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Old 2012-06-12, 01:04   Link #1101
Endless Soul
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Zod, what a heart wrenching episode. Not Grave of the Fireflies bad, but still left me a little misty eyed.

Those f***ing idiot elders. I hope they all died painful deaths.

The broken leg and the bleeding didn't help, but I'm sure she was down there slowly dying over the course of a few days. Without water she would not have lasted much more than a week.

And Teiichi felt all of it.

Endless "heavy heart" Soul
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Old 2012-06-12, 01:58   Link #1102
Coldlight
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I liked the "film showing"-like take on the flashback involving Teiichi as the sole viewer & reenactor. Kirie does kind of resemble her grandmother Yukariko. Yuuko died a horribly slow, painful death as a sudden sacrifice. I wouldn't blame her for snapping near the last moments of her life.

I can only imagine the guilty, dumbfounded, desperate faces of those elders once it became clear that sacrificing Yuuko didn't stop the epidemic right away (I'm assuming it didn't). Found the episode to be both sad and heart-pounding at times.
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
but he thinks that how they handled the second season is well done.
Second season? What second season?
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Old 2012-06-12, 02:23   Link #1103
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^ Lol wait, take out the "second" on that part. My mistake.
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Old 2012-06-12, 03:11   Link #1104
MeisterBabylon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldlight View Post
I can only imagine the guilty, dumbfounded, desperate faces of those elders once it became clear that sacrificing Yuuko didn't stop the epidemic right away (I'm assuming it didn't). Found the episode to be both sad and heart-pounding at times.
You know what's sicker? Maybe it just so happened that the TB bug ran out of people to kill after Yuuko, and so the elders lived out the next 2 decades of their lives in comfort...

Or worse, some Marines shipped rifampicin to the village the next day and saved everyone...
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Old 2012-06-12, 04:02   Link #1105
Rayrah
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Ah, so Kishida Mel designed the episode 10 end card; I knew that lovely art style looked familiar ~



Stupid watermark.
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Old 2012-06-12, 04:13   Link #1106
Randrak42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeisterBabylon View Post
You know what's sicker? Maybe it just so happened that the TB bug ran out of people to kill after Yuuko, and so the elders lived out the next 2 decades of their lives in comfort...

Or worse, some Marines shipped rifampicin to the village the next day and saved everyone...
Or maybe they tripped on the inter-dimensional 13th* step hit their heads and died a slow and agonizing death!

Spoiler for *:
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Old 2012-06-12, 04:26   Link #1107
HasuMasu
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
Or maybe they tripped on the inter-dimensional 13th* step hit their heads and died a slow and agonizing death!

Spoiler for *:
Spoiler for lol:
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Old 2012-06-12, 06:37   Link #1108
Lukeman1884
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So what happened to Yuuko's face? It looked almost..................dessicated. Cracked, and dried. I doubt she would've gotten that from just the fall.
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Old 2012-06-12, 07:19   Link #1109
Randrak42
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Originally Posted by Lukeman1884 View Post
So what happened to Yuuko's face? It looked almost..................dessicated. Cracked, and dried. I doubt she would've gotten that from just the fall.
That tends to happen when you are left for god knows how long in a deep, dark basement with a broken leg. Malnutrition, dehydration, infections, fevers, possible TB...and so on. You'd look like shit too...
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Old 2012-06-12, 08:56   Link #1110
FredFriendly
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My very first substantive impression of episode 10 was, "There Yuuko goes slapping someone again." Her sister, no less, and for something that she should have shown compassion for, not anger. No wonder she's also violent in her ghostly form, that's just the type of person she is.

Although I will admit that this was probably the best episode yet (out of a wide field of not very good ones), there were some things I thought the episode could have done without. Particularly the gratuitous humor and fanservice, plus idiot-boy's neurotic yelling. I think the episode would have carried a lot more weight, emotionally, if they had left out these elements.

But seeing Yuuko violently slap her sister put me off feeling much sympathy for her to start with, then whiny idiot-boy (plus his miniaturized size) and the fanservice really made it feel like a cheap thriller.

Everything else was played pretty well; Yuuko's caring and kind nature towards Asa; the fear and panic of the elders; Yuuko's capture and imprisonment and her subsequent torment. Very well done, indeed.

But, in the end, for me, the fanservice and idiot-boy were just too much to take the episode, as a whole, seriously. Really, was there any real need for a bath scene? Pure fanservice in an episode which otherwise could have been top-notch.
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Old 2012-06-12, 10:48   Link #1111
-Sho-
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Well , Yuuko's past was less worse than expected.
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Old 2012-06-12, 11:00   Link #1112
MrTerrorist
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That was cruel and terrifying. What happen to Yuuko was truly the most horrible thing to happen to her.
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Old 2012-06-12, 11:03   Link #1113
Paradoxine
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Really liked this episode, the first person point of view gave a heightened sense of empathy for Yuuko imo. I'm not really that mad at the elders', I'm not sensitive to the failing's of humanity any-more, haven't been for a long time. I thought the episode was extremely well done and the fact that Teiichi felt the pain etc was a really nice touch. Makes me interested, though, to see how the issue of Shadow-Yuuko will be resolved. I can hardly fathom her just disappearing and indeed such an end would be unsatisfying as well. But as well as that, will Yuuko and Teiichi be able to deal with a 'whole' Yuuko?

Lastly, I don't agree that the bath scene was fan-service either, I think too many of you are just conditioned to think that any kind of shower/bath scene is fan-service because of it's frequency. I think what It was truly trying to show how close the two sister's were and how the plague was causing friction between them -> The slapping. Looking forward to the rest of the series.
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Old 2012-06-12, 12:14   Link #1114
TheEroKing
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Another Yuuko freebie.
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Old 2012-06-12, 12:19   Link #1115
Kaoru Chujo
Yuuki Aoi
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredFriendly View Post
...But, in the end, for me, the fanservice and idiot-boy were just too much to take the episode, as a whole, seriously. Really, was there any real need for a bath scene? Pure fanservice in an episode which otherwise could have been top-notch.
First, it wasn't "pure" fanservice, since it did also have an emotional purpose, as Paradoxine said. Second, what the heck is so bad about showing people naked, anyway? Just because it makes the show inconvenient to present to certain people? (A problem, I admit.)

I do wonder why they had to make Teiichi look younger, but his reactions made emotional sense to me. They communicated real feeling, which is a reasonable thing to do in drama. Those reactions didn't seem extreme to me, under the circumstances. Maybe even the opposite.
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Old 2012-06-12, 13:03   Link #1116
mangamuscle
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@Kaoru Chujo Thanks for the info.

The saddest part IMO is that a doctor had already visited the village, so the epidemy was probably already under control (already infected people probably continued to die, specially if it was a tuberculosis outbreak) but the senile elders still went on a rampage kidnapping Asa.

My only doubt if is Yukariko is really innocent, when Yuuko asked her about Asa's whereabout the screen turned red three times, which to me foreshadows she was lying and was the one that told the village elders about Asa's whereabouts (and when to kindap her without making a ruckus).

The part about the mirror intrigues me, the fact that Yuuko after 60 years continues to exert control over the physucal world (most ghosts become dimmer as times goes by, becomeng little more than a shadow). Maybe when Yuuko finally accepts her shadow self she will become a Youkai, she has been talked about for so long that she is somehow an object of fear/worship.
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Old 2012-06-12, 14:19   Link #1117
FredFriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradoxine View Post
Lastly, I don't agree that the bath scene was fan-service either, I think too many of you are just conditioned to think that any kind of shower/bath scene is fan-service because of it's frequency. I think what It was truly trying to show how close the two sister's were and how the plague was causing friction between them -> The slapping. Looking forward to the rest of the series.
To think including a bath scene is not primarily for fanservice, especially in an anime whose #1 selling point is its fanservice, is just plain silly. You can't get much more clichéd than that, except, perhaps, an onsen scene. And more specifically, within the first few seconds of the scene, not only do we hear idiot boy say, "I saw them again," obviously referring to Yuuko's breasts, but a few seconds later he whines and turns bright red when Yukariko walks in and asks Yuuko if she can join her. Not a fanservice scene? Really?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
First, it wasn't "pure" fanservice, since it did also have an emotional purpose, as Paradoxine said. Second, what the heck is so bad about showing people naked, anyway? Just because it makes the show inconvenient to present to certain people? (A problem, I admit.)
In the first place, I, personally, don't have any objections to fanservice, per se, and probably enjoy it just as much as any dirty old man. Most of the fanservice in this anime is perfectly delightful, and one of my favorite animes is even Kenko Zenrakei Suieibu Umisho, which probably has even more fanservice than Tasogare Otome x Amnesia, though it is not one of my favorites because of the fanservice. But there are times when even I feel that fanservice is inappropriate, and this entire episode was one of them. There really was no need for any of it, yet, right from the get-go, before and after the opening credits, we are served the appetizer to our weekly dose of Yuuko fanservice.

Certainly they could have found a different way to express Yuuko's concern for her sister, other than displaying the two of them naked in the bath together. In the first scene with Yukariko, they certainly were able to get across how much she cared for Yuuko, as well as how much Yuuko cared for Asa (but, coincidentally, the scene only showed hostility on Yuuko's part towards her own sister).

Perhaps if idiot boy had kept his mouth shut during the bath scene, and if he wasn't shown blushing like a fire hydrant, I might have been able to take that scene seriously. But, those detriments, combined with the sisters slapping each other, just seemed like another opportunity to show naked women in action. Instead of making me feel like the two sisters cared a lot about each other, I came away from the scene feeling like they were just very hostile towards each other.

It's too bad, like I said earlier, because most of the episode was really well done. If they had left out all those detrimental elements that I've mentioned, I'd probably rate this one episode a solid 10. But I guess some people, animators included, gotta have their weekly dose of Yuuko fanservice, no matter how it affects the rest of the episode.
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Old 2012-06-12, 15:16   Link #1118
Kaoru Chujo
Yuuki Aoi
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredFriendly View Post
...Perhaps if idiot boy had kept his mouth shut during the bath scene, and if he wasn't shown blushing like a fire hydrant, I might have been able to take that scene seriously....
Hmm. In that, I have to agree with you: that kind of silliness always annoys me. Even if he is a 12-year-old Japanese boy.

You make good points. I just didn't happen to react the same way. I admitted fanservice was part of the reason for the bath scene. But it seemed natural and intimate to me, and also gave a bit of an old-time flavour. The slapping gave a bit of old-time flavour too, lol. People treated each other worse in the past, is my opinion.
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Old 2012-06-12, 15:56   Link #1119
FredFriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
Even if he is a 12-year-old Japanese boy.
Hmm... Someone else said that previously. Was it you? Is there something inherently different between 12-year old Japanese boys and, say, 12-year old British boys, or Canadian boys, or, for that matter, any other 12-year old boys? Are they more prone to giggle? To blush at a naked girl's body? To tell a girl around his own age to not expose herself to him?

Not that I even believe that last one. At the age of 12, when hormones were beginning to run wild, I don't think any of my male classmates would have objected if one of our female classmates were to disrobe in front of us. That must just be an anime thing. Or, maybe it is a Japanese thing.

Quote:
You make good points. I just didn't happen to react the same way. I admitted fanservice was part of the reason for the bath scene. But it seemed natural and intimate to me, and also gave a bit of an old-time flavour.
As usual, you make some very good points, as well. It may have seemed natural and intimate to me, as well, if idiot boy hadn't been there, ruining the whole atmosphere, making it seem like a parody of a very important, serious scene. I will admit that, if he hadn't been there, my inclination to call it fanservice would be severely diminished, but with him there, particularly in full-blown blush, it was obviously pandering to a certain segment of the audience (the segment of the audience that will buy the DVDs to see the uncensored bits).

Quote:
The slapping gave a bit of old-time flavour too, lol. People treated each other worse in the past, is my opinion.
Geez. I have the opposite opinion. I feel that, a long time ago, when I was young (let's just say more decades than you can count on one hand), people were a lot more considerate of each other, and this sort of spontaneous slapping each other would not have been the norm, but an oddity. It seems to me that, nowadays, people in general are a lot more crass and impolite than they were when I was young. Respect and consideration for your fellow human were more prevalent, and "Please" and "Thank you" were the norm then. Nowadays they're the rarity, particularly, but not only, among teenagers. Maybe not in Japan, but at least where I come from, that is.
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Old 2012-06-12, 17:17   Link #1120
Kaoru Chujo
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@FredFriendly -- I had the same reaction you did about the "Japanese boy" thing, when someone previously explained his attitude with that idea (I was quoting them). I thought as you did that the 12-year-old boys I know would react quite differently. But then I thought about it and realized that Japanese society remains a bit more conventional and hidebound than ours in North America. For better and worse.

As for the thing about people in the past being less kind, I say it not just because I believe it, but because it is so counter-intuitive. My moment of realization came when I watched a Marx Brothers and a WC Fields film back to back. The humour was quite cruel. And people 50-100 years ago certainly had stricter demands for conventional behaviour and less tolerance of outsiders of any kind. In 18th century England, executions were popular public entertainment. And in the time of Christ, people though mass crucifixions were a good idea, and slavery perfectly normal. That slavery thing kept going until 150 years ago in the US (it was abolished a bit earlier in Britain, where it was not so economically significant).

People may have been more polite in the past, but not necessarily kinder. Courtesy may be a form of self-defence in a society where everyone is actually afraid of each other (e.g., the origin of shaking hands as showing you held no weapon). I've always thought abject fear of lords and samurai was the origin of Japanese high courtesy and social discipline.

Sorry, getting off-topic. To bring it back, could you show village elders sacrificing a child in modern Japan without it seeming totally impossible? I wonder.

EDIT: @Grimjack (next post) -- Good points. But I think of that kind of cruelty as part of a pre-modern society. Or perpetrated by the occasional psychopath in a modern society.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2012-06-12 at 17:40.
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