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Old 2011-10-30, 04:21   Link #70
pikachuwei
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New Zealand
Firstly, F/Zerker's "take anything as my NP" ability only converts it to a D rank Noble Phantasm if it was a non-conceptual weapon in the first place. Be it a normal 9mm pistol or a giant gatling gun or telephone pole, as a Noble Phantasm it will still be D rank

Which means it cannot bypass Heracles's God hand, which ignores all attacks from any weapon below A rank

Also, another ability of God Hand that is often forgotten is that God Hand develops immunity to what killed it before. So you cannot kill Heracles with the same attack multiple times.
Gilgamesh and Archer were able to bypass this due to having multiple Noble Phantasms, but the rest of the Heroic Spirits are not so lucky. If it wasn't for the fact that Archer took out 5 of Heracles's lives in Fate, Shirou and Saber would still have died in the forest, for once Berserker regen from having 7 lives taken out, he would have become invulnerable to Caliburn.

And Caliburn taking out 7 of Heracles's lives was simply plot. In Heaven's Feel, Saber Alter only took out 2 or 3 of Heracles's lives with her full Excaliblast. That was why Shirou was able to kill Dark Heracles with Nine Lives Blade Works even though it only killed Heracles 9 times (3 + 9 = 12, the number of lives Heracles has).


Finally, Heracles actually has the highest stats of all Servants in F/Z or F/SN (even without Mad Enhancement) so he is most likely faster and definitely physically stronger than F/Zerker. F/Zerker only hard counters Gilgamesh's Gate of Babylon, while Heracles's God Hand alone makes most of the other Servants ineffectives. Nasu states if F/SN's Caster, Fake Assassin, True Assassin and Lancer were all to fight Heracles at once, at most they would be able to take out 2 or 3 of his lives. In Heaven's Feel Zouken commented that Heracles would have been able to fight evenly or even beat Saber Alter + True Assassin, and that it was only Dark Sakura's presence that cost him the battle. Heracles truly does deserve the title of the greatest Heroic Spirit. Even as Berserker with most of his skills shafted for a mere stat boost he is still the second most formidable Servant after Gilgamesh.

And people shouldn't think that F/Zerker was schooling Gilgamesh just from this encounter. As Kirei said, Gilgamesh was just getting started. That last volley from GoB that Gil was preparing before being ordered to retreat? It had twice the number of NP about to be launched as the volley Berserker counted (32 opposed to 16, if you don't believe me, count them all onscreen XD).
Gilgamesh can paste Berserker easy as 1,2,3.
1) Keep Berserker in place with GoB
2) Launch Enkidu and tie Berserker down
3) Enuma Elish

Heck Gilgamesh could just go from 1) to 3) like he did against Saber in Fate route. Except Berserker doesnt have Avalon =P

theres a reason Gilgamesh could have soloed both Grail wars in 1 hour if he was playing seriously.
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Last edited by Klashikari; 2011-10-30 at 08:07. Reason: FZ spoiler removed
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