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Old 2018-06-06, 04:58   Link #62
Klashikari
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv175
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by erneiz_hyde View Post
Yes, I think it's possible present SERN does know about the complete time machine theory. They don't need the FG to complete it, they only need them to not leak that theory to any other party. They already won the race. But it remains that all this is possible only because SERN found out about the D-Mail in Echelon sometime in the future. That discovery is the real ground zero. Without that first D-Mail then future SERN will not learn about the time machine and thus they can't send that information to the past.
That's false, because if they already had the full theory, their dystopia is already secured. The very reason why SERN could have their time machine done was because of the FG members, which is proved by Suzuha who plainly stated Kurisu helped SERN with the time machine and was the "mother of the time machine".
SERN has the basic theory behind the time machine, but it is deemed as not functional because it gellifies the operators.

SERN canonically never completed the time machine theory on their own, but they still worked on it for a very long time as it was the raison d'Ítre of SERN, which is demonstrated by Daru fishing information from the Z-program. This couldn't happen due to the future. Instead, it is an established fact for any world line. Otherwise, it would cause a severe contradiction with SG0.
They need Kurisu, Okarin and Daru to complete the machine. That's why Moeka doesn't kill them but capture them, whereas Mayuri wasn't needed at all because she isn't part of the time machine development. It pretty much confirms SERN needs them to complete their time machine, while killing anyone else who know about the machine but not useful to them. Therefore, if your assumption were to be true, then SERN would have tasked the rounders to kill all of them, not capturing them.

Furthermore, you are still with a major plot inconsistency:
Again, if SERN learn from the future about the time machine, erasing the first d-mail would not change anything because the present SERN can maintain the logic that the future SERN would have the time machine and give that info to their past self. It is self sustaining which is something SG tried to avoid at all cost.
Quote:
And I'm saying this doesn't make sense. If SERN already saw the first D-Mail in the present, then even if it is deleted, there is nothing stopping them from capturing the FG lab member eventually.
I should have phrased myself more properly. I stated above they learned about the first d-mail later, not immediately. That's why the capture still occur soon after even when Moeka is stopped.
When I said future, I meant dates like 2025.

To me, the present is basically the period of Steins;Gate, meaning 2010.

In a nutshell, my perspective is like this:
*Assuming the raid performed by Moeka didn't occur*
1) The first dmail caught by ECHELON made SERN aware that a time machine has been properly build around 2010 (in the present in my perspective, but obviously after the "current events" of the alpha world line).
2) They order the rounders to capture the FG members
3) Kurisu is the main contributor to the time machine development
4) Years later, Okarin and Daru manage to flee from SERN, but Kurisu is still stuck with them.
5) SERN has established their Dystopia. Okarin forms the resistance
6) 2025: Okarin dies. Kurisu is (already?) dead.
7) At some point, Daru dies too, keaving behind the FG203
8) 2036. Suzuha goes back in time with the FG203

From there, the first D-mail being the trigger of all of this fits naturally, since it is the very reason why SERN could finish the time machine by securing the FG members.
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Last edited by Klashikari; 2018-06-06 at 05:28.
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