2013-04-19, 01:26 | Link #1 |
Swordy Turkey
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Where turkeys can actually fly
Age: 31
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Let's Talk: Swords and Martial Arts
So, I was pretty bored and decided to make this topic to kill some time. (And to share with you guys some of the limited knowledge I have.
Swords are fascinating objects. A tool for killing no doubt, but nevertheless it has become a powerful icon in our popular culture. We see it everywhere, from the razor sharp katana to laser-esque blades in sci-fi. These objects themselves have a strong historical and cultural significance being symbolic in both the East and the West. Eastern swords arts, particularly east asian sword arts, are renown for their grace, elegance and efficiency. Martial artist whom practice them are known for both their fighting prowess and humility. On the western sword arts on the other hand we have fencing. No, no that fencing which you see in the Olympics, or the clubs in universities. I'm talking about the Kunst de Fechtens, the Art of Defense, the Noble Science of Defense. To understand what I'm talking about, first we'll have a brief history lesson. It is a common misconception that the medieval battlefield was ruled by brute strength. Clumsy but big hearted knights bashing each other engaging in slow, and ponderous combat. This was not historical fact however. Ancient manuscripts and treatises of systematic martial techniques have recently been rediscovered after being lost for centuries, after being sadly neglected for many centuries. These many treatises were recorded by the Masters of Defense who lived during that period, and are now being studied world wide. The study of this Art, commonly known as Historical European Martial Arts (HEMA), has experienced a massive resurgence in the 21st century, thanks to the internet. By studying, interpreting and experimenting the texts with a scientific approach and an understanding of bio-mechanics, these techniques can be (and have been) reconstructed efficiently. There are many sword-arts within HEMA itself which includes the much favoured longsword, the rapier, sword and buckler, single sword, and many others! So here's a short swordy FAQ: Katanas are generally the best swords hands down Not really. The Katana is an excellent weapon, and their forging techniques ensured excellent quality control, but otherwise made swords of comparable quality to the rest of the world. In fact the famed 'folding the blade' technique was in event the world over, and the Celts have been using the technique in the form of pattern welding. European swords were blunt and heavy designed to bash through armour Again this is false, European swords were definitely sharp, as modern reconstructions using accurate period materials have been tested. There are also archaeological evidences discovering skeletal remains which have been cleaved from the should/collarbones to the mid ribs. Also, the average weight of longswords themselves are 3lbs, designed for nimble use and fast cuts and thrusts. Furthermore, cutting is a poor solution to plate armour. Instead if a fencer would be expected to grip the blade with one hand in a technique called 'half-swording', where the sword would be wielded more like a spear, allowing increased precision to stab into the joints and exposed bits where the armour is not covering. Another technique utilized in armoured combat itself is the Mordschlag, where the blade is gripped with both hands. In this technique the sword functions more like a warhammer, to crush through the enemy's armour. With proper technique to grip the blade, (Pressing against the flat and not sliding on the edges) one may use these techniques without fear of cutting themselves.) |
2013-04-19, 06:47 | Link #4 | |
Swordy Turkey
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Where turkeys can actually fly
Age: 31
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Agile, nimble, and an all-purpose weapon. The German school of swordsmanship that I tend to favour: The Lichtenaur Tradition is an awesome style for the sword. Brutally efficient and elegant to watch. Unfortunately I'm still a beginner so the only sword I have right now is a nylon waster. (Training blade) |
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2013-04-19, 09:30 | Link #6 | |
Moving in circles
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Singapore
Age: 49
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Rather than compare weapons from different cultures and different eras against each other, it is more meaningful to consider how each sword was designed to be used against which types of armour and in what types of tactics. Also, it's worth noting that the sword, while prestigious, was rarely the primary field weapon in most battles before the gunpowder era. |
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2013-04-19, 10:50 | Link #10 | |
Sensei, aishite imasu
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Hong Kong Shatterdome
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2013-04-19, 14:17 | Link #11 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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In fact, armor has always been overrated. Most of the soldiers in the past do not wear the heavy plate armor as it is expensive and often reserved for those who can afford to buy and maintain it. Chainmail is also quite expensive and hard to mass manufacture, so most soldiers went with cured hard leather and longer ranged weapons, like pikes and polearms which can cause hurt in simple movements. Of course, there are the "metrosexual" Doppelsoldners who dress in bright colours and wield two-handed swords. We would have laughed at them today for their dress code, but in those days they are considered the dangerous elite swordsmen that they were known as Meister des langen Schwert (Master of Long Sword), cutting down horse riders and pikemen with ease.
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2013-04-19, 16:22 | Link #12 | |
Sensei, aishite imasu
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Hong Kong Shatterdome
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Dunno. A warhammer with a back spike on it is REALLY dangerous.
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There are still limitations, and obviously things dedicated to going through armor can often do it, but doesn't necessarily mean its overrated. Also, I would suggest not trying certain European sword techniques without armored gauntlets. Or at least I'd feel better with gauntlets.
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Last edited by Roger Rambo; 2013-04-19 at 16:40. |
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2013-04-19, 16:40 | Link #13 | |
Not Enough Sleep
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 48
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In China, the sword is more ceremonial then functional. The main weapon on the battlefield are polearm types.
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2013-04-19, 20:43 | Link #14 | ||||||
Swordy Turkey
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Where turkeys can actually fly
Age: 31
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Last edited by theflyingturkey; 2013-04-19 at 20:56. |
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2013-04-20, 14:00 | Link #18 |
大巧不工
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Different weapons for different scenarios. Setting bows aside (esp the crossbow), the pike/spear is a cheap, easily mass produced weapon which requires very little training and works wonders when arranged in a formation.
Other than that I would probably use an axe. As seen in the warhammer video, the pick is much more useful in most situations than the blunt side. If you are to replace the blunt with an axe-blade, you have something which can easily cut shields into half, snap spears, trap swords, and also penetrate plate armor pretty effectively. Most melee weapons require a certain about of expertise to use. A quick reloading crossbow esp when coupled with a poisoned bolt allow amateurs to take down a seasoned warrior. |
2013-04-20, 14:28 | Link #19 | |
Sensei, aishite imasu
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Hong Kong Shatterdome
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The spike is deadly of course, but keep in mind that it takes a bit of work to retrieve it after it goes through platemail. And if you don't hit a vital area, you might run the risk of having your weapon stuck in a guy whose still attacking you. Or you could fail to remove it fast enough to deal with another enemy. The hammer is what you use to knock the enemy around, and you finish him with the spike.
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sword, swordplay |
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