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SilentKnight 2007-06-20 11:31

The Intelligent Hip Hop/ Rap Discussion Thread
Alright, so let's get this started.
Some ground rules to help facilitate a decent discussion.
1. If you come in here and ignorantly bash rap with a simple rap is crap or whatever statement, I WILL request that a mod take some sort of disciplinary action.

2. If you're one of the skeptics to the rap genre, please, politely tell us what it is about the genre that you don't like, what you look for in a song, and what you're currently listening to so that the rap veterans have an idea as to what to aim for.

3. I ask that you guys try to avoid flaming and keep an open mind. Threads like these can often become flame wars simply because one person comes in acting like a douche and so the people in the thread treat him like one. And in this manner the cycle continues.

4. For those that are more well-versed in rap, please try to contribute. One man providing artist suggestions and whatnot for an entire forum can get really difficult and time consuming.

And that should be it for now. Now on with the thread.

Let's face it, rap music is hated by most because of the image that commercialized mainstream rap has produced. Most people see rap as nothing more than unskilled buffoons talking into a mic and promoting drugs, gang violence, immoral materialistic desires, etc.

The purpose of this thread is to spread the word of quality rap music to the masses. To let them know that like every genre of music, rap music also has its good and bad artists.

With that said, I'll start things off by recommending the one artist that has changed most people's perspectives about rap. Sage Francis

Sage Francis is often described as the "thinking man's" version of Eminem, I simply call him a genius. This man is a far cry from your traditional rapper, a few listens should convince you of this fact. Insane wordplay, witty satire, excellent fusion of poetic lyrics with a rap flow, some sweet instrumentals, and always a conscious message.

If anyone wishes to hear some samples of Sage Francis, post up.

I lack sleep at the moment, so I'll recommend a bunch of other artists a bit later.

Azurexsky 2007-06-20 12:23

i love alot of artists from Stone Throw(mf doom, madlib, etc.), thats about it for hip hop for me though.

Sinestra 2007-06-20 12:32

Im more of a fan of old skool rap Tribe called quest, Common, Run DMC. Most Rap these days does not suit my taste. I feel that most rap is not actually saying anything or dicussing issues. Lets be real some artiest will throw a sample on throw some BS lyrics in and some curse words and thats a song I dont like that its not creative. I wish we could go back to the roots of what Rap/Hip Hop came from. But for the most part i like a good beat anything by Nas and even thought they are in the 40's now i still love Bone Thugs.

Also, I want to say Silentknight great job creating the thread and yes Sage Francis is great artiest. Kudos my friend

CeDeR 2007-06-20 12:39

i like to listen to 2-pac,snoop and dr dre..maybe some jay-z
and i like latin hip-hop.ocasionally the rap hits in the clubs and thats it.

kauldron26 2007-06-20 16:03

a tribe called quest is godly. anyone here love the roots?? im looking forward to talib kweli's new album

Akeval 2007-06-20 16:30

I think if you want intelligence in rap you should give Deltron a shot, i love his music.

That opened my eyes. After listening to his CD i knew there was something in RAP that i could actually like

Westlo 2007-06-20 18:46

Talib Kweli still hasn't released a quality solo album imo, his highpoint was definately Balckstar with the Eternal Reflection album closely following it.

If I had to make a best of Nas cd I don't think anything after Stillmatic except for maybe Let there be light would make it.

Jay-Z hasn't been the same the last few years, his voice has lost it's arrogance and complete confidence it use to carry and he just dials in performances but I guess it's hard to be hungry when you're a CEO and have Betonce....

Bone Thugs new album is meh, too much Swizz Beats and wtf at bow wow.. he wrecked that mariah collabo which is usually great between her and bone.

Kaioshin Sama 2007-06-20 19:08

I'm a supporter of rap as a medium when the artist is trying to convey some sort of socially relevant message. For example Coolio's Gangsta's Paradise, which I take to be a rant against the entrapment and dead end lifestyle of gangsterism is one of my most respected pieces of music. However, when you're talking about Gangsta Rap which seems to serve no purpose other than to brag about how quickly you'll kill someone with your gun, I just have to shake my head and chuckle, because it's so lame.

I used to really hate rap, but I've come to tolerate most forms of it in recent years after I found something I dislike ten times worse. Now I really don't mind it at all other than maybe 50 Cent's music.

SilentKnight 2007-06-20 19:51

I posted this idea of mine earlier, but apparently double posting gets your second post deleted.
I was thinking that I or someone else could throw together a nice compilation of select tracks and make a mixtape for those unfamiliar with rap to sample.

Shadow Miko 2007-06-20 22:50

My mom is really into Rap and hip hop. The only stuff I can say I like is...ummm...BEP and Eminem. Do they count?

SilentKnight 2007-06-20 23:15


Originally Posted by Shadow Miko (Post 1003920)
My mom is really into Rap and hip hop. The only stuff I can say I like is...ummm...BEP and Eminem. Do they count?

BEP and Eminem count. They're both more mainstream and commercialized and from my viewpoint rather mediocre in terms of quality. For Eminem I recommend only listening to Slim Shady LP or earlier as that's when he still has his clever punchlines and whatnot.

deviousj 2007-06-20 23:41

Well, I barely listen to hip hop nowadays, but it still pisses me off when people declare all hip hop as uninteresting crap. When I was still an avid listener I liked Kweli a lot. Black Star was one of my favorite albums, and Thieves in the Night was one of my favorite tracks ever - Mos' verse on that track was ridiculous. Reflection Eternal was a great album. The Manifesto was tight as well. Last Emperor's One Life is amazing as well. I loved Nas' earlier stuff as well; Illmatic is probably my favorite album. Of course, there's Rakim; what can I say about him that hasn't been already said. I love Public Enemy as well.

Mueti 2007-06-21 11:10


Originally Posted by kauldron26 (Post 1003390)
a tribe called quest is godly. anyone here love the roots?? im looking forward to talib kweli's new album

I wholeheartedly agree. A Tribe Called Quest are indeed godly. And I like the roots, I don't know much of their stuff yet though.


Originally Posted by Akeval (Post 1003428)
I think if you want intelligence in rap you should give Deltron a shot, i love his music.

Are you talking about Deltron 3030 or is Deltron some different artist? If you mean 3030, yes they (he?^^) are awesome. One of my favorite hip-hop artists as well.

My absolute favorite among hip-hop and rap is probably madvillain, I could listen to their album non-stop, can't wait for a second one. I guess I should check out MF Doom solo as well.

SilentKnight 2007-06-22 12:57

I only recently came across Solilliquists of Sound. Quality stuff, DiVinci is a freaking genius with the MPC. Anyone who doesn't consider the drum machine or whatnot an instrument should check this video out.

retardation 2007-06-23 01:49

deltron is actually the group name and deltron is del's name in the context of the group. deltron 3030 is like the ultimate nerd rap album.

the new common bout to drop soon. i'm pretty excited.

i'm also feeling lupe fiasco right now for intelligent rap. kinda feeling that whole chi scene right now.

bronze nazareth recent album is not too old. i'm still giving that some listens.

i said this last time around in the last hip hop thread. not really feeling sage francis flow... putting too many words in the bar. plus his voice sounds real gay (no offense to you yuri folks).

elusive 2007-06-26 21:30

the problem w/those that want to get into rap is that it's easy to get lost in the lyrics. great rappers use a lot of metaphors/similes and techniques that a novice won't get. that's why mainstream rap is so simple and dumbed down.

if you're willing to give rap a try i suggest:

1)Lupe Fiasco: he's a nerd who's into anime, a skater, doesn't curse, a devout muslim, intelligent, very lyrical, addresses social ills

-check out his song "kick,push" which is about skateboarding (and a metaphor for life), his album Food & Liquor, and his Revenge of the Nerd mixtape

2)MF DOOM: nerds/comic book readers will love him, his song are never about much but he's great, funny, wears a Doctor Doom style mask, does voices for Adult Swim shows

-check out MM...FOOD and DangerDoom (Adult Swim album)

3)get some De La Soul or A Tribe Called Quest both are really fun, lighthearted, and smart

4)Talib Kweli and Common: really socially concious and intelligent, lots of meaningful songs

5)Count Bass D: indie artist, raps and produces, average joe/everyman type of guy
-check out his album "Dwight Spitz"

6)Nujabes: japanese producer, did a lot of the Samurai Champloo OST, jazzy
-get Metaphorical Music and Modal Soul

7)The Roots: one of the best live bands, they've played w/everyone from Prince to John Mayer

For real hip hoppers, check out Blu & Exile's album "Below the Heavens"

Fragment 2007-06-27 12:55

I wouldn't choose rap over hip/pop, but if you're looking for some good rap I reccomend HOME MADE KAZOKU.

funk 2007-06-27 17:12


Originally Posted by kauldron26 (Post 1003390)
a tribe called quest is godly. anyone here love the roots?? im looking forward to talib kweli's new album

are the roots still making music? =o

When i was in middle school and into rap, the roots were one of my favourite bands. Really soul-full music.

Heh, when i came into this thread i thought it was gonna be about japanese rap artists like def-row, or sorta like flo, but i guess they are more popish.

As for my matured opinion of rap. Usually it stands for everything i hate. Alot of oldschool rap was about being good at rapping, hanging out, or about nothing at all! Which was cool and fun. Now i find alot of it is just egotistic ignorance. I'm not a fan of nickelback or whoever made this song, but i love this quote: "if everyone learned and nobody lied, if everyone shared and swallowed their pride... then we'd see the day when nobody died." It's not true in entirety, but in theory and everything i hear in rap is saying "hey im better than you, and stop rapping cause this is my scene, blah blah I'm an idiot." It's all the ignorance that makes me glad im on the south side of detroit river (Canadian side).

Sorry i got carried away, but it angers me because pop appears to be in the process of being taken over by rap, which just makes japanese music that much more appealing.

jonram91 2007-06-27 17:32

I've been looking for a bit and i can't seem to find too many good rap love songs. Does anybody know of any good ones?

Inu_Sess__ 2007-06-28 14:45

You can never go wrong with The Pharcyde or A Tribe Called Quest when it comes to quality hip/hop that is not crunk. If you're looking for fun style rap, check out laptop rappers MC Chris and MC Lars, both very intelligent, funny, and very geeky.

Edit: Some how I forgot to mention Jurassic 5. Jurassic 5 is my favorite hip hop group, and Quality Control is an excellent album.

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