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-   -   Naruto the Sequel - Speculation Thread concerning the future of the Naruto Franchise (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=131205)

kitten320 2015-04-26 09:46

Children designs are plain bad, their personalities are not original. Boruto is another prankster Naruto and Sarada a mean ass Uchiha. He could have at least given them different characteristics from their fathers or have them be friends for once. The only interesting character in new generation is Chouji's daughter. Her design is ok and her personality is a bit refreshing too.

The last 2 chapters of the original were bad, can't believe Kishi actually plans to expand on it. That explains why everyone gave birth in one year, money -_-

Kishi made a bad conclusion just so he could squeeze more money from people! I have no respect for that.

So yeh, I'm definitely not bothering with this.


And Kakashi's face should have been revealed years ago when people actually cared.

kampfer91 2015-04-26 10:25

You begin to sounds like those salty fans who keep posting nonsense , baseless rant :twitch:

Quote:

Children designs are plain bad, their personalities are not original. Boruto is another prankster Naruto and Sarada a mean ass Uchiha. He could have at least given them different characteristics from their fathers or have them be friends for once. The only interesting character in new generation is Chouji's daughter. Her design is ok and her personality is a bit refreshing too.
Nope , no one is orginal in here , Naruto having Kushina bad temper , Sasuke have serious personality just like his father , Shikamaru just like his dad , even his looks . The only reason why everyone think Chouchou is different because we didn't get to see Kaori much.
Let say , Boruto took after his mother personality , everyone still have reason to rant about it , mainly Hinata is a boring person , so does Boruto .

Quote:

The last 2 chapters of the original were bad, can't believe Kishi actually plans to expand on it. That explains why everyone gave birth in one year, money -_-
He had written Naruto for 15 years , so it's time for the conclusion of everything , and tell me , how many manga artist nowadays write the ending that show the future of every character ? I fed up with the cliff hanger ending in which nothing is solved , everyone keep continuing with their everyday life , no one know who end up with who .
Which , also because of the pairing war that plague the manga , everyone want their OPT win , they will do everything , including threatening the author .

Quote:

Kishi made a bad conclusion just so he could squeeze more money from people! I have no respect for that.
You don't work in manga / anime industry in Japan , Kishimoto didn't receive more pennies for making NaruHina , he planed it a long time ago , he slowly showed why NaruHina is the best and Japanese agreed about it , and Japaneses are happy with the conclusion of Naruto .

I hate those comment about Kishimoto write NaruHina so that he can steal moar moneys , from who anyway ? You let your hate blind you , you don't live in Japan , you don't work in Japan , you don't know how !@#$ the life of a manga artist and animator is . As a person who work in this field , i respect Kishimoto and his work .

Quote:

So yeh, I'm definitely not bothering with this.
So may be you don't need to visit this thread if it bothering you .
Quote:


And Kakashi's face should have been revealed years ago when people actually cared.
and today ppl still curious about his face .

Luminer Astartes 2015-04-26 11:50

This post fascinates me, so I might as well break it down as much as possible.
*Down whiskey glass*
Ho-kay, let's do this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
Children designs are plain bad

Subjective opinion and therefore not fact. I'm sure many find them anything from adorable to interesting. Next!

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
their personalities are not original. Boruto is another prankster Naruto and Sarada a mean ass Uchiha

And you draw this bold conclusion based on, what exactly? We've had ch.700 which mostly focused on the changes that happened in the Naruto-verse as opposed to Boruto himself while this new one focused on Sarada. Hardly the amount of time needed to determine what these characters' personalities are.

Also from what was shown, she's far away from being a "mean ass Uchiha". She's hardly smug and despite her frustrations over her parentage (which has now come into question) puts emphasis on family. She has displayed neither Sakura's explosive anger issues or her father's perpetual stoicism. Does this mean she won't later show these qualities or doesn't already have them? No. Like any character, she can undergo character development depending on the writer. But that requires time and we've not spent enough of it with these characters to know them in full.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
He could have at least given them different characteristics from their fathers or have them be friends for once.

And how do we know they are not friends? Just because someone is a rival doesn't make them "not friend". For the characteristics, I feel like comparing the kids to their parents is going to be inevitable but I feel like we should judge them as separate until we see more. Hell, if the idea that Boruto is a confident prodigy is legit then that already makes him far and above different from either Naruto (our no-talent knucklehead) and Hinata (the epitome of self-depreciation).

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
The last 2 chapters of the original were bad, can't believe Kishi actually plans to expand on it. That explains why everyone gave birth in one year, money -_-

Kishi made a bad conclusion just so he could squeeze more money from people! I have no respect for that.

Baseless accusation with no proof. No different from the butthurt shippers who didn't get their wish and decided to vent by calling him every insult in the book because they didn't get what they wanted. Next!

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
So yeh, I'm definitely not bothering with this.

Oh good. Don't let the proverbial door hit you on your way out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
And Kakashi's face should have been revealed years ago when people actually cared.

People to this day still care. I just spent a whole hour talking to a friend overseas who was dying to know what was underneath that mask even after he long since stopped following the series due to a lack of time and interest.

Avalon64 2015-04-26 12:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by kampfer91 (Post 5515012)
You begin to sounds like those salty fans who keep posting nonsense , baseless rant :twitch:


Nope , no one is orginal in here , Naruto having Kushina bad temper , Sasuke have serious personality just like his father , Shikamaru just like his dad , even his looks . The only reason why everyone think Chouchou is different because we didn't get to see Kaori much.
Let say , Boruto took after his mother personality , everyone still have reason to rant about it , mainly Hinata is a boring person , so does Boruto .


He had written Naruto for 15 years , so it's time for the conclusion of everything , and tell me , how many manga artist nowadays write the ending that show the future of every character ? I fed up with the cliff hanger ending in which nothing is solved , everyone keep continuing with their everyday life , no one know who end up with who .
Which , also because of the pairing war that plague the manga , everyone want their OPT win , they will do everything , including threatening the author .


You don't work in manga / anime industry in Japan , Kishimoto didn't receive more pennies for making NaruHina , he planed it a long time ago , he slowly showed why NaruHina is the best and Japanese agreed about it , and Japaneses are happy with the conclusion of Naruto .

I hate those comment about Kishimoto write NaruHina so that he can steal moar moneys , from who anyway ? You let your hate blind you , you don't live in Japan , you don't work in Japan , you don't know how !@#$ the life of a manga artist and animator is . As a person who work in this field , i respect Kishimoto and his work .


So may be you don't need to visit this thread if it bothering you .

and today ppl still curious about his face .

correction Kampfer, this person isn't sounding salty, this person IS salty...plain and simple they didn't get what they want (the series to end when THEY wanted) so this person feels like an entitled hipster and does nothing but complain about how much they hate it expecting people to care...the problem is this person is going to a FAN BOARD and telling us how much they hate this sequel which is BARELY even out I must add, I just have to laugh this person is claiming how they won't give this sequel a chance yet takes the time to write posts on like I said a FAN BOARD about how they won't give it a chance...that is just a sad cry for attention...and I won't be surprised if they respond to what we say to respond how they should feel justified about hating the sequel they never gave a chance to

you know what was so annoying? Going to Mortal Kombat X boards before the game came out and hearing people complain how the new characters were bad copies of the old characters and they weren't going to give the game a chance oh but they felt they NEEDED to tell people this on fanboards thinking the people who do want to play is going to care, same thing here...

Anyway series is barely out, I really hope we see what Himawari can do lol I jsut have a feeling she was created for a purpose a REALLY special one

and Luminer for your Inojin idea but what if Inojin gets stuck in the body of his creation and starts having an existential crisis about whether he's alive or not and goes berserk? (Lol SO referencing an old episode of G1 Transformers, I'll give you a cookie if you maange to guess the episode lol)

Luminer Astartes 2015-04-26 12:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avalon64 (Post 5515093)
and Luminer for your Inojin idea but what if Inojin gets stuck in the body of his creation and starts having an existential crisis about whether he's alive or not and goes berserk? (Lol SO referencing an old episode of G1 Transformers, I'll give you a cookie if you maange to guess the episode lol)

No cookie for me, sorry. I grew up with Transformers but unfortunately it has been a very long time since I watched G1. All I know these days is that Optimus Prime is my favorite character of all time and that Peter Cullen is my favorite voice actor because of it.

As for Inojin, it was only an idea I had and maybe not all that well thought out. I was going more with that fact that since his drawing's are less "refined" than Sai's, he'd need to mentally operate them by switching his mind with them.

cyberdemon 2015-04-26 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5514969)
And Kakashi's face should have been revealed years ago when people actually cared.

surprisingly it was revealed to us years ago by Pakkun. No one believed it lol

https://40.media.tumblr.com/f96ca9bb...rehraq_540.png

kenjiharima 2015-04-26 16:07

I don't remember that chapter, what chapter was that?

kitten320 2015-04-27 07:28

Ok let's get it straight. This is a discussion thread where you write down your opinion. OPINION! It does not say positive opinion or that I have to sugar coat everything, I have the right to say what I think even if your little paradise bubble gets broken in the process. I'm not over stepping any lines here. By calling me bitter, you are not making yourself look good. If I'm bitter in your eyes then you are blinded in mine.

1) When characters came out, the initial response was "Plain and not original", even "ugly". Boruto is still made fun off for his banana hair. People criticized Ino/Sai kid for having bright blonde hair that totally does not work. Just because you got used to them, does not mean they got better. It's psychology, the more you see someone, the more beautiful they get in your mind.

2) When it comes to original characters, we barely even saw their parents so it was not in your face. And even those differed. Shikadai is literally Shikamaru's copy. At lest he has Temari's eyes. Here it is. Besides since when does Naruto have Kushina's temper? Sakura is far more of Kushina's replica than Naruo. Naruto inherited both parents traits.

But ok, I'll let it be. As you said only 1 chapter is out. But first impression was not the best of these characters for me.

3) Ok, why exactly are you focusing this on NaruHina when I said bad conclusion? If my opinion is of a bitter shipper, then yours are of happy shippers cause you got what you wanted and don't care about how bad it was presented.

Let'a get things straight. One of the reasons why I started to watch Naruto years back, was because of NaruHina and SasuSaku, cause back then I felt that these could really work out. But then came Shippuden.

NaruHina got completely ignored until Pain arc and then ignored again after. Naruto never even once talked to Hinata about what happened and her confession. People go "But he transformed! That's cause he loves her!" NO! That's cause Naruto is a kind person and no matter who it would be in Hinata's place, he would react the same.

Then in the middle of a war it's like Kishi suddenly remembered that Hinata exists and started to give NaruHina more interactions. Not very logical ones, sudden hand holding and all that. But whatever.

SasuSaku was a complete disaster. Till last chapter Sakura never saw Sasuke as abusive asshole even though he tried to murder her and all his friends 50 times over. Sasuke only helped Konoha cause it was beneficial to him, not cause he cared. If Madara's goals lined up with his, he would murder everyone in a heartbeat. And then in last 2 chapters Kishi tried to make it look like Sasuke actually cared and after one small sorry he is fully forgiven, like what? No punishment, nothing? Kishi loves Sasuke way too much. Want to see a positive avenger? Check out Kurapika from Hunter x Hunter. Now that's a vengeance full character who does care for friends.

And then we have NaruSaku that started as a "no no" cause Sakura was a mean, idiotic shit to Naruto. But over the cause of series, especially Shippuden, she came to respect him. To care for him, to be protective of him while Naruto still kept liking her. Call NaruSaku shippers bitter as much as you want but that ship actually was build up and developed. But for some reason Kishi decided to put all that build up to the side and bring dusty Hinata back into picture when series were almost over and have everyone magically forgive Sasuke and have him "secretly care for Sakura". Who cares that he almost murdered her 50 times over.

I'm sorry but I'll take well developed NaruSaku over dusty NaruHina and enforced SasuSaku any day now. Back in season 1 it would be other way around.

As you said, it was a 15 year running manga and Kishi wanted to finish it so he went for a fanfiction type of ending where he ignored logic, squeezed everything in 2 chapters and gave what majority wanted without any build up and that's extremely popular SasuSaku, NaruHina and kids of the same age so he could build upon it. Cause who would bother if kids were of different age and didn't really know each other?

Kishi showed after effects of war and how world changed? No he didn't. He wrote a fanfiction. We never saw Suna land or any other lands. We never saw what happened to their policies, and what actual changes happened in Ninja world. All we saw were tons of ships, Kage Naruto and that there is peace right now. That's it. We got nothing from that ending part from ships.

Kishi was after money. Otherwise he would try harder here. If he really planned SasuSaku and NaruHina from a get go, then he should have made it more obvious over course of the series, not in the last few chapters. He should have given them just as much attention if not more as NaruSaku. He didn't. He just quickly put one and two together and went "Yeh I planned it".... yeh right...


cyberdemon
Ah yeh kinda remember seeing it in the episode. Ok I'll give Kishi thumbs up here for positive trolling. Well done on his part here.

Avalon64 2015-04-27 07:51

and let me get this straight it might be a discussion board but this is a board for fans nonetheless, so far your recent comments have been baseless and without backing or proof, you say you don't want to give the sequel a chance and yet you took the very time to post about how you weren't going to give it a chance, you say this is all a money grab, even if there is ANY hint of that why should we the fans who want to read the manga should or have to care about your feelings about that? You came across as someone who is saying this is bad, this is why I personally think its bad and this is why you shouldn't read it (even if you don't say it directly why else do you keep making so many negative comments? You want someone to agree with you that's why)

Kishimoto isn't perfect, no writer ever is but when you choose to be a fan you accept the good and the bad oh and while yes when he releases statements or interviews about how he came to decisions for the direction of the series, you can choose to say he's a liar, oh then so let me get this straight then? They are not liars for series YOU liked and YOU thought was perfect right? But as long as you disliked what was written there is NO way that what he said like NaruHina was his plan from the start can possibly be true oh and people are gullible for believing him and his "fanfiction". You know instead of telling us whether Kishimoto is a liar and is doing this for the money, why don't you let fans come to the conclusion on their own instead of you FEELING the need to tell us? How does this is a cash grab in ANY way should be used as a critique on the sequel? Sure it might influence YOUR decision and whatever if it does but the fact you are using it as an actual point of argument shows lack of actual evidence in your argument, cause guess what? This can be said for anything, hey I think JK Rowling is a liar and the ending she chose for Harry potter is pure fanfiction! Does it make it true? No it doesn't, this is personal opinion and can't be regarded as truth so stop pushing it as truth

I have no idea what boards you hang out, probably people that hated how the series ended like you to come up with such opinions, because the places I went to thought ALOT of the designs were adorable like Boruto or Himawari's, sure jokes were cracked about similarities but when a sequel was announced alot of people I discussed said they were intrigued to see what was next, cause guess what this is the internet, you're going to get those so called fans that hate everything just for the sake of hating it, that's why I gave the Mortal Kombat X example, people are so wrapped up trying to find something to complain about and then try to convince themselves that everyone thinks like that

There is a difference with being constructive and just being I don't like this so I'm just going to rant about how bad it is, you're right you don't have to sugar coat it BUT instead of talking ALL about what you hate, hey why don't you talk about something positive and something you like amoung all that? But whatever, I predicted exactly that despite saying yeah I am not going to give the sequel a chance, that you'd come right back and post another I dislike Kishimoto for the story not being how I wanted it..it's so predictable, and no doubt when you read this you are thinking about how much of a "blind fanboy" I am, whatever at least when I come here I talk about what I both like AND dislike or what I hope or predict to see in the future, it comes as a package when giving a REAL discussion not this "I hate this and that" lecture you're doing, and I have feeling for someone who said I am not going to bother with the sequel you are going to be clinging around here, to keep reminding us about how much you hate it and again you're going to see that around here you are the minority that feels like this

And you talk about how the first impression didn't work out for you? How could it you already decided this sequel wasn't going to even work, and passed judgement on it, you decided before anything was even written you were going to hate it, that's why we aren't taking your comments seriously, and this should be something for you to consider

kampfer91 2015-04-27 08:17

Quote:

Kishi was after money. Otherwise he would try harder here. If he really planned SasuSaku and NaruHina from a get go, then he should have made it more obvious over course of the series, not in the last few chapters. He should have given them just as much attention if not more as NaruSaku. He didn't. He just quickly put one and two together and went "Yeh I planned it".... yeh right...
I should have known.....
Another piece of trash called NS fan delusion .

Let's me ask you all , do you know Kishi 's bank account ? To give Kishi your money so that you can bash him for stealing everyone money .

You clearly don't and will never accept anything beside your so called faked NS .

And NH / SS is pretty much accept by the majority of Japanese , you may as well insult them all , oh , and they didn't give money to Kishi , how terrible .

This is what Sawyer think about you guys
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GC3R6REw3z4

kitten320 2015-04-27 09:41

You people keep responding, what else am I meant to do? Never said you should not read it, I simply do not understand why anyone would want to read it. I have yet to find any legit explanation to that.

I'm not forcing opinion on anyone but I know how majority of fandoms are, they do not think. If they get what they want, they don't care about how it was handled and just go around screaming CANON! Their brain stops functioning. Just because I ship something, does not mean I accept everything that is thrown my way with them. If it's done bad then it's done bad. It gives me no satisfaction in knowing that my fave ship is canon if it was built on bullshit.

Want to talk about HP? Ok. Yes ending was very positive, a bit too positive for my liking but guess what? I do not hate it. Because events naturally lead to it. I dislike Ginny/Harry ship but it's been developed since book 2 and naturally brought the two together. Same as Hermione/Ron that was hinted on since book 4 and developed over time. Draco did not change over night, he showed fear and several positive traits as series progressed. It is his friends who suggested killing and all, Draco was reluctant when it actually came down to it.

Everything we got in HP ending was developed over a course of the series. I do not like Harry/Ginny pairing but I am not bitter over it cause it was developed, it was there all the time. Draco did not become positive over night either with one small sorry.

Can you say same thing about Naruto ending cause I definitely can't.

Me disliking this or that ship has nothing to do with my dislike for the ending. Not to mention that I did originally support SasuSaku and NaruHina with all my might. Shit development made me stop carrying.


"try to convince themselves that everyone thinks like that "

You do realize you are doing exactly the same? You are so wrapped up in idea that this is good and that there are people who agree what means everyone should. If they don't, they are wrong.
You are doing exactly same thing but reverse.


You really don't know people, do you? Why would I pop back here every week and say same thing over and over when I said I won't bother. I'm replying cause you are replying.

No constructive criticism? I think I gave clear explanation on what is wrong with the ending and development of main ships. Naruto stopped being interesting the moment Obito was revealed cause it all turned into super power battle from then on with no real plot. I skipped quiet a lot of chapters back then but hey! Did you see me posting every chapter complaining how bad it is? No, so stop putting words in my mouth.

Want to see well develop pairing in Naruto, take a look at ShikaTema who was hinted on pretty much from their first fight together and was naturally developed into friendship that eventually had hints of something more. It was constant from a get go and these two live miles apart. And yet Kishi could not give same development to NaruHina that lived almost next to each other. And they are the main pairing unlike ShikaTema.


If a first episode of a new show does not present anything entertaining to you, will you bother with the show when there are 10 others that did get you engaged?
If you did not like how season 1 ended, will you bother with season 2 in most cases? I really doubt that.


kampfer91
Clearly that's the only paragraph you read. And going by your response and signature, you are a massive NaruHina fan. I won't even bother.

The only thing I'll say is: just because there are lots of people who support something, does not mean it's good. Zutara from ATLA fandom still has the biggest fan base but since there was no romantic development between the two, creators never put them together at the end despite how many fans wanted it. They focused on Kataang, they developed it and they stayed with it. No jumping around right at the end. And I don't even care about Kataang.

shadow1296 2015-04-27 09:59

kitten stop just stop it been more than half a year accept the ending and move on already, it doesn't help anyone and all you are doing is complaining about something that won't change and it eventually going to get a mod involved, also your beating a dead horse along with the other who are might be the reason kishi started the sequal the way he did

Avalon64 2015-04-27 10:03

You reacted and responded just as I predicted, trying to turn everything around and try to turn it back on me but the key difference is I understand that there ware fans trying to enjoy something and while I will crack jokes about the things I don't like I largely try to respect the beliefs that the ones that do, I don't send a whole post about this is why I hate things...I say the good and bad

And dude I wasn't turning it into a Harry Potter discussion, just using it as an example of anybody can turn any popular fiction into this is why I dislike it piece, it doesn't matter if its a 7 Book series or a 700 chapter manga, I can call it all a cash grab, but you proved my point you liked Harry potter that's why you are going to say its so well developed and hence its not a legitimate argument, people want to like what they want to like and you aren't respecting that even now you are saying oh Harry potter is so much better written then Naruto, who cares in the end something is good just as long as the fan wants to like it

and the reason "you people" keep responding is because we are trying to show our appreciation for this series and trying to remain positive, maybe we are not as "blind" as you think, maybe we do like it and like how it is written and want to show how much we like it, have you ever thought of that? Regardless if we got the canon ending we wanted, why can't you accept maybe some of us want to like Naruto for what it is? You however shouldn't have a reason to keep posting your negativity, you said your piece and fine you don't like it, some of us said our thoughts about how we don't agree with you in my first response to you I tried to be polite I said if you don't like it fine please don't be a downer to the ones who want to enjoy it, yet you keep talking about how much you hated it so yes regardless of how much you deny it you are trying to get people to agree with you, you largely come across as hating it and not giving it a chance, your comments about not liking Season 1 so Season 2 won't be any better is proof of that. I don't think like you, if I don't like something that much then I stop watching, and leave it for fans who wants to enjoy it, but if I don't like it but don't totally hate it, I will give the next season a clean slate, but you still persist on commenting more even after you said you weren't going to give the sequel a chance, all you are doing is finding excuses to spread more negativity, so you're using the oh but someone responded to me so I HAVE to respond to them back, again the difference is here is we're reading the sequel and you are not...maybe if you say you will read the sequel with an open mind maybe I'll actually take anything you have to say with any legitimacy

cyberdemon 2015-04-27 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5515829)
I'm sorry but I'll take well developed NaruSaku over dusty NaruHina and enforced SasuSaku any day now. Back in season 1 it would be other way around.

except NaruSaku was not developed in ANY romantic sense. With the exception of the very beginning of the manga where they became friends and she softened up to him, they remained JUST friends. Sakura never took to looking at Naruto in a romantic light and Naruto "crush" on Sakura became a joke (and a joke he liked playing around with since he only seemed to like teasing her at the end). They had become like a brother and sister and that is really blatant in the manga.

NaruHina was actually much more blatant about the progress in their relationship. In the beginning you see Naruto thinking that Hinata was weird. Then you see him appreciating her and her abilities and resolve. You see the point he becomes much more aware of her as a woman after the Pain arc even if it was put to the side. You see how he starts relying on her for support when he was at his weakest points. They may not have the amount of time together as NaruSaku since they are on different teams but compared to NaruSaku, NaruHina ALWAYS had develoment when they were together.

kitten320 2015-04-27 10:55

Avalon64
As expected you don't even bother to read.

I list why HP ending worked and why I had no problem about it in comparison to Naruto. You ignore it and bring in money that I did not even mention there. I never finished book 6 and never bothered with book 7 so I'll repeat again: DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH.
I lost interest in HP series before they were finished, did not stop me from respecting an ending to which events of the series naturally lead to.

I list ShikaTema as a good developed example in Naruto, it flies over your head.

You being nice to me? You are not even reading what I write so I won't bother with you any more. Pointless.


cyberdemon
Yes Sakura did not show romantic interest but know what stopped her?
"It would be wrong for Sakura to move on from Sasuke" Kishi's words. He ignored all build up and potential NaruSaku had because of his sexist logic. How dare a woman stop carrying about a man who tried to murder her. But hey, it's ok for Sasuke to be a prick and try to kill his friends and abandon his family and daughter, after all he is Kishi's fave man.

All Kishi had to do was give Sakura brains so she would tell Sasuke to fuck off for being an ass hole and move on. That's it. That's literally all that was needed to make NaruSaku work romantically. For Sakura to move on.


It's natural to think that someone is weird if they are weird and then change your mind when you get to know them better.

"You see the point he becomes much more aware of her as a woman after the Pain arc"

Where?

Naruto relied on whole village, not just Hinata.

cyberdemon 2015-04-27 10:59

Ignoring things or pretending they don't happen isn't helping any of your arguments.

Ultragunner 2015-04-27 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5515926)
You people keep responding, what else am I meant to do? Never said you should not read it, I simply do not understand why anyone would want to read it. I have yet to find any legit explanation to that.

I'm not forcing opinion on anyone but I know how majority of fandoms are, they do not think. If they get what they want, they don't care about how it was handled and just go around screaming CANON! Their brain stops functioning. Just because I ship something, does not mean I accept everything that is thrown my way with them. If it's done bad then it's done bad. It gives me no satisfaction in knowing that my fave ship is canon if it was built on bullshit.

Want to talk about HP? Ok. Yes ending was very positive, a bit too positive for my liking but guess what? I do not hate it. Because events naturally lead to it. I dislike Ginny/Harry ship but it's been developed since book 2 and naturally brought the two together. Same as Hermione/Ron that was hinted on since book 4 and developed over time. Draco did not change over night, he showed fear and several positive traits as series progressed. It is his friends who suggested killing and all, Draco was reluctant when it actually came down to it.

Everything we got in HP ending was developed over a course of the series. I do not like Harry/Ginny pairing but I am not bitter over it cause it was developed, it was there all the time. Draco did not become positive over night either with one small sorry.

Can you say same thing about Naruto ending cause I definitely can't.

Me disliking this or that ship has nothing to do with my dislike for the ending. Not to mention that I did originally support SasuSaku and NaruHina with all my might. Shit development made me stop carrying.


"try to convince themselves that everyone thinks like that "

You do realize you are doing exactly the same? You are so wrapped up in idea that this is good and that there are people who agree what means everyone should. If they don't, they are wrong.
You are doing exactly same thing but reverse.


You really don't know people, do you? Why would I pop back here every week and say same thing over and over when I said I won't bother. I'm replying cause you are replying.

No constructive criticism? I think I gave clear explanation on what is wrong with the ending and development of main ships. Naruto stopped being interesting the moment Obito was revealed cause it all turned into super power battle from then on with no real plot. I skipped quiet a lot of chapters back then but hey! Did you see me posting every chapter complaining how bad it is? No, so stop putting words in my mouth.

Want to see well develop pairing in Naruto, take a look at ShikaTema who was hinted on pretty much from their first fight together and was naturally developed into friendship that eventually had hints of something more. It was constant from a get go and these two live miles apart. And yet Kishi could not give same development to NaruHina that lived almost next to each other. And they are the main pairing unlike ShikaTema.


If a first episode of a new show does not present anything entertaining to you, will you bother with the show when there are 10 others that did get you engaged?
If you did not like how season 1 ended, will you bother with season 2 in most cases? I really doubt that.


kampfer91
Clearly that's the only paragraph you read. And going by your response and signature, you are a massive NaruHina fan. I won't even bother.

The only thing I'll say is: just because there are lots of people who support something, does not mean it's good. Zutara from ATLA fandom still has the biggest fan base but since there was no romantic development between the two, creators never put them together at the end despite how many fans wanted it. They focused on Kataang, they developed it and they stayed with it. No jumping around right at the end. And I don't even care about Kataang.

First of all, allow me to say something about the second bolded line in your quote: "I AGREE 100%!!!!" just something popular doesn't mean it's good.

But back to the 1st bolded line, I'd argue that NaruHina already had plenty of developments before the last chapter (or before The Last movie):

_ Naruto cheering for Hinata during her fight against Neji despite her not being in the same team as him like Sakura was (granted it was Neji that pissed Naruto off in the 1st place),
_ Naruto vows to beat Neji both because of Neji being a dick and for Hinata,
_ during Pain invasion of the village Hinata was the only one who rushed to rescue Naruto (Sakura DID NOT MOVE!!) despite she was fully aware that the enemy was beyond her,
_ during the war, after Neji died, Hinata was the one that snaped Naruto back into reality and give some the encouragement that he needed (did Sakura do that?)

all of these combined with the fact that Hinata has always held Naruto dear to her heart, and as an inspiration for her to become better.

=> despite not sharing much screen time together, there HAVE BEEN some real VITAL developments between Naruto and Hinata, especially the two moments when Naruto nearly lost himself (physically and mentally, respectively), Hinata was there for him, not Sakura

Sakura also had some important development with Naruto, but none of them indicate any romantic feeling, even her "confession" was done out fear that Naruto was still being bothered by the promise back there, she didn't show any signs of loving Naruto romantically

Again, I cannot stress enough that I agree on the fact that Kishi handled these character development quite clumsily, Naruto was pretty much obsessed with Sasuke the entire story, while NaruHina definitely deserved more screentime to make things more natural (esp. after the Pain invasion).

This is coherently due to how Kishi's somewhat poor attention to details and sublety

oh well

EDIT: onto your point of why Sakura did not move on from Sasuke and what stopped her, yeah you're right, Kishi's response is really off and unsatisfying. But what about Hinata? She's always had feeling for Naruto, after the war what would stopped her from going for Naruto? Just because she did not have as much screentime as Sakura (and most of which did not contain any romantic development), it does NOT mean that Hinata had no right to be with Naruto?
also about this

Quote:

All Kishi had to do was give Sakura brains so she would tell Sasuke to fuck off for being an ass hole and move on. That's it. That's literally all that was needed to make NaruSaku work romantically. For Sakura to move on.
Seriously? You even said:

Quote:

Yes Sakura did not show romantic interest but know what stopped her?
so (supposedly) after Sakura got over Sasuke, she could just go for Naruto like he was the obvious choice? what about from Naruto's side? Has there been any real indications that he had actual romantic feeling for Sakura, all the arguing he had with Sasuke over Sakura when they were young meant little to nothing

Avalon64 2015-04-27 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by kitten320 (Post 5515964)
Avalon64
As expected you don't even bother to read.

I list why HP ending worked and why I had no problem about it in comparison to Naruto. You ignore it and bring in money that I did not even mention there. I never finished book 6 and never bothered with book 7 so I'll repeat again: DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH.
I lost interest in HP series before they were finished, did not stop me from respecting an ending to which events of the series naturally lead to.

I list ShikaTema as a good developed example in Naruto, it flies over your head.

You being nice to me? You are not even reading what I write so I won't bother with you any more. Pointless.

Much like how you ignored my comments about things are well written in the fan's opinion it doesn't matter if its a 7 Story series or a 700 Chapter manga, we are free to like what we want to like and even if you find something badly written a fan should be understanding enough to respect that maybe the next fan wants to like what was written even if I myself did not, oh and saying one small barely a sentence amoung a whole sea of negative posts is not constructive critiques, for someone who claims that I ignore what you say, you are guilty of it youself but like I said the key difference is i am still giving this sequel a chance and you are not

kitten320 2015-04-27 11:27

Ultragunner
Glad we start this with agreement :)

As you yourself said, Neji played big part there. Besides Naruto is a caring person and Hinata appeared as a nice girl. He was not alone who responded negatively to NejiHina fight, even tutors jumped in. Neji was taking things too far. It was not a fight but vengeance full of bullying. It was not sportsmanship any more.

This whole vengeance thing is not about Hinata but Naruto's personality. He was bitter towards Gaara about Rock Lee too as far as I remember. Naruto responds in same way every time someone gets mistreated. That's who he is. That's one of his main personality traits that is used even in fillers and films.


The other 2 points show what we knew from day one, Hinata loves Naruto. Nothing new. A one sided support for Naruto.
Sakura did all of that for Sasuke back in Season 1 too, one sided again.

However, it is Sakura who rushed to Naruto the first time he transformed and got herself injured. She rushed despite knowing the danger. So saying that Sakura never cared is far fetched. It just got less attention in future chapters.

In order for relationship to work, it has to go both ways. While I can understand NaruHina and am ok with it, I will never understand SasuSaku.

This is why ShikaTema works for me cause it came from both ways. NaruHina and SasuSaku were far more one sided, especially SasuSaku.

I don't have that many problems with NaruHina, a seed was there even if it was handled badly as you yourself agreed. But SasuSaku is just a mess.


Naruto was into Sakura back in Shippuden too, Sasuke has no part here. Naruto is a logical conclusion cause that's the only other male character with whom she got close. Sakura's blind and illogical love for Sasuke is what stopped Sakura from seeing Naruto any other way but brotherly.

I mean if you are blind and someone tells you that world is black and white, you'll believe it. However, if one day you gain sight, you'll see there is more to it. Sakura simply could not see any other male character as anything more cause Kishi put a lock on that emotion. Sakura's eyes are for Sasuke only. How can you develop any other potential romance with Sakura when she is restricted to liking only Sasuke?

Avalon64 2015-04-27 11:32

Well I certainly was guilty of getting off track as well so maybe instead of going on and on about the ending and how it should have happened why don't we get back to talking about the actual sequel in this thread...?

Here's something I'm wondering the glasses on Salade...thinking about it maybe its a keepsake from Karin? Or does anyone think Salade's eyes are really that bad? Also which kid do you think the next chapter should focus on next?


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