[Purdys99]

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

I absolutely agree with the part I put in bold. There is glaring lack of focus on the characters themselves and their relationships. Whatever interaction we get is usually either buried under philosophical messages or symbolism, impeded by the writers' inability to write sane characters of different sex (namely Heero and Relena) or is so minuscule, you hardly notice. But the thing is, it's there. You just have to look for it. Hard.

I completely agree with you, especially the last part. Also, sorry for the belated reply. However, I never forgot this post b/c you bring up so many thoughtful points. Sometimes I think I'm the only person who has these opinions.

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

The best example I can think of is the relationship between Duo and Trowa. Yes, there is one.
Duo has a number of good reasons to at least dislike the guy; he showered him with missiles when they first met, blew up his Gundam, threw him into jail and even punched him. But is Duo mad at Trowa when they meet again in space? No, he's relieved. He even feels depressed that Trowa lost his memories. Furthermore, he even goes through the trouble of "saving the guy who destroyed [his] partner," proving that no, he did not forget what Trowa had done to him but he wasn't holding a grudge either. Fast forward a few episodes when Trowa gets his memories back and what do we see them do? Play chess and generally look like they're buddies. What really drives the point home for me is when they part on Libra and Duo apologizes to him for having to leave him alone. He thinks "don't get yourself killed" and Trowa thinks back "you, too Duo."

What we can piece together from all this is that Duo himself is not a person to hold grudges but is very forgiving. Heck, he's pretty hard to offend in the first place. When Trowa fires missiles at him again in EW, Duo looked like he genuinely believed he'd die there. But when they meet up again instead of going "Dude! This is the second time!" or "What the heck is wrong with you?!", the only thing he does is jokingly remark that there's nothing wrong with helping a friend in need. Completely unrelated.
He's also very companionable. Looking at Trowa's character, it's likelier Duo asked him for that game of chess than the other way around.

Trowa gets character development, too (of the funny kind). When Heero knocks Duo out in EW, he hands him over to Trowa and instead of letting Duo plop onto the ground or something, Trowa actually lifts him to his shoulder before handing him over again. No big deal, you say. But do you remember how he first treated a half-dead Heero when he self-destructed? Yeah, major development there. xD

You know, its so funny that you mention Trowa... I actually think he has the MOST clear cut character arch out of all the characters in GW. Sure you can make an argument for the likes of Relena, Zechs, Quatre who also went through a lot of trials and growth but to me Trowa's personal journey is the most clearly portrayed. He goes from going very cold, stoic, single minded to the point of recklessness/suicidal to a very gentle, caring person. And what's more, they very subtly showed signs of these traits right from the beginning to make it all the more believable (ex. saving Heero, accepting Quatre's friendship, his natural kinship with animals). And its ever slowly fleshed out, from his nearly getting killed, to losing his memories, connecting with Catherine and the Circus, to regaining his memories, his subtle comraderie with Duo and Quatre. The progression is subtle, and while there is improvement to be desired, its all layed out for the audience to see. There's also that scene b/t him and Noin in Antartica. He argues the fate of a soldier is to have an enemy while Noin says a soldier's fate is to have someone to care for to protect. He never understands this until the very end of the series. Therefore, I think Trowa is the most well written character out of the series. Easily the top 3. Then again, his competition isn't that steep.:P

Now contrast Trowa's arch to Relena's arch. Relena went from a girl hot with vengeful anger to the point of wanting to burn down a whole building full of people to the head of a Pacifist nation and school....o.O Uh, say what now? Seriously! They leave her off with her contemplating arson, we don't see her again until Antartica and even then that doesn't give us any reason how and why she's let go of her anger to become a freaking pacifist all of a sudden. There's no progression: forget going from A to C, she goes from A to W w/ zero reasoning. The writers didn't think that her sudden transformation needed any explanation? @_@

I love your analysis of Duo too! How he never seems to hold a grudge against Trowa inspite of everything he put him through, so therefore he's just not the type to hold grudges. I like that interpretation very much!

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

I guess GW displays an extreme case of "show, don't tell" (which understandably isn't many people's cup of tea) and I'm honestly not sure if the writers were fully aware of it or not, but to me at least the characters come off as thought out extremely well. They all act differently, as real people would (note: "as," not "like"). When every single action of theirs, as mundane as it is, can be taken as a hint of what sort of person they are (due to lack of clarification, no doubt), resulting in a potential multitude of personalities in the entire cast (as implied as they are), I'll view it as good writing. Or rather, I'll view it as having put effort into it instead of just going the easy way and shoehorning them into stereotypes. Even if it's still anything but sufficient.

I do agree with the "Show, don't tell" argument, however, though there is showing, I do believe the execution could've been way better. If I dare say so, sometimes GW is waaaay too subtle. I mean, what audience were they aiming for exactly? Not to stereotype teenagers here, but when it comes to entertainment, complex philosophical thoughts on war and peace isn't exactly the top of their list, is it? But I digress. If all of the characters were written with the same care and slight of hand as Trowa was, I think the 'show' could've been a lot better. If were to compare GW to a recent show, its a lot like Mad Men. The part in bold applies perfectly to Mad Men. That show is purely character driven so almost every line, every action says something about the character. Nothing is ever fully explained; a scene plays out before you and its completely up to the audience to find their own meaning in it. Maybe that was what GW was trying to do, which is why it kinda became a bit of a mess. I dont' think they had perfected their story formula quite yet when going for this style... A better example of this type of story telling would be say Noir, an anime I highly recommend. While the plot, again, is very very difficult to understand and again, nothing is fully explained, the atmosphere, characters, and music are wonderful. There are a lot of things in Noir that are very similar to GW as well.

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

To tell the truth, the "cookie cutter archetype" is the only part in your statement I can't grasp. I admit, I haven't seen many Gundam series but from what I understood, GW was supposed to be the exact opposite of MSG in terms of premise; instead of having a civilian be turned into a soldier, you start off with a fully trained assassin regaining his humanity somewhere along the way. Instead of fighting in an army, the GW pilots are terrorists fighting against it. And instead of (initially) fighting for self-defense, the GW pilots are usually the ones initiating attacks. I'm generally hard-pressed to find comparable characters to the GW pilots from any anime...

Hmm. Well aren't the likes of Relena and Zechs copied from the first Gundam series? Isn't Zechs another version of Char and Relena is based on...uh, the female protagonist? (forget her name) Hmm, maybe I got it the other way around. I can name a lot of other mecha series that came AFTER GW, where the characters are a lot like the ones in GW. Examples: Gundam 00, Gundam Seed, Code Geass.

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

Which is why I adore the Blind Target CD drama.

:O Is there an english translation for the CD drama or do you listen to it in japanese?

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

If you aren't ten, most battles are downright boring when compared to the impressive battle choreography Seed or 00 sport for example.

Omg, those battles! I'm not really sure if they were horrible. Maybe it only seemed that way b/c of that God AWFUL guitar music that accompanies them! Oh god, that has to be the most obnoxious, distracting, and unfitting music I've ever heard from any movie or tv show ever!>.<! HATE IT. lol.

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

Anyway, I can't really blame anyone for not wanting to go through the series numerous times to grasp every meaning because, while I don't really have a problem with it, it is horribly paced, the plot is too big to fit into 47 episodes (which is why you have to watch GW thrice to get it), the wording at parts is downright confusing because the creators are trying to cram entire ideologies into single sentences and if you aren't paying attention, the characters may come off as severely bland. And there's also the little matter of having to ignore certain things because no one knows what the creators were smoking that day...
Nonetheless, GW has incredible potential and is well worth the time needed to understand it. True, you have to fill a lot of gaps yourself but GW was never a show to spoon-feed its audience, so from here on it's personal preference. But I will not concede to GW having a bad plot or one-dimensional characters or whatever else there is that people wrongly accuse it for. You can argue about the execution but not its core.

Touche. Very well said!

Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna

And before anyone asks, I have no idea why I'm babbling so much.

I like your babbling. People have lost sight on what a good babble can do.