(L) Freezing [Manga]

[FlavorOfLife]

Originally Posted by vg166

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

I don't think they ever said Mark IV was a complete failure. It had a too high failure rate and when it fails, it FAILS, but I don't think even Amelia said it was a complete failure. And they need the extra Pandoras fast. If that means say 20 out of 100 works, thats 20 they can have soon then wait for a regular Pandora to grow up and get 3 years of training. Its harsh but sadly thats how the world often works. We saw people inside the Chevaliers not wanting to go with the E-Pandoras and Mark IV, but like I said earlier, sometimes its a choice between a bad, horrible decision and a worst alternative. And while Amelia almost died testing the Mark III, I don't think anyone including her thought it would create a Nova-Form.

And the Nova-form is a risk with the regular Pandoras too. They thought they licked that by limiting how many Stigmas each Pandora got but that didn't work. Either way you can say you are making troops for your enemies but that's the only way anyone (Including it looks like Kazuya's grandfather.) knows how to fight the NOVAs.

We don't know if cloning is possible but its been hinted that they did it with Maria. But this is Freezing, where everything so damn obscure. Trying to figure out the details they didn't say can drive you mad.

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

Actually their nova form would have been expected from the celluar invasion as noted by the cheveliar chairman. Going nova form is a known risk for all pandoras hence it would have been understood by all pandora researchers, which is also the reason why they had a drug on hand to inject and kill the subject on failure (somewhere in chap 59 or 60).

The regular Pandoras go nova form after unknown years of pushing their limits during which most die in combat. The Mk 4 creates nova forms after 3 days and that was in lab conditions where a controlled introduction of the mk 4 drug to gather data is expected which implies that 3 days before nova form is being very generous. This was already noted in my previous post as the slow cooked chicken vs instant noodles.

From the viewpoint of the novas, the faster the earthlings give them soldiers, the better it is for them. The flip side is of course, good things for the novas=shit for the earthlings ->hence this is a suicidal tactic. My problem with it is not a matter of lesser evil vs greater evil or such. It is simply this tactic is idiotic to the extreme.

Also to note is the strength of the nova form. The previous assimilated nova forms had a stupidly obvious weak point which the mk 4 nova form lacked. Forcing a year 3 number 1 to fight at >50%(?) strength just to kill a mk 4 nova form means a year 3 number 10 (given the power difference shown, more likely number 7+ would be in deep shit) may not be able to defeat a mk4 nova form.

So in addition to giving them soldiers, you give them elite soldiers. The novas would be cheering.

[Alhazad2003]

Originally Posted by FlavorOfLife

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

Actually their nova form would have been expected from the celluar invasion as noted by the cheveliar chairman. Going nova form is a known risk for all pandoras hence it would have been understood by all pandora researchers, which is also the reason why they had a drug on hand to inject and kill the subject on failure (somewhere in chap 59 or 60).

The regular Pandoras go nova form after unknown years of pushing their limits during which most die in combat. The Mk 4 creates nova forms after 3 days and that was in lab conditions where a controlled introduction of the mk 4 drug to gather data is expected which implies that 3 days before nova form is being very generous. This was already noted in my previous post as the slow cooked chicken vs instant noodles.

From the viewpoint of the novas, the faster the earthlings give them soldiers, the better it is for them. The flip side is of course, good things for the novas=shit for the earthlings ->hence this is a suicidal tactic. My problem with it is not a matter of lesser evil vs greater evil or such. It is simply this tactic is idiotic to the extreme.

Also to note is the strength of the nova form. The previous assimilated nova forms had a stupidly obvious weak point which the mk 4 nova form lacked. Forcing a year 3 number 1 to fight at >50%(?) strength just to kill a mk 4 nova form means a year 3 number 10 (given the power difference shown, more likely number 7+ would be in deep shit) may not be able to defeat a mk4 nova form.

So in addition to giving them soldiers, you give them elite soldiers. The novas would be cheering.

Spoiler:

HOLY- You mean they really are trying to create Nova form Pandoras? That's way beyond idiotic, it's downright insane! Then it's a given now that they mustn't get a hold of our dear heroine. Satella went Nova form without Mark IV, add it to the mix, and it could create widespread destruction and chaos, far worse than even Kazuha.

All this is giving credence to the theory another user had earlier that the Nova might've been created from a failed top secret government experiment. Kinda ironic that they'd also create the Pandoras, whose power comes from the Novas, to fight them. Now that I think of it, how else could they have acquired those stigma, unless they were the ones who originally created the Nova in the first place. Truly diabolical, mankind creating its own destroyers. Whoever said this manga is getting darker was spot on, this arc alone is proving that, and it's nowhere near over. Can't wait for the next chapter.

[vg166]

Originally Posted by FlavorOfLife

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

Actually their nova form would have been expected from the celluar invasion as noted by the cheveliar chairman. Going nova form is a known risk for all pandoras hence it would have been understood by all pandora researchers, which is also the reason why they had a drug on hand to inject and kill the subject on failure (somewhere in chap 59 or 60).

The regular Pandoras go nova form after unknown years of pushing their limits during which most die in combat. The Mk 4 creates nova forms after 3 days and that was in lab conditions where a controlled introduction of the mk 4 drug to gather data is expected which implies that 3 days before nova form is being very generous. This was already noted in my previous post as the slow cooked chicken vs instant noodles.

From the viewpoint of the novas, the faster the earthlings give them soldiers, the better it is for them. The flip side is of course, good things for the novas=shit for the earthlings ->hence this is a suicidal tactic. My problem with it is not a matter of lesser evil vs greater evil or such. It is simply this tactic is idiotic to the extreme.

Also to note is the strength of the nova form. The previous assimilated nova forms had a stupidly obvious weak point which the mk 4 nova form lacked. Forcing a year 3 number 1 to fight at >50%(?) strength just to kill a mk 4 nova form means a year 3 number 10 (given the power difference shown, more likely number 7+ would be in deep shit) may not be able to defeat a mk4 nova form.

So in addition to giving them soldiers, you give them elite soldiers. The novas would be cheering.

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

It _is_ a choice between bad and worst alternatives because the humans have NO other ways of fighting the NOVAs. IIRC, the humans do not have any other way of killing the NOVAs, or at least killing them before they self-destruct. So...Unless you want the humans to glass the planet, they DON'T have abi.lity to play nice.

The situation from the human standpoint is a awfully bad one. The decision maybe be idiotic and to many in the chain of command are jerkasses but even the ones who had problems with the E-Pandora program project had to admit the problem of numbers of Pandoras need answer now. Good, bad, horrific - anything better then just lying down for the NOVAs to kill.

[vg166]

Originally Posted by Alhazad2003

Spoiler:

Now that I think of it, how else could they have acquired those stigma, unless they were the ones who originally created the Nova in the first place. Truly diabolical, mankind creating its own destroyers. Whoever said this manga is getting darker was spot on, this arc alone is proving that, and it's nowhere near over. Can't wait for the next chapter.

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

The NOVAs all explode after a limited time rampaging in the human world which is why when the NOVAs from the Yokohama clash disappeared everyone was in a panic. That is a easy place to get remains.

And since so much of the background and story is not told yet if ever, we might never klnow.

[FlavorOfLife]

Originally Posted by vg166

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

It _is_ a choice between bad and worst alternatives because the humans have NO other ways of fighting the NOVAs. IIRC, the humans do not have any other way of killing the NOVAs, or at least killing them before they self-destruct. So...Unless you want the humans to glass the planet, they DON'T have abi.lity to play nice.

The situation from the human standpoint is a awfully bad one. The decision maybe be idiotic and to many in the chain of command are jerkasses but even the ones who had problems with the E-Pandora program project had to admit the problem of numbers of Pandoras need answer now. Good, bad, horrific - anything better then just lying down for the NOVAs to kill.

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

No there are plenty of tactics that are not stupidly gifting the enemy with units if even a little thought was put into it.

The first is the most obvious. Make 3-5 limiters per pandora depending on each ones number of stigma, more if the limitations do not belong merely to the physical number of stigma.

Why? Note the reason why aircraft/ships/weapons fail so badly. They all get frozen

Stick a limiter into each vehicle or use them as per normal, to counter the nova freeze ability.

But the shells and missiles will get frozen once there is no physical contact, you say? Note the weapon types in use by the pandoras particularly the chain/flail types. Answer from that? Attach a physical chain to the missile. Done

Alternatively do close range strafing depending on the limiter's freezing radius

Then there is the longer term methods that no one seems to bother with.
i) Analysis and creation of volt weapons and applying them to the weaponry particularly bow/missile types, equip each army with said weapons

ii) Analysis of limiter freezing ability and replication of said ability. Apply to vehicles or place in populated areas ensuing power level is greater than Novas.

iii) Technology too low to do that? Clone a few thousand number 1s. Even if they cannot be instantly aged to physical maturity, implementation of this tactic years ago would have given them thousands of pandoras which would buy them time to clone a few tens of thousand more, etc

iv) Make light/laser/non-matter based weaponry. Obviously light is unaffected by freezing else no sight would be possible.

[Methuselah]

Someone please tell me what happens in manga 42 in the novel version if there is any. I must know now. I don't want anything bad to happen to her. Damn it Kakuya why are you so freaken dense! Your lover has been pale and eyes shock the whole time Louis appears. You must know that there is something wrong. AND for fuck sakes why did you not ever ask her why she "didn't like to be touched" I would have suspect that she had a traumatizing past.

[shaselai]

are there any children between the female and male teams? wouldnt it be interesting if the offspring is someone who has the combat abilities as well as can freeze on the fly?

[vg166]

Originally Posted by FlavorOfLife

Spoiler for Chapter 64-65:

No there are plenty of tactics that are not stupidly gifting the enemy with units if even a little thought was put into it.

The first is the most obvious. Make 3-5 limiters per pandora depending on each ones number of stigma, more if the limitations do not belong merely to the physical number of stigma.

Why? Note the reason why aircraft/ships/weapons fail so badly. They all get frozen

Stick a limiter into each vehicle or use them as per normal, to counter the nova freeze ability.

But the shells and missiles will get frozen once there is no physical contact, you say? Note the weapon types in use by the pandoras particularly the chain/flail types. Answer from that? Attach a physical chain to the missile. Done

Alternatively do close range strafing depending on the limiter's freezing radius

Then there is the longer term methods that no one seems to bother with.
i) Analysis and creation of volt weapons and applying them to the weaponry particularly bow/missile types, equip each army with said weapons

ii) Analysis of limiter freezing ability and replication of said ability. Apply to vehicles or place in populated areas ensuing power level is greater than Novas.

iii) Technology too low to do that? Clone a few thousand number 1s. Even if they cannot be instantly aged to physical maturity, implementation of this tactic years ago would have given them thousands of pandoras which would buy them time to clone a few tens of thousand more, etc

iv) Make light/laser/non-matter based weaponry. Obviously light is unaffected by freezing else no sight would be possible.

This is more a complete indictment of the series/idea concept than what is going on in the story-verse. Freezing is liek Claymore except Claymore puts together the parts a little better.

Spoiler for Previous Chapters:

And all of this recommedations would work, if the FREAKIN' technology from Freezing actually approximated 2060-2070. They're flying Ospreys for god's sake.

Theyu could fire some bomb pump lasers at the NOVAs whenever they attack but since the NOVAs attacks cities with large populations, that wouldn't work to well.

And the most important thing they could do to fight the NOVAs - get rid of the Pandoras. Period.

Because its apparent that some people like Sister Margaret believe that any Pandora, because they carry the Stigmata, is vulnerable to being transforming into a NOVAform. At any time. That's why she was correcting West Genetics' vice-president during the attack.

[shaselai]

Spoiler for new side chapter:

Ok, new chapter but side story... The teacher is giving out test results and told Lana and Sattelizer they both need to retake. Basically both of them passed combat courses but failed in all other courses. The principle said how can Sattelizer be so dumb when she's from a famous family - she then asks how she is in class and was told she is very serious listening to teacher etc. One teacher said maybe because all the nutrients went to her breasts instead of her brain? Principle told her to cut it and out and try to help them get better so the two teachers decided to try something out.

We see Lana getting pumped up for the extra study class and Sattelizer's like "people who arent smart are really simple" and Lana's like "you are in same boat as me so you are just the same!" They take the first course taught by a senpai and the senpai told them be serious when taking the course and in the end Sattelizer was praised for her very good notes while Lana was like "I didn't know we had to take notes?"

Second class taught by Elizabeth Mably and she commented how Sattelizer is the first student ever to fail all her non-combat classes. While they are doing work Elizabeth hits Sattelizer telling her she messed up on her formulae and she should ask for help and not let her pride prevent her from doing it. Sattelizer asks Elizabeth for help and she gets the question right and thinks Elizabeth has a nice side - then gets hit again when she got the next one wrong. Lana's like "i don't get this at all!"
Third calss taught by another senpai and she is surprised Sattelizer is taking the class and comments if Kazuya knows about this and Lana's like "if kazuya knows she is a dumb gorilla maybe he will stop being your partner". She then said if Sattelizer keeps failing she will be held back - perhaps she is purposely trying to stay back a class to be with Kazuya. lana's like "so this is what you were plotting!". The senpai also said "from now on we should call you "unpassable queen" instead of "untouchable queen". Sattelizer goes "i am not gonna stay back a class and proceeds to fight it out saying if combat is perfect it doens't matter. The teacher passes by the building comments on how they are still hard at studying then part of the building blows up with the two fighting. In the end the school created a new combat class and whoever gets a perfect on that class won't be held back because of non-combat classes.

[Waven]

Originally Posted by shaselai

Spoiler for new side chapter:

Ok, new chapter but side story... The teacher is giving out test results and told Lana and Sattelizer they both need to retake. Basically both of them passed combat courses but failed in all other courses. The principle said how can Sattelizer be so dumb when she's from a famous family - she then asks how she is in class and was told she is very serious listening to teacher etc. One teacher said maybe because all the nutrients went to her breasts instead of her brain? Principle told her to cut it and out and try to help them get better so the two teachers decided to try something out.

We see Lana getting pumped up for the extra study class and Sattelizer's like "people who arent smart are really simple" and Lana's like "you are in same boat as me so you are just the same!" They take the first course taught by a senpai and the senpai told them be serious when taking the course and in the end Sattelizer was praised for her very good notes while Lana was like "I didn't know we had to take notes?"

Second class taught by Elizabeth Mably and she commented how Sattelizer is the first student ever to fail all her non-combat classes. While they are doing work Elizabeth hits Sattelizer telling her she messed up on her formulae and she should ask for help and not let her pride prevent her from doing it. Sattelizer asks Elizabeth for help and she gets the question right and thinks Elizabeth has a nice side - then gets hit again when she got the next one wrong. Lana's like "i don't get this at all!"
Third calss taught by another senpai and she is surprised Sattelizer is taking the class and comments if Kazuya knows about this and Lana's like "if kazuya knows she is a dumb gorilla maybe he will stop being your partner". She then said if Sattelizer keeps failing she will be held back - perhaps she is purposely trying to stay back a class to be with Kazuya. lana's like "so this is what you were plotting!". The senpai also said "from now on we should call you "unpassable queen" instead of "untouchable queen". Sattelizer goes "i am not gonna stay back a class and proceeds to fight it out saying if combat is perfect it doens't matter. The teacher passes by the building comments on how they are still hard at studying then part of the building blows up with the two fighting. In the end the school created a new combat class and whoever gets a perfect on that class won't be held back because of non-combat classes.

Spoiler for oO:

Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait ...... so they actually learn something in this school beside beating each other to a pulp and showing off their giant boobs?

[shaselai]

Originally Posted by Waven

Spoiler for oO:

Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait ...... so they actually learn something in this school beside beating each other to a pulp and showing off their giant boobs?

Spoiler for joke:

I think that's why this is a "joke" chapter. trying to show the "intellectual" side of the academy but it ends up a battle ground in the end

[Alhazad2003]

Originally Posted by shaselai

Spoiler for new side chapter:

Ok, new chapter but side story... The teacher is giving out test results and told Lana and Sattelizer they both need to retake. Basically both of them passed combat courses but failed in all other courses. The principle said how can Sattelizer be so dumb when she's from a famous family - she then asks how she is in class and was told she is very serious listening to teacher etc. One teacher said maybe because all the nutrients went to her breasts instead of her brain? Principle told her to cut it and out and try to help them get better so the two teachers decided to try something out.

We see Lana getting pumped up for the extra study class and Sattelizer's like "people who arent smart are really simple" and Lana's like "you are in same boat as me so you are just the same!" They take the first course taught by a senpai and the senpai told them be serious when taking the course and in the end Sattelizer was praised for her very good notes while Lana was like "I didn't know we had to take notes?"

Second class taught by Elizabeth Mably and she commented how Sattelizer is the first student ever to fail all her non-combat classes. While they are doing work Elizabeth hits Sattelizer telling her she messed up on her formulae and she should ask for help and not let her pride prevent her from doing it. Sattelizer asks Elizabeth for help and she gets the question right and thinks Elizabeth has a nice side - then gets hit again when she got the next one wrong. Lana's like "i don't get this at all!"
Third calss taught by another senpai and she is surprised Sattelizer is taking the class and comments if Kazuya knows about this and Lana's like "if kazuya knows she is a dumb gorilla maybe he will stop being your partner". She then said if Sattelizer keeps failing she will be held back - perhaps she is purposely trying to stay back a class to be with Kazuya. lana's like "so this is what you were plotting!". The senpai also said "from now on we should call you "unpassable queen" instead of "untouchable queen". Sattelizer goes "i am not gonna stay back a class and proceeds to fight it out saying if combat is perfect it doens't matter. The teacher passes by the building comments on how they are still hard at studying then part of the building blows up with the two fighting. In the end the school created a new combat class and whoever gets a perfect on that class won't be held back because of non-combat classes.

Spoiler:

LOL, this was too funny. And I daresay Elizabeth has the right opinion of Satellizer: her bad grades are more a case of bad attitude than bad aptitude. If a person really doesn't want to learn, nothing will stop them. And Satellizer pretty much verifies it with her "As long as I can fight perfectly, I don't need to learn this useless stuff," remark. Too funny. ^^;;

And let me guess, it was Elize who made that comment about all the nutrients going to Satellizer's breasts instead of her brain? Enviou much? I know it wasn't Yumi because she's even bigger [a whole 5 cm according to the anime, but I digress]. Or was it another teacher who'd yet to be introduced? Either way, loved it.

[ShiroiRyu]

42 scanlation out ...
That was bad ... Really bad ... >_<
Not in the story, not in the artwork ... But because of the brother.
How many chapter before the ending of this arc ? Because i already want to kill him. XD

[Nemuru]

Originally Posted by ShiroiRyu

42 scanlation out ...
That was bad ... Really bad ... >_<
Not in the story, not in the artwork ... But because of the brother.
How many chapter before the ending of this arc ? Because i already want to kill him. XD

Spoiler for ...:

finish at chapter 48-50 this arc I think can't remember exactly. ^^,, enjoy the pain

It's only going to get uglier from here....

[Kagayaki]

Well, that's the angriest I've been after reading any manga chapter in a good while.

[Kyouka]

since they are on 42 are they just really slow at the scans or something

[Nemuru]

Originally Posted by kyouka

since they are on 42 are they just really slow at the scans or something

You could always read the raw.... but the current arc is a slog-fest for most people to spend time translating.

[hoarfrost]

Well here's something I wouldn't have guessed from the raws. Not only is he a monster in general but he's also a racist. Try harder to make a less likable character.

[Sinestra]

what a Jack Ass it was actually hard to read this just thinking of the pain and how this guy lives to torture Satella. If this guy was real i would tear him apart with my bare hands. Its easy to see why she traumatized and now he is trying to make her relive it all over again. To top it off this guy has video. I see nothing good, nothing redeeming about him. Violet should have been more thoughtful of arranging this little family get together. This guy needs some serious therapy the last couple of scenes of Satella tied to a pillar and him whipping her was just wrong.

However, hear Satella say outloud she does love Kazuya was nice. The fact that she said no other man will be allowed to touch her other than him reaffirmed her feelings for Kazuya. Its just too bad it had to come to the surface like that because Louis provoked her.

I wonder if Louis's Pandora knows what hes up too. From the looks of it she has feelings for Louis that little psycho bastard. who could love that douche.

[technomo12]

fer better or worse imma get the raws and put my net prowers to understand the rageful volume