Shakugan no Shana II - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll

[HayashiTakara]

Kazumi exploding with Pheles popping out? I'm all for it. Considering its about retrieving the Reiji Maigo, Pheles is the best person to call. She'll have some power to remove it Hecate's grimy hands and return it to Yuji.

Edit: Am I just imagining things... or does Yuji's dad sound a lot like Sabrac? maybe they just have the same VA, or are they... you know?

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by holyman282

This ep was amazing and cemented my concrete belief that i'm not just watching this show for the action. The emotion in this ep was deep and heart felt, in this ep we saw that every character has made a dramatic change from how they started from ep 1 of S1. In this ep so many things were happening such as Ike confessing to Yoshida or Yoshida and Shana's love confession letters, being just a few.

The part where Yuji's father told him that he was the second born and that they hoped that the brother's life that didn't make it would add to Yuji's really tugged at my heartstrings. It's also ironic and symbolic that Yuji will indeed live longer with the Reiji Maigo implanted in him.

Or, you know, disappear and be forgotten in the next few days or months.

Also of note, the Yuji that was born is already dead.

[Kristen]

Originally Posted by Mukki

Despite how out of character it would be for Pheles to make a contract with anyone, we also have to take into account that while she is a powerful Tomogara, she is nowhere near the power of Tiamat, Alastor, Marco, etc.

Add on the fact that Yoshida has no combat experience or knowledge at all...

So, if somehow Yoshida were able to contract with Pheles, logically she would end up being incredibly weak.

Not to mention that her cap for PoE wouldn't even be able to hold much more than an average human, she would quite possibly end up not becoming stronger at all if this were to happen. That's why I never understood these fanboyish theories of her becoming a flame haze.

I don't think Pheles' abilities have been revealed at all. To start off with, she was able to fight Sabrac and survive. She created the Reiju Maigo. She was able to create a second entity of herself. She fought alongside Wilhelemina. And she has done all of that, just living off of torches.
Wilhelemina said that Pheles was too dangerous of an opponent, and if she came, it would be a catastrophe. There was no chance of victory.
I think Pheles is powerful enough to be a lord of Guze.

Also, Yuji had no combat experiance, I don't think Margery had any combat experiance, that kid from Margery's past had no combat experiance, and I don't think Wilhelemina was tossing ribbons at people before she became a Flame Haze. But, as Shana said, she has the knowledge of the entire world.

Also, it's not a fanboyish theory until a male agrees with my theory. Until then, it's fangirlish.

[Deathscyther]

Good episode. I'm just surprised with the ending. I wonder why Hecate did it and what will happen next.

[grey_moon]

Any cute girl asking people openly how to make babies deserves to win

[teelotes]

How old are Yuji's parents? They said something about having Yuji 16 years after the firstborn, or did I read wrongly?

[serenade_beta]

Originally Posted by holyman282

2. What does Yuji's name mean in relation to what was discussed about Yuji's name in the ep? I still don't get it could someone plz explain.

Yuuji's name in kanji is "悠二" which has "二" (two) symbolizing the fact he is their second kid. That's why Kantarou wants the third kid to have a three in his name.

[teelotes]

Originally Posted by ChrissieXD

I don't think Pheles' abilities have been revealed at all. To start off with, she was able to fight Sabrac and survive. She created the Reiju Maigo. She was able to create a second entity of herself. She fought alongside Wilhelemina. And she has done all of that, just living off of torches.
Wilhelemina said that Pheles was too dangerous of an opponent, and if she came, it would be a catastrophe. There was no chance of victory.
I think Pheles is powerful enough to be a lord of Guze.

Also, Yuji had no combat experiance, I don't think Margery had any combat experiance, that kid from Margery's past had no combat experiance, and I don't think Wilhelemina was tossing ribbons at people before she became a Flame Haze. But, as Shana said, she has the knowledge of the entire world.

Also, it's not a fanboyish theory until a male agrees with my theory. Until then, it's fangirlish.

In the end, she couldn't protect Johan and had to safekeep him in Reiji Maigo. I think it didn't matter how strong she was, all she wanted to do (and why she did all those) was because of Johan. Mentality-wise, she's just as good as the other Tomogaras, because without Johan, all she cared for was herself.

I've always wanted a side story about the travels of Wilhelmina & the Engage Link. There is a lot of room for good character development there, as I'm curious how a Flame Haze would work alongside a Tomogara and a Mystes. There must have been lots of misunderstanding, and funny or touching moments. Also, there would be periodic action provided by their encounter with Sabrac. Elaboration on their friendship bond would boost the Pheles arc and explained many things too. But now that Pheles has been formally introduced, I don't think they'll go back to doing this side story again.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by teelotes

How old are Yuji's parents? They said something about having Yuji 16 years after the firstborn, or did I read wrongly?

Early to mid thirties, I forgot the precise number. He said that the third kid came 16 years after the first two (Yuuji and his dead (stillborn?) older twin).

[Guido]

Honestly, I was worried at how the animation staff would handle direction of the show's storyline for the remainder episodes.

Spoiler:

Thankfully, the Bal Masque made their last preparations at the episode's prologue which triggered with Hecate seemingly pulling out the Reiji Maigo from Yuuji's body towards the end of the episode to initiate the last arc for season two.

Between those two events there was a relative calm and to me an unexpected enlightment about the main characters.

Spoiler:

1. Satou won't be swayed away too easily after all the things he has experienced and watched in the world of Guze. He truly wants to work for Outlaw, using any means or people possible even that requires he must confront his estranged father.

2. Ike, heeding Satou's advice, finally put his guts together for a radical mean to change his whole person and confessed Kazumi his feelings, although Kazumi politely apologize at not being able to accept them.

3. Kantarou's conversation with Yuuji had the most anticipating and suspenseful feeling to me. That's because I precipitated with my assumptions and thought that Yuuji was actually adopted, and thus, explaining a little bit about the nature of his self being 'dead' for a long time without him realizing it, until meeting Shana.

4. Wilhelmina's discussion with Shana was as well tense, since Wilhelmina again displays her motherly affection and concern for Shana, and which we haven't seen since the latter half of the previous season and at the start of season two.

5. The real funny moments were everyone getting blushed at Shana's naivety asking about how she can make babies. Kazumi gives some word of advice about being a topic which can't be discussed openly, since it is more embarrassing than being looked at naked.
Shana immediately got the gist of what really meant, since her previous experience with Yuuji at the very start of season one.

[Sinestra]

Man iv given up hope that the hate in SnS forum will ever go away makes thing so unpleasant sometimes and you can only face palm so much when someone writes 5 paragraphs about how they wish Kazumi was dead but doesnt talk about anything else in show or when the Shana Shippers go on a rampage *face palms again*

A lot of people seem to dislike this episode. I found nothing wrong with it maybe because i am separating the novels and the anime. I have only read a handful on the novels and decided to go back to once this season is done. I do like how they tried to move to some type of resloution in the romance department. But that slippery Yuji manages to find a third option lol. The shock of having RM taken from him will be a lot to handle at first. Im sure his first reaction will be the fear of him fading away. From what i understand he needs to get it back at least before midnight since thats when the RM restores his POE,

I enjoyed Shana's and Carmels little spat back and forth since they both made valid points. The fact that Alastor stayed quiet showed what his opinion is already nothing else to be said. Carmel is such a mother figure to Shana which is why i love their interactions. The fact that she offered to make her a dress for the occasion shows how much she cares and there is no color more fitting for Shana than red.

Not sure if they can or will wrap everything in the end or if we are going to see a season 3. But the joy of a new life either a baby sister/brother shows that life goes on but also i see it as another reason for Yuji to protect the city and get stronger. I dont think he and Shana will leave the city in the end everything they love and want to protect is there.

side note it was nice to Ike get his feelings out there even if he was turned down. At least he can say he tried and told his feeling instead of living with the regret of Kazumi never knowing how he truly felt. I do hope Kazumi comes out ok even if she is not chosen i would like to see all the characters end up with a pretty nice ending. There is no one who i feels deserves to die in SnS every character has their strengths and their weaknesses.

Good episode solid 8/10

[Kinny Riddle]

Excellent episode. Just when last episode felt like a "final episode", this episode showed that it can still be gripping even without any action, save for the anticipated cliffhanger near the end.

Last week, I was disappointed that Sabrac "died" so quickly after only two episodes, but decided to get on with it. Then this week I find out he's actually still alive and well, I don't know whether I should feel glad that such a villain has survived or how anti-climatic to bring him back after Shana finished him in epic style only just last episode.

So this is why Chigusa was ill, she was pregnant. Figures. The main reason for Kantarou and Chigusa to get married was Yuji's late twin sibling. Hence the "ji" (two) in Yuji's name.

Though it's interesting to note that had there been no Reiji Maigo on Yuji, Kantarou might just end up calling the new baby Yuji instead of giving him/her a "san" (three) in his/her name, since the original Yuji would have been forgotten.

LOL at Shana asking how to make babies.

More LOL at Wilhelmina nearly cutting herself with the butter knife after Shana says she's gonna confess to Yuji.

It was a nice touch to mention Wilhelmina's unrequited love for Merihim, a complex love-quadrangle briefly mentioned in the prequel episodes last series and in more detail in novel volumes 5 and 10, both prequels, thus linking it with her concern that Shana might get rejected just as she had suffered from Merihim.

Even Ike has decided to move on. Though Yoshida decides she still loves Yuji, Ike bears no hard feelings. For him, just being able to confess his love was a huge burden lifted off his shoulders, and he has no regret. May you be rewarded for your bravery one day.

In the end, Hecate arrives to relieve Yuji from having to choose between Shana and Yoshida. Bal Masque now puts their master plan to motion. I can feel it, "that" which has been whispered here and there before the mods removed it from the non-spoiler threads. I may pretend I don't know, but I cannot completely forget what I accidentally read when I stumbled upon seeing "that". Until then, I'll try and cast "that" off my mind and retain as much suspense as I can.

No comment on all the senseless hate, I just spent a post last episode reprimanding one poster for his frequent slandering and contributing nothing to the discussion, so I won't add anymore.

[teelotes]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Early to mid thirties, I forgot the precise number. He said that the third kid came 16 years after the first two (Yuuji and his dead (stillborn?) older twin).

Oh... ok I get it now. So the first child is a twin of Yuji. I've always thought he was like an older brother. Everything makes sense now

[Sinestra]

Originally Posted by Kinny Riddle

So this is why Chigusa was ill, she was pregnant. Figures. The main reason for Kantarou and Chigusa to get married was Yuji's late twin sibling. Hence the "ji" (two) in Yuji's name.

Though it's interesting to note that had there been no Reiji Maigo on Yuji, Kantarou might just end up calling the new baby Yuji instead of giving him/her a "san" (three) in his/her name, since the original Yuji would have been forgotten.

Thats an interesting point you have made there about Yuji's name if had disappeared if there was no R.M. I never thought about it like that but it does make sense. Which leads me to believe there is a still a chance that the current Yuji will disappear and the new baby will be Yuji "Ji" since the of course the dead brothers memory wont fade. Im hoping that all of Yuji's hard work and struggles pay off and he can live his life with mother, father his new little brother or sister and of course which ever girl he choses. Just feel like it would be such a waste after everything he has been through to see him fade away and no one remembers him.

[Kinny Riddle]

Having gone through the posts ahead, I discovered that it might be a blessing to not have read the latest novels as it seems to deviate once again. I blame Kadokawa Taiwan for their slow progress with translation. Once I get my hands on reading them, then perhaps I can passionately join in the campaign of you guys to burn down JC STAFF's HQ.

But before then, please don't post your spoilers here, not even with spoiler tags if you don't label them properly. There's a Spoilers and Speculation Thread for that purpose. You don't see me spouting out the entire plot of Clannad in the episode threads, do you? Thank you for your consideration.

Come to think about it, those last 5 episodes in series 1, where they had Bal Masque captured Yuji and "inserted" his memories into Hecate, causing her to moan suggestively, served no purpose towards the main storyline as outlined by author Takahashi at all.

Of course Bal Masque had a masterplan with the Reiji Maigo all along, but those five episodes were completely pointless.

[Anh_Minh]

I don't think Ike's truly moved on. At least, I don't like to think so.

The conditions he's set - the suddenness of the confession, the asking for a quick decision... That was like asking to fail. Which is fine, if it's just getting into another phase of his love. Now his relationship with Kazumi isn't tainted by deceit. Even if he was rejected, he can keep trying until she gets a boyfriend or his own feelings change. Whichever comes first. Kinda like what she's been doing.

But if he did it as a kind of last ditch effort before putting the matter behind him... That'd be rather disappointing.

[Kinny Riddle]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

I don't think Ike's truly moved on. At least, I don't like to think so.

The conditions he's set - the suddenness of the confession, the asking for a quick decision... That was like asking to fail. Which is fine, if it's just getting into another phase of his love. Now his relationship with Kazumi isn't tainted by deceit. Even if he was rejected, he can keep trying until she gets a boyfriend or his own feelings change. Whichever comes first. Kinda like what she's been doing.

But if he did it as a kind of last ditch effort before putting the matter behind him... That'd be rather disappointing.

Nah, you're just in denial.

OK, I was just joking. By heading towards Yuji, Yoshida has given Ike the signal that he can finally move on. Of course being rejected hurts, but Ike would rather have that, than live the rest of his life in regret that Yoshida never knew his feelings for her.




BTW, around the scene where Shana asks Yoshida how to make babies, does anyone notice that her twin ponytail resemble that hawt Chinese girl in Gundam 00? (I only watch the screenshots in blogs of that series, it's more entertaining that way for me. )

[Solais]

I haven't seen this episode yet, but it seems Shana Second has failed like Nanoha StrikerS to me. I loved the first season, but the second one? Full with boring everyday-life episodes, with only a bit action at the end, and that's it.

[Whitemoon648]

Originally Posted by HayashiTakara

Kazumi exploding with Pheles popping out? I'm all for it. Considering its about retrieving the Reiji Maigo, Pheles is the best person to call. She'll have some power to remove it Hecate's grimy hands and return it to Yuji.

Edit: Am I just imagining things... or does Yuji's dad sound a lot like Sabrac? maybe they just have the same VA, or are they... you know?

That has been my theory since he apeared. For some reason i think Yuji's dad is somehow Sabrac.

I mean how did Yuji recieve reji maigo? He probably was eaten and sabrac actually gave it to him to save him. Sabrac might have fallen in love with Yuji's mom or something.

I said that in some thread along time ago, and some one said that Yuji ( as stated in anime) got it randomly.

Originally Posted by Kinny Riddle

Once I get my hands on reading them, then perhaps I can passionately join in the campaign of you guys to burn down JC STAFF's HQ.

But before then, please don't post your spoilers here, not even with spoiler tags if you don't label them properly. There's a Spoilers and Speculation Thread for that purpose. You don't see me spouting out the entire plot of Clannad in the episode threads, do you? Thank you for your consideration.

.

Some of these guys dont want to listen at all. I have been telling them to stop posting spoilers but no one listens. I see the same people doing it over and over. I mean as you even said, there is a reason for having speculation thread right?

P.S. I have tried to avoid reaching this conclusion, But sadly some people enjoy anoying people by spoilin them.

[nines]

I get the feeling that Yoshida will summon Pheles now that the RM has been removed and would probably want it back. Plus Pheles thinks of the RM still as Yohan technically he still is the RM. but all i can say to this was damn another shoot down lol.

and no yujis dad does give off some weird ass aura emphatically but i dotn think his a king of guze if he is anything at most he probably works for outlaw or is a flamehaze lol. He has to do something when he first came into the show he was stalking shana and she said he was at a high level so lol XD