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Old 2012-10-11, 22:50   Link #30824
GoldenLand
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Rokkenjima
Quote:
Originally Posted by pikablu View Post
Also people use ShKanon to explain Kanon’s disappearance from the games. I’m just saying that there other explanations for how the Kanon can go missing.

The bit about EP8 – this is such a red herring, this red only applies to Bern’s game and not the core question arcs. If this did apply so literally then one could raise an eyebrow at Battler being the culprit.
Ah, but it's not a red herring. That red may or may not apply only to that game, but Lambadelta says that that is what happens to Kanon at any time that Shannon dies. "Well, I thought it'd be rude, so I kept quiet about it, but that's what happens when Shannon dies." = she's also talking about the earlier games, not just Bern's game there. Can you explain why she said that, using your theory?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pikablu View Post
The bit about EP7 – this only applies to EP7 again, Shannon going BSoD in one moment does not prove ShKanon for everything. Yes Shannon = Kanon in that kakera but that doesn’t mean anything in the wider context.
Why doesn't it mean anything? I'm disappointed: that's a really inadequate response which seems to me to boil down to "OK, Shkanon is proven beyond a doubt in this one ep, but it doesn't mean anything, because, uh, I say so." Really? I don't think your theory can be correct, but I'm responding to you seriously, so please don't resort to a "because I say so" level of reasoning.

EP7is the game where two kakera (one with Shannon, Kanon, and Beatrice, and the other with Lion) are sewn together so that Will can solve all of Beatrice's mysteries. It's the ep which is described on the title screen of the game as the one where "the cold, hard truth will be revealed". It's the one where Yasu is revealed and her backstory is gone into. It absolutely must have relevance to the games as a whole. If it is irrelevant, why is it there?

Ryukishi has said about ep 7 that
Quote:
At the end of EP6, they said "we want to have an answer session", so I think that it will include backstory elements that haven't yet appeared in the story, as well as the inner thoughts of various people, making for something that borders on the level of a confession.
He's also said that
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EP7 was the heart and soul of all the hints and answers. And EP8 is something like an afterword to round up the story.
It's really not good enough to simply say that EP7 has no relevance to the rest of the story and not give a reason for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pikablu View Post
5) And actually their dreams are not contradicting but extremely similar; don’t both just want to be with their love? I don’t think that it’s specified WHERE they would have to be.
It is stated. I'll get back to that in a second. (And I'll get back to the rest of your arguments if I have time and nobody else addresses them.) Firstly...

How can you say that their dreams are not contradicting when Shannon and Kanon themselves describe their dreams as contradicting, as in the quote I gave you earlier?

You really, really need to re-read Ep 6, because Ep 6 makes it extremely clear that if Shannon wins, she will leave the island and Kanon will quit and leave the island "for all eternity", and if Jessica looks for him it will "be in vain". If Kanon wins, then he will stay on the island and work on his relationship with Jessica, but Shannon and George will break up.

Quote:
Beatrice the Elder: "If you give up on the miracle of magic and leave it to Shannon and George,......they will be joined and leave the island......After that, Kanon will leave the island as well. That is an unavoidable fate."

Beatrice the Younger: "Th, ......then what if they can obtain the miracle of magic...?"

Beatrice the Elder: "Of course, Kanon will remain on the island, by Jessica's side for all time.......He will probably start learning music with Jessica as she wished for.......How their relationship will progress afterwards is a matter for the two lovers. They may deepen their relationship slowly all by themselves, as Jessica wanted..."

Shannon: "......However,...if that happens, George-san and I will not be joined."

Kanon: ".........We must fight this fate by betting our futures and our happiness."

Jessica: "A, ......are you kidding me...?! What the hell...?! So if we are joined, the other pair will split apart?! What kind of demon's game is this?!!"
Quote:
Shannon:"......Please forgive me, Milady.......I am determined not to flinch in my resolve..........Even if I know......that sticking to my feelings......means ending your loving relationship, Milady."
Quote:
Kanon: "I......want to start a new life with you, Milady......Even if that life.......means crushing Nee-san's happiness......I will not falter..."
This and more is why, basically, your theory of Kanon and Shannon taking on the other's hopes and dreams and whatnot is really in trouble, because over and over again it's hammered in that their dreams are mutually exclusive and only one can come true.

I'm afraid your argument for them taking on the other's dreams is not at all clear, and your evidence appears to be just that they knew what the other one's dreams were, which is not really satisfactory. Can you provide, say, evidence in the form of quotes from the series to support your argument?
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