[itachi-san314]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

Let me quote your earlier post:

and let me quote my entire earlier post because you seem to not be able to see it. hashirama > madara was just 1 reason, not the be all end all of my point.

Originally Posted by itachi-san314

...and the uchiha clearly were subjugated by them. the senju took control, became hokages and madara believed that the senju would eventually wipe them out. that doesn't sound even to me

edit: just reread my original post. i was talking about post-uchiha massacre. so without the uchiha, they are certainly the best clan. if they existed at that time, which i dont think would make sense

You just assume that because Hashirama is stronger that makes Senju stronger automatically.

it would be nice if you stopped saying this... it's not true. i never said it...

There's only one hokage at a time, future promises in a world like that are pointless.

sarutobi himself said that itachi was hokage-like. making him the 4th over minato would have most likely averted the coup scheme. also, having an uchiha be the second hokage would have probably done the same. there must have been an uchiha below madara who was on or near tobirama's power at that time.

edit: also just pointing out here that the konoha alliance is a 'future promise' in and of itself that these clans would all work together for the better of the village. an addendum that said the uchiha would have equal representation would be just as serious / frivolous as the entire agreement

They didn't deserve it, neither should the Senju, the village was not about Senju and Uchiha only.

never said it was. but if the uchiha and senju were the strongest clans (which they were) then it stands to reason that they must have had some strong ninja aside from hashirama and madara.

You just disregard other clans that joined the village.

nope... i'm just assuming that the uchiha had at least 1 strong ninja among them who could have been 2nd hokage. do you disagree?

If Madara didn't attack and leave the village than he would have been the 2nd. He was the one who failed his clan because of his personal ambitions. Once he betrayed the village his clan was politically weakened.

this makes sense. but if there was an agreement that madara would have been 2nd hokage, he probably wouldn't have felt the way he did. in his own words he feared the senju would wipe the uchiha out. if he felt he had a significant leadership role, which he did deserve, then it wouldn't have happened. but yea, we have yet to see these specifics