[Lord of Pandemonium]

Originally Posted by Haak

No, I'm aware of all that. But this is all before he accepted his hollow powers. It shouldn't matter that much, then. In reality what he really should be doing is getting them to accept their hollow powers.

He had to be forced to accept his. That is something that someone should decide on their own (Do I sound like a cliched anime character?)
Ichigo wasn't given a choice, and he tried to get rid of his hollow powers, and was actually surprised to see him again in the Decide Arc. He's not the type that would try to force a power on a person, that they didn't want. Besides, he wanted his own powers back ---he jumped at the chance to get them. Selfish yes, but then he's not perfect. He didn't dwell on it long enough because he wanted his powers back, but had trouble admitting that. So he used "helping them rid themselves of the ebil hollow powah" as an excuse.

Like Aizen said "There is no such thing as 'truth' or 'lies' in this world; there never has been. There is only plain, hard facts. And yet, all beings who exist in this world take only those 'facts' that are convenient to them, and take them to be the 'truth'. They do so because they know no other way to live. However, for those powerless beings that make up the majority of this world it is those 'facts' that are inconvenient for their own self-affirmation that make up the real 'truth'."

Originally Posted by Haak

And btw I think you've got the Yammi scene wrong. He didn't freeze out of fear because he realised he was like them. He was just a little curious about it.

Nope, it's you. He was gloriously kicking Yammi's ass, and then he saw his Zanpakuto and He froze. he said. "A zanpakuto and hollow mask...are they like me"? It was then, his hollow threatened to come to surface and then shit went downhill from there.

Originally Posted by Akashin

Right. Aizen pretended to be good (Ginjou had Tsukishima turn him good), and he removed anybody that could see through his facade (Ginjou had Tsukishima turn the rest of Xcution; not turning Ishida and risking exposing himself is, as has been said, a rather glaring plot hole). Right, not the same at all.

Oh wait--

I'm not saying it's the exact same, but there is a certain resemblance between the two besides how much Ginjou looks like Aizen.

Ginjou was actually sincere, because he believed himself to be a good-guy. Aizen, was never sincere. It's not really the same

Originally Posted by Akashin

Also, this. It always bugged me that they drove home that Fullbring powers were unpleasant and that they wanted to be rid of them, yet Ichigo never bothered to ask why the powers he was acquiring were so unpleasant. If somebody tells me something tastes bad and then tries to feed it to me, I'm not going to be too quick to eat it.

See Reply to Haak above...

Originally Posted by rei_ayanami17

I absolutely agree. This just proved how worthless Ishida is.

Don't you think you're being a little hard on the Quincy?;uhoh: Ichigo was in front of Ginjou and he didn't trust Ishida, it's because he was desperate to make Ichigo, understand, he was caught unawares. That doesn't make him worthless. He was distracted and because of that, he was wounded. It's not like he actually fought them and got beat-down.

Originally Posted by rei_ayanami17

And actually, let’s not put all the blame to Ishida. All of them had mistakes here. Ichigo is really stupid and idiot in giving his trust to them and even Chad….(I wonder how they persuade Chad to join their Xcution?)…..Ginjou try to make doubt before to Ichigo where he said to him about Uruhara but Ichigo, being so dumb and stupid, rather choose to believe the stranger and not even try to confirm it to the right person involved.

He's not stupid,Ichigo admitted that he didn't really trust Ginjou during training, for his final fullbring. Urahara and Isshin were being secretive. They chose not to tell him anything. Urahara manipulated him, and then turned him into a hollow-shinigami hybrid without his knowledge. His father has been lying to him his entire life. Orihime lied about being attacked, Chad not only tried to cover for Inoue's lie. He omitted being attacked as we;;. and didn't tell Ichigo any of his suspicions regarding Tsukishima's powers. Right now everyone that he should trust and depend on, has been lying to him. It's not so odd that he chose to believe the words of a stranger, especially when he was desperate, powerless, and it seemed as if that stranger was the only one who would tell him anything. Especially when that stranger, seemed to have a common enemy and was the key to getting his powers back.

If you want to blame anyone, blame Urahara for being so smart, that he's stupid. His choices, the ones that he makes to protect people, always end up putting them in harm's way. Blame Ishida for being the worst dad in the mangaverse, despite his being the coolest dad in the mangaverse. Do not blame Ichigo, for being a pawn. That's all he's ever been because of the constant lies, and I don't think he deserves all the criticism that he gets.

Originally Posted by rei_ayanami17

It’s because everyone is lying from the start of this arc that’s why it became worst as it is and now, they’re just all fall to enemy’s trap – zero hope? Huh? – not a chance!

Everyone lied to him in the very first arc, of Bleach. I don't see why this time is so maddening, and the other times are not. I am not being flippant, I am just saying...

Originally Posted by Kyero Fox

Tsu used his power to turn ginjuro into a good guy to trick ichigo.

Exactly. Ginjo had been sincere, up until he was cut twice

Originally Posted by Casshern

Two things really bothered me about this chapter.
First, I'm disappointed that Ishida went down so fast. I know he's a small fry but come on, his cool moment was curb-stomped while it was only 73% complete. At least let him have his cool moment before reminding us that everyone in this series who isn't called Ichigo or Aizen is irrelevant.

He was caught by surprise, like I already said, you act as if he fought and got owned in one hit. Hell he had a moment of cool, up until his arrow went tink tink off of Yammi and setting off a bomb that merely put a whole in the floor and didn't hurt nobody. . In my opinion that was much worse...

Besides, Ichigo is the most important character. How come people get so mad, because he's the one that has most of the crowning moments of awesome?

Originally Posted by Casshern

Second, without Orihime screaming Kurosaki-kun every time Ichigo get's fatally wounded (several times per chapter) it feels like there's something missing. I don't like it one bit. Orihime is one of my favorite characters and I sense that she is losing her role in this series.

That's gotta be a first...

In all my years in the Bleach fandom never ever have I ever seen anyone mad because she DID NOT say Kurosaki-kun. Are you a masochist?

Originally Posted by Casshern

Other than that it was ok. Pretty decent. A bit boring though, with all those twists. One day Kubo should pull a real twist and write an arc that has no twist.

Cute, really cute. I like the plot-twists. It's part of Kubo's charm

Originally Posted by Slayerx

And my point is that Ichigo never bothered to ask. which was stupid of him...

He did ask. Ishida, didn't answer--no he refused to answer. It's not stupid of him at all. If anything it was stupid of Ishida to act that way

Spoiler for CLICK ME PLEASE!!!:

Like Papa Quincy said...

Spoiler for Um yeah, Clicking would be nice:

"it's not that he doesn't want to tell you. He doesn't have anything to tell you"

Unless Ishida drew a picture of Ginjou, even if he told Ichigo who attacked him, what good would it have done? He's a stranger What makes you think that Ichigo would have known he was talking about Ginjou?

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Fullbring is clearly different than Vizard powers een if they are both related to Hollows. Ginjo said the powers were unpleasant but at no point did we or ichigo ever see WHY these powers were unpleasant. Hell the fact that ichigo was going to inherit these powers should only lead him to asking SPECIFICIALLY what makes these power unpleasant.
..

you're killing me, you know that?
Ginjou inferred that their powers, were bad and he used Ichigo's own experiences with his hollow to drive the point home. Why would Ichigo ask, what makes it unpleasant, when Ginjou has already compared their plight, with Ichigo's. Ichigo knows first hand, how much grief hollow powers can cause. Hollows aren't evil but they eat people..they consume the soul. Here are humans that are both Human and Hollow like he is. Why would he assume that there is no downside, to their powers, when he's experienced the downside of hollow powers first hand?
Besides like I said before, he didn't care to go into too much detail because deep down inside, all really gave a damn about was his own feelings of powerlessness.
Getting his powers back,so he could once again be the hero, was his main objective. So he seized the opportunity that was presented to him and did so. Of course he wouldn't try to ask a bunch of questions because he that might mean he can't use them to get his powers back. He was using their desire to get rid of their so-called unwanted powers to get his own back. Because he realized that he wanted them after all. Their wanting to give him their powers were a convenient excuse for him to get his back. He's a flawed hero, he's not really that noble and is actually quite selfish. (Something I find refreshing) ---

He didn't beat it to death, because--- See Aizen quote above, because it makes no sense for me to type it twice, especially since I am tired of repeating myself, something I did a lot of times during this post.


Gonna end this here...I swear to god I am gonna answer the rest of your post, just not now.I am really stoked off of the Thundercats premiere --so this response is incomplete,because I want to post about how great it is, on the the ThunderCats websites


Ja!