2010-09-07, 07:21 | Link #17421 | ||||
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Quote:
That of course means it isn't a hint. I don't think this incident was ever hinted in the core arcs. Unless Shannon herself mixed the two stories up, but that's quite preposterous if you ask me. If that was done on purpose I'd frown on ryuukishi more than in case it was a simple mistake. Quote:
Even supposing that she doesn't want to be the heir as you say, then she would have acted exactly as Beatrice did, she would have told the servants to keep quiet about that, get all she could get from the gold and then making someone else solve the epitaph leaving them whatever she couldn't convert. And then the whole scene of Beatrice solving the epitaph wouldn't make any sense. No I'd say the whole story wouldn't make any sense, because clearly Beatrice must be in a position of power to do all that she did, even Will said it. Unless you claim that Rosa is Beatrice, then it's absolutely impossible that Rosa solved the epitaph before everyone else. Quote:
Even assuming legal actions were forwarded, proving that the epitaph was solved could be easy to prove. Apart from the servants witnessing the facts, you can show how the epitpah is solved in front of a judge and the jury. As for rosa giving a hint. Please... that was the most useless hint ever, and if there is someone that really helped Eva, that's Kyrie not Rosa. She basically did 70% of the job. Quote:
But I don't think her challenge was meant for Battler alone. Of course like Kinzo, she created a riddle that everyone could solve, while wishing that one specific person would solve it, but while ready to accept whoever would solve it as the one chosen by fate. In other words George and Jessica should also be viable options. The love trial is probably meant for them too. Can they still love he/r after they get to know the harsh truth?
__________________
|
||||
2010-09-07, 09:23 | Link #17422 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
|
Quote:
Quote:
Will has motivation(saving Lion) and doesn't know the truth. It would be a perfect setup. But I have a terrible feeling we won't see either of them again. |
||
2010-09-07, 09:45 | Link #17423 | |
Senior Member
|
Quote:
It's in chapter 5 of the Episode 4 manga. Ange is in the hotel room and thinks about the message bottles. She leans against the window and says that she will definitely destroy the illusion of the witch. Suddenly Beatrice reflects in the window. Ange takes a step back and Beatrice grabs her from behind, screaming at Ange that she shall try. When Ange snaps out of it, there is Amakusa standing directly behind her... It's strange especially because Ange is confused and Amakusa said that he tried calling out to her but she did not respond.... Very strange, especially considering that Amakusa's true goal is still an unknown factor...
__________________
|
|
2010-09-07, 10:17 | Link #17424 | |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
|
Quote:
__________________
Last edited by LyricalAura; 2010-09-07 at 10:45. |
|
2010-09-07, 10:56 | Link #17425 | ||
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
|
Quote:
There's a conflation of information here that does not necessarily hold as related. "Evidence for a secret child" definitely exists as early as ep1-4. "Evidence of a secret child exactly 19 years of age born from Beatrice-2" does not. People had considered Beatrice-2 as a potential mother long before ep5, but that still rather forces us to assume Incest Rapist Kinzo, and I maintain that it's a gross injustice to ascribe such speculation to a character who never has the ability to defend himself in-story by virtue of always being a filtered character. I could even explain that evidence with no child. That is to say, speculation that such a child could have existed would lead people to attempt to make that child exist. Yasu or a person like her could believe themselves to be Lion, when in fact Lion either died or simply never existed in the first place. The evidence from ep1-4 basically supports either conclusion equally well, and if we're leaning strictly on Chiru, I'm not quite so comfortable calling that stuff a done deal. Quote:
But perhaps he won't.
__________________
|
||
2010-09-07, 10:58 | Link #17426 | ||
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Quote:
Now suppose for a second that someone wanted to create that "evidence", using a piece of mandible from another source and attaching someone's teeth on it. Who would you choose as the subject of this forgery assuming you didn't want to harm anyone? Personally I'd go with the nine year old girl who just changed her teeth recently. Isn't it suspicious, that among all the people the only one whom we have evidence of being dead is Maria? Quote:
Beatrice was found right away! But Rosa, who could only go there in a few occasions, managed to ninja all her way to the golden room without Genji even suspecting it. Then Rosa had the wonderful idea to just forget about that, never telling anyone that she went there, and she waited 2 years to formulate a brilliant plan to make someone else find the gold, and all of this without ever worrying that maybe some servant could claim the prize in the meantime. Good job Rosa.
__________________
|
||
2010-09-07, 12:33 | Link #17428 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
|
Quote:
I mean damn she is annoying. But seriously though, DNA profiling has been commercially available since 1987. Though it was only used in high profile cases until recently, I'd say that the incident qualifies as high profile enough. |
|
2010-09-07, 13:05 | Link #17429 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
|
Quote:
Kinzo met Beatrice, that looks like the portrait, during the World War II. Therefore, in 1967 she should be relatively old, but Rosa saw a young woman, who strangely looks like the portrait too. Is it magic or is she her daughter? Beatrice says that she was living in that mansion since the day she was born. When was that mansion constructed? After the war. And Kawabata carried supplies there for 20 years until 1967. In 1967 she died, so the child should be 19 at most. Now, does it really matter if it was 19, or 20, or 21? Could you clearly distinguish the exact age, especially if you know that Shkannon is a very slim and weak person? Then, a very young servant arrives to work on the island. Exceptional case. Is it really that hard to hide her real age? Ah, and of course all information is from ep1-4 only. Last edited by cmos; 2010-09-07 at 13:38. |
|
2010-09-07, 13:41 | Link #17430 | |
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
|
Quote:
"Hey I just received this strange letter, it says I sent it, and that I sent it to my deceased relative, right the day before of the incident... from Niijima... But I certainly never did, this is not my writing! And look it contains such suspicious stuff inside." That sounds like pretty important stuff to me. Well I guess a few people found out all the money and decided to keep quiet. But the police needed just one letter to begin the investigation of all the others. It's so strange that not even one talked to the police. I mean... it's not like it's been so incredibly hard for Ange....
__________________
|
|
2010-09-07, 15:05 | Link #17431 | ||
Senior Member
|
Quote:
Forging something like this seems to be highly speculative and too far out there. The fake corpse in Higurashi was okay, because that person actually had access to medical files. But to fake a piece of Maria, too many things would have to come together that weren't foreshadowed. For one somebody would have to be collecting her teeth, for a believable piece of mandible you would at least need 4 or 5 of them. You would also need a piece of mandible of a child, so there's no way to get something like that so easily, unless you want to imply that somebody dismembered a little girl, just to fake the death of another little girl you suddenly didn't want to harm?! That seems like an aweful lot of dirty work, just to cover something up... Quote:
I might remember it wrong as I still haven't found the time to reread whole Episodes.
__________________
|
||
2010-09-07, 16:34 | Link #17432 |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
|
The way the letters work is:
__________________
|
2010-09-07, 16:50 | Link #17433 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
You know according to the text Nanjo Jr. only had the key to A112 and he thinks there were at least 20 other safety deposit boxes with green lamps that he was allowed to open. That means that including his key there are at least 20 other keys right? The card and the PIN number only gets you permission to bring your key to a single safety deposit box.
So why were there only 4 relatives shown to get a key? For example why is a relative like Nanjo jr. more special than Kyrie's sister Kasumi? Why are all the recipients the victims sons and daughters?
__________________
|
2010-09-07, 17:04 | Link #17434 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
|
Quote:
|
|
2010-09-07, 17:11 | Link #17436 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
How about a master key then? Would it be possible for the person behind this to make a master key for each of the safety deposit boxes? I think that's more realistic than hauling around 20 regular keys.
__________________
|
2010-09-07, 17:25 | Link #17437 | |
Senior Member
|
Quote:
Nanjo and Kumasawa were both in contact with the Beatrice's (as implied by Chiru) and knew about the existence of Kuwadorian (as implied by Episode 4). It is pretty unlikely that they went to the forest every time they got there, so it is quite likely that they also knew about the hidden passages and the chamber of gold. But the question is, if Kumasawa or Nanjo were on Nijima on the 3rd. Kyrie is a highly suspect individual (not only due to Chiru). It was she who brought the siblings to work together against Krauss and she brought the theory of dead Kinzo up, even before they went to Rokkenjima. Her only daughter also conveniently got sick on the day they went to Rokkenjima, thus 'accidently' saving her from the Rokkenjima explosion accident. In the Tea Party of Episode 7 it is also implied by the siblings that it is strange how many thought provoking impulses came from Kyrie while they were solving the epitaph, even though she's not even a proper Ushiromiya. It wouldn't be a problem for her to send the letter in Rudolph's name. BUT the handwriting on the envelope is said to be the same as the Beatrice signature in Maria's diary and the handwriting of the bottle letters. So we have to assume that the letters were at least not produced by any of those three people, unless we believe one of them to be Beatrice. Yet it is quite possible that at least those three senders are in contact with said Beatrice, which gives her a reason to grant them (or their families) at least partial access to the money. Maybe it was some kind of insurance, to convince those people to take part in a rather risky act. In case something went wrong, at least some of them or their relatives would get compensation. We knew that at least Nanjo needed the money because of his grandchild, according to Episode 3. Episode 3 also implies that at least Eva in that scenario knew about the safety deposit boxes. In the anime we even get an added hint, as she is seen, feverishly scribbling down the code written on the door, even though she says that she has no idea what it could be used for.
__________________
|
|
2010-09-07, 17:44 | Link #17438 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2010-09-07, 18:04 | Link #17439 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
|
Quote:
Either way, the fact of that matter is that the number of people on the island has always been less than 20. Therefore, the count intentionally includes individuals not on the Island during those two days. |
|
2010-09-07, 18:18 | Link #17440 | |
BUY MY BOOK!!!
Join Date: May 2009
|
Quote:
The sender may not have specifically intended that everyone actually claim the contents of the boxes. It was just there as an offer.
__________________
|
|
Thread Tools | |
|
|