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-   -   Steins;Gate 0 - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll (http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=152234)

NightWish 2018-09-26 12:10

Steins;Gate 0 - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll
 
Welcome to the discussion thread for Steins;Gate 0, Episode 23.

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HtwoN 2018-09-26 13:48

Good finale. It felt a little rushed but I don't mind.

I think the extra episode will be a gag in the Steins Gate world line. It will be amusing to see Maho and Leskinien's faces when they know about Okabe-Kurisu relationship.

Dextro 2018-09-26 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by HtwoN (Post 6279792)
Good finale. It felt a little rushed but I don't mind.

I think the extra episode will be a gag in the Steins Gate world line. It will be amusing to see Maho and Leskinien's faces when they know about Okabe-Kurisu relationship.

Oh I'd love that. Just some closure for the S;G timeline would be nice to see again.

I also would love to see Kurisu interact with her senpai a bit.

FlareKnight 2018-09-26 15:22

It was a fine episode. Not unbelievably good, but as effective a way to end this show as they could go with all things considered.

And that puts this show to a rest. Not exactly a thrilling ride and certainly not on the same tier as the first series. But it was ok.

Klashikari 2018-09-26 15:31

The last episode is one of the very few which were "properly" directed, but the early part felt like a rushed mess I'm not sure why they spent so much time on irrelevant subplot, padding the episodes count prior that point.

Steins Gate was always about Okarin being very cautious about his actions and all the possible consequences of changing the past and so on. The fact they made him completely skip this process after the world line shift with the disappearance of Amadeus is kind of silly, because it requires a lot of suspension of disbelief with the events being "still the same to a certain degree" but "different" enough.

The biggest issue I have with this huge setup change is the fact that Kagari has gone rogue, BUT not brainwashed and NOT working with Leskinen. According to Leskinen, he lost contact with her after she fled the facility, meaning that all the events with the mozart piece to recapture her didn't happen (no full brainwashing after all). That said, Leskinen could confirm she was with the lab mems, since Reyers knew about that (although the anime never bothered explaining how Reyers cooperated with Leskinen for whatever reason).

But then, here is the catch: how could Kagari learn close combat and wield weapons like that since she was never abducted by Leskinen in the present? In this given situation, she didn't get any training compared to the previous WL.
Let's assume for a minute that Kagari somehow got completely insane after realizing Mayuri will go with Suzuha. That still doesn't explain how she got that suit nor how she got that gun either.

Frankly, I still think they really shouldn't have merged PR (2036 path) and V&A (Operation Arclight), because the pacing got completely fragmented for no good reasons.
I understand they wanted something more linear and wanted to address the plot holes from the VN, but the way they did brought even more issues. There is no realy explanation what's the deal between Stratfo and DURPA, the fact Russia somehow have a copy of Amadeus, but doesn't dominate the world already (and the whole Okinawa sequence was merely alluded and never explained in the anime), Fubuki's RS being just there for no reasons, etc.

I honestly thought the anime could avoid the inherent issues of the VN, but while it did fix some points (few points about Kagari, Amadeus being actually relevant), it got a much worse execution and plot holes as result. I'm kind of surprised they made Reyers even more irrelevant than she already was in the VN.

Kanon 2018-09-26 16:45

Now that it's over, I have to say Zero feels like a rather pointless prequel to me. It wasn't all bad, there were a few good moments and some nice fanservice (like seeing the 2036 versions of the characters), but I feel it didn't add anything to the original series. Except Maho. She was a good addition.

What killed this series for me was the pace. It took way too long for something significant to happen. And when it did, it was already so late they had to rush everything. Maybe my expectations were just wrong in the first place. I thought we were going to see how Okabe build the rebellion, how he came up with his strategy to fool the world and the Steins;gate theory; etc...

The time travel was also made confusing when it was super easy to understand before.

Overall, I'm really disappointed.

GDB 2018-09-26 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by HtwoN (Post 6279792)
Good finale. It felt a little rushed but I don't mind.

I think the extra episode will be a gag in the Steins Gate world line. It will be amusing to see Maho and Leskinien's faces when they know about Okabe-Kurisu relationship.

Is there an extra episode? I was under the impression this was the finale.

That said... Mayuri had a good scene with the Suzu/Kagari showdown, but otherwise I was disappointed in the episode. Felt like we took a long time to get not very far, and ultimately Kagari was still pointless. Worse yet, we didn't get an expansion on the Steins;Gate timeline at all. I was really looking forward to them having Okabe and Maho meet there.

And given the power of his Reading Steiner, I wonder if he'd ever remember anything that happened in the beta timeline. I can't imagine he would since "he" never experienced it, but still.

Kanon 2018-09-26 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by GDB (Post 6279837)
And given the power of his Reading Steiner, I wonder if he'd ever remember anything that happened in the beta timeline. I can't imagine he would since "he" never experienced it, but still.

Yeah, I doubt he would. Although there was one time where he seemed to be experiencing a different worldline in his dream. They never explained what that was about.

There will indeed be an extra episode, just like with the original series. I too think it will be set in the Steins;Gate worldline. It will most likely be about Kurisu introducing Maho to the lab members.

GDB 2018-09-26 18:39

Will this air next week, or is it a BD special that we won't see until next year?

Wandering Soul 2018-09-26 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon (Post 6279828)
Now that it's over, I have to say Zero feels like a rather pointless prequel to me. It wasn't all bad, there were a few good moments and some nice fanservice (like seeing the 2036 versions of the characters), but I feel it didn't add anything to the original series. Except Maho. She was a good addition.

What killed this series for me was the pace. It took way too long for something significant to happen. And when it did, it was already so late they had to rush everything. Maybe my expectations were just wrong in the first place. I thought we were going to see how Okabe build the rebellion, how he came up with his strategy to fool the world and the Steins;gate theory; etc...

The time travel was also made confusing when it was super easy to understand before.

Overall, I'm really disappointed.

Pretty much how I feel. A pointless sequel that did have some good moments and one good character.

Ryuuoh DeltaPlus 2018-09-26 23:33

As an anime-only viewer who hasn't played the game, I actually find it pretty good overall. Sure it has some pacing issues, but I'm quite satisfied with it.

serenade_beta 2018-09-27 02:22

So the point of this Zero story is to milk the original franchise?
Well, that's the problem when you make a prequel story despite knowing how it ends.

I think it was...okay, but the middle part honestly sucked. You had Daru-emon being Doraemon, and Suzuha going Hokuto no Ken on supposedly trained soldiers with 0% accuracy.
And then there was at least one missed broadcast week.

And if I think too hard on the last episode's time travelling and their consequences or no consequences, I start having other questions on why the world didn't turn upside-down with the corpses of the two girls who would have died in the BC5-digit time period until Okarin came back to save them and all that good stuff.

7/10

GDB 2018-09-27 05:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by serenade_beta (Post 6279937)
I start having other questions on why the world didn't turn upside-down with the corpses of the two girls who would have died in the BC5-digit time period until Okarin came back to save them and all that good stuff.

Impression that I got was, while it had been 14 years or whatever for Okabe, it had only been a day or two for Suzuha and Mayuri. Him saving them was "destined" or whatever, thus the world didn't need to correct itself. Or something.

pervypig 2018-09-27 10:52

I find Okarin's face that the last scene totally awesome!

Kanon 2018-09-27 11:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by GDB (Post 6279851)
Will this air next week, or is it a BD special that we won't see until next year?

The latter.

mangamuscle 2018-09-27 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klashikari (Post 6279821)
But then, here is the catch: how could Kagari learn close combat and wield weapons like that since she was never abducted by Leskinen in the present?

IMO the martial traning was done at the same time the brainwashing with future technology when Kagari was still a child. Leskinen was not a genius so it makes sense he did not invent some brainwashing techniques himself.

Quote:

That still doesn't explain how she got that suit nor how she got that gun either.
It makes sense she would have stolen them at the same time she escaped from Leskinen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by serenade_beta (Post 6279937)
And if I think too hard on the last episode's time travelling and their consequences or no consequences, I start having other questions on why the world didn't turn upside-down with the corpses of the two girls who would have died in the BC5-digit time period until Okarin came back to save them and all that good stuff.

What I am more interested is what happened to the two time machines. Did okarin also had a miniature nuke to bomb one of them? Since they traveled to the far past (from where all known timelines originate from), even after the timeline switched to the steins gate timeline, the three of them might have not ceased to exist. Maybe the ova will be about the further adventures of Okarin zero.

Also, what happened to suzuha at the end of the original steins gate? Her vanishing in thin air because the timeline changed does not make sense in my mind.

Natsurin 2018-09-28 04:17

Spoilering just in case.

Spoiler:

4th Dimension 2018-09-28 11:31

This episode was nice emotionally, but for me the logic of it doesn't seem to stand scrutiny. It's things like this time helicopter arriving a HAIR's breath later than usual, which seems like an asspull to me.

Also them actually arriving on the method Kyouma used to solve the Kiritsu issue wasn't shown. So even the last scene doesn't add up much to the S;G even though Zero was supposed (I think) to show how they got to the point where they were able to send Kyouma the info he needed.

And I still don't get why the need to save Suzuha and Mayushi. Hell the moment they sent that D-mail back in to the past (which doesn't trigger SERN this time?) (also why not the Rhine mail they just introduced?) the entire timeline should have changed weather they liked it or not.

mangamuscle 2018-09-28 12:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Natsurin (Post 6280209)
Spoilering just in case.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:


Quote:

Originally Posted by 4th Dimension (Post 6280331)
Also them actually arriving on the method Kyouma used to solve the Kirisu issue wasn't shown.

I do not understand what unresolved issue you are talking about, saving kurisu was achieved with the video mail kyouma sent to himself and the theory behind that probably required years of extensive (and boring) computations to produce.

Quote:

And I still don't get why the need to save Suzuha and Mayushi. Hell the moment they sent that D-mail back in to the past (which doesn't trigger SERN this time?) the entire timeline should have changed weather they liked it or not.
To my understanding Kyouma traveled in time using the first time machine and then Daru sent the two mails.

Quote:

(also why not the Rhine mail they just introduced?)
At that moment in time only Daru had the app installed, if Kyouma had it then Daru and him would no had used it during the original S:G series. At least the people I know stopped using SMS altogether once whatsapp appeared.

GDB 2018-09-28 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4th Dimension (Post 6280331)
Also them actually arriving on the method Kyouma used to solve the Kiritsu issue wasn't shown. So even the last scene doesn't add up much to the S;G even though Zero was supposed (I think) to show how they got to the point where they were able to send Kyouma the info he needed.

It was the whole "deceiving the world" thing they did to save him in 2036 despite him "dying" in 2025. That was his answer. This is why he reiterates it about saving Mayuri and Suzuha, since he'll "disappear from this world" in 2025.

Quote:

And I still don't get why the need to save Suzuha and Mayushi. Hell the moment they sent that D-mail back in to the past (which doesn't trigger SERN this time?) (also why not the Rhine mail they just introduced?) the entire timeline should have changed weather they liked it or not.
I always figured there was something like it was just a normal text message embedded in the Time Machine that went to his phone at the right moment. Was still recorded in the future, but wasn't technically a DMail.


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