(L) Re:Creators

[moridin84]

The difference between liking and not liking episode 21 is probably whether you like Altair or not.

This episode would come off as very boring if you don't emphasize with Altair. And very unfulfilling if you want to see her defeated.

Personally, I don't think the fights in the episodes before this were pointless. Most the battles in ReCreator were pretty inconclusive. Generally, people said that they wanted to say and then left for one reason or another. This was the same. Every fight in the last few episodes was meaningful for the ones in them. Well, probably not Hikayu Hoshikawa but she was a gag fighting character anyways.


You know, people sure get worked up on the words "murder" and "murderer" sometimes. Killing people is pretty common in anime. Murder is simply "unlawful killing" which is also pretty common.

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

I still think the greatest backlash is caused by the story having the audacity to create an artificial fandom, disconnected from the real audience. Basically having the show praising itself for how good it is, and how many fake people loved it, all happening off screen where the real audience never saw it. People hate to be misrepresented, it is understandable that it offends

You kinda have a point there.

Because the way you are posting, you are claiming to represent the "real audience", which hates Altair and episode 21. This is something I find rather annoying since I like Altair and episode 21.

Being misrepresented is definitely irritating.

Good job man.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by moridin84

You kinda have a point there.

Because the way you are posting, you are claiming to represent the "real audience", which hates Altair and episode 21. This is something I find rather annoying since I like Altair and episode 21.

Being misrepresented is definitely irritating.

Good job man.

having peoples cheering for altair is fine and no problem, the problem is when they make looks like "everyone" there was cheering for her, even peoples wich whee supposed to cheering for the so "claimed heroes", or the fans of the others characters, for some weird reason, everyone here didin't wanted altair be defeated(they showed peoples cheering for altair but don't showed a single person reacting negative to her in the audience) and give her the ultimate unbreakable plot armor, why also that peoples don't give that plot armor to heroes???, since when majority if not the everyone could prefer see the heroes be defeated, that is when the serie get wrong and just showed "what thw writer wanted" and not really something "beliavable".

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Marcus H.

The character design of the Creations and the opening theme songs were on point, though. Both gravityWall and sh0ut can stand as contenders for the season's best OP theme song alongside Princess Principal's "The Other Side of the Wall".

I like all those songs, but they can't hold a candle to the OP for Made in Abyss. The composer uses changes in key and instrumentation to create four different moods in just ninety seconds. That's a real accomplishment in composition.

[moridin84]

Originally Posted by Blueknight78

having peoples cheering for altair is fine and no problem, the problem is when they make looks like "everyone" there was cheering for her, even peoples wich whee supposed to cheering for the so "claimed heroes", or the fans of the others characters, for some weird reason, everyone here didin't wanted altair be defeated(they showed peoples cheering for altair but don't showed a single person reacting negative to her in the audience) and give her the ultimate unbreakable plot armor, why also that peoples don't give that plot armor to heroes???, since when majority if not the everyone could prefer see the heroes be defeated, that is when the serie get wrong and just showed "what thw writer wanted" and not really something "beliavable".

You claim that the ending it is not "believable" but there are plenty who watch the anime that have no problems believing this ending. Including myself.

So really it is nothing to do with it being "believable" or the in-show concept of "acceptance", you just didn't like it.

Disliking it is fine. Disliking characters because they have plot armor or disliking the show because the "bad guys win" is perfectly reasonable. Don't put on airs about it by trying to fit your opinions of the show inside the show's philosophy.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by moridin84

You claim that the ending it is not "believable" but there are plenty who watch the anime that have no problems believing this ending. Including myself.

So really it is nothing to do with it being "believable" or the in-show concept of "acceptance", you just didn't like it.

It isn't about like or don't like. It is about the very concept that everyone in the audience want the heroes to die. You apparently would have joined them, but the rest of us disagree. And since the "audience" is referencing the people watching, the very fact that we are arguing at all is evidence that we are right and you are wrong.

The "audience" isn't a separate character, they are meant to represent people who watch anime. It creates a disconnect the same way I watch X-men cartoons, and have no idea why everyone wanted to kill mutants. When you have "normal people" in the cast, and then have them act unlike what the audience would have done IRL, you completely break the story.

And I am sorry that you believe heroes deserve to be killed. I don't know what kind of past you had, but it must be messed up that you want the world destroyed.

[moridin84]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

It isn't about like or don't like. It is about the very concept that everyone in the audience want the heroes to die. You apparently would have joined them, but the rest of us disagree. And since the "audience" is referencing the people watching, the very fact that we are arguing at all is evidence that we are right and you are wrong.

The "audience" isn't a separate character, they are meant to represent people who watch anime. It creates a disconnect the same way I watch X-men cartoons, and have no idea why everyone wanted to kill mutants. When you have "normal people" in the cast, and then have them act unlike what the audience would have done IRL, you completely break the story.

And I am sorry that you believe heroes deserve to be killed. I don't know what kind of past you had, but it must be messed up that you want the world destroyed.

I don't want the heroes to die and I don't want the world to be destroyed. The fake audience don't want to either, that would be crazy.

The problem is not the show is crazy or stupid. The problem is you decided to interpret the show that way. Like, maybe don't do that.

By the way, can you really not understand why people wanted to kill the mutants in X-Men? If so then you have a very fundamental problem of not being able to see things from other peoples perspectives.

[Convoy]

Some perspectives necessitate being put out of your own misery.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

It isn't about like or don't like. It is about the very concept that everyone in the audience want the heroes to die. You apparently would have joined them, but the rest of us disagree. And since the "audience" is referencing the people watching, the very fact that we are arguing at all is evidence that we are right and you are wrong.

Now you're simply making stuff up. Where did you hear that every single person in the audience wanted the heroes to die?

The "audience" isn't a separate character, they are meant to represent people who watch anime. It creates a disconnect the same way I watch X-men cartoons, and have no idea why everyone wanted to kill mutants. When you have "normal people" in the cast, and then have them act unlike what the audience would have done IRL, you completely break the story.

If you really don't understand why folks from Marvel Earth are scared of mutants, then I highly advise that you read some X-Men comics sometime.

And I am sorry that you believe heroes deserve to be killed. I don't know what kind of past you had, but it must be messed up that you want the world destroyed.

No one wants the heroes to die, or the world to be destroyed. Don't be silly.

[justpassingby]

The show is stupid because it decided to appease the villain, and shoving a "touching scene" that made the deaths in prior episodes pointless, and like the audience didn't care. Not even Setsuna and Altair reflected on Altair's actions.
It's not like the staffs didn't have options to give crazy power up to the heroes to defeat the villain. I'm sure the the make-believe audience will accept it, just like you who don't want the heroes to die.
BTW, if Hiroe followed the path like Light from Death Note and gave more screen time to Altair, he wouldn't have any choice but to kill her. Instead, he gave minimum time to her and not so pitiable reason to cheer for her cause.

[Kurohane]

By supporting Altair, the audience gave her the abilities to no sell every attack against her. By supporting Altair, they also supported her goals, wanting her to win.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by moridin84

You claim that the ending it is not "believable" but there are plenty who watch the anime that have no problems believing this ending. Including myself.

So really it is nothing to do with it being "believable" or the in-show concept of "acceptance", you just didn't like it.

Disliking it is fine. Disliking characters because they have plot armor or disliking the show because the "bad guys win" is perfectly reasonable. Don't put on airs about it by trying to fit your opinions of the show inside the show's philosophy.

the same can be said for your statment, just because you like it don't means beliavable, because if have peoples which don't stand in altair side in real world then why in "fiction world" which was supposed to mirror real don't have, this show how your logic is fail, again like =//= beliavable, only a a "perfect world" where everyone like the same thing and have the same mindset which you could see peoples liking and cheering for the same person, is simple like that.

you are just trying to rever the like, deslike concept which is wrong.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

The show is stupid because it decided to appease the villain, and shoving a "touching scene" that made the deaths in prior episodes pointless

Why does a scene between Setsuna and Altair invalidate the sacrifices in prior episodes?

It's not like the staffs didn't have options to give crazy power up to the heroes to defeat the villain. I'm sure the the make-believe audience will accept it, just like you who don't want the heroes to die.

I'm beginning to wonder if you actually bothered to watch this show. It explained multiple times why this was not possible. The audience aren't idiots, they won't accept a power-up that comes out of nowhere, with no basis in the story.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Why does a scene between Setsuna and Altair invalidate the sacrifices in prior episodes?



I'm beginning to wonder if you actually bothered to watch this show. It explained multiple times why this was not possible. The audience aren't idiots, they won't accept a power-up that comes out of nowhere, with no basis in the story.

then if they are not "idiots" why they are accepting all altair powerup???, which also come out of nowhere???, why they can accept the villian stupid bs power ups but not heroes??? what sort of "smart" audience is that???, they make a clain and it actually be real bringing to a real world are 2 different things, if the audience can't accept the heroes have "bs power ups" why they accept altair.

this is not audience being "smart" but being "pick".

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Why does a scene between Setsuna and Altair invalidate the sacrifices in prior episodes?



I'm beginning to wonder if you actually bothered to watch this show. It explained multiple times why this was not possible. The audience aren't idiots, they won't accept a power-up that comes out of nowhere, with no basis in the story.

So what did Setsuna and Altair say about the mess and deaths caused by Altair?

The power-ups could have came from the ECF story that wasn't shown to us real audience. Hiroe just decided not to include any because he was determined to show how touching Altair's raison d'etre is.

I'm sure if Hiroe admitted that she's the villain like you are admitting, then he wouldn't have any problem to kill her.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Blueknight78

then if they are not "idiots" why they are accepting all altair powerup???, which also come out of nowhere???, why they can accept the villian stupid bs power ups but not heroes??? what sort of "smart" audience is that???, they make a clain and it actually be real bringing to a real world are 2 different things, if the audience can't accept the heroes have "bs power ups" why they accept altair.

Again, the show explained this multiple times.

Altair is a meme. People will accept anything from a meme, while they have stricter standards for published work from an author.

[SeijiSensei]

Just a reminder that Altair didn't "kill" anyone. She defeated and "killed" other fictional constructs. The only human I recall being murdered is Magane's creator.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Again, the show explained this multiple times.

Altair is a meme. People will accept anything from a meme, while they have stricter standards for published work from an author.

strange because in real world this not happened, even she being a "meme" you have peoples have in japan which didn't liked it, then this show which that idea of "meme" and everyone will accept is false or is not accurace, if we mirror with real world, which is what was supposed to be.

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Just a reminder that Altair didn't "kill" anyone. She defeated and "killed" other fictional constructs. The only human I recall being murdered is Magane's creator.

So we won't have any problem if a fictional construct like her was killed by the heroes, right?

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

The power-ups could have came from the ECF story that wasn't shown to us real audience. Hiroe just decided that not to included any because he was determined to show how touching Altair's raison d'etre is.

So you didn't actually watch the show then. They explained this. There are limits to what the audience will accept, no matter how well you write it, especially when they only have 6 months to work with.

They couldn't, for example, just instantly give Selesia the power to destroy a planet in a single novel. Some smaller power ups are possible, but nothing on a scale needed to fight Altair, and certainly not in 6 months.

[Blueknight78]

Originally Posted by Endscape

So you didn't actually watch the show then. They explained this. There are limits to what the audience will accept, no matter how well you write it, especially when they only have 6 months to work with.

They couldn't, for example, just instantly give Selesia the power to destroy a planet in a single novel. Some smaller power ups are possible, but nothing on a scale needed to fight Altair, and certainly not in 6 months.

that show how something is wrong with the show, because he keep saying which acceptance is the base for everything, then in the end they get a "asspull" from magane e souta and "break the acceptance" to allow setsuna to "spawn" if acceptance was so that important her power was not supposed to work and even with that, souta could be much more smart if instead of "summon" setsuna he used this power to break altair link with audience during the battle rending her powerless and her clone could had beat her easy, but he "waited" until last second and when everything failed to do that, souta and magane had the power to stop altair at anytime based on that episode, specially magane she had the power to stop altair among all the characters.

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

Just a reminder that Altair didn't "kill" anyone. She defeated and "killed" other fictional constructs. The only human I recall being murdered is Magane's creator.

magane also murdered the "bookstore" vendor" with her power summoning a monster from a book to kill him.