[Macbrother]

The 3/4 of our posts were about the shinobi in general for the very reason that we have no info about the past strength of the Sannin, it wasn't knick knack side discussion, it was the backbone of this discussion.

Your argumentation until then was based on the fact that because the regular ninja never stop to grow, so does Yondaime.
Whereas my point was to say maybe The 4th would have continued to grow, but it's not the case for the regular ninja.

If we let slide that then I can only stick on what I said in my first post : Now did Yondaime would have become stronger (and I mean significantly stronger) than the Sannin and possibly than the God of the Shinobi himself at his best?
Maybe, who knows?

Acutally that's exactly what it is. How a normal shinobi will grow with age, has very little to do with the point, that of how Yondaime would. I never responded that Yondaime would would never stop to grow based on regular ninja, in fact I have been using the sannin has the data set the entire time, as they make an excellent showing of how geniuses grow with age. As for the topic of 'regular' ninja, again we are pretty much at a stonewall here. Without any data to back either side, it is best to let that topic die. As for would've Yondaime become stronger, I stick to my original statement as well.

And I agreed with that since the beginning, the point where we diverge is the amount of time that it can last.

Which is boggling, my original point was Sarutobi had 50 years to establish his legend, and by all accounts, shinobi of that calibur appear retain or keep growing with knowledge and ninjutsu in that time period.

And you can dedicate yourself all you want, in the end time wins.
I'm not new in the concept that widom comes with age : it's just that it's a bullshit.
Neither common sense nor good judgment will come just because you're old, old isn't equal to wise.
Anyway as you reduced knowledge to jutsu knowledge, you reduce wisdom to battle wise or battle experience and I already say that it was one of the element allowing ninja to continue to improve their skills so what's your point?

Yes, in the end. When did I argue it didn't? And right, after experiencing life for 50 years you don't have a better of idea what to expect, how to react, and what's correct when you did at 20? Now that is bullshit. I didn't 'reduce' knowledge or wisdom to anything, I'm merely using it in the context of this dicussion. Of course knowledge is going to refer to jutsu knowledge or 'whatever' knowlege thats beneficial in battle that they pick up, what else would I refer to? If you agree then that allows ninja to continue to improve their skills, great. Looks like we can leave another topic in dust.

Six of one and half a dozen of the other.

Not quite. One is saying it makes no difference. The other is saying it might make a difference but certainly nothing noticable and nothing we can show to be noticable. If you have evidence to the contrary (that age is making a relavent difference to chakra at 50), please show it.

What the hell are you talking about?
Indeed Oro hasn't any apparent loss of chakra, he has a young and strong body and the spiritual energy of his old soul.
More than that given that the strong thoughts of his host remain inside him (as he said), maybe the spiritual energy of his new body increase his own(?).

The point here is that it is Orochiamru and his physical body that his enormous, legendary chakra. How come when he switches (changes bodies) he didn't have any apparent chakra loss? Are we to assume there is a good supply of people walking around with legendary chakra that compares to the sannin? Before you mention it, yes, it is Orochimaru's spiritual energy that makes up for some of the chakra, but he switched bodies and in turn switched his physical energy for the physical energy of the body he took on. Are we to assume the body he took on also had enormous, ridiculous chakra like the sannin? When almost no one in Naruto sports this kind've chakra? (My overall point being the above is unlikely, and therefore the amount of chakra one has isn't related to the physical body quite like we may imagine.)

Tsunade changes the age of her body with a Ninjutsu, she's in her younf self.
Look at her arm when the jutsu stopped and you will see what means degeneration (actually it must be even worse for Tsunade due to the side effect of her Genesis Rebirth).

Hold up, where is it said that the age of her body changes? The appearance has changed yes, but she is still 50, and her body is still aging. There's nothing that shows she has somehow by-passed the limits of age using this body, but merely walks in this form because she doesn't like looking old or because she needs to change appearances whenever necessary. (like decieving debtors, like Jiraiya said)

No like you said earlier we have no clue of their past strength, so forget your 'apparently' and 'likely', there is no indication the aging process is extremely slow or worse non-existant.
And for the second time, aging is a continual process, you don't start to age at 50.

Surely you are aware that the rate of age can and does change over the course of a lifetime. Yes, one is always getting older, but I may not experience rapid health loss until 50, 65, or even older, depending on who the person is. We have evidence that age affects you at 67, e.g., Sarutobi. We have zero evidence that it affects you at 50, in the world of Naruto. Which is my point.

The aging process is exagerated so it's non-existant?
You make no sense.

Maybe because you're putting words in my mouth? I never said it was non-existant.

Indeed there are difference between these jutsu, but we simply don't know them, the Shiki Fuujin and the Edo Tensei are both Summon jutsus, there is no reason to think that the Edo Tensei can't be based on some sort of contract as well as we don't know if the Shiki Fuujin is based on a contract before the summon.

Except the fact that Sarutobi said you must make a contract before using this jutsu, whereas that was never said of Edo Tensei, and would be illogical anyways, who would you make the contract with?

Actually no there isn't only one lol, it's a Shinigami, there are plenty of them.

Then why doesn't use the live of these guinea pigs who had survived their utility?
Without saying that it has more strength to show the corpses of people the reader knew.

lol, where's it said there are multiple shinigami? (in the world of Naruto) And again, yes, the point of the moment (protecting your country) hits alot more harder by showing Oro sacrificing his, but still, why go through the trouble of killing people you trained when you can just get a corpse of someone already dead?

Why?
Btw the Anbu captain explained all he knew about the Edo Tensei after that saying that it's a forbidden Kuchiyose etc.

Because, after he says the name, instead of saying "so it's that jutsu..." he still asks how he got here, like he doesn't know anything about the jutsu other than the name itself. Then Shodaime's response is "if that's the case" as if though Nidiame had explained the answer when he seemingly didn't even know it himself. And indeed, the anbu captain seemed to know all about it, which is pretty solid enough evidence despite the hokage's responses.

I don't know what would be the abilities of Oro in an old body, how his transformed body, the chakra changed joint of his bones, allowing him to be sneak-ish would react to age for example?
And like I said Oro is a Ninjutsu specialist so the least touched by his body capacity.

Actually hopefully your last statement here gets much of the point I've been trying to get across all along, that the ninjutsu aspect, being the least effected by the body is more in the sense of a spell-caster who is almost always stronger with age. Oro as a ninjutsu specialist combined with his experience combined with the fact sannin still have incredible movement, chakra, etc would all but certainly lend the fight to the older Orochimaru.

And given that we have no clue on their past strength, you simply can't say that the 4th had to become stronger based on them.

I never said had to either :P

In the other hand we do know that the 3rd who was 17 years older than them suffered heavily from his age, even with new jutsu and experience.
You assume that it's not the case at all at 50, I assume that it's less the case at 50 because they're not that old yet.

Regardless of why you and I assume, the outcome (that at 50 they are showing zero reference or ability loss due to age) is the same.

The point isn't if he could have become stronger than he was at 25, but if he could have exceed the 3rd, again I don't see anything which makes that more likely than unlikely.

lol, exactly how much stronger would he have to become? Indeed, we don't know. The point is, considering what he had developed just at 25, the sky is the limit, not just surpassing the 3rd. Like I already pointed out we'll never know for sure.

With time Tsunade dropped in a fallen state, with time Kakashi admitted that his current state wasn't enough and that he should re-train etc.

Time isn't a precise data of what will happen, it's not equal to training, it's not equal to more strength.
Especially when you have already the duty of your job to handle, a Hokage can't train all the time like a genin learning the jutsus he will use during his life.

I never said time always = strength or training. But in the case of the Oro/Tsunade/ (maybe) jiraiya/Yondaime, that is proven to be the case.

These titles don't exist in real word, all the title we know in Naruto were given to living (and young btw) Ninja like the Sannin, Copy Ninja Kakashi, the Seven Sword Mist, The Demon of the Mist, etc.

Besides the professor and the God of the Shinobi are two different titles, I you really want to know I do think it's more likely that the 3rd gain this one when he was older (I have no particular amount of time in mind, just older).

lol of course not those 'specific titles', but most any title like 'greatest of the sport' or 'alexander the great' etc etc are given not in the athlete or leader's prime, but after it, or perhaps even after their deaths. Yes, of course the professor and 'God of the shinobi' are different titles, but also of course one (the professor) effects and surely plays a large role in the latter.