2006-10-01, 19:22 | Link #2041 | ||
Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre?
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2006-10-01, 21:15 | Link #2042 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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People who think "Gundam" is Gundam Seed and Gundam Wing filled with pointless robot fights and yaoi, please please take a look at the original Gundam, created by the fantastic creator Yoshiyuki Tomino. People who love Simoun for the depth of character and setting, with an epic tale of the human soul and dreams - check out the three part movies - the movie version of the original Mobile Suit Gundam. If Simoun's ending filled you with a sense of beauty and hope for the human soul, Gundam is the original animation which truly fills you with something special. Well, I can't say anymore without spoiling anything, but check it out. |
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2006-10-01, 21:32 | Link #2043 | |
Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre?
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2006-10-01, 23:22 | Link #2044 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Ah cool. To be honest, I just used your post as an excuse to promote Gundam.
Still Matrim, looking at your posts so far, I would recommend Gundam for you. I don't like Mecha either, and I didn't want to watch Gundam for the longest time, one reason being seeing Gundam Wing (gah). Anyway, I just really enjoyed Simoun, though I criticized it a lot (it's only cuz I love it ), and I wanted to share some other outstanding anime series with people with somewhat similar tastes. |
2006-10-02, 00:28 | Link #2045 | |
Simoun-Fans Editor
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK
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(I was all for translating said line as "Harder, Neviril! Harder!". ) |
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2006-10-02, 04:00 | Link #2046 | ||
気持ち悪い
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: New Zealand
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For anyone interested, here are the covers for the Simoun manga included in Megami (nicked off a YJ listing, because I'm not game to remove the staples on my copies to extract them).
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2006-10-02, 08:47 | Link #2047 | |
nani ni tatoemu
Join Date: Sep 2006
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One of the things I like about AS is that people usually gather around and talk about what they enjoy as opposed to bashing what they don't. Because of that, I almost feel like I should apologize for what will probably come across as a strong anti-Simoun sentiment in what I'm going to saw below. However, I need to get some of this out of my system. This is going to be quite long, so I'm going to put a lot of it into spoiler tags to improve thread readability. I guess that's what happens if you wait until the series is over to start posting about it It'll probably also be somewhat disjointed and "stream of consciousness"-like, but hopefully still comprehensible. Spoiler for a few caveats about me:
Spoiler for impressions:
Spoiler for why I would continue to bother with something I don't like:
Spoiler for Simoun fans vs SP fans:
OK, so I guess there goes my "Simoun dump" I wonder if any of you actually read through it. Maybe it's best if you didn't Anyway, I'm not trying to say that Simoun is a terrible anime. Objectively speaking there are many worse. However, subjectively speaking Simoun did nothing for me, so I felt the need to express some of my views about it. Sorry if it was too negative. Like I said, probably I would have liked it better if I'd seen it back when I was less saturated with anime. Spoiler for a note to Kaoru Chujo:
Edit: I ran the Haruhi and Fate stats as well, and the pattern there is significantly less "top heavy". Some of it may be due to the different dynamics that happen when a show has a forum as opposed to a thread, but I'm sure it's also a meaningful indication of a wider fan base. BTW, I didn't do this to "prove" yet something more about Simoun, I was just interested in how prevalent the quasi-80/20 pattern really is. Spoiler for Haruhi and Fate stats:
Last edited by yononaka; 2006-10-02 at 09:54. Reason: Added the stats for Haruhi and Fate |
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2006-10-02, 09:26 | Link #2048 | |
floofer. floof.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Read it all, yononaka, and I see where you're coming from. Dashing off some points.
It seems like a lot of this subjective element comes from the character designs. Personally, I don't look past that -- it just doesn't register after a certain point, I don't know why. The later episodes, especially. I fight the anti-SP sentiment in myself quite frequently these days, because I'm participating in a thread elsewhere that loves SP to bits. I think it is bad to feel like this, and I certainly think we Simoun fans should be more subtle about it. But at the same time, people do tend to select different levels of tact when speaking, and it may be more hypocritical to hold back, I don't know. Honestly, for myself it may be jealousy speaking. Objectively, I support SP, sort of. It's not as horrible as non-fans say it is, and it's a milestone for yuri, which I do gravitate towards. The feelings are ambivalent, so I guess I concluded that the less I say, the better. Oh no, the thread is definitely getting derailed. Is this against the rules? I forgot who said the creators are making it up as they go along, but I'm pretty sure he or she meant some of the material, not all. The Japanese are humble people. We shouldn't take creators' disclaimers at face value. Besides, the author is dead, blah blah. Quote:
All that said, I suspect it is the anti-SP undercurrents that brought out yononaka's words. I hope no blame gets thrown around. I think there is a middle ground to be found. I like reading critiques, 'cause some of us have been searching and searching for reasons why some anime fans can't take to Simoun, and this is relatively well-articulated. edit: Argh, I can't seem to leave this alone. The entire HB paragraph is implying that Simoun is using its sex appeal to prop itself up and that it has nothing else. The problem with this argument is, if we disagree with yononaka there, there is no more to say besides flogging that dead horse. Last edited by fignae; 2006-10-02 at 09:52. |
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2006-10-02, 09:34 | Link #2049 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Well, I guess to each his own...or something like that.
I watched thru both SP and Simoun... I was introduced to the manga of SP first, was impressed, then anticipated the anime...which totally flopped for me. Simoun, on the other hand, was dangling right in front of me with all the nice chinese fansubs but I took a month before picking it up, just because I had nothing better to do. I was initially put off by the drawing and massive new info of their world...but oh well..i ended up waiting for raws every tuesday. Just compare the final eps and I know I made a right choice by skimming thru SP. Just the dialogue of Shizuma at the church made me cringe hard. Taiwan dramas show something similar... If simoun was "manipulating" me into watching it, then i guess i was manipulated. but aren't shows supposed to "draw" us into their world? |
2006-10-02, 10:02 | Link #2050 | ||
nani ni tatoemu
Join Date: Sep 2006
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I'm back to my usual diplomatic style now
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As for the sex appeal, I wouldn't propose something silly like "it has nothing else". However, Simoun is certainly relying on it, whereas HR I don't think was relying on it at all (unless you count the angelic elements as sex appeal). Quote:
Last edited by yononaka; 2006-10-02 at 10:39. Reason: typo fixes |
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2006-10-02, 10:24 | Link #2051 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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2006-10-02, 11:21 | Link #2052 | |
floofer. floof.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Relying on it to pull in extra viewers, yes. May turn people off, true. But Simoun has so much more than that, and if the audience can't look beyond that, it's a shame. I wouldn't blame the director for it, though, as the character designs are an important part of the show. I am, by now, rehashing an old, old point. It comes down to that, huh? In other words, the anvils exist, the flaws exist, but viewers don't deal with them in the same way. Additionally, we really mustn't ignore the group who were drawn in by the in-your-face whatever, then stayed for the underlying greatness. |
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2006-10-02, 13:11 | Link #2053 | |||||||
Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre?
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Anyway, nice to see someone who has put such an effort only to criticise a series he does not like. I am impressed, although your introduction almost put me to sleep, it's way too long.
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Last edited by Matrim; 2006-10-02 at 15:01. |
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2006-10-02, 13:17 | Link #2054 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Texas
Age: 61
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I didn't even know what 'yuri' ment until like show 21. Catagorizing the shows at the start probably hurt this one. Yes I know the 2 'sisters' in Simoun talked about something but generally their world was as it was - all were born female until at the age of 17 they 'had' to make a choice.
So I didn't view most of it as 'yuri'. Now I did see the covers for the music cds I guess thats really 'yuri'.... Remember eps 1 and 2 and 3 then it was like 5 months before any one got back to it, and again, another long long laps in shows. Thanks to wowos work I believe most of us caught up about ep 17 then back and forth so in a way for ME the series unfolded like a flower. And once they are 17 they get married have kids - ie not 'yuri'. Yes yes yes, im not in Japan and do not live under their ways of life which we Cannot here in the U.S.A. and im not saying theres any thing wrong with them. Like in the show its just the way of life. The 'Girls' had to sleep in the same rooms for a while and they had to live with each other on that rust bucket ship they were on so you could see it was not a happy box of apples for them. Much like us. This series is awsome, best originality todate. Thanks to all that helped fill in the not understood parts. thanks everone in the forum. |
2006-10-02, 14:05 | Link #2055 |
Yuuki Aoi
Join Date: Jul 2004
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No offense taken, yononaka. Interesting posts. I hope you can gather from my posts that I am not anti-SP. I think I was one of the first in that thread to defend it, in the early days when most of the posts seemed so negative. I thought many posters there then just didn't get the fact that it was intentionally cliched.
Spoiler for resposes to yononaka, spoilered to keep the page shorter:
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2006-10-02 at 15:31. |
2006-10-02, 15:09 | Link #2056 |
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yononaka,
I actually think most of the comments in my previous post are extreme because admittedly extreme ones have left in my memory. And it seems some of us interpreted your stats more than enough. However, I see your view on the two shows and their fandom is also extreme as much as them. Spoiler for sexual aspect:
Spoiler for manipulation:
Spoiler for fandom:
Last edited by warainagara; 2006-10-02 at 15:31. |
2006-10-02, 15:45 | Link #2057 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Lol, this week's Simoun radio is hilarious, check it out if you can understand Japanese.
Guest this week was :drumroll: Director Nishimura Junji! A few things that stood out to me: - the reason the show was created was, quote from director: "me and two other old foggies wanted to write about young girls growing up" - the choices for the final sex: "of course I had the story and dramatics in mind, but I chose their sex mostly on my tastes. Like Morinas has such a good body, it would have been such a waste for her to become male" Lol. It was funny when a listener wrote "I bought the DVDs and games, but I can't get myself to watch them", and Takahashi Rieko answered: "Eh, doesn't matter if you don't ever watch them, as long as you bought them we're happy." Dark! Lol. A few things were bleeped out / left out, and will be included in the CD, according to them. |
2006-10-02, 16:35 | Link #2058 | |
Naysayer?Fanboy?Wiseacre?
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2006-10-02, 18:46 | Link #2059 |
floofer. floof.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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LOL, Wowo. Right. ("Shaddup, creator. We're having fun here." )
Anyway, if anyone has heard of this I'm glad to announce that even though it's a limited edition disc, the specials are quite stupid. Most of the seiyuu were awkward placed in front of the camera, and only Mizuki Nana really shone. In terms of attitude, that is, as for information, I couldn't catch any after all the courtesies paid. [edit] Contents: PS2 game CM DVD CM Cut scenes from the seiyuu studio messages Seiyuu comment on the show (not much) Last edited by fignae; 2006-10-02 at 23:53. |
2006-10-02, 19:07 | Link #2060 | |
気持ち悪い
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: New Zealand
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Those discs are selling pretty well on YJ at the moment: I snaffled one for Y1000 early on, but they're averaging around three times that now (makes me feel less of a mug for paying Y2400 for a game poster - if I'd waited I could have got one for way less, but then waiting is exactly how I missed out on the poster for the TV series). It's nice to see collectors taking an interest, even for a cheesy promo item.
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Last edited by Simon; 2006-10-02 at 20:27. |
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drama, science fiction, yuri |
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