[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by Used Can

Can you elaborate a bit further on this?

Even when Erika was pressing the point with the Red Truth used with Dlanor, Battler just turns the tide with the Gold Truth.
Even when Battler is still unable to prove with facts that Natsuhi is not the culprit, Battler made Dlanor surrender, advocating that even if Erika has truth, Battler also has his.

So, Meta-Beato is still alive?

Unknown. Like Sterling posted in the spoiler thread, Meta Beato (long hair) disappeared after saying "farewell... sorry".
Since Beato is a concept, it is very likely that Meta Battler can "revive" her.

Didn't the ending credits state she died in 1998? She was most likely killed by Kasumi and her killers, I think. The magic battle was most likely from Ange's imagination, while she was dying.

Yes, but what I mean: the real events behind her death, because the problem is how it can be interpreted at least 2 ways (I also believe that either Amakusa backstabbed the whole party or Ange was still killed by Kasumi... but since the scroll says only 1998, it is even possible she is killed much later).

This is something I'm not sure about. Sure, they've mentioned Knox's rules, but the red and golden truths sort of violate the "All supernatural or preternatural agencies are ruled out as a matter of course."

Actually, it isn't even a "mention". They use it, period.
The anti fantasy side brutally use it to disable completely Piece-Beato in a very ugly way.
In case of Erika and Dlanor, they do not use "real red" because they provide elements that are within the story and the genre: Erika gives facts that cannot be countered and become red, thanks to bern and lambda confirming in red (which can be applied because they "are not" pieces but players).
Battler was unable to claim there is that "man of 19 years ago" unless it is one of the 18 already, because Dlanor pinned him down with Knox commandement n°1.
Rule n°1 and n°8 prevents a dumb "it happened like this!" without anything relevant which would give such conclusion.

Yes, they have been used to confirm things that have been shown in the games, which follows the 8th rule, but the fact remains that these coloured truths are pretty much a supernatural factor, because in an actual mystery novel, a detective cannot ask for this kind of confirmation.

This is why Umineko starts to bend both genre as Ryukishi planned: the PLOT itself is mystery and thus follow Knox's commandements, but the story, the execution itself do not follow this. Therefore you can have both assertions even if they are supposed to contradict each other.

Originally Posted by Used Can

Mate, is that the first contradiction you've found? Didn't you find the red text (i.e. the witch's words) contradictory?

No it isn't a contradiction regarding Erika.
In fact, Erika never used the red ever once (except reciting one provided by Bern, to seize her rights as a detective). She is forced to rely on Dlanor, Gertrude, Cornerlia and Bern. This is actually the point where it diverge from "mystery" and "fantasy" elements. Both are aimed to the same thing: truth. Thus, Erika, the "human side" brought things that are later confirmed in red by the fantasy side and even further confirmed with Dlanor.

Originally Posted by Marion

The point is Eva was just as easily as obvious of a culprit as Natsuhi was in EP 5. Fact is Battler is afraid. He obviously doesn't want to believe in witches, but he obviously doesn't want to blame anybody for murder. Not everyone can have a happy ending. Higurashi for example.

That is correct: Battler finally got back to his initial stance, despite in Ep3 and Ep4, he was completely driven to pin down "Eva" or "anyone with his blue truth".

Not everyone gets a happy ending. Even in EP 5.

The "even" is too much: Episode 5 might be the worst situation possible, save Episode 3.
My problem is... if Ryukishi wants a global happy end (everyone except the culprit), it will be helluva hard, considering everyone's backstory. It is extremely depressing, especially for Natsuhi but also Maria/Rosa.

Originally Posted by Battler Ushiromiya

Hey I've heard some rumours about Battler goin' antagonist on us all, the 'Golden Sorcerer' or something along those lines, anyone got some evidence to back that up?
I'd like to hear your opinions also~.

No, Battler is definitely the protagonist.

Originally Posted by and618and

Well,not that most people hava had time enough to be spoiled(at least those who wanted to),what do you think of the game?Did it live up to your expectations?Maybe better?Sub-par?

I would say... it betrayed my expectations, in a good and bad way (a lot more on the good side though).
Like Sterling said, you cannot consider chiru as "answer" because it is nowhere similar what Kai was to Higurashi.