[GDB]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

I didn't say that he went against his ideals in Fate, I just said that his actions in Fate weren't because of them (or, at least, weren't because of his father's ideal). Can you name one action that Shirou takes anywhere in FSN that adheres to the "kill one to save many" philosophy, where the "one" isn't a clear bad guy in the process of doing something bad?

You said he didn't stick to his ideals in Fate, and then said in the next line that he never went against them. Those are your words, and you didn't say anything about his actions and whether they were because of his ideals or not.

Thinking about it, the shadow may actually be the contents of the Great Holy Grail (which includes Angra Mainyu) leaking out through Sakura's body.

I think this is what it says is the case during one of her nighttime romps.

This I'm not sure of. I guess his soul is marked as being "Emiya Shirou", or something (UBW shows that there are problems with having two Shirous in the same time, so clearly there is some marking that says "this person is Emiya Shirou"), and with her ability as a magus (which is to do with soul manipulation) she's able to read it.

When did UBW show that there were problems having two Shirous in the same time?

No, it is. True Assassin isn't the exception, Fake Assassin is. The game makes that quite clear, even in Fate and UBW. He's not a 'proper' servant because he was summoned by Caster, and thus the Grail made a 'fake' out of some souls it found lying around.

All I recall Fate/UBW saying about Assassin up to that point is that he was a Fake Hero, as in he never existed. It never said anything about any other possible restrictions to the class.

Well, perhaps, but the way that the Grail War works in FSN only allows Hassan to be Assassin. It's obvious to me at least that the only reason Fake Assassin is described as an Assassin-class servant is so that Nasu could include True Assassin in HF. Otherwise, they'd have come up with a more suitable class name for him.

No, but they have the properties of an Archer, in that they're good at long-range attacks. Being an Archer-class servant doesn't mean you have to be an Archer, it just means that you have to rely mainly on long-range attacks.

So Archer-class servants don't have to be Archers, but Assassin-class servants have to be Assassins? If all you need to be an Archer is being good at long-range attacks, then why can't an Assassin just be someone who is exceptionally skilled in stealth and melee combat?

For that matter, what qualifies someone to be any class? Saber would, logically, be someone with a sword. But we saw with Hercules that weapons can easily change their form to another type of weapon. The only one with a really "clear" definition is Rider, but even that's kind of loose when you think of Medusa's lore.

Perhaps not, but Nasu has made it canon that Assassin is Hassan-al-Sabbah unless you cheat (like Caster did). So, that's Nasu's definition of the servant class. If you're complaining about how he's defined the Assassin class then you should also be complaining about how he's defined the Archer class, and thus you should have decided that UBW is 'full of plot holes' too.

I would have a problem with the Archer class if there were a third Archer shown who was clearly a bowman. As it is, it's rather iffy, but at least it can be looked at as the "hodge podge" class.

Seriously, can you give one reason why Fake Assassin should fit in the Assassin class, other than "because it's the only class that was left when Caster summoned him"? He has none of the properties of an Assassin at all, and (unlike the Archers) there's no particular property that he has that would make him a 'pseudo'-Assassin. The only reason Fake Assassin is called 'Assassin' is because True Assassin wasn't summoned like he should have been, so Fake Assassin took his place.

I did earlier. He's exceptionally skilled at stealth and melee combat. He has to rely on said skill because of his lack of extraordinary powers (Magic Armor, Super-Special-Awesome Energy Attack (like Excalibur), etc). His kill-move is designed to not allow for escape, which would be a perfect assassination technique to use on masters.