Fate/stay night Episode 13 Discussion thread

[Seska]

yeah, they take the "Spirits" only cause of they Skills in lifetimes.

Saber

Spoiler:

King. Strong fighter (like a Dragon). Good Leader.

Rider

Spoiler:

Fighter? well, anyway, should be more a magic type. This one here ist much agility.

Archer
well, dont saw any action yet with his true skills. The littel clash at the begining dosent count. That was not a Bow he used

Hercules

Spoiler:

Incredible strong (god-like powers).. Well, at last he should be a half-god. Good choice to be a beserker class.

and i dont think, they takem them cause of their background....

Its just picking the good ones, to make a good anime.

Mfg,
Seska

[idofgrahf]

Hercules is half God or full God depending on the timeline. Since he is a myth they could potray him however they want, although from all the stories he is know to be quite cunning and not stupid like most beserkers seems to be.

Since all of these people except for assain are probably not real they can make up their backgrounds.

Also the reason they could get away with making Arthur a female, there is no proof that Arthur wasn't a female. Now if they were to make real life figures like Boudicca, the Iceni Queen a male or Gaius Suetonius Paulinus (the Roman commander who crushed Boudicca at walting street) a female then I can see why people would have a problem since there are reliable records of their existance ( Tacitus recorded the battle 50 years later, pretty acuratly considering that his Father in law was one of Paulinus advisors during that battle) proving Boudicca is female and Paulinus was a male. But no such detailed records exist for Arthur.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by idofgrahf

Hercules is half God or full God depending on the timeline. Since he is a myth they could potray him however they want, although from all the stories he is know to be quite cunning and not stupid like most beserkers seems to be.

hercs imo was not a good choice fro berserker class since in his battle always use his brains and plan well ahead for his battles. Thor or a one of the more famous vikings would have fit the berserker class better.

[Seska]

.. doppelpost ...

[Seska]

Well another try then...

What comes in your Mind if you hear about this names?

Spoiler:

King Arthur?

Hercules?

Robin Hood?

Medusa?

Thor? I know him only as a Hammer swing Thundergod. Hows daddy is Odin...

Well the others i dont know, i only know the "Western" Myth legends...


Do you get my point, what im trying to say?

With this littel trick, they save some time and money. They dont need to explain much about them. Cause, this types you learn yourself the background....

So they save money to create a background storie for them. and im sure the other ones (Asia names) are famous, too. And dont need to be explain...

Only WHAT they are is a secret, but if you will know the name. you will say "Ahhhhh, its him/her they can do this and that..."

Mfg,
Seska

[idofgrahf]

Originally Posted by Seska

Well another try then...

What comes in your Mind if you hear about this names?

Spoiler:

King Arthur?

Hercules?

Robin Hood?

Medusa?

Well the others i dont know, i only know the "Western" Myth legends...


Do you get my point, what im trying to say?

With this littel trick, they save some time and money. They dont need to explain much about them. Cause, this types you learn yourself the background....

So they save money to create a background storie for them. and im sure the other ones (Asia names) are famous, too. And dont need to be explain...

Only WHAT they are is a secret, but if you will know the name. you will say "Ahhhhh, its him/her they can do this and that..."

Mfg,
Seska

How do you know that Archer is Robin Hood?
Assasin was not very famous, at least to none japanese like myself, I've never heard of him.
Many people know the name of medusa and what she can do but not her background story, its not as obvious as you might think.

Spoiler:

I've played the game and archer is not Robin, I'm not telling who he really is but Robin he is not

[Seska]

Originally Posted by idofgrahf

How do you know that Archer is Robin Hood?
Assasin was not very famous, at least to none japanese like myself, I've never heard of him.

Spoiler:

I've played the game and archer is not Robin, I'm not telling who he really is but Robin he is not

well, was a guess in the black. Thanks to you, now i know that hes not...

I dont played the game...

Mfg,
Seska

[npal]

I think his point is wasn't that. More like it's very easy to establish characters if they resemble stereotypes, and you don't need to explain much. If you create a male knight wearing a crown, wielding a sword and shouting Excalibur, you don't ask questions

I don't think he impied Archer is Robin Hood, but if I see Robin Hood, the first thing that comes to mind is a Ranger with a bow. Of course it could be someone else with a bow, and not Robin, but some myths are well known and you needn't bother explaining or altering them. They can do most of your job for you.

Or did you mean something else?

[Seska]

Originally Posted by npal

I think his point is wasn't that. More like it's very easy to establish characters if they resemble stereotypes, and you don't need to explain much. If you create a male knight wearing a crown, wielding a sword and shouting Excalibur, you don't ask questions

I don't think he impied Archer is Robin Hood, but if I see Robin Hood, the first thing that comes to mind is a Ranger with a bow. Of course it could be someone else with a bow, and not Robin, but some myths are well known and you needn't bother explaining or altering them. They can do most of your job for you.

Or did you mean something else?

No, you catch my point. Thats was i trying to say...

Mfg,
Seska

[npal]

Originally Posted by Seska

No, you catch my point. Thats was i trying to say...

Mfg,
Seska

And of course, if you insist that King Arthur is a woman, you're pissing loyal Arthur fans like me At least say "we have no King Arthur here, it was always Queen Arturia and her Knights of the Round Table". Tsk tsk... Infidels...

[gogogoh]

I did some research and I found out that saber's story does not really match the myth story we know.

Saber> is to king Arthur.

Excalibur> is the sword not put form the stone but was taken form the lake. "Lady of the lake"

This interesting part is that after all my research I found one myth that tell of a woman that held the Excalibur as her weapon. The story goes on saying that her kingdom was not invaded but a civil war that started and brought the kingdom to the brink destruction. It was said that there was about 4 powerful people with different powers. Then she finally used the power of the sword to …

Funny thing was it never told the end, whether she succeeded or not. If there were 4 powerful people, in this story there were 7 masters and 7 servants. Makes me wonder how all this myths are connected. I am kind of puzzled. I don’t think this book is even real.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by gogogoh

Excalibur> is the sword not put form the stone but was taken form the lake. "Lady of the lake"

In episode 13, Excalibur was not the sword that Saber pulled out of the stone, it was Caliburn.

[shaolinx]

Originally Posted by idofgrahf

However this argument is getting wired, we are ofcourse assuming that Arthur exist to begin with, but because there is no conclusive proof of his existance the he could have been a She.

i dont get your point... this is like saying. 'although zues from geek mythlogy is may or not may be real, we dont have real proof that he could have been a she.' of course we dont know if a character in a myth is a he or she, but using verious other facts from the myth, aka. KING arthur, we can be sure arthur is a he. if everyone followed ur response, then whats the point using, he, she, or queen or king?, those words would be meaningless, snice we dont have proof.

[npal]

Originally Posted by shaolinx

i dont get your point... this is like saying. 'although zues from geek mythlogy is may or not may be real, we dont have real proof that he could have been a she.' of course we dont know if a character in a myth is a he or she, but using verious other facts from the myth, aka. KING arthur, we can be sure arthur is a he. if everyone followed ur response, then whats the point using, he, she, or queen or king?, those words would be meaningless, snice we dont have proof.

EXACTLY my point! Thank God someone actually got it. Hope I haven't given you a cookie yet

[Shiroth]

Hmm has anyone even listened to what VI said?

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=186

[gogogoh]

Originally Posted by Angelsama

In episode 13, Excalibur was not the sword that Saber pulled out of the stone, it was Caliburn.

I know what I mean is that in main myth says it's from the lake. and many people dont know about the lake part.

[idofgrahf]

Originally Posted by shaolinx

i dont get your point... this is like saying. 'although zues from geek mythlogy is may or not may be real, we dont have real proof that he could have been a she.' of course we dont know if a character in a myth is a he or she, but using verious other facts from the myth, aka. KING arthur, we can be sure arthur is a he. if everyone followed ur response, then whats the point using, he, she, or queen or king?, those words would be meaningless, snice we dont have proof.

I think you got my point just fine, since we don't know for a fact that Arthur existed at all, the he could be a she. And the word king could have just as easily meant something else during that time just as the word Barbarians orignally meant all that is none Greek and did not have the negative connotation attached to it.
Zeus ( not zues) is King of the Gods and is a form of worship hence religion, I don't see how you draw the analogy, no one is worshiping Arthur as a God. Religion is based of faith you either believe it or you don't proof is not required. But since Arthur is not tied to any religion that I know of, you need to prove his/her existance. There are no FACTS in myth, there are several version on how Achillies died, fact is something you prove and you can't prove a myth thats why its called a myth to begin with. There is generally accepted Canon within that myth but that does not mean it is fact. I however do agree that they should have just used queen Arthur and state it clearly that this is an alterate unverise. They stick to Canon in some character but not in others it is kinda annoying.

Better yet they could have simply used Boudica as saber, she is just as well known at least in england and she certianly has a lot of regrets and would love to do things over again. (maybe use more of her brain cells, not charge the Roman legions head on and getting slaughtered)

[justinstrife]

npal needs to just enjoy the show for what it is, and accept the fact that King Arthur, in the Type Moon universe, is female and that's that. Seriously, you can't take history lessons from 99.9% of anime out there, so why take it as such? I like the idea, and have been rolling with it no problem. Don't get hung up on something that just adds flavor to the story.

[Xellos-_^]

We need stop going off topic

lets get back to the all important loli topic

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by justinstrife

npal needs to just enjoy the show for what it is, and accept the fact that King Arthur, in the Type Moon universe, is female and that's that. Seriously, you can't take history lessons from 99.9% of anime out there, so why take it as such? I like the idea, and have been rolling with it no problem. Don't get hung up on something that just adds flavor to the story.

You're 100% right there, lets just hope npal and understand what you're saying.

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

We need stop going off topic

We're talking about Saber being King Arthur, and seems as though she appeared as that in episode 13 - then i think thats right on topic.