011-05-19, 14:39
Overall, a decent episode. Pace is finally picking up on Jinta's side as he slowly breaks out of his comfort zone and starts going back to school.

Fun & casual moments between Anaru and Jinta. Regarding Menma, she cries yet again [almost every? episode now;'(] while conversing with Jinta. I'm given the impression that Menma consistently affects reality as far as Jinta is concerned, so at least they have been pretty consistent on that matter although it doesn't really explain how a 'ghost/ethereal' being is affecting things physically.

.x.crii.x.
2011-05-19, 14:54
I was so on the verge of tears when everyone was talking badly of Naruko. ;O; But thankfully Jintan stood up for her. Good Job, Jintan! <3

And omg, ending scene. xDD

JintanxAnaru FTW <3

At the end, did Jintan say:

No doubt about it, she's still a virgin.

Before getting hit by the can? xDD I want subs so bad right now. DDX

shibakun
2011-05-19, 15:14
At the end, did Jintan say:

No doubt about it, she's still a virgin.

X

^Lol yes, you are correct. "Without a doubt, she is definitely a virgin."

pagan poor
2011-05-19, 15:18
Looks like Jinta's GAR is a bit rusty.

I liked how the tire got thrown out there in the end.

edit: Dunno if I should add or dock points to Naruko for handling Poppo's porn mags and used tissues. Eww.

tsunade666
2011-05-19, 15:19
At the end, did Jintan say:

No doubt about it, she's still a virgin.

Before getting hit by the can? xDD I want subs so bad right now. DDX

Correct :heh: but really nosebleed mode be it ghost or 3D.

konart
2011-05-19, 15:19
Lol, ^ the last scene made my evening.

Ecchi, Skecchi! Wantacchi!

.x.crii.x.
2011-05-19, 15:26
Lol, but the first nose bleed, didn't he get it because he was beside himself with anger/emotions? xDD Though I'll admit that he did blush later on when Menma was on top of him. :P

But still, Anaru FTW. <3 I really hope they end up together by the end of the series. Or at least some hint that there will be something between the two of them in the future. ....or I shall be sad, very sad indeed. u.u

AmyElizzabeth
2011-05-19, 21:33
When everyone was whispering about Anaru (or Anjou, I dunno what the hell I should call her anymore) I just wanted to turn into pixels and punch everyone out.
Good that Jinta actually did something about it.

serenade_beta
2011-05-20, 00:04
A bit less heavy then usual. Not a bad thing, and it was interesting anyways, so great.
Jintan goes "protagonist" for once, which is okay too.

Glad that the it wasn't actually Anal being bullied and her just writing stuff about others. Also, her friends might not be as bad as they were shown to be...?

Yukiatsu... :heh: Crap, seeing him just makes me laugh. Great guy.

OceanBlue
2011-05-20, 00:25
Also, her friends might not be as bad as they were shown to be...?That's honestly what I thought too. They seem concerned about her well-being, so I'm starting to wonder if they are really going to be the one-dimensional, plot-only characters that I thought they would be.

Interesting episode. We're keeping a lighter mood, which isn't a bad thing at all. Major props for Jintan this episode. Not only did he manage to do nice things in his awkward way, A-1 really did a good job making him feel awkward. There was a good amount of stuttering in his speech and such both in the classroom and when he was yelling at Menma. It just added to everything.

It was a straightforward, plot-centric episode. We get a little more Tsuruko development, plot progression with Anaru, and some development for Menma. I enjoyed it.

Malkuth
2011-05-20, 00:48
Jintan showed also quite a fetish there with Menma crying while he was yelling at her. Still though, despite being portrayed very sympathetically, I can not help but dislike him. He just manages constantly to screw up, despite having the good intentions, and for some mysterious reason none is pissed at him.

Anyway, Anaru was very cute again, unfortunately again in a childish way, but damn that girl has some serious issues, leaving last episode aside, in this one she decides not to go home, changes her mind after encountering Menma's mom, but ends up in the secret base... in between practically kicking out Poppo... just make up your mind woman... oh! wrong! zettai shojo :heh:

In between, why are some here surprised by Anaru's friends worrying about her :confused:

pagan poor
2011-05-20, 00:59
Guess from the conversation on the train back between Yukiatsu and Tsuruko, it looks like back then Menma was trying to get Yadomi back in the clubroom so she could tell them together why she called them in the first place. It looks like she was going to tell them her wish.

OceanBlue
2011-05-20, 01:01
In between, why are some here surprised by Anaru's friends worrying about her :confused:
I completely expected them to be one-dimensional characters whose sole purpose would be to advance the plot by being jerks later on, to be honest. Characters like that wouldn't need to be shown in a positive manner, so now I'm wondering if that's truly the case.

Pocari_Sweat
2011-05-20, 01:10
Anyone notice that Seikimatsu Occult Gakuin was playing on Jintan's TV at the start? That was ... kinda random. Well I guess it's not completely random since both animes are Aniplex/A-1.

Malkuth
2011-05-20, 01:16
I completely expected them to be one-dimensional characters whose sole purpose would be to advance the plot by being jerks later on, to be honest. Characters like that wouldn't need to be shown in a positive manner, so now I'm wondering if that's truly the case.

Which makes the script even better, paying attention to background character. In any case, whether they are good or bad (which is debatable), it's natural to be concerned about her getting for into trouble.

Dist
2011-05-20, 01:41
Jintan's speech was so awkward that I had to stop it there for a moment cause I couldn't just keep listening to him .. lol.

A decent episode in overall though.

EroKing
2011-05-20, 01:50
Yukiatsu... :heh: Crap, seeing him just makes me laugh. Great guy.

lol but he didn't really do anything this week.

Jintan's speech was so awkward that I had to stop it there for a moment cause I couldn't just keep listening to him .. lol.


Well that is what happens when you don't talk to other people for a long time. I know from experience >_>

SoFarGone
2011-05-20, 02:04
Good episode especially for Jintan. He defended Anjou and yelled at Menma. Earned points for me today.

Narzia
2011-05-20, 02:07
I have to say that nosebleed there worries me, especially since it's that kind of show. I hope it's not some KyoAni AIDS or god knows what kind of tumor.

A good episode otherwise, and more Naruko/Jintan is always welcome.

SoFarGone
2011-05-20, 02:19
http://blog.draggle.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/ano_hana_06_3.png

Master Chibi
2011-05-20, 02:22
Shit, Anaru threw a damn tire at him. That's crazy.

Sebasu
2011-05-20, 02:26
Aw, I was hoping for Tsuruko or maybe Poppo to get some flashback/show their involvement on "that day", but it's still an enjoyable episode nonetheless. I still liked it, it's like a "breather" after all the Yukiatsu dorama. xD

Speaking of Yukiatsu... oh lord. For some reason I just enjoy watching him and Tsuruko together. I loved that smirk he made after irritating her. I also loved Tsuruko saying she should spread cross-dressing photos of him. It's nice to see Tsuruko smiling in this episode too. This show definitely needs more of them.

Anaru is so adorable in this episode! I think I'm slightly rooting for her and Jintan now. At first I thought they both had no chemistry but this episode proved me wrong. The school parts were so awkward but cute. On Anaru's friends, the tanned girl irritated me first when she was all smug saying to Anaru she screwed up, but it's nice to see them looking more humane afterwards. I was quite worried before on the spoiler thread that they would bully Anaru-chan.

And of course, an episode won't be complete without Menma crying. lol @ Jintan's random nosebleed though (unless that's gonna be a disease and he'll die~) and then catching Anaru on Poppo's shack. I also laughed how Anaru just picked up Poppo's used tissues like that. She's so clueless. :heh:

Yeah, still a nice episode. Looking forward to whatever the revelation is on Menma's diary next episode.

Malkuth
2011-05-20, 02:37
http://blog.draggle.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/ano_hana_06_3.png

^ gg-subs?

Kaoru Chujo
2011-05-20, 02:41
Excellent episode again. Jintan's first steps.

We are left wondering if his nosebleeds are tension for both, turn-on for both, or one of each.

Since Menma is dead, Anaru is his only possible partner, if he ends up with one.

My first thought hearing Anaru's "friends" was that they were writing her off, not really sympathizing. Time will tell.

OceanBlue
2011-05-20, 02:57
Which makes the script even better, paying attention to background character. In any case, whether they are good or bad (which is debatable), it's natural to be concerned about her getting for into trouble.
Maybe. I personally don't believe unneeded character development for extraneous/filler characters is a good thing. Certain characters in most stories exist to fill a function and then promptly disappear. Developing these characters contrary to their function in the plot seems counter-productive, since it just leaves the characters feeling unfinished or awkward.

In this case, it's not important whether or not it's natural, but how it serves their development. If these girls were to do what I thought they were going to do [bully Anaru so Jintan and friends can stand up for her], then them worrying over Anaru will either have been needless characterization or will need further development, since you don't go from being worried about a friend to discarding and bulling her.

That being said, I think I'm wrong. These girls are probably going to be actual side characters instead of just plot devices, so them being good or bad comes into question.

Edit:
^ gg-subs?
Yep.

winhlp32
2011-05-20, 03:01
Looks like Jintan unexplainable disease flag +1. Possibly the same one that killed his mom.

Otherwise good episode as always.

Malkuth
2011-05-20, 03:12
Maybe. I personally don't believe unneeded character development for extraneous/filler characters is a good thing. Certain characters in most stories exist to fill a function and then promptly disappear. Developing these characters contrary to their function in the plot seems counter-productive, since it just leaves the characters feeling unfinished or awkward.

In this case, it's not important whether or not it's natural, but how it serves their development. If these girls were to do what I thought they were going to do [bully Anaru so Jintan and friends can stand up for her], then them worrying over Anaru will either have been needless characterization or will need further development, since you don't go from being worried about a friend to discarding and bulling her.

That being said, I think I'm wrong. These girls are probably going to be actual side characters instead of just plot devices, so them being good or bad comes into question.

I kind of disagree, side/background characters, that are featured by showing emotions, given extra lines, in general, exist and are minimally developed after fulfilling their plot-related functions make a show more realistic, which generally speaking, I consider a good thing. Now I agree that sometimes writers get carried away, but only then this approach becomes counter-productive. And with only 11 episodes to tell the story, the danger here is quite present, we still know almost nothing about Tsuruko and Poppo, while Menma's mother, Tsuroko's friends, and Jintan's father probably have played a greater role in this first half of the show.

Edit:

Yep.

I like them when they are trolling with Aria, Geass, etc. but here, as well as with Merry last season it's just out of place.


Looks like Jintan unexplainable disease flag +1. Possibly the same one that killed his mom.

Otherwise good episode as always.

So he has a brain tumour that first generates delusions of his dead friend, then makes him say gibberish to defend Anaru, then makes his nose bleed, and finally kills him so he can be happily reunited with his childhood love... somehow I don't think/hope that will happen :p

VentAileron
2011-05-20, 03:16
I really don't think the nosebleed has any significance to the plot. It was only there the first time to prevent Jintan from apologizing to Menma and the second time was just for the lulz.

I think this episode is the only one with a very light-hearted ending.

Did anyone get the post-credits screen?

Kanon
2011-05-20, 04:15
The return of ecchi, sketchy, one touchy! Oh, how I love that line.

Best scene in the episode for me was by far Jinta standing up for Anal (that sounds very wrong, doesn't it? Blame Menma for giving her that nickname :p). His speech was confusing and incredibly awkward, yet still awesome. Him having such a hard time expressing himself in public is a nice touch.

Yukiatsu makes me laugh everytime he's on screen. He's still as smug as he used ot be despite everything that happened. He's clearly more likable than before though.

We finally got a hint about Menma's wish. Seems like she had something important to say to the gang the day she died. I have no idea what it could be...

Looks like Jintan unexplainable disease flag +1. Possibly the same one that killed his mom.

Calling it now. The reason he's the only one who can see Menma is that he's close to death. Or maybe it was just a simple nosebleed. Ohana had some too. I guess Mari Okada loves them, huh?

darkmanure
2011-05-20, 04:19
Very light hearted episode. I really wanted Jinta to talk to Menma's mother, but that would just cause her more grief. Maybe near the end or something to put her at ease.

Haak
2011-05-20, 04:39
Yukiatsu makes me laugh everytime he's on screen. He's still as smug as he used ot be despite everything that happened.

He could probably come to school crossdressing and still have a sumg look on his face.

And that ending was just pure awesome. "Ecchi, sketchy, one touchy!" XD

Saturn Beaver
2011-05-20, 05:00
Ouch, that was just painful to watch, I'm really really bad at seeing awkward moments like that. Really, Jintan, if there's one thing you can learn from Yukiatsu, it's proper white knighting.

Looks like the Scooby Doo gang (speaking of which, Jintan is also watching Occult Academy) finds a clue this time, Menma's diary. At the same time, Shaggy and Velma (Yukiatsu resembled Fred better though) remembered that Menma had something to say on that fateful day, so hopefully next episode they can meet up and try to solve this mystery. There's also melancholic moment between Menma and her mom, and Menma thinking of the afterlife...

But the best part is, without a doubt, Ecchi Sketchy One-touchy. I think this is the first time after 6 episodes that when I watched the ending, I don't feel sad or melancholic, because this time I just laughed out loud throughout the song. Just hilarious, and when Jintan said "she's no doubt a virgin" and got hit by a can, I completely lost it.

Solace
2011-05-20, 07:16
I really love all the small lines that build these characters. Yukiatsu is harassed about his cross dressing again. Poppo commenting about being the loner. You get a better sense of Menma's family in this episode as well. The differences in mourning, Menma's worry over her mother. It's interesting to note that even though they packed up Menma's belongings, the room is still unused.

So we get a few more hints about Menma's wish, confirmation that Anaru is a virgin (there's a disturbance in the force, as if millions of otaku suddenly squealed in joy), and Jinta has nosebleeds of questionable significance. So far I'm really enjoying the pacing for this series, it's laid back but eventful. It doesn't seem like things are progressing much, but things are already quite different from where we first started.

I'm starting to wonder though, if the reason Menma's "ghost" nature isn't being called into question is because we're going to get some kind of Sixth Sense style twist. It would be awfully cliche to get some kind of tearful goodbye scene as Menma disappears because gosh darn, mystery solved.

Pocari_Sweat
2011-05-20, 07:21
I'm starting to wonder though, if the reason Menma's "ghost" nature isn't being called into question is because we're going to get some kind of Sixth Sense style twist. It would be awfully cliche to get some kind of tearful goodbye scene as Menma disappears because gosh darn, mystery solved.

Although it would be cliche for Menma to disappear after her wish has been granted, this would be far better ending than say, Menma coming back to life or something ridiculous. I also doubt the Sixth Sense style twist in a series like this where it seems to be relatively laidback, tame but dramatic, but with limited supernatural elements (bar Menma's ghost status)

Proto
2011-05-20, 08:23
I'm starting to wonder though, if the reason Menma's "ghost" nature isn't being called into question is because we're going to get some kind of Sixth Sense style twist. It would be awfully cliche to get some kind of tearful goodbye scene as Menma disappears because gosh darn, mystery solved

For a moment I thought you were going to say that everyone else was dead, only Menma is alive. Now that would be a twist. :heh:

Riou17
2011-05-20, 08:28
This episode is a nice change since the previous ones are quite dramatic. I love the scene where Jintan defends(? no extra dialog needed, Jintan) Anaru. I also favor this scene more than when Menma said that she doesn't want her mother to suffer more.

The ending scene was hilarious XD and Anaru's more concerned about Jintan thinking perverted things than picking up Poppo's magazines and used tissues. Also, it's official. I'm a JintanXAnaru shipper!

I'm still thinking on what part Tsuruko has to do with Menma's case. Most of the characters are linked with Menma other than being her friend or part of the Super Peace Busters, but they still haven't shown hers.

Next episode is the reading of Menma's diary. What secrets does Menma holds? Will it be a vital clue to her wish? Will Menma cry again? We'll find out on the next episode of Ano Hi Mita Hana no Namae o Bokutachi wa Mada Shiranai.

Ascaloth
2011-05-20, 08:57
I dunno if I'm late to the party, in fact I probably am, but Jintan's "virgin" line about Anaru was extra hilarious to me.

I mean, think about it. Tomatsu Haruka.

:D

shibakun
2011-05-20, 09:12
Will Menma cry again?

^without a doubt, an episode is not complete without her crying lol. :frustrated:

HayashiTakara
2011-05-20, 09:28
Great Episode! I want MOAR!!!!! *cries* :heh:

You know, I wouldn't be surprise that it's just funny drawings in the diary, basically a picture diary :heh:

Soconfused
2011-05-20, 09:37
I thought it was a weird place for the episode to end, but good none the less. And yeah, not gonna lie, I fast forwarded through Jintan's class speech, was just too awkward for me to handle. And I feel so sorry for Menma's mom, she seems so lonely. :(

And yeah, the random Occult Academy clip in the beginning was pretty cool.

Fawx9
2011-05-20, 10:01
Theory time
So, while I'm still convinced she's a ghost, it seems like the only reason he can see her is that because he has a tuma. Her wish may be getting to say goodbye to everyone, even if it's only through him, since she never got a chance to.

BladeEntity
2011-05-20, 10:40
Disease flag just went up for Jintan or it could be the heat he eats too much junk food and lives a pretty much unhealthy life. Anyway great episode excellent lines:

"Definitely a Virgin"

Quoto of the day.

kitten320
2011-05-20, 11:00
So many disscusions about nosebleed... like if you have never had one out of nowhere? I think it is quiet normal. Now if he will keep having them, then it will be a problem.

finally Jintan got some guts and stood up for poor Anaru and looks like her friends do care after all.

Tsuruko's and Yukiatsu's interections are always fun. Looks like being caught crossdresing had its positives effects, he is not annoying anymore.

Solace
2011-05-20, 11:25
Although it would be cliche for Menma to disappear after her wish has been granted, this would be far better ending than say, Menma coming back to life or something ridiculous. I also doubt the Sixth Sense style twist in a series like this where it seems to be relatively laidback, tame but dramatic, but with limited supernatural elements (bar Menma's ghost status)

I didn't mean exactly like the Sixth Sense, but just that I feel that there's a possibility that there's more to Menma's odd manifestation than meets the eye. I mean, it's a little strange that for someone who is supposed to be dead, she acts so alive. Her appearance continues to bother me too. Why appear as a more grown up version of herself? If the show was really trying to push her as a moe character, you'd think keeping her as a small child would be better. Let's face it, she's not exactly in a fair competition with Anaru as far as sex appeal goes. :D

For a moment I thought you were going to say that everyone else was dead, only Menma is alive. Now that would be a twist. :heh:

My mind went there too, but wow how would they pull something like that off convincingly? :heh:

So many disscusions about nosebleed... like if you have never had one out of nowhere? I think it is quiet normal. Now if he will keep having them, then it will be a problem.

I get them sometimes in drier times of the year (like Winter), and yeah...it sucks. But I think people are discussing it mostly due to the trope in anime, and the fact that this is mostly a drama. So he's either following the trope, the nosebleeds are simply random, or we're getting a hint that something is wrong with him. I agree with you, if they show him with more nosebleeds, the third option is the likely one. Otherwise it's just him being horny imo.

demonkevy666
2011-05-20, 11:33
So many disscusions about nosebleed... like if you have never had one out of nowhere? I think it is quiet normal. Now if he will keep having them, then it will be a problem.

finally Jintan got some guts and stood up for poor Anaru and looks like her friends do care after all.

Tsuruko's and Yukiatsu's interections are always fun. Looks like being caught crossdresing had its positives effects, he is not annoying anymore.

I think it's just anxiety from hearing all those people talk about him and anaru.

I'm disagreeing with the disease part. :eyebrow:

1 she can an effect on other people when she jumped on them
2 she can move things (more like a poltegist:uhoh:)
3 she's eaten food.
4 she evn made muffin bread can't be all in mind.

Honstly this was epsode dragged on after school,

User68604
2011-05-20, 11:50
:D best line "shes definitely not a virgin" SLAM with can to the face

:D

Shadow5YA
2011-05-20, 12:03
I don't think Anaru's "friends" were actually worried about her. Their first response when she got in trouble was that she messed up. They were the ones that put her into that situation, so I think they were more concerned that Anaru would receive punishment from the school rather than all the rumors flying around.
It was only after Anaru pulled Jinta out of the classroom that they looked truly worried.

ID555
2011-05-20, 12:13
Wow, didn't expect Jinta to save Anaru.

Hope he takes her home next ep, that's no place to leave a girl.

'Ecchi, sukecchi, one touchi'... :heh: Where have I heard that before? *scratches head*

Otani-kun
2011-05-20, 12:33
What's up with people skipping the 'oh so awkward' speech because it was too awkward to handle?

I loved it, was good to see Jintan taking a stand and defending a friend for once.

Pellissier
2011-05-20, 12:33
'Ecchi, sukecchi, one touchi'... :heh: Where have I heard that before? *scratches head*
For example, "Kore wa Zombie desu ka?". :)

1 time version

kDdCYo4eXZY

7 minutes version :heh:

YnQF5mBWL00

Riou17
2011-05-20, 12:34
^ I heard that line before from Kore wa Zombie Desu ka.

I don't think Jintan has a disease. It's might be stress from the events that had happened that day. He finally attended class after a long time, defended Anaru by speaking out loud (he even stutters), went to Menma's house which he is uncomfortable with, and then before the day ends, Menma started crying again. But if the nosebleeds occur more frequently, then he really might have a disease.

ID555
2011-05-20, 12:46
^^Yeah, looks like it. Those clips... :heh:

Haak
2011-05-20, 12:52
Oh God, not KeyAIDS. Anything but that...

DragoZERO
2011-05-20, 13:09
Awesome episode. Everyone emotion is hit at some point in the episode, yet agian.

The animation is waning a little since we are half way in, I hope it gets better.

As for the story... I will never get over how in Japan what you do out of school impacts you in school. I know why they do it but... it's just so stupid and unfair.

But kudos to Jinta there. I don't think he should have even commented on Anaru though. He should have made a big enough disturbance to override her gossip.

Excellent episode again. Jintan's first steps.

We are left wondering if his nosebleeds are tension for both, turn-on for both, or one of each.I want to go with one of each. But Anaru wasn't really wearing anything that revealing.

Since Menma is dead, Anaru is his only possible partner, if he ends up with one.I hope they pair up in the end, or there is some hint to it. Aside from it being sweet for Anaru, Jinta needs a good girl to help him out of this rough patch here.

The return of ecchi, sketchy, one touchy! Oh, how I love that line.:heh: Yes, it's a great line, isn't it.

Best scene in the episode for me was by far Jinta standing up for Anal (that sounds very wrong, doesn't it? Blame Menma for giving her that nickname :p). His speech was confusing and incredibly awkward, yet still awesome. Him having such a hard time expressing himself in public is a nice touch. Yes, seeing him struggle to do what he knew he had to was a nice tough. And when did Menma nickname her "Anal"?

Calling it now. The reason he's the only one who can see Menma is that he's close to death. Or maybe it was just a simple nosebleed. Ohana had some too. I guess Mari Okada loves them, huh?Yeah... brain tumor... that would be so bad, lol.

I really love all the small lines that build these characters. Yukiatsu is harassed about his cross dressing again. Poppo commenting about being the loner. You get a better sense of Menma's family in this episode as well. The differences in mourning, Menma's worry over her mother. It's interesting to note that even though they packed up Menma's belongings, the room is still unused.

So we get a few more hints about Menma's wish, confirmation that Anaru is a virgin (there's a disturbance in the force, as if millions of otaku suddenly squealed in joy), and Jinta has nosebleeds of questionable significance. So far I'm really enjoying the pacing for this series, it's laid back but eventful. It doesn't seem like things are progressing much, but things are already quite different from where we first started.

I'm starting to wonder though, if the reason Menma's "ghost" nature isn't being called into question is because we're going to get some kind of Sixth Sense style twist. It would be awfully cliche to get some kind of tearful goodbye scene as Menma disappears because gosh darn, mystery solved.

For a moment I thought you were going to say that everyone else was dead, only Menma is alive. Now that would be a twist. :heh:At the end Menma is going to wake up in the hospital with a sprained ankle and have her friends all around her. :heh:

And yeah, the random Occult Academy clip in the beginning was pretty cool.I almost forgot to mention that! I love when they do things like that. Man that was a great series.

serenade_beta
2011-05-20, 13:17
Anyone notice that Seikimatsu Occult Gakuin was playing on Jintan's TV at the start? That was ... kinda random. Well I guess it's not completely random since both animes are Aniplex/A-1.

Yeah, that was unexpected.
Anime :heh: no :heh: Chikara :heh:

lol but he didn't really do anything this week.

Yukiatsu is just that amazing!
(He did go "There is a weird guy around..." to the two girls though... Which would be him, yes, and also, Tsuruko telling him that he could scare them all off with his crossdressing :heh: )

ars89
2011-05-20, 13:20
Felt bad for Anaru during class. Good thing Jintan stepped up even though it was so awkward.

Lol that girl called out Tsuroku, but she was just like whatever. Seems like her and Yukiatsu figured out that Menma called them together that day and what ever she wanted to tell them that day is probably her wish.

Felt sad when they were visiting Menma's house. Really felt bad for the mother.

Menma did have a point with not wanting them to go to her house, but i agree with Jintan's speech even though he shouldn't have yelled at her. What was with that nosebleed though.

Ending was the best with Jintan's line.

Silverwyrm
2011-05-20, 13:42
Honestly...the only thing I didnt like was menma crying again, that scene I felt could have been done without waterfalls from her face

DragoZERO
2011-05-20, 14:38
Lol that girl called out Tsuroku, but she was just like whatever.I was waiting for Tsuroku to call the girl a coward for not giving him the letter herself. :heh:

Flower
2011-05-20, 14:39
Such an excellent series. :)

I also really liked Jintan protecting Anaru like that.

Regarding Anaru's friends actually caring for her, I must admit that I thought they might show it - I've seen things like that often happen, and the show has been making efforts (successful ones imo) to really portray RL emotional struggles, realities and the like.

I've always smiled a little to myself that they've used a "fictional element" like a ghost as the driving force to make the story and the portrayal of these RL elements manifest themselves. When I saw the first episode I was actually a little reminded of Dickens' "A Christmas Carol" (in the sense of a ghost driving the story, I mean). :)

Anyway, very good ep. I gave it 8/10.

Archon_Wing
2011-05-20, 15:19
That was a fine screw around episode. He finally goes to school and makes a fool of himself, but it's worth it. :heh:

At least Naruko had fun with it too. I'd expect her to flip out and slap him for the ridiculous things he said. So it's going along well. Fun makes time pass really quick.

And yea, people just can't forget about Menma. I think the last half is really going to have our cast confront it once and for all. But Jintan just runs away to the "angst bridge", probably the same one from Shakugan no Shana.

Also, lol @ random tire. So what is she doing at night? And more of Tsuriko. 8/10

At the very end: Kyubey is that you?

guuchan
2011-05-20, 15:23
http://blog.draggle.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/ano_hana_06_3.png

Not really.

I surely hope no one believed in that. If it's a purposeful troll attempt, I have to say, it's a pretty tasteless one.

Did anyone get the post-credits screen?


Did some research, don't think anyone got it. I'm tempted to say the line should be taken literally, even though I seriously doubt about it.

I dunno if I'm late to the party, in fact I probably am, but Jintan's "virgin" line about Anaru was extra hilarious to me.

I mean, think about it. Tomatsu Haruka.

:D

Heh, what are you implying? :D

Honestly...the only thing I didnt like was menma crying again, that scene I felt could have been done without waterfalls from her face

As much as people complain about Menma crying too much, I think the crying in this episode is justified. Kind of, at least. And it didn't make me feel out of place or anything so it's all good to me.

At the very end: Kyubey is that you?

Lol, you're thinking too much. That does resemble Hamutaro alright, even though I'm more thinking about Pikachu (from someone who never watched Pokemon :heh:).

Flower
2011-05-20, 15:26
One of the things I have found the most interesting about the series is the fact that Menma herself cannot remember what it is she wants the others to do. The title of the series gives a teasing possible hint at this (no guarantees that the title is related to Menma's wish, though).

This recent episode has the newly revealed fact that Menma called everyone together the day before she died for advice on something and has some of her friends getting a hold of her diary from when she was alive.

Again - it is very possible that these events will show the very thing Menma is hoping the others would fulfill for her, but again (curiously) no guarantees.

For all we know none of these things could be the key for Menma to be at peace - they could be the catalyst for an unexpected event that allows her to finally be at rest, though....

Guardian Enzo
2011-05-20, 15:55
Moving on (http://lostinamerica-deeg.blogspot.com/search/label/AnoHana):

Anyone who ever school time and felt a panic attack at having to return knows just how hard that was for Jintan. His awkwardness is more than understandable.

I definitely see the question of "moving on" as a growing and vital theme of this series. Menma's parents are at the extremes of the scale, but the Busters are all dealing with it in their own way. This is a difficult subject for anyone, and a central tenet of Buddhist enlightenment is not surrendering to attachments - be they to lost loved on, material things, etc. But is what Menma's father has done - packing her memories safely away in a box and sealing them tight - any better than what her mother has done? This is central to Jintan's dilemma - not just that the fact that he can see his dead sweetheart, but that he's glad he can see her. And to him, his intellect is saying both of those are wrong.

CWW
2011-05-20, 16:01
The classroom scene was definitely a d'awww moment for me and I normally can't stand awkward scenes, but as you may have been aware, I'm a little biased towards Jinta. :P

So I was partially right about the motto of the story is related to not forgetting your loved ones (be they dead or alive) and the memories you shared together. Menma's father is pretty heartless in that regard. I'm beginning to wonder if Menma's his legitimate daughter as they are nothing alike. I feel pretty bad about Menma's mother.

Oh, and finally, it looks like Anjou's crush is of the unrequited kind as I was almost positive Jinta was about to proclaim his true feelings before the nosebleed. :sadface: Jinta's also taking it pretty hard about Menma showing up.

Blaat
2011-05-20, 16:11
An excellent episode (although anal, I mean Anaru, needs to stop being a damsel in distress) , and seeing Occult Academy again was a nice added bonus.

FlareKnight
2011-05-20, 17:26
Thank you Jintan for the best line of the episode. "There's no doubt. She's definitely a virgin." Then getting smoked by the can :D.

But really good job by Jintan in stepping up for Anaru. Considering he wasn't even able to get himself to go to school before, standing up and making that fuss took a lot of guts. Could feel how difficult this was for him, but he kept on going anyways. Couldn't let Anaru just sit there suffering without at least trying to do something. Though geeze every time he tries to go to school something like this happens :heh:.

In terms of her friends I'm not sure what they felt at the end there. But it's clear and hopefully is becoming clear to them that they don't understand Anaru at all. Saying something like she screwed up without realizing at all that she would never just go to a love hotel or sleep around. If they aren't going to be dumped as friends during this series something will need to happen.

Going to Menma's house was tough on them, but clearly getting that diary will be important. Along with the realization of Yukiatsu and Tsuruko they have some clues. There was something important Menma wanted to talk about and maybe if they can resolve that it will be enough to help her. Though not sure what it could have been about. Can understand Jintan getting upset at the end there. Lying to herself about wanting to be forgotten by her mother though also hurting because she can see how in pain her mother is. She's lost in terms of how to move on or what her wish is supposed to be. Jintan being so frustrated could also be as simple as Menma is talking about her mother like that and yet here she is in front of Jintan making him deal with all these emotions.

cyth
2011-05-20, 19:06
Here's a good kicker for those who argue AnoHana lacks realism: that flying can would probably have killed Jintan on the spot if the show was earnest about conforming to the rules of reality. Canned fruit is fucking heavy. :D

winhlp32
2011-05-20, 19:23
That ending scene was just okay.

It would've been much funnier if just as Jinta starts nose bleeding, 'Secret Base' begins to play in the background.

ThereminVox
2011-05-20, 21:29
I didn't take the nosebleed as anything more than a way to end the conversation, probably brought on by stress. It's possible Jintan has ClannAIDS, and this show could probably carry it off, but I'd still rather they not go there.

I was disappointed at how little we saw of the beta "couple". We're getting so deep into the season now that I suspect Tsuruko's story is going to be tied in fairly tightly with Menma's, or they'd probably be well into dealing with it by now. Right now she's a satellite character just waiting to hit center stage. I do like the way her real relationship with the others is always being teased, but never explicitly dealt with. They're definitely building to something with her.

The recollection that Menma called everyone to the secret base that day felt like the "ah-ha!" moment we've been waiting for. I think we finally have a solid lead on Menma's wish.

Again, Anaru's my favorite character, and since she's all over this episode she stole the show. We got to see a little mini-arc for her, as interacting with Menma's mother seemed to give her a minor epiphany regarding her own relationship with her mom. I wonder why she ends up back at the clubhouse? Maybe it didn't go so well after all? Jinta obviously has some mom issues as well, so perhaps we're seeing a theme developing.

I know I'm a bad person for being taken out of it whenever Menma starts to cry, but now that you guys have pointed out that it's her once-per-episode spot, I can't unsee it.

Triple_R
2011-05-20, 23:27
I know I'm a bad person for being taken out of it whenever Menma starts to cry, but now that you guys have pointed out that it's her once-per-episode spot, I can't unsee it.

That's not your fault. It's just a really questionable decision on Okada's part.

I don't know where she's getting this notion that having Menma cry every single episode is a good idea. Of course many viewers are going to notice that, and grow numb to it. Menma is fast approaching a level currently occupied by E8 Mikuru Asahina and Excel Saga's Pedro. :heh:

The handling of Menma has become the one real weak spot in an otherwise excellent anime, in my opinion. It in turn is making Menma the weakest character overall for me. The rest of the cast is wonderful, and with this episode I found myself being thankful to have fewer Menma scenes and more scenes focusing on other core cast members.

Anaru, Jinta, and Poppo have great chemistry together, and so does Anaru and Jinta by themselves. Anaru is really a fun character.

Also good to see some school scenes with Yukiatsu and Tsuruko. The school scenes in general brought some plot movement and a touch more lightheartedness to this anime.


As for Jinta's awkward speech, I didn't fast forward through it, but it did make me wince a bit. Still, his heart was clearly in the right place, and the net effect of it was probably beneficial. So good job by him overall.

Pocari_Sweat
2011-05-21, 00:00
I think Menma crying at least once per ep is becoming a meme now.

james0246
2011-05-21, 00:09
Besides being far better than Episode 5 (which was a real mess), Episode 6 really gets the series back on track as we focus almost exclusively on Jintan and his "trauma" (or whatever he calls his angst) and how it affects his interactions with the other characters. I appreciate his speech to his classmates, and I really liked his speech to Menma. In fact, every scene with Jintan was quite good. Sadly, this made the scenes without him a little awkward (for example, the cut to Tsuruko and Yukiatsu felt a little forced, and their school scene (while adequately mentioned as to be transitioned too), felt very uninteresting, though their conversation on the train ride home was partially interesting.) Still, the pacing felt off (too fast), and the brevity of certain scenes (Menma's mother...who I will address momentarily) really hampered the drama. But, it was still better than last week’s episode :).

Additionally, I really liked Menma's mother. Her role may be simplistic, but she, more than any other character, reflects the powerlessness and hopelessness of outliving a child. Jintan description of her depression wasn't even close the pain and suffering a parent must feel when they outlive their child. (Then again, I may be biased since one of my current favourite shows on American television is The Killing, a series about how the death of a young woman affects a variety of different people, including her parents.)

That being said, of particular interest was the ramifications of Anaru's harassment. I'm actually glad the writers choose to have her victimization (of which I hated) highlighted, specifically how 'society' judges the victim. True, this was another case where the writers seem to shove an entire series worth of discussions out the window just for one big character moment (similar to Yukiatsu's suddenly cured obsession with Menma, the consequences of the rumours surrounding Anaru will undoubtedly be ignored henceforth after one simple scene), but the writers manage to make this moment more natural, and the ramifications (i.e. the rumours will not play a part in the rest of the story) more acceptable.

Additionally, unlike other viewers, I have no problem with Menma's tears. As far as I'm concerned, the writers have more than justified her frustrations and fears (frustrations at being unable to change anything; fears at not knowing herself and not remembering what she has wished for), and her tears simply exemplify what any human (or ghost) would feel in her situation.

Silverwyrm
2011-05-21, 00:19
As much as people complain about Menma crying too much, I think the crying in this episode is justified. Kind of, at least. And it didn't make me feel out of place or anything so it's all good to me.



Hmm maybe, but...I just can't care anymore when she does =/ it had an effect before but since I am *expecting* it now I'm just like "Oh, again. Whatever."

With that said, I am certainly enjoying this show.

"If I showed them pictures of you crossdressing all my problems would go away" Haha, the cold truth.

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 00:42
Additionally, unlike other viewers, I have no problem with Menma's tears. As far as I'm concerned, the writers have more than justified her frustrations and fears (frustrations at being unable to change anything; fears at not knowing herself and not remembering what she has wished for), and her tears simply exemplify what any human (or ghost) would feel in her situation.

Her frustrations and fears may be justified, but that doesn't mean that her tears are.

If crying is the only coping mechanism a character has for dealing with frustrations and fears, that doesn't say much about that character, in my opinion.

Always keeping emotions bottled up isn't healthy, no, but Menma is displaying the opposite extreme. Neither extreme is good, in my opinion.


But what it says about Menma is actually secondary to the impact that her very frequent crying is having on many viewers.

In drama, it's important to know when to "pick your spots", so to speak. It's important to know when to go for something bold and loud, and when to go for something subtle and merely suggestive.

By having Menma crying every episode, the balance between the two is off. Subtlety is entirely lost (at least when it comes to Menma), and bold/loud scenes are overrepresented when it comes to her. The viewer grows accustomed to the bold/loud scenes, and they basically don't seem "special" anymore.

In my opinion, non-comedic scenes where a character cries profusely should be emotionally powerful, but that requires not overusing such scenes. Basically, many viewers are getting desensitized to Menma crying. I know that I am.

pagan poor
2011-05-21, 00:50
Additionally, unlike other viewers, I have no problem with Menma's tears. As far as I'm concerned, the writers have more than justified her frustrations and fears (frustrations at being unable to change anything; fears at not knowing herself and not remembering what she has wished for), and her tears simply exemplify what any human (or ghost) would feel in her situation.

Count me in as not having a problem with her tears as well. Even though she is older looking, her mindset is still that of the child she was when she died. Coupled with her not knowing much of why she is there, I wouldn't expect her to react like an adolescent much less an older person.

james0246
2011-05-21, 01:11
Her frustrations and fears may be justified, but that doesn't mean that her tears are.

If crying is the only coping mechanism a character has for dealing with frustrations and fears, that doesn't say much about that character, in my opinion.


Menma seems to be facing her problems fairly head on (her entire existence may be in doubt (hell, she’s even looking for her own ghost :)), but she is still pushing forward looking for answers, even if she is crying along the way), so I am unclear why you are simply explaining her tears as a coping mechanism (not to say they are not a coping mechanism, but since she is facing her problems, they are clearly not harmful, and since she always cries with friends, it's obviously a healthy way of relieving stress (as opposed to locking herself away and crying continuously)).

Additionally, and this is a point many have ignored, Menma seems to have a mental state equivalent to a 10 year old (or however old she as when she died). So, judging based on what you expect from a 16 year old character seems a bit disingenuous.

You may consider her crying to be annoying (why do you think babies do it? :p), but simply because they are annoying does not mean her tears are unjustified.

edit:
desensitized

Her crying has served a purpose every time, so I'm a little confused as to why the audience is becoming desensitized to the drama of her crying. Additionally, have you ever thought that maybe she is crying so much so that one day, when she decides to not cry, it actually means something? I can think of no better way to visually show the change of an emotionally fragile character like Menma from innocent youth to wise adult, than to not cry...If this is how her character evolves and changes, then her crying becomes not just justified, but prevalent to the plot...

Raiga
2011-05-21, 01:20
Jinta gets major man points for that. I mean damn, since when does the angsty hikikomori pull off a stunt like that on his first day back in school?

Don't have much to say. Loved this episode like the rest. Can't believe it's half over already.

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 01:29
Menma seems to be facing her problems fairly head on...

Actually, I find that debatable. Menma is getting so caught up in her emotions that she's frequently failing to apply calm critical thinking to how to overcome, or at least ameliorate, her current plight. Why didn't she think to check her own Diary for a clue as to what her wish might be, for example?

In Episode 5, when Poppo is desperately trying to see her, why doesn't she think of doing something to make him notice her? By this point, she knows that Poppo can feel her presence when she touches him, so it shouldn't be that hard for her to make her presence known to him (mind you, this is as much Jinta's error as Menma's).

These are things that even a 10 year old is generally smart enough to think of, and Menma has shown in other scenes a capacity for smart thinking.

So I do see where her emotionality is hindering her progress.


so I am unclear why you are simply explaining her tears as a coping mechanism

Crying in general is a coping mechanism (except when people are moved to tears of joy, which I don't think is the case for Menma).

In some cases, it's perfectly justified and possibly even helpful. But as a person's only coping mechanism, it is usually more hurtful than helpful, as it can get in the way of more practical solutions.



Additionally, and this is a point many have ignored, Menma seems to have a mental state equivalent to a 10 year old (or however old she as when she died). So, judging based on what you expect from a 16 year old character seems a bit disingenuous.

I'm not making any such judgment. Menma's frequent crying is excessive even for a 10 year old, in my opinion.



You may consider her crying to be annoying (why do you think babies do it? :p), but simply because they are annoying does not mean her tears are unjustified.

I find it annoying because I can tell that it's lowering the effectiveness of scenes like this for me. I don't like being desensitized to scenes that are clearly intended to be emotionally powerful, but it can't be helped because I'm just growing numb to it all.

At a drama level, Okada is overplaying her hand by having Menma cry so much. For some viewers and myself, these scenes are losing the effectiveness that they should have because they're being overused.




Her crying has served a purpose every time,

Her crying was in response to something in particular every time, but that doesn't mean it serves a purpose. Many of those scenes would get the impact of that something across without Menma crying.

In this episode, for example, I don't need to see Menma crying in order to understand how she doesn't want her mother to be hurt by lingering memories of her.


I can think of no better way to visually show the change of an emotionally fragile character like Menma from innocent youth to wise adult, than to not cry...If this is how her character evolves and changes, then her crying becomes not just justified, but prevalent to the plot...

And my fear is the complete opposite - that this anime will end with all of the core cast crying in a climatic scene, and I won't be able to shed a tear or even feel much of anything over it, because Okada will have thoroughly desensitized me to crying scenes in this anime.

Reckoner
2011-05-21, 01:40
I find it annoying because I can tell that it's lowering the effectiveness of scenes like this for me. I don't like being desensitized to scenes that are clearly intended to be emotionally powerful, but it can't be helped because I'm just growing numb to it all.


I agree with your assessment that the crying lessens the lets say "emotional impact" in the sense it doesn't invoke any desire to ball your eyes out like it did in episode 1. However, I'm actually wondering if that is what they're going for in the other episodes. Couldn't it also be possible that the crying is supposed to invoke a sense of being uncomfortable?

I mean looking at it from Jintan's perspective, he always becomes upset, annoyed, and really uncomfortable with her crying as was showcased exactly in this episode. That is practically what much of the audience feels as well I would think.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-21, 01:43
The classroom scene was definitely a d'awww moment for me and I normally can't stand awkward scenes, but as you may have been aware, I'm a little biased towards Jinta. :P

So I was partially right about the motto of the story is related to not forgetting your loved ones (be they dead or alive) and the memories you shared together. Menma's father is pretty heartless in that regard.

He's no more heartless than Menma for wanting her mother to forget her. He saw his wife destroying herself by dwelling on Menma. He did what he could to care for the living.

Thank you Jintan for the best line of the episode. "There's no doubt. She's definitely a virgin." Then getting smoked by the can :D.
Lines. Don't forget "She's got a love hotel face". :p

But really good job by Jintan in stepping up for Anaru. Considering he wasn't even able to get himself to go to school before, standing up and making that fuss took a lot of guts. Could feel how difficult this was for him, but he kept on going anyways. Couldn't let Anaru just sit there suffering without at least trying to do something. Though geeze every time he tries to go to school something like this happens :heh:.

It'd be funny if the rumors become "the reason he didn't step out of his house for months is that she exhausted him". :naughty:


BTW, is it me, or did he mention "glasses" several times? Does he have a thing for them?

Dr. Casey
2011-05-21, 01:47
Prediction: Menma's wish was for all the Super Peace Busters to remain together forever. The series will end with Jintan, Anaru, Poppo, Yukiatsu, and Tsuruko turning into ghosts so that they can be with Menma forever in the afterlife. I think that would be a touching ending...

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 01:47
I agree with your assessment that the crying lessens the lets say "emotional impact" in the sense it doesn't invoke any desire to ball your eyes out like it did in episode 1. However, I'm actually wondering if that is what they're going for in the other episodes. Couldn't it also be possible that the crying is supposed to invoke a sense of being uncomfortable?

I mean looking at it from Jintan's perspective, he always becomes upset, annoyed, and really uncomfortable with her crying as was showcased exactly in this episode. That is practically what much of the audience feels as well I would think.

That's an interesting perspective, I admit.

If the crying scenes are intended to annoy the viewer (and hence make him or her relate more to Jinta's perspective), then they've become quite effective for me, lol. :heh:

james0246
2011-05-21, 01:57
Actually, I find that debatable. Menma is getting so caught up in her emotions that she's frequently failing to apply calm critical thinking to how to overcome, or at least ameliorate, her current plight. Why didn't she think to check her own Diary for a clue as to what her wish might be, for example?

In Episode 5, when Poppo is desperately trying to see her, why doesn't she think of doing something to make her notice her? By this point, she knows that Poppo can feel her presence when she touches him, so it shouldn't be that hard for her to make her presence known to him (mind you, this is as much Jinta's error as Menma's).

That has less to do with Menma, and more to do with the writers/director refusing to answer whether Menma is a ghost or not (in which case, you can argue that all the characters have been dumbed down to facilitate this mystery (why doesn't Jintan, at any time since episode 01, just have Menma move a tea cup in front of his friends?)). If Menma did "do something", then we would know she has a physical presence (or at least a presence that can affect the physical world), which in turn would answer the question of the supernatural.

That being said, the entire scene was supposed to reflect Menma's frustrated impotence at not being able to adequately address her problem. In other words, for this scene in particular, for the emotional drama to actually have depth, she could not do anything.


These are things that even a 10 year old is generally smart enough to think of, and Menma has shown in other scenes a capacity for smart thinking.

So I do see where her emotionality is hindering her progress.

I'm unclear which 10 year olds you've dealt with, but whenever I have dealt with young children, they have never been as cool and calm as you are making them out to be...I guess we just roll in different elementary-schooler circuits ;).


Crying in general is a coping mechanism (except when people are moved to tears of joy, which I don't think is the case for Menma).

In some cases, it's perfectly justified and possibly even helpful. But as a person's only coping mechanism, it is usually more hurtful than helpful, as it can get in the way of more practical solutions.

Firstly, this entire line of argument relies solely on the possibility that Menma is real. If she is just a mental construct of Jintan's, then her entire disposition is reflective of his own psychosis, which in turn means he wants Menma to cry so that he can, in turn, change himself to help her, which in turn will actually be helping himself (a kind of reverse psychology, if you will).

Secondly, if she is a ghost, it could be said that Menma's "practical solution" was to seek help from Jintan. She clearly cannot solve the problem herself (she is, more or less, 10 after all), so she has approached her leader for help. Since then, she has tried to help him solve her mystery, even if her help is more humorous than actually helpful. (It could even be said that she uses her crying as a tool to force Jintan to help her...)

Whatever the case, and to paraphrase something Tiny said last discussion thread, it is Menma's crying that moves the plot. The mystery of her existence will not be solved by Poppo's tomfoolery, of Yukiatsu's obsession, or Tsuruko's cold logic, or Anaru's big breasts. It will be solved in the discussion (and crying) between Jintan and Menma as they both attempt to break free of the stresses that bind them.


I'm not making any such judgment. Menma's frequent crying is excessive even for a 10 year old, in my opinion.



At a drama level, Okada is overplaying her hand by having Menma cry so much. For some viewers and myself, these scenes are losing the effectiveness that they should have because they're being overused.

Fair enough. I disagree, but fair enough.

FlareKnight
2011-05-21, 02:14
He's no more heartless than Menma for wanting her mother to forget her. He saw his wife destroying herself by dwelling on Menma. He did what he could to care for the living.


Lines. Don't forget "She's got a love hotel face". :pI'll admit he did a good job with that line too :). Not bad for a speech he just came up with on the spot.

It'd be funny if the rumors become "the reason he didn't step out of his house for months is that she exhausted him". :naughty:

BTW, is it me, or did he mention "glasses" several times? Does he have a thing for them?It would be pretty comical and certainly possible with them leaving the room together.

Funny enough was just rewatching that scene and noticed him bring up glasses a few times. Could just be that he was running out of ideas of things to say so he just kept falling back on glasses. They are a pretty obvious thing to focus on visually. But think your theory on it is more entertaining :D.

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 02:18
That has less to do with Menma, and more to do with the writers/director refusing to answer whether Menma is a ghost or not (in which case, you can argue that all the characters have been dumbed down to facilitate this mystery (why doesn't Jintan, at any time since episode 01, just have Menma move a tea cup in front of his friends?)). If Menma did "do something", then we would know she has a physical presence (or at least a presence that can affect the physical world), which in turn would answer the question of the supernatural.

That being said, the entire scene was supposed to reflect Menma's impotent frustration at not being able to adequately address her problem.

But the thing is that she isn't impotent to adequately address her problem here, as it wouldn't be hard for her to demonstrate her presence to Poppo.

I'm willing to let it slide that characters are being dumbed down in order to avoid definitively answering the question of if Menma is a ghost or not. However, when that dumbing down results in other issues arising (such as Menma crying over something that she could address in a more practical way), I become a bit less forgiving of it.

It's not perfectly justifiable for a person to cry over something that can be easily fixed.



I'm unclear which 10 year olds you've dealt with, but whenever I have dealt with young children, they have never been as cool and calm as you are making them out to be...I guess we just roll in different elementary-schooler circuits ;).

I never said that Menma wasn't cool or calm enough for a 10 year old. I said that I found her crying excessive for a 10 year old. 10 year olds tend to be very active and easy to excite, but that's not the same as frequent profuse crying.


Firstly, this entire line of argument relies solely on the possibility that Menma is real.

With almost every passing episode, the alternative possibility seems increasingly unlikely to me.

deadite
2011-05-21, 02:30
I don't see how Yukiatsu is magically better. He is still as egotistical as ever and still spiteful of Jintan s seen in this episode. The only difference is at least he accepts that there is something wrong with him.

Also Imagine if Anaru and Jinta get expelled. I mean a girl who is rumored to be hooker leaving before class ends with some guy who never goes to school sends all kinds of signals.

karice67
2011-05-21, 02:38
Also Imagine if Anaru and Jinta get expelled. I mean a girl who is rumored to be hooker leaving before class ends with some guy who never goes to school sends all kinds of signals.LOL. It's a Japanese public school. Not gonna happen...though it would be funny, in a way. :heh:

Pocari_Sweat
2011-05-21, 05:40
For example, "Kore wa Zombie desu ka?". :)

1 time version

kDdCYo4eXZY

7 minutes version :heh:

YnQF5mBWL00

Just to clarify the origin, I believe it was in Toradora episode 7 where:

Taiga pokes Ryuuji's mom's breasts with chopsticks because she was jealous at the size of them and Ryuuji's mom responds by saying that Taiga is "Ecchi, Sketchy, One-Touchey".

dB_-LGcjI-U

karice67
2011-05-21, 06:00
^
For anime, perhaps (personally, this is the first time I've heard of it).

It's actually a Japanese word game that goes back at least one generation (Japanese link (http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q1154314556) if anyone wants to have a gander). The whole idea is to finish the phrase with a word ending in "-chi", and possibly adding a rhyming line.

Solace
2011-05-21, 07:46
It's not perfectly justifiable for a person to cry over something that can be easily fixed.

I have to giggle for a moment because of this statement. This sounds exactly like something an irritated adult would say to a little kid. :heh:

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 08:57
I have to giggle for a moment because of this statement. This sounds exactly like something an irritated adult would say to a little kid. :heh:

I guess it is kind of funny how much this is making me nerdrage. :heh:

I admittedly have pretty specific tastes when it comes to drama. Okada is often very good at appealing to those tastes (such as in True Tears and Wandering Son, and most of Anohana), so I guess I just find it a bit disappointing when something of her's doesn't hit the right note for me.

But maybe James and/or Reckoner will be right. I hope so, anyway.

Haru~
2011-05-21, 08:57
Nice episode with--
Jintan whiteknighting.
Manma doing manly cool face.
Ecchi sketchi Wantacchi.

DragoZERO
2011-05-21, 09:16
Prediction: Menma's wish was for all the Super Peace Busters to remain together forever. The series will end with Jintan, Anaru, Poppo, Yukiatsu, and Tsuruko turning into ghosts so that they can be with Menma forever in the afterlife. I think that would be a touching ending...I don't think a mass suicide would be a nice ending. :heh:

MeoTwister5
2011-05-21, 09:28
If this goes Sixth Sense I'm going to shoot myself. Others may also die.

BetoJR
2011-05-21, 10:01
At least I'm safe, across the Pacific and more than half a continent away from you, eh? :heh:

coderlan
2011-05-21, 10:12
Did the ED somehow partially changed?

Blaat
2011-05-21, 10:16
If this goes Sixth Sense I'm going to shoot myself. Others may also die.Good thing you're in a medical school then. :heh:

Guardian Enzo
2011-05-21, 10:29
All this talk of Sixth Sense endings and nosebleed theories has me in fear of a plotquake now. I hope Okada-san doesn't go either of those extreme routes, because that would mean my interpretation of what this series is all about has been totally wrong...

Sebasu
2011-05-21, 10:41
Did you guys believed Poppo when he said he became a level 5 shaman in Vietnam? I'm starting to have crazy doubts on his character. :heh:

TakezoMusashi
2011-05-21, 10:44
Prediction: Menma's wish was for all the Super Peace Busters to remain together forever. The series will end with Jintan, Anaru, Poppo, Yukiatsu, and Tsuruko turning into ghosts so that they can be with Menma forever in the afterlife. I think that would be a touching ending...

Sound kinda screwed up to me.:heh:

james0246
2011-05-21, 10:46
Did you guys believed Poppo when he said he became a level 5 shaman in Vietnam? I'm starting to have crazy doubts on his character. :heh:

I was wondering about that myself. Either Poppo is just being his usual laidback self, or he really hasn't been around the world...honestly, considering how hard it is to actually travel (even when you are willing to use low grade travel, like Fishermen's boats, and out of the way routes, etc), I wouldn't be surprised if Poppo has been lying this entire time...

Dr. Casey
2011-05-21, 10:49
I don't think a mass suicide would be a nice ending. :heh:

Oh, I don't mean anything that depressing. I just meant that they all transform from normal human beings into ghosts through sheer force of will. That they did something so amazing through their simple willpower would be a true testament to the power of friendship, and I think it would make for a very touching ending.

TakezoMusashi
2011-05-21, 10:54
I was wondering about that myself. Either Poppo is just being his usual laidback self, or he really hasn't been around the world...honestly, considering how hard it is to actually travel (even when you are willing to use low grade travel, like Fishermen's boats, and out of the way routes, etc), I wouldn't be surprised if Poppo has been lying this entire time...

I think he is lying. He doesn't look like someone with enough money to travel.
Plus he seems to live in that shed.:uhoh:
And, lv.5 shaman, really? Sounds like something out of an RPG.:heh:

Oh, I don't mean anything that depressing. I just meant that they all transform from normal human beings into ghosts through sheer force of will. That they did something so amazing through their simple willpower would be a true testament to the power of friendship, and I think it would make for a very touching ending.

Why not use that sheer force of will to bring Menma back to life. That sounds easier than everyone turning into ghosts.:heh:

User68604
2011-05-21, 10:58
Oh, I don't mean anything that depressing. I just meant that they all transform from normal human beings into ghosts through sheer force of will. That they did something so amazing through their simple willpower would be a true testament to the power of friendship, and I think it would make for a very touching ending.

interesting,

i think this series would be great if we had an ending that was not cliche/normal

something where they all "move on" from the past and then menma disappears is simply...too boring. theres alot of potential in this series, and i want to have my mind=blown at the end.

+1 for a school days ending..................

TakezoMusashi
2011-05-21, 11:07
interesting,

i think this series would be great if we had an ending that was not cliche/normal

something where they all "move on" from the past and then menma disappears is simply...too boring. theres alot of potential in this series, and i want to have my mind=blown at the end.

+1 for a school days ending..................

I don't think I could handle another one of those.:(

If you really think about it, it would be really selfish for them to do that and leave everyone else in their lives behind... they should take the whole town with them.:D

Flower
2011-05-21, 11:30
You know, I had a different kind of eerie thought last night. It was centered around three parts of episode 6.

The first was Jintan shouting at Menma to be more angry and stick up for herself instead of taking everything upon herself. Menma also seems concerned with not hurting her mother.

The second was the fact that Menma apparently called everyone together at the clubhouse on the day she died to ask their advice about something.

The third was the scene where Menma's mother says that Menma's father had cleaned up the Menma's room and told the former not to dwell on Menma's death to much. (Wasn't it also mentioned that Menma's father was also "scary"?)

With all these in mind I began to wonder if, given Menma's personality, the catalyst for her calling everyone together was somehow related to something her father either did (and she saw him doing it) or something her father did to her (read "abusively" here) and she did not know how to deal with it. She did not want to somehow hurt her mother with the information thereof.

I sure hope I am wrong ... the story is already sad enough. But I would not be surprised if they took such an angle.

But if that were the case I wonder what "fulfilling Menma's wish" would be? It's possible that such an event being uncovered would not be what Menma's wish actually was, but rater the necessary event in the story that leads to Menma's wish being fulfilled.

Hmm....

Just ponderings at the moment - thinking out loud.

TakezoMusashi
2011-05-21, 11:40
You know, I had a different kind of eerie thought last night. It was centered around three parts of episode 6.

The first was Jintan shouting at Menma to be more angry and stick up for herself instead of taking everything upon herself. Menma also seems concerned with not hurting her mother.

The second was the fact that Menma apparently called everyone together at the clubhouse on the day she died to ask their advice about something.

The third was the scene where Menma's mother says that Menma's father had cleaned up the Menma's room and told the former not to dwell on Menma's death to much. (Wasn't it also mentioned that Menma's father was also "scary"?)

With all these in mind I began to wonder if, given Menma's personality, the catalyst for her calling everyone together was somehow related to something her father either did (and she saw him doing it) or something her father did to her (read "abusively" here) and she did not know how to deal with it. She did not want to somehow hurt her mother with the information thereof.

I sure hope I am wrong ... the story is already sad enough. But I would not be surprised if they took such an angle.

But if that were the case I wonder what "fulfilling Menma's wish" would be? It's possible that such an event being uncovered would not be what Menma's wish actually was, but rater the necessary event in the story that leads to Menma's wish being fulfilled.

Hmm....

Just ponderings at the moment - thinking out loud.

The show has enough depressing elements without bringing abuse into the equation.
I hope it doesn't go in that direction.
Menma's to sweet to have something so horrible happen to her like that and then die young.:(

User68604
2011-05-21, 12:05
pardon the term, but i think it would be way too "fruity" or "cheesy" if they went in a direction that wasnt dark/thematic.

The series can really go in quite a few directions. I liked Flower's analysis, but it seemed to be possibly a "stretch" given how the ghost-Menma acts. Im almost sure that she would not be as happy-go-lucky if she was a victim of household abuse.

But I wont lie, I think the series would be much better if we were to see something along those lines...

AnoHana is unique in a way, and it would be a shame to see it end in a predictable or cheesy manner.

Flower
2011-05-21, 12:10
....The series can really go in quite a few directions. I liked Flower's analysis, but it seemed to be possibly a "stretch" given how the ghost-Menma acts. I'm almost sure that she would not be as happy-go-lucky if she was a victim of household abuse....

I had thought so at first as well, but then I recalled that at the moment Menma seems to have forgotten a few things. Also, sometimes it happens that children who have been traumatized by abuse often "forget" what happened as well....

To be sure it is not an "air tight" possibility, just one that, to my mind, seems a very likely one.

I agree with you that it is likely that the series may take a darker turn story wise, though.... :(

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 12:13
pardon the term, but i think it would be way too "fruity" or "cheesy" if they went in a direction that wasnt dark/thematic.

The series can really go in quite a few directions. I liked Flower's analysis, but it seemed to be possibly a "stretch" given how the ghost-Menma acts.

Actually, given how ghost-Menma acts, Flower's analysis would seem fitting to me. If Flower is correct, then ghost-Menma's crying instantly becomes completely justifiable to even me. You could then say that she's still bearing the psychological scars of household abuse, even if such abuse is no longer held in her memory.

One haunting idea I just now had is that Jinta calling Menma "ugly" in a tsundere moment for him might have had a harsher impact than he thinks, because perhaps Menma's own father made insults like that too her...

Part of me wouldn't want this anime to get this dark, but on the other hand, it would change how I view Menma's character, and probably in a positive way. It would also add greater depth to the drama in this anime, imo.

So, yeah, overall I kind of want Flower to be right in his speculations.

Flower
2011-05-21, 12:17
....One haunting idea I just now had is that Jinta calling Menma "ugly" in a tsundere moment for him might have had a harsher impact than he thinks, because perhaps Menma's own father made insults like that too her....

I had thought the same things - might also explain why Menma looked a little "shellshocked" when he said it.

Of course, this could be my conveniently interpreting things to suite my theory....

Guardian Enzo
2011-05-21, 12:18
All of this speculation is really putting me (uncomfortably) in mind of TM8. I'm not going to reopen old wounds by debating the turn that series took, but I think it's fair to say that the choices it made completely changed the type of series it was, right smack in the middle of its run. I liked the type of series it was for the first half, and I think it was plenty dramatic without making the choices it made. Similarly, while all of these theories have some intrigue in their own right, I would hate to see this show follow that path. I hope that the drama here is about everyone emotionally dealing with Menma's death, and with growing up. That's plenty of drama for me - I don't need to see it become theatrical and melodramatic.

Flower
2011-05-21, 12:25
....Similarly, while all of these theories have some intrigue in their own right, I would hate to see this show follow that path. I hope that the drama here is about everyone emotionally dealing with Menma's death, and with growing up. That's plenty of drama for me - I don't need to see it become theatrical and melodramatic.

Hmm ... I can see the "temptation" to "exploit" such a story plot, focusing on Menma's abuse (all speculation atm, of course) and having it overshadow the other elements of the story. But if I am correct I am hopeful that the story writers will be able to put it in its proper balance and place. At least I hope so.

I personally do not mind such drama, but I must admit that the main thing attracting me to the series atm is the emotional growth of all the characters in dealing with the sadness and pain they have encountered in life at a young age.

I say for now lets give the story writers the benefit of the doubt if they do take that route. They may be able to pull it off! But it does, admittedly, seem to me that it would be a tricky thing to do....

TakezoMusashi
2011-05-21, 12:29
Menma's wish is one of the primary plot threads amongst several others, and were already half-way through the show, right?
I don't think we need a new one that doesn't really seem to follow the themes already presented.

Pellissier
2011-05-21, 12:34
I'm cold towards this theory, first because as Enzo said I don't want a TM8 again, second I honestly don't see the anime going that deep and that dark with more than half series done. We don't even know how precisely Menma died. Anyway, I think we may have a chance to verify the truthfulness of this theory right in next episode, assuming they'll actually get to read Menma's diary.
One thing though, if such dark secrets could be hidden in that diary, why keep it, and furthermore why giving it out to "strangers" ?

james0246
2011-05-21, 12:37
I had thought the same things - might also explain why Menma looked a little "shellshocked" when he said it.

Of course, this could be my conveniently interpreting things to suite my theory....

Admittedly, she immediately started chasing after him when he left. So, if she did gather the friends together to say she was abused, then Jintan's words should have driven her away, not make her seek him out further (not only running after him, but essentially coming back from the dead for him as well). So it seems unlikely that emotional abuse was going on...(physical abuse is another matter, but since physical abuse is often accompanied by emotional abuse (not vice versa), I expect Menma would have reacted far more negatively to Jintan's words if she was actually being abused).

That being said, I also wouldn't mind a little more drama to her death (though, still having the bad memories of Fractale which had the same time slot just 7 weeks ago, I am reluctant to go the abuse/possible rape/suicide route). I expect it would be more acceptable for all of us to have a ghost appear due to a more tragic event (she seems to have simply fallen in to a lake and died; tragic sure, but not exactly worth coming back from the dead over), rather than a ghost seemingly randomly appearing to help it's friends.


One thing though, if such dark secrets could be hidden in that diary, why keep it, and furthermore why giving it out to "strangers" ?

To act briefly as a devil's advocate, the father boxed up the room, so it is possible that the mother simply did not know if anything traumatic was in the diary. Additionally, since the mother was the one who gave them the diary (sorry to knit-pick, but the scene should have been shown), it can still be said that the father would not want the diary to be shown to anyone...admittedly, if he was responsible, while clearing out the room, he should have simply burned any evidence...

Flower
2011-05-21, 12:49
Admittedly, she immediately started chasing after him when he left. So, if she did gather the friends together to say she was abused, then Jintan's words should have driven her away, not make her seek him out further (not only running after him, but essentially coming back from the dead for him as well). So it seems unlikely that emotional abuse was going on...(physical abuse is another matter, but since physical abuse is often accompanied by emotional abuse (not vice versa), I expect Menma would have reacted far more negatively to Jintan's words if she was actually being abused).

Hmm ... I see what you mean - but given Menma's love for Jintan as well her her tendency to take everything on herself I think running after Jintan would not be too out of place.

Again though - this could be me conveniently arranging the "facts" to fit the theory.

That being said, I also wouldn't mind a little more drama to her death (though, still having the bad memories of Fractale which had the same time slot just 7 weeks ago, I am reluctant to go the abuse/possible rape route). I expect it would be more acceptable for all of us to have a ghost appear due to a more tragic event (she's seems to have simply fallen in to a lake and died; tragic sure, but not exactly worth coming back from the dead over), rather than a ghost seemingly randomly appearing to help it's friends.

Uh oh, another person who was disappointed with Fractale. I seem to find more and more as time goes on! :D I was one of those who actually enjoyed Fractale....

But back on topic I also would not mind a little more intense turn in the story.

****

Incidentally, I am sorry for weighing in so fast and often at this point in the thread on this point - I am not trying to "evangelize" or be pushy with it; there are some parts to me that hopes my guess is not true! (Mostly bound up with feeling sorry for the Menma.)

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 13:09
Part of the reason why I think Flower might be on to something here is that this anime has already had something of an attempted rape scene, which could be foreshadowing that similar conflicts/issues will soon be delved into.

Household abuse also strikes me as the sort of darker and/or sophisticated issue that Okada likes to deal with. The anime shows that Okada has wrote for tend to deal with somewhat dark, but nonetheless realistic/societal, issues.

Solace
2011-05-21, 14:20
I really doubt Menma had some kind of family abuse going on. I'm not saying it isn't plausible, but I think a lot of these theories are like shooting darts at a board for now.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-21, 14:55
Did you guys believed Poppo when he said he became a level 5 shaman in Vietnam? I'm starting to have crazy doubts on his character. :heh:

Sure, why not? It sounds like some kind of con, but I can see him falling for it.

guuchan
2011-05-21, 14:58
Did you guys believed Poppo when he said he became a level 5 shaman in Vietnam? I'm starting to have crazy doubts on his character. :heh:

There is shamanism in Vietnam alright, and that's not really something you would normally know unless you have stayed there for a while, but I don't know much about it so I'm not going comment on the level 5 part (I'm thinking Anohana's writer combined it with index/railgun or something haha).

I really doubt Menma had some kind of family abuse going on. I'm not saying it isn't plausible, but I think a lot of these theories are like shooting darts at a board for now.

Word. I have no idea how the speculation headed that way. :heh: I'd imagine Menma's wish is something simple and childlike. As I stated at the beginning of this show, Anohana is about simplicity and we will see if that changes when the show progesses.

CWW
2011-05-21, 15:41
I don't need to see it become theatrical and melodramatic.
Don't worry, Shaft isn't at the helm.

Honestly, it's like people have been drunk with melodrama and pretense lately that they can't enjoy an anime about homely values anymore. It has to have a twist to tickle their senses. The tumor, the abuse, the murder, the paedophilia, none of those have crossed my mind for a second. You're free to hypothesize of course, but some of these are pretty out there. I won't rule out a future twist - and if there is one it's likely something to do with Menma's forgotten wish - but the chance of it being dark and twisted is pretty darn small if you ask me.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-21, 15:51
Change of subject: what was indecent about Anaru's clothes that she felt she had to throw stuff at Jinta? It looked like normal summer wear...

Kirarakim
2011-05-21, 15:52
Yeah I like angst as much as the next person but I actually like that Anohana is more laid back. It reminds me of Honey & Clover more than anything.

Okay sure there is a lot of drama but I honestly feel this is a moving on/growing up story but in this case the characters are moving back to each other.

Although that being said I have no idea what Menma's wish is. Of course I do think it has something to do with what she called them to the club house that day for but other than that I have no theories and just want to see how it all turns out. I am not expecting anything Grim!Dark though.

Flower
2011-05-21, 18:45
After thinking about it a bit I am inclined to think that if the theory of abuse holds water I think it is much more likely to be between Menma's father and mother as opposed to between Menma and her father - for example if Menma saw her father physically abusing here mother. Of course this could lead to all kinds of variations as regards "why", but I also agree with Solace - it is true that my speculation IS just shooting in the dark for now. And I am notoriously bad at guessing where anime/manga plots are headed! :D

But for now I am still going to go with my theory in general and put the focus squarely on some sort of abusive activity between Menma's mother and father that she unknowingly stumbled across.

cyth
2011-05-21, 20:12
Honestly, it's like people have been drunk with melodrama and pretense lately that they can't enjoy an anime about homely values anymore. It has to have a twist to tickle their senses. The tumor, the abuse, the murder, the paedophilia, none of those have crossed my mind for a second. You're free to hypothesize of course, but some of these are pretty out there.But crossdressing is pretty out there as well and a good indicator this anime wasn't written for general audiences. Otaku love this kind of controversial, shocking stuff, however I wish to defend our tastes for just a moment here, even though I do long for a more chill, down-to-earth atmosphere from time to time, and would actually prefer to see it in AnoHana. In short, the kind of shocking stimulation is what some of us were seeking before we started watching anime. Mainstream entertainment is weaksauce and just doesn't do it for some of us.

If it comforts you in any way, my prediction (about paedophilia) was mostly made in joke. It could happen though! I'm looking at Poppo's trainwreck potential and I can't help myself but to make fun of him. :D

OceanBlue
2011-05-21, 20:17
Otaku love this kind of controversial, shocking stuff
Watching daytime television makes me think that everyone loves controversial, shocking stuff like that.

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 20:26
While I certainly respect that some fans don't want this anime to get too dark (I myself share the same sentiment to some degree), I'm not exactly sure why the addition of child abuse (it wouldn't have to be sexual, by the way) would be making this show melodramatic.

I mean, we already have:

1. A teenage boy who cosplays as his deceased childhood female friend, including cross-dressing.

2. An (unsuccessful) attempted rape scene.

3. A hikikomori male lead that had quit school for a long time.


And all of the above were presented pretty seriously, in my opinion.

I would never underestimate Okada's ability and tendency to broach taboo and/or very touchy subjects, and with a certain maturity as well. Wandering Son and True Tears speak loudly to this, imo.

Thankfully, Okada is generally very good at this. :)

DragoZERO
2011-05-21, 20:40
I was wondering about that myself. Either Poppo is just being his usual laidback self, or he really hasn't been around the world...honestly, considering how hard it is to actually travel (even when you are willing to use low grade travel, like Fishermen's boats, and out of the way routes, etc), I wouldn't be surprised if Poppo has been lying this entire time...Maybe he was certified over the internet? :heh:

Oh, I don't mean anything that depressing. I just meant that they all transform from normal human beings into ghosts through sheer force of will. That they did something so amazing through their simple willpower would be a true testament to the power of friendship, and I think it would make for a very touching ending.I know, I was just joking.

Part of the reason why I think Flower might be on to something here is that this anime has already had something of an attempted rape scene, which could be foreshadowing that similar conflicts/issues will soon be delved into.When was there an attempted rape scene??

Change of subject: what was indecent about Anaru's clothes that she felt she had to throw stuff at Jinta? It looked like normal summer wear...Not really indecent, just more revealing than usual. It was Jinta who made things awkward, I think. Either way, he got himself some point there. :heh:

Triple_R
2011-05-21, 20:45
When was there an attempted rape scene??


That guy in Episode 5 was trying to force Anaru to have sex with him. It didn't get that far (largely thanks to Yukiatsu), but it was clear that he wasn't taking "no" for an answer...

OceanBlue
2011-05-21, 20:52
When was there an attempted rape scene??
Anaru and that random guy in episode 5, where Yukiatsu saved here. At least, I think that's what Triple_R is referring to.

As for the child abuse thing, it'd bother me because it's so distinct from the other main characters. Most of the other conflicts are related to the group and Menma's death to the point where issues outside of this would feel like they're forced or the story would feel unfocused. Menma being abused as a child wouldn't really do much to progress the larger narrative; at most, it'd lead to sympathy for Menma, but that wouldn't really lead anywhere since it's so unrelated to the rest of the group.

Ottocycle
2011-05-21, 21:55
Change of subject: what was indecent about Anaru's clothes that she felt she had to throw stuff at Jinta? It looked like normal summer wear...
I guess it's Jinta who has probably yet to see Anaru (or any other pubescent girl with decent curves) in that state of dress, acting up.

She obviously didn't feel anything about it at the beginning, or when Poppo and Jintan visited her place a few eps back.

wandering-dreamer
2011-05-21, 22:05
Actually, when I was watching the episode I was wondering if it was Menma, not Jinta who had the soap-opera disease. Calling everyone together to talk about something important, which ends up not being discussed, feels like a death flag to me (even if she's already dead) so I hope we do get more flashbacks about that day soon, maybe Tsuruko next?

Sebasu
2011-05-21, 22:05
Change of subject: what was indecent about Anaru's clothes that she felt she had to throw stuff at Jinta? It looked like normal summer wear...

It's just because Jintan had a nosebleed and she thought it's because of her (being alone together at night and her bra strap showing out would probably make her think that way).

Reckoner
2011-05-22, 02:30
I think the attempted rape scene can be more accurately labeled as enjo kosai (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enjo_k%C5%8Dsai). It was more like Anaru didn't know what she was doing exactly.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 02:41
... She said "no", he tried to drag her to the hotel forcefully. So, yeah, attempted rape.

Haru~
2011-05-22, 03:53
I think the attempted rape scene can be more accurately labeled as enjo kosai (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enjo_k%C5%8Dsai). It was more like Anaru didn't know what she was doing exactly.

In that older guy's perspective yes, but to a third person view perspective, it's an attempted rape. Moreover, why would you drag someone refusing, struggling to your advances. That guy just assumed Anaru is like that.

Seiryuu
2011-05-22, 05:29
Very interesting, and sort of surprising to show a ghost who's actually afraid of what will happen when she moves on. I suspect that she might have some idea of what her "unfinished business" is, but deliberately forgot it out of fear of the unknown, and a desire to bring everyone back together again and be with them longer.

Naruko's getting to me more and more. There's not much worse you can do to a girl than spread rumors like that. I'm a little uncertain about how close she really is with her "friends", or whether to a good extent she just hangs out with them to have someone to be with. And then they let some guy take her away. And worse, as the only ones there they were obviously the ones who told everyone how she went off to a hotel with an old man she'd just met. It seems pretty clear that the girls were up for doing enjou kousai and going all the way. And a bystander who saw an older businessman walking with a girl who was dressed a little bit like that would think that. Tsurumi herself warned Naruko that the way she and her friends dressed was typical of those sorts of "gals".
The way people like her friends are treated can be painful enough, but the way they treat people when they suddenly "find out" that they'd done something like that is horrible. This sort of thing is sometimes called "Second Rape" or something like that, as a person's image and psyche is violated over and over again by the way she's suddenly seen by people.

BTW, one thing's been bothering me. Where the heck did the phrase "Ecchi, Sketchy, One-touch!" come from? I've heard it before several times but it just seems really weird.

User68604
2011-05-22, 05:38
This aint your average saturday morning cartoon,

so ruling out a thematic/dark progression is silly...

OceanBlue
2011-05-22, 05:55
This aint your average saturday morning cartoon,

so ruling out a thematic/dark progression is silly...
That doesn't mean it can't be ruled out for other reasons.

Rather, I'll say that it'd be a bad choice because it's so unrelated to everything that has happened so far. I'm not convinced that Menma being abused would be related to anything happening in the story. It'd just happen to drum up sympathy or tears. That's why I personally believe it'd be melodramatic.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 06:29
Naruko's getting to me more and more. There's not much worse you can do to a girl than spread rumors like that. I'm a little uncertain about how close she really is with her "friends", or whether to a good extent she just hangs out with them to have someone to be with. And then they let some guy take her away.
Which they considered lucky for her. I mean, that's what they were there for, right?

And worse, as the only ones there they were obviously the ones who told everyone how she went off to a hotel with an old man she'd just met.
You forget the PTA member who saw her. (And apparently did nothing to help her... Well, whatever.)

karice67
2011-05-22, 07:17
BTW, one thing's been bothering me. Where the heck did the phrase "Ecchi, Sketchy, One-touch!" come from? I've heard it before several times but it just seems really weird....

If I might make a suggestion: try reading the thread.

It's actually a Japanese word game that goes back at least one generation (Japanese link (http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q1154314556) if anyone wants to have a gander). The whole idea is to finish the phrase with a word ending in "-chi", and possibly adding a rhyming line.

Malkuth
2011-05-22, 07:37
... She said "no", he tried to drag her to the hotel forcefully. So, yeah, attempted rape.

In that older guy's perspective yes, but to a third person view perspective, it's an attempted rape. Moreover, why would you drag someone refusing, struggling to your advances. That guy just assumed Anaru is like that.

That's an exaggeration IMHO, I mean what was Naruko expecting... watch One Piece :heh: or think of it in another way, if you reverse their sexes or ages would you say it was an attempted rape?

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 07:43
It doesn't matter what she was expecting. Or what he was expecting. Neither do their genders or ages. She said "no", he tried to force her. How is that not attempted rape? Unless you believe he wanted to watch TV with her in that hotel room?

Seriously, what's next? "Look at how she dressed, she totally wanted it"?

Solafighter
2011-05-22, 08:06
Will there be at least one episode, where Menma wont cry?...


Good episode, though.

Triple_R
2011-05-22, 08:14
That doesn't mean it can't be ruled out for other reasons.

I don't see much reason why it should be completely ruled out. At least not yet.

I will say, though, that a plot element of this seriousness would need to come up soon in order to be effective, imo.




Rather, I'll say that it'd be a bad choice because it's so unrelated to everything that has happened so far.

That's not necessarily the case. What if the big reveal that Menma was going to make to the rest of the "Super Peace Busters" on that eventful day was that she was enduring abuse at home, and was hoping that her teammates in the "Super Peace Busters" could save her from that?

If so, things start to tie together nicely, in my opinion.

And, to me, melodrama is about making a mountain out of a molehill, or about using an actual mountain for pure shock value alone. If handled correctly, a reveal about child abuse in this anime would not be just shock value, and it's a pretty serious issue that does happen in real life. I'd personally be impressed to see an anime tackle that issue with maturity and seriousness.


It doesn't matter what she was expecting. Or what he was expecting. Neither do their genders or ages. She said "no", he tried to force her. How is that not attempted rape? Unless you believe he wanted to watch TV with her in that hotel room?

Seriously, what's next? "Look at how she dressed, she totally wanted it"?

Agreed.

Haru~
2011-05-22, 08:33
That's an exaggeration IMHO, I mean what was Naruko expecting... watch One Piece :heh: or think of it in another way, if you reverse their sexes or ages would you say it was an attempted rape?

Are you that older guy who likes One Piece?!:heh:

Malkuth
2011-05-22, 09:29
It doesn't matter what she was expecting. Or what he was expecting. Neither do their genders or ages. She said "no", he tried to force her. How is that not attempted rape? Unless you believe he wanted to watch TV with her in that hotel room?

Seriously, what's next? "Look at how she dressed, she totally wanted it"?

Don't turn this into some feminist rant :heh: What I am saying is that it is a little bit more complicated than a yes or no. Should it go to court, apart from ruining both their lives, the one with the most money and/or standing will win anyway. So if you want the short cynical (and not necessarily right) answer, getting into such situation has it's consequences.

Are you that older guy who likes One Piece?!:heh:

I hate One Piece :p

Triple_R
2011-05-22, 09:51
Don't turn this into some feminist rant :heh: What I am saying is that it is a little bit more complicated than a yes or no. Should it go to court, apart from ruining both their lives, the one with the most money and/or standing will win anyway. So if you want the short cynical (and not necessarily right) answer, getting into such situation has it's consequences.



What about Anaru's situation even comes close to implying sexual consent?

From what I can tell, these were just a bunch of teenagers hanging out together at some establishment. The establishment in question didn't even look seedy to me.

Anaru is clearly not enjoying herself like her two female friends are, so a guy asks her if she'd like to leave with him. 9 times out of 10 in anime this sort of situation would segue into a romantic confession on the guy's part (or even just the lead-up to one later on), not propositioning to have sex right then and there.


Again, keep in mind that these are teenagers, not adults at a bar late at night.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 09:55
Don't turn this into some feminist rant :heh: What I am saying is that it is a little bit more complicated than a yes or no. Should it go to court, apart from ruining both their lives, the one with the most money and/or standing will win anyway. So if you want the short cynical (and not necessarily right) answer, getting into such situation has it's consequences.

The court would make it complicated because it would be hard to prove he forced her. Her word against his. The facts which we as anime watchers saw quite clearly point to attempted rape, or at least attempted unlawful imprisonment (Yeah. He wanted to drag her to a love hotel for totally chaste reasons. Right.). She said no, he tried to use physical force to coerce her. It doesn't get much more clear cut.

And I can't really imagine much you could say against that that wouldn't make you sound like some creepy date rapist, but hey, surprise me.

MeoTwister5
2011-05-22, 09:58
A Reason for Living (http://meotwister5.wordpress.com/2011/05/22/1144/)

I think the concept of personal responsibility runs deep in this show. Everyone of the friends feel responsible in some way for Menma’s death, but now we see that she suffers deeply as well. She cries not for herself, but for her friends, so much so that in somehow impedes her ability to move on. It's no longer just about the five remaining friends moving on with lives, but Menma moving on with hers (in a less than alive sense).

Malkuth
2011-05-22, 10:22
@Anh_Minh: So saying that it is more complicated than a simple yes or no makes me a date rapist :confused: I guess if I don't blindly condemn inappropriate behaviour and think about the whole situation, I am some kind of enemy? Dunno, maybe I give women much more credit than those who vocally protect their rights.

What about Anaru's situation even comes close to implying sexual consent?

From what I can tell, these were just a bunch of teenagers hanging out together at some establishment. The establishment in question didn't even look seedy to me.

Anaru is clearly not enjoying herself like her two female friends are, so a guy asks her if she'd like to leave with him.

Don't forget, that her friends, like the audience, immediately understood his intentions, and even manage to comment on them before they left the karaoke booth. Yet she follows him, until they reach the love hotel, and still debates about his intentions... so either someone should either go and live her life in a convent or stop acting like an ostrich.

9 times out of 10 in anime this sort of situation would segue into a romantic confession on the guy's part (or even just the lead-up to one later on), not propositioning to have sex right then and there.

In romantic anime, movies, novels, and fairytales... not IRL.

Again, keep in mind that these are teenagers, not adults at a bar late at night.

Insignificant, teenagers can have sex around late elementary or early middle school, so if they are not up to the responsibilities that come with it, they should not mess around, because nothing good will out of it.

In this case, Naruko is hanging out with people that she has nothing in common, and is forcing into herself a life-style that she does not enjoy. Shouldn't it be for that attempted rape, and the confession from Yukiatsu, she would have gotten into more serious trouble, than her classmates labeling her as a whore. And yet again she is saved by her NEET friend... You know damsels are in distress, not because of stressful situations, but because they can not handle them alone, and this is a recurring theme with Naruko.

Now, I know it sounds harsh, but Naruko is not a kid any more at 16, and certainly none will see her that way should this be a real life situation, except a certain group that these days blindly supports one sex completely ignoring the context. I definitely do not support that the old guy behaved properly, quite the opposite, but what I originally said is that Naruko is not exactly innocent in the whole situation.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 10:47
@Anh_Minh: So saying that it is more complicated than a simple yes or no makes me a date rapist :confused: I guess if I don't blindly condemn inappropriate behaviour and think about the whole situation, I am some kind of enemy? Dunno, maybe I give women much more credit than those who vocally protect their rights.

Saying a woman doesn't have the right to say "no" from the moment she accepts going to a karaoke booth with you does, indeed, pretty much make you a date rapist. Or at least some kind of supporter of date rape. I mean, seriously, what kind of credit do you give women that means that men have the right to force themselves on them?


Don't forget, that her friends, like the audience, immediately understood his intentions, and even manage to comment on them before they left the karaoke booth. Yet she follows him, until they reach the love hotel,
Because it was, apparently, on the way to the station.

and still debates about his intentions... so either someone should either go and live her life in a convent or stop acting like an ostrich.
There's a serious line between "he's maybe going to proposition her (or maybe, you know, act more civilized and just ask for her number or something...)" and "he won't take no for an answer". Maybe you should give men more credit. We're not all... criminals.



In romantic anime, movies, novels, and fairytales... not IRL.



Insignificant, teenagers can have sex around late elementary or early middle school, so if they are not up to the responsibilities that come with it, they should not mess around, because nothing good will out of it.
Not precisely relevant to this case, but you do know the concept of "age of consent", do you? Even if kids are dumb enough to have sex, adults do have a responsibility not to go for it with them. Let alone forcibly dragging them to love hotels.

In this case, Naruko is hanging out with people that she has nothing in common, and is forcing into herself a life-style that she does not enjoy. Shouldn't it be for that attempted rape, and the confession from Yukiatsu, she would have gotten into more serious trouble, than her classmates labeling her as a whore. And yet again she is saved by her NEET friend... You know damsels are in distress, not because of stressful situations, but because they can not handle them alone, and this is a recurring theme with Naruko.

Now, I know it sounds harsh, but Naruko is not a kid any more at 16, and certainly none will see her that way should this be a real life situation, except a certain group that these days blindly supports one sex completely ignoring the context.
Context can count in cases of misread signals. From the moment she said she didn't want to and struggled against him, that wasn't what was happening at all any more. He knew damn well she didn't want to go there with him, and he choose to force her.

I definitely do not support that the old guy behaved properly, quite the opposite, but what I originally said is that Naruko is not exactly innocent in the whole situation.
Naruko's made some bad choices. Maybe she should have been more careful in her choice of friends, maybe she should have made more of an effort to not be alone with that creep. None of that takes away from her right to say "no". It's not a matter of gender, or even of age. It's a simple matter of the right to say "no", even when you wear sexy clothes or go out to karaoke.

CWW
2011-05-22, 10:56
Shouldn't it be for that attempted rape, and the confession from Yukiatsu, she would have gotten into more serious trouble, than her classmates labeling her as a whore. And yet again she is saved by her NEET friend... You know damsels are in distress, not because of stressful situations, but because they can not handle them alone, and this is a recurring theme with Naruko.
What the hell does this even mean? So because she can't defend herself, it's somehow her fault? That is not how the law works. I'm sorry, but you're saying some of the dumbest things in this thread. I'm not even going to try to make sense of your perceived morality.

Malkuth
2011-05-22, 11:39
Saying a woman doesn't have the right to say "no" from the moment she accepts going to a karaoke booth with you does,

That is not even close to what I wrote :frustrated:

indeed, pretty much make you a date rapist. Or at least some kind of supporter of date rape.

Funny, I thought we were talking about a fictional character... how did you manage to equate a behaviour that I completely disapprove of, with what I am doing IRL eludes me :twitch:

I mean, seriously, what kind of credit do you give women that means that men have the right to force themselves on them?

That they can handle themselves, instead of needing some white knight to constantly protect them.

Because it was, apparently, on the way to the station.

If I remember correctly, Naruko said that they are not heading towards the station, in the beginning of the scene.

There's a serious line between "he's maybe going to proposition her (or maybe, you know, act more civilized and just ask for her number or something...)" and "he won't take no for an answer". Maybe you should give men more credit. We're not all... criminals.

I give men credit, when their favourite past-time is not hanging out after work with high school girl eager to entertain them. Sorry for being harsh here, but that's what the white knight mentality leads to.

Not precisely relevant to this case, but you do know the concept of "age of consent", do you? Even if kids are dumb enough to have sex, adults do have a responsibility not to go for it with them. Let alone forcibly dragging them to love hotels.

And you certainly must be aware of natural instincts, if a sexually mature person wants to engage in it, it is unnatural to blame his/her partner. That's just witch-hunting from irresponsible and frustrated parents. But I have no idea why you bring this up, it has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

Context can count in cases of misread signals. From the moment she said she didn't want to and struggled against him, that wasn't what was happening at all any more. He knew damn well she didn't want to go there with him, and he choose to force her.

No he didn't, she might be just fooling around. You clearly have double standards here. And before you freak out again, I am not saying that she was fooling around, nor that he couldn't have understood her real intentions, but that it is a possibility... it's not as clear cut as you (and actually I) would like it to be.

Naruko's made some bad choices. Maybe she should have been more careful in her choice of friends, maybe she should have made more of an effort to not be alone with that creep.

That's what I originally said.

None of that takes away from her right to say "no". It's not a matter of gender, or even of age. It's a simple matter of the right to say "no", even when you wear sexy clothes or go out to karaoke.

Agreed with one reservation, that wearing sexy clothes, hanging out with those type of guys, and leaving alone with one of them, probably will be interpreted otherwise, as was the case by everyone except Naruko. Still I never disagreed that no should have been the end of it, just that after everything she did, it would be hard for that type of guy to take it seriously. But this is a far cry from saying he tried to rape her, to say that we must assume that a lot more would follow, granted probable, but not certain.

And please try reply to what I write, not to what you assume I might have written in defence of that type of guys, because for one I am not defending them, and certainly do not behave like them.


What the hell does this even mean? So because she can't defend herself, it's somehow her fault?

Indeed, it was in her hands to avoid all these situations, but she is a 16 year old inexperienced virgin, and everyone in 2chan can now be happy, that she was saved from a traumatic experience, by a snobbish cross-dresser, and then by a hikikomori.

That is not how the law works.

Irrelevant to what I wrote in that paragraph.

I'm sorry, but you're saying some of the dumbest things in this thread.

No comment.

I'm not even going to try to make sense of your perceived morality.

Try Jungfrukällan (en: The Virgin Spring) by Ingmar Bergman (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0053976/), for my morality on the subject.

james0246
2011-05-22, 12:12
Please ceass this discussion. It has nothing to do with this episode. Either find an appropriate thread, or take the discussion to PM.

Deconstructor
2011-05-22, 13:51
Another very good episode, but perhaps lacking the emotional movement I felt from the first two episodes. Menma bawling her eyes out may be getting too repetitive. Luckily, the straightforward attitude of Jinta provides some comfort to Anaru, who was clearly suffering terribly inside.

Tsuruko could make Yukiatsu her slave, if she decided to use the crossdressing photos as blackmail. Actually, she could probably get him kicked out of school by publishing his secret identity in the school newspaper. The fact that Tsuruko has withheld those photos shows she has somewhat gotten over her past unrequited love for Yukiatsu. But I'm not so sure about how she feels with Menma and the others.

Darn, I was hoping Anaru and Yukiatsu would get it on.

Episode 6 Rating: 8.5/10

Please ceass this discussion. It has nothing to do with this episode. Either find an appropriate thread, or take the discussion to PM.

Hmm... where were you when the Madoka wars were being waged?

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 14:20
Another very good episode, but perhaps lacking the emotional movement I felt from the first two episodes. Menma bawling her eyes out may be getting too repetitive. Luckily, the straightforward attitude of Jinta provides some comfort to Anaru, who was clearly suffering terribly inside.

Tsuruko could make Yukiatsu her slave, if she decided to use the crossdressing photos as blackmail.
Maybe, maybe not. He could very well go "publish and be damned", since there seems to be a real self-destructive streak in him.

Actually, she could probably get him kicked out of school by publishing his secret identity in the school newspaper.
Why would she want to do that?

The fact that Tsuruko has withheld those photos shows she has somewhat gotten over her past unrequited love for Yukiatsu.
How so? Not showing those pictures is her way of protecting him. At a certain inconvenience to herself, though I'm not sure turning him into a social pariah would better her own situation.

Deconstructor
2011-05-22, 14:41
Maybe, maybe not. He could very well go "publish and be damned", since there seems to be a real self-destructive streak in him.

He seemed relieved when Tsuruko decided not to use his Menma photos as hostages. Even if this is the guy who runs around in a white sundress at night, he still values his successful life because of his unsuccessful past as merely being part of Jinta's group. The most prevalent example is the flashback to beetle catching - Jinta holds up a massive beetle, while Yukiatsu only has a tiny one. Ever since then, Yukiatsu's been a little obsessed with doing better than Jinta.

Why would she want to do that?

To get back at her former love for not loving her. To exact vengeance upon Yukiatsu for still loving Menma, even after she's passed away for several years now.

Well, maybe not... but Tsuruko has the power. She can choose to exercise it, and the pleasure derived from watching the magnificent bastard Yukiatsu suffer would already be enough justification. As seen in episode 6, everyone was eager to talk about Anaru and her visit to a love hotel. Everyone but Jinta, anyway.

How so? Not showing those pictures is her way of protecting him. At a certain inconvenience to herself, though I'm not sure turning him into a social pariah would better her own situation.

Protecting, eh. Well, I'm wondering why she didn't burn the photos and relieve herself of this "certain inconvenience" - in fact, I believe Tsuruko took them in the first place with her cell phone. She has them, but is not exposing them to the world... it seems she's either saving them for her own pleasures, or keeping them as a large bargaining chip against Yukiatsu. Who knows.

Anh_Minh
2011-05-22, 14:48
He seemed relieved when Tsuruko decided not to use his Menma photos as hostages. Even if this is the guy who runs around in a white sundress at night, he still values his successful life because of his unsuccessful past as merely being part of Jinta's group. The most prevalent example is the flashback to beetle catching - Jinta holds up a massive beetle, while Yukiatsu only has a tiny one. Ever since then, Yukiatsu's been a little obsessed with doing better than Jinta.

He didn't seem relieved to me. First because the subject of blackmail never arose. She could have chosen to release them, but there wasn't anything in particular she wanted from him to blackmail him into. Second because he seemed to me... self-deprecating more than anything. At being reminded that, though he was outwardly great enough to have girls fight over him, he was really screwed up in the head.

Protecting, eh. Well, I'm wondering why she didn't burn the photos and relieve herself of this "certain inconvenience"
The inconvenience I meant was having him around, and so attracting the girls' jealousy.

- in fact, I believe Tsuruko took them in the first place with her cell phone. She has them, but is not exposing them to the world... it seems she's either saving them for her own pleasures, or keeping them as a large bargaining chip against Yukiatsu. Who knows.
That's my read on it too.

karice67
2011-05-22, 17:17
Well, I'm wondering why she didn't burn the photos and relieve herself of this "certain inconvenience" - in fact, I believe Tsuruko took them in the first place with her cell phone. She has them, but is not exposing them to the world... it seems she's either saving them for her own pleasures, or keeping them as a large bargaining chip against Yukiatsu. Who knows.I think she's just talking hypothetically. It's doubtful that she even has photos.

Seiryuu
2011-05-22, 17:27
Which they considered lucky for her. I mean, that's what they were there for, right?


You forget the PTA member who saw her. (And apparently did nothing to help her... Well, whatever.)

I somehow doubt that the word spread that fast purely because someone on the PTA saw and reported her. That would get her in trouble with the school, but I think they'd try to keep things quiet. I suspect it's a bit of a combination of her getting busted and her friends either talking about how she'd gotten together with a guy or speculating that that's why she'd been called in. Anyway, her "friends" obviously didn't know her too well if they just assumed that she'd be glad to take the night to the next level. It should have been rather obvious to the girls that she was not used to that sort of thing, not to mention that her behavior at various times should have told them that there's a guy on her mind. Still, Naruko herself was a little ignorant of her friends' intentions here; if she paid enough attention to them and the things they were saying to recognize what the hopeful outcome of the meeting was, then she most certainly would not have agreed to leave together with the guy. Anyway, she was very lucky here. In that sort of situation she might have even had trouble getting rape charges taken seriously. Her outfit, the situation that had led to the incident, and plenty of other factors would make it look like she was giving the OK. Plenty would think she'd gotten mad about something and decided to either get back at the guy or get something from him through the charge.

Either way, it's horrible for her that one stupid mistake that she got rescued from turned her into a sl*t in the eyes of almost everyone in school.

OceanBlue
2011-05-22, 18:56
That's not necessarily the case. What if the big reveal that Menma was going to make to the rest of the "Super Peace Busters" on that eventful day was that she was enduring abuse at home, and was hoping that her teammates in the "Super Peace Busters" could save her from that?

If so, things start to tie together nicely, in my opinion.

And, to me, melodrama is about making a mountain out of a molehill, or about using an actual mountain for pure shock value alone. If handled correctly, a reveal about child abuse in this anime would not be just shock value, and it's a pretty serious issue that does happen in real life. I'd personally be impressed to see an anime tackle that issue with maturity and seriousness.
What could they do about it? So Menma was abused as a child. Assuming that's the case, there's nothing they can do about it now. Menma is dead, the mother is in a state of grief, and we basically haven't been exposed to her family for any other reason than to expand on the issue of moving on. Having that be the big issue moves the focus from the group to Menma and her family.

How do you think this ties things together? I don't understand how this would be a good decision from a thematic point of view. It could fit in plot-wise. Jintan could be diagnosed with cancer, and there would be a way to fit it in the plot. I don't think either of those fit into the story though, for similar reasons.

I don't know. I personally thought that melodrama was drama created for the sake of drama, regardless of whether or not it's a serious issue or whether or not it happens in real life. That being said, melodramatic or not, there are plenty of serious, real-life issues that I think wouldn't fit into this story.


Basically, I just think that, as an important revelation, it does nothing to further the relationship between the group and does nothing to expand on Menma's wish [in fact, it makes it much more complicated and starts bringing in outside elements], which are the two biggest issues in this anime and what everything has been revolving around.

Sorry if I'm rambling. I tend to do that.

Flower
2011-05-22, 19:14
Seems to me that a large percentage to my speculation has come from the angle of it adding too much extra drama/etc. to the story than there already is. (Which in many ways is bound up with personal taste, which is, of course, fine.)

OceanBlue has correctly identified the speculation as primarily plot related, which it is. It is also true that Jintan's being diagnosed with cancer and the like could be made to fit in the story as a plot device. But I think it would be a lot harder to go back through the previous 6 episodes and show it as consistent as the possibility. And to my mind the possibility of abuse in Menma's home (whether directly at her or between other family members) seems to me a very reasonable possibility that also holds water looking back through the other 6 episodes.

I am in no way trying to persuade people to "like it" if the story does indeed go that way - I was just surprised to suddenly notice a very detailed possible pattern throughout the eps that was catalysted by some things I watched in ep 6. Personal taste wise I would not mind if the story included such elements, because I have faith that the writers would be able to pull it off and do a good job - although it seems many feel either they would not be able to or are not even interested to see them try to pull it off. (Was TM8 that big of a disaster and disappointment?)

Well - all of these speculations are limited to the first half of the season, and I would never have been able to guess it before seeing ep 6. Maybe the latter half will show us even more unexpected surprises, like Madoka consistently pulled off? :D

CWW
2011-05-22, 20:21
I still don't see where it possibly hinted of physical abuse...

Seems to me that there is some form of personal wish-fulfillment involved, which I alluded from your last line. No, I don't need to see it become like Madoka, and frankly, the situations aren't comparable. For one thing, it was pretty obvious from the start that Kyubei didn't have a caring attitude (those eyes gave it away) and secondly, it's Shaft. That's their thing.

Flower
2011-05-22, 20:42
I still don't see where it possibly hinted of physical abuse...

Seems to me that there is some form of personal wish-fulfillment involved, which I alluded from your last line. No, I don't need to see it become like Madoka, and frankly, the situations aren't comparable. For one thing, it was pretty obvious from the start that Kyubei didn't have a caring attitude (those eyes gave it away) and secondly, it's Shaft. That's their thing.

No problem ... admittedly the speculation of some sort of abusive family environment was my own conclusion which I thought might be a logical step from a couple of scenes in ep 6 that struck me. Afaict nowhere in the ep was it blatantly spelled out that my speculation was in fact so.

Wish-fulfillment? Maybe. At the moment it is simply a possible way to interpret things up to now and point to possibilities ahead that seemed to me (and a few others) as a fairly plausible explanation and direction the series might go. In that light (as with any theory) the data can of course be used to "explain away" all sorts of things. And sometimes it seems to "work" because it is "wish fulfillment". But there are rare occasions it works because it either is the correct solution or hits near to the correct explanation. But I don't think either I or others who thought the speculation might be hitting near the mark are so attached to it that we are trying to force others to somehow accept it. Again, apologies if it came across like that. It was merely intended to throw some ideas out there.

As regards Madoka - I was not comparing the two stories nor saying that it "needed to become like that"; I was simply using Madoka as an example of a story plot uncovering itself bit by bit in a way that often took the viewers by surprise, and saying that that principle of taking viewers by surprise could come into play in this series. That was all.

Anyway - more will become clearer with the next ep, I am sure. :)

broken270
2011-05-22, 22:46
I'm surprised that they featured Seikimatsu Occult Gakuin in the beginning when jinta was watching TV, lamenting to himself about what she should do with Menma.

Okay back to topic. So, Jinta decided to take the chance of Menma's wish from before and began to go to school. Optimism or not, he just wanted to find out if this would truly "send her to heaven" as Poppo stated. So, he does to school, yet everyone ignores him, which is normal, seeing that they probably might have forgotten him an is no real concern in their lives. Instead, his surprising appearance is overshadowed by gossip of Anaru with that dude from before. I do not know who leaked out the information, but that is just wrong. Her "friends" aren't helping her, which I am not surprised about. Even during classes, people are whispering about her and the love hotel scene. Jintan sees her misery and immediately points himself out in front of the class. I cannot believe the teacher did not recognize him for a second there. Actually, I can. Anyway, Jintan starts getting off track, and Anaru manages to shut him up and walk away. Going outside does not help the already declining reputation of Anaru. And so, she ends up staying at the club shed.

Poppo decided to go to Menma's place for information on Menma's wish. Jinta has a bad feeling about this, but goes along with in anyway. Her mother is really relived to see her, and the three pray for Menma. Jinta catches a quickly glance of her troubled face. Maybe they should not have gone there at all. Menma's place was cleaned up, which was not surprising. In the end, Poppo received a journal from her, in which the last entry could contain information about what Menma could have wished for. I'm not a big fan of opening up other people's private lives myself, however. Meanwhile, Tsuruko is already having a bad day at prep class. getting talked off by her like that. It looks like the whole cross-dressing incident is just going to be thrown around as a laugh. I guess Yukiatsu was finally able to let thaat part of him go. I am not surprised that his character is one that wants to be the best out of the group no matter what. Tsuruko points out that Menma was the one that wanted to call them over on the day that she died. Could that have any clues as to what exactly was it that Menma wished?

Jinta comes back, but Menma is still there. So much for going to school. Jinta tells her he meet her mom, to which she overreacts to. Menma really cares about others over herself, and Jinta is slightly pissed off from that attitude. I do not know how the nosebleed came in play. Well, at least she stopped crying, but that does not mean there is an awkward atmosphere between them. Jinta decides to head to the shed to cool off, only to meet Anaru in her pajamas. A bad timing for his nosebleed to come out again.

hero147
2011-05-22, 23:44
Did the nosebleed incident remind anybody else of to aru majutsu no index?

Anh_Minh
2011-05-23, 00:13
I somehow doubt that the word spread that fast purely because someone on the PTA saw and reported her. That would get her in trouble with the school, but I think they'd try to keep things quiet. I suspect it's a bit of a combination of her getting busted and her friends either talking about how she'd gotten together with a guy or speculating that that's why she'd been called in.
It could just be parents telling their kids to stay away from Anaru, and why.

DragoonKain3
2011-05-23, 01:08
A bit late... was a bit busy this weekend, being a long weekend and all for my country, not to mention getting ready for a convention this coming week. Anyways...


Unlike most people, my attention was focused on Tsuruko.

Girl A: Minako wanted you to give this to Matsuyuki-kun.
Tsuruko: You're in the same class. Give it to him yourself.
(Translation: Go fark yourselves)
Minako: You're so stuck-up! Do you look down on us because you always get to be by his side?
Tsuruko: Huh?
(Translation: What does being by his side do any good, when all these years he still has not LOOKED at me!?)
Minako: We know! Tsurumi-san you have a crush on Matsuyuki-kun, right?!
Tsuruko: What are you--?
(Translation: --saying? Don't go comparing what I feel to YOUR pathetic little crush, girl.)

I mean, Anaru is too straightforward that its no fun. Tsuruko on the other hand, since most of everything is unsaid, can't resist putting words on her mouth... :heh:

Odd that. Anaru is easy to read because she isn't honest to her feelings, yet Tsuruko being the one who openly shows how she feels is the one hard to figure out what she's thinking.

In any case, glad Tsuruko turned the other girl down. Too many times the childhood friend has been used as the messenger, mainly because childhood friend is too nice for her own good and just can't say no. Sometimes, you just got to be selfish, no? :heh:

Yukiatsu on the otherhand, well, he certainly knows the perfect time to 'save' Tsuruko from her 'rivals, and knows exactly what to say to bring a smile to her face. Almost died from squeeing when he said that he can't fool her no matter what he does, and the satisfied look at Tsuruko's face right after. Plus points for him, though still don't compare to what Jintan did this episode. That's one thing Yukiatsu don't have Jintan beat lol.

applejuice
2011-05-23, 04:31
This episode was an exact reason why I love this animation so much. There is not a single incidents or situations that is wasted for nothing. Anjou's love hotel scene is acting as one of the significant plot point especially in this episode. I really liked this subtle complexity in plot.

Prime
2011-05-23, 17:18
Girl A: Minako wanted you to give this to Matsuyuki-kun.
Tsuruko: You're in the same class. Give it to him yourself.
(Translation: Go fark yourselves)
Minako: You're so stuck-up! Do you look down on us because you always get to be by his side?
Tsuruko: Huh?
(Translation: What does being by his side do any good, when all these years he still has not LOOKED at me!?)
Minako: We know! Tsurumi-san you have a crush on Matsuyuki-kun, right?!
Tsuruko: What are you--?
(Translation: --saying? Don't go comparing what I feel to YOUR pathetic little crush, girl.)

I mean, Anaru is too straightforward that its no fun. Tsuruko on the other hand, since most of everything is unsaid, can't resist putting words on her mouth... :heh:


Yeah, and that's why I love that meganekko xD

But, seriously, I actually can't see "the love" coming from Tsuruko towards Yukiatsu, and as you said, that is why her character is more interesting than any other in this series.

ahelo
2011-05-23, 21:53
Things to point out this episode (http://traveleronrevenge.wordpress.com/2011/05/24/ano-hana-06/)

Also, lol at occult academy reference.

Kaoru Chujo
2011-05-24, 00:40
Well, there must be something unknown going on to explain what Menma wants from the group, and wanted in the past. It is possible to get too dramatic, but it is also possible to have so little drama that things are trite and pointless. Yukiatsu's cross-dressing and Anaru's current situation both show me that the writers are willing to push things pretty far, so cranking up the drama regarding Menma's family life seems possible to me. And it wouldn't seem any more tangential than either of those things, to me.

As for Anaru, I'm continuing to think of her "gal" friends as not very nice people, until I see it proven otherwise. It does seem to me that they are the most likely way the rumors could get to the students. I'm imagining they probably just thought she was careless in being caught. We shall see.

Malkuth
2011-05-24, 05:51
As for Anaru, I'm continuing to think of her "gal" friends as not very nice people, until I see it proven otherwise. It does seem to me that they are the most likely way the rumors could get to the students. I'm imagining they probably just thought she was careless in being caught. We shall see.

Certainly they are not good for her, considering how Naruko is being portrayed during these last few episodes. Generally speaking, they did seem concerned that she was pushing them away in the 5th episode, while in the 6th they at least seem to realize that the trouble she got into was partially their fault, and to me they also looked regretful. Now whether their behaviour is right or wrong, I don't want to easily pass judgement, we practically know nothing about them.

~Yami~
2011-05-24, 09:14
That's it Jintan!!!!! You have done very well.... even though you never attending school to the end.... lol.... this time only attending until the first period.... XD

awww... Jintan and Anaru obviously will make a good couple... and finally I can see a flag about how Anaru will end her friendship with those two bad girls....
Anaru got little tsun-tsun in this episode and the last scene wrapped it all... ^^

I am glad that I don't get any mindbreak in this episode.... and Menma's wish is getting clearer
I love all of the main character... they are unique and developed very well in every episodes