(L) Kanojo, Okarishimasu

[kari-no-sugata II]

100% made up.

Spoiler for what she's actually saying:

You're a good person

[amasposu]

Chapter 128:

Spoiler for 128:

[AndrewR5D4]

So, why does Mami continue butting into Kazuya's life?

[Kuroageha]

Because she hates he could be with a girl she perceives as better than herself.

Now she deluding herself that Chizuru was forced by Kazuya into that relationship and offers to help her to get rid of him.

[AndrewR5D4]

I never thought I'd say this, but Ruka might be worse than Mami after that last chapter...

[WingedAccelerator]

This manga is a collection of lows. A lot of lows. Some of them are apparent, some of them get swept under the rug.

Not only Chizuru gets every possible winning flag with an overwhelming screentime to boot over the rest, the author even makes the competition detestable (Except the harmless one, but she barely exist as the unfortunate 4th addition, and she is also a supporter). Only they can be portrayed as negative characters, only they can do bad, only their selfishness can be treated as bad. An underrated low was when Chizuru's grandma pulled a flashback to justify the web of lies eating Chizuru away as something positive if she twists it enough.

At that point it shouldn't be surprising that the manga will continue to do just that. Wank the goody two-shoes Chizuru further, while the competition will attract all of the negativity.

[stray]

Originally Posted by WingedAccelerator

At that point it shouldn't be surprising that the manga will continue to do just that. Wank the goody two-shoes Chizuru further, while the competition will attract all of the negativity.

It can't not because Kaz relationship with Chizuru is fundamentally toxic and it needs to obfuscate that from the shippers.

[AndrewR5D4]

Originally Posted by WingedAccelerator

Not only Chizuru gets every possible winning flag with an overwhelming screentime to boot over the rest, the author even makes the competition detestable (Except the harmless one, but she barely exist as the unfortunate 4th addition, and she is also a supporter). Only they can be portrayed as negative characters, only they can do bad, only their selfishness can be treated as bad. An underrated low was when Chizuru's grandma pulled a flashback to justify the web of lies eating Chizuru away as something positive if she twists it enough.

At that point it shouldn't be surprising that the manga will continue to do just that. Wank the goody two-shoes Chizuru further, while the competition will attract all of the negativity.

I never got the impression that Chizuru had any good competition. Mami always struck me as a evil man-eater (partially confirmed by the Sumi spin-off), and Ruka immediately came off as clingy and bratty once you got past her heart issues.

Were you referring to Sumi or Mini? I would say the latter is even more supportive of Kazuya than the former. Mini strikes me as the most affectionate and honest of the five girls. It's a pity she isn't one of Kazuya's love interests.

Originally Posted by stray

It can't not because Kaz relationship with Chizuru is fundamentally toxic and it needs to obfuscate that from the shippers.

Speaking from an in-universe perspective, whose fault would that be? Is it Kazuya for digging a hole through lies, or Chizuru for her deep-seated emotional constipation?

[Lex79]

This manga has never been about who Kazuya will end up with, it's "will be be able to get together with Mizuhara"? The other heroines are there to give support or be obstacles but so far they never had any chance to win.
Now, speaking of Ruka, I always thought she was a detestable girl but she Is becoming worse and worse. Kazuya should clearly tell her she is an horrible bitch and he wants to never see her again but I've got the feeling he will apologize to her instead.

[WingedAccelerator]

Originally Posted by AndrewR5D4

I never got the impression that Chizuru had any good competition. Mami always struck me as a evil man-eater (partially confirmed by the Sumi spin-off), and Ruka immediately came off as clingy and bratty once you got past her heart issues.

Were you referring to Sumi or Mini? I would say the latter is even more supportive of Kazuya than the former. Mini strikes me as the most affectionate and honest of the five girls. It's a pity she isn't one of Kazuya's love interests.

That's my point. Chizuru has no good competition, because the shipping ended with Kazuya fapping to her instead of Mami early on. Then it's low-effort padding with creating a fake harem by introducing more competition, even though it's a disgustingly one-sided OTP story, with other heroines as the plot devices. But even that could be palatable, if the competition could get any sort of acknowledgement or credit from Kazuya. Even when he does that rarely, in the same chapter he has to think about how much he loves Chizuru. But of course, the main leads are obnoxious in the first place.

Mami is a psycho bitch. Her portrayal is straight up negative. Putting up a happy facade, then killing the people in her head just by looking at them.

Ruka is "take responsibility" without actual impregnation. Of course she is clingy, when Kazuya wants nothing from her, but agreed to date her since Chizuru asked, and cannot refute her argument about Chizuru being just a rental and he being her client.

Sumi is the harmless one that came to exist from nowhere, has no real place in the story, so she got banished to the spin-off outside of her support cameos. Kind of ironic, since Kazuya was actually a positive influence for her in an organic way, they have good chemistry, but like I said, the competition has to be treated as dogshit compared to Chizuru.

Mini is the self-insert of the readers. She is not a proper love interest.

[stray]

Originally Posted by AndrewR5D4

Speaking from an in-universe perspective, whose fault would that be? Is it Kazuya for digging a hole through lies, or Chizuru for her deep-seated emotional constipation?

The lies aren't Kaz's problem as much as the long ass time period where he decided to be her patron or something saying things like "I'm just going to support Mizuhara from afar" or whatever. He's no less emotionally constipated, and his self esteem has probably been worse for the time he's been "dating" Chizuru than he was after Mami left him.

The issue with an "in universe" perspective is that there's a lot of things we've never actually seen, like Chizuru out on a rental date with another client. And even though this chapter made Ruka to look like the villain she's 100% right that Chizuru pushed for Kaz and Ruka to be a thing in the first place, likely to create distance between her and Kaz. But the manga presents things in such a way that deep down she seems to like Kaz so all should be forgiven.

[Johnny]

All the hate at Ruka should be actual praise instead since maybe just maybe this will make Chizuru act for once because we know after the umpteenth time Kazuya sure isn't going to...

Then again this could backfire and we get another hundred chapters of the same Kazuya going to confess but he loses his spine or some other low brow schtick...

I like stray's idea of letting him get a taste of Chizuru going on a rental date with another client but that's a balancing act on a knife's edge with how rabid some readers can be on that subject. Although that might happen if the mangaka wants to milk this out even further if she decides to back off like Ruka said. Good times...

[Lex79]

My theory is that in the next chapter Mizuhara will ask him in vague terms if he did anything with Ruka, he will say yes (because she kissed him) but that didn't mean anything for him, Mizuhara will misunderstand and we'll get another 50 chapters of drama. I hope I'll be proven wrong.

[AndrewR5D4]

Originally Posted by WingedAccelerator

That's my point. Chizuru has no good competition, because the shipping ended with Kazuya fapping to her instead of Mami early on. Then it's low-effort padding with creating a fake harem by introducing more competition, even though it's a disgustingly one-sided OTP story, with other heroines as the plot devices. But even that could be palatable, if the competition could get any sort of acknowledgement or credit from Kazuya. Even when he does that rarely, in the same chapter he has to think about how much he loves Chizuru. But of course, the main leads are obnoxious in the first place.

Mami is a psycho bitch. Her portrayal is straight up negative. Putting up a happy facade, then killing the people in her head just by looking at them.

Ruka is "take responsibility" without actual impregnation. Of course she is clingy, when Kazuya wants nothing from her, but agreed to date her since Chizuru asked, and cannot refute her argument about Chizuru being just a rental and he being her client.

Sumi is the harmless one that came to exist from nowhere, has no real place in the story, so she got banished to the spin-off outside of her support cameos. Kind of ironic, since Kazuya was actually a positive influence for her in an organic way, they have good chemistry, but like I said, the competition has to be treated as dogshit compared to Chizuru.

Mini is the self-insert of the readers. She is not a proper love interest.

I feel like the worst decision Chizuru made was forcing Kazuya to date Ruka. She used him to keep Ruka silent about the web of lies they had created. That being said, Ruka clinging to someone who clearly has no interest in her is getting annoying. That, and Kazuya actually asked her to break up with him... Dude, just grow a pair and straight-up dump her if you're really sick of the arrangement. Granted, I have no clue how Ruka would react if he had the guts to do that.

Why does Mami keep hanging around in the background? She's plays the villain, but it feels like she has nothing to gain by ruining his relationships. With the way she was acting, you'd think Kazuya was the one who dumped her. I highly doubt she still like him either, so WTF is her deal?

Sumi's not really involved much, so no issue with her. Your interpretation of Mini's character seems reasonable.

Originally Posted by stray

The lies aren't Kaz's problem as much as the long ass time period where he decided to be her patron or something saying things like "I'm just going to support Mizuhara from afar" or whatever. He's no less emotionally constipated, and his self esteem has probably been worse for the time he's been "dating" Chizuru than he was after Mami left him.

The issue with an "in universe" perspective is that there's a lot of things we've never actually seen, like Chizuru out on a rental date with another client. And even though this chapter made Ruka to look like the villain she's 100% right that Chizuru pushed for Kaz and Ruka to be a thing in the first place, likely to create distance between her and Kaz. But the manga presents things in such a way that deep down she seems to like Kaz so all should be forgiven.

Nice analysis! Now that you mention it, Kazuya's self-esteem is really in a terrible state. He seems to believe that someone like Chizuru could never have feelings for an ordinary guy like him ( I even recall her saying something like this early on in the series). No doubt that high-class party she took him to only deepened his feelings of inadequacy. Being surrounded by successful, good-looking people when he's just a college student with no career path must've been brutal.

The real question is: How long has Chizuru liked Kazuya? Back when she told him to date Ruka, she did so in the hopes that the latter wouldn't talk about her Rental Girlfriend job in public. Basically a means to silence her while using Kazuya as the bargaining chip.

[stray]

Originally Posted by AndrewR5D4

The real question is: How long has Chizuru liked Kazuya? Back when she told him to date Ruka, she did so in the hopes that the latter wouldn't talk about her Rental Girlfriend job in public. Basically a means to silence her while using Kazuya as the bargaining chip.

On the surface maybe but Chizuru's actions in general are all about keeping Kaz at a (comfortable) distance. Its just not as apparent as it was early in the manga because Kaz doesn't even try to test her boundaries anymore.

It doesn't matter if she likes him or not if she's doing whatever she can to keep the relationship from moving forward.

[WingedAccelerator]

Originally Posted by AndrewR5D4

I feel like the worst decision Chizuru made was forcing Kazuya to date Ruka. She used him to keep Ruka silent about the web of lies they had created. That being said, Ruka clinging to someone who clearly has no interest in her is getting annoying. That, and Kazuya actually asked her to break up with him... Dude, just grow a pair and straight-up dump her if you're really sick of the arrangement. Granted, I have no clue how Ruka would react if he had the guts to do that.

Why does Mami keep hanging around in the background? She's plays the villain, but it feels like she has nothing to gain by ruining his relationships. With the way she was acting, you'd think Kazuya was the one who dumped her. I highly doubt she still like him either, so WTF is her deal?

Multi-layered problem. Ruka is not gonna just accecpt that Kazuya wants a breakup, since she didn't do anything really to offend him. I mean as his girlfriend and clinginess aside. Kazuya can't counter her usual argument about rental and client, plus aspiring actress, so it looks like he is walking in for a rejection because of circumstances, different worlds. So why would she just let him do that and burn up everything behind him in his delusion? He doesn't have a spine to say that he rather end up being all alone assuing a rejection (despite saying he wants a girlfriend when he has one already) than to lead her on (when he did all this time). He not even tried to make it tactful that every other guy would be happy with her or something, it's not her fault, it was just "Sorry, break up with me, I lied, but I need to hurry up to confess to my Chizuru!". Then there is also the heart problem. She is not using it for pity points, which is good, but it certainly would help Kazuya understand why she is so obtuse in not letting him go. Just for fun, I also say that the complaint or excuse that she is minor will be null next year as legal adulthood in Japan will be changed from 20 years to 18 years. Padding it is, said the author.

Now Mami. I read a comment some time ago that the author said he didn't plan anything with Mami beyond Chapter 1, but he felt he shouldn't waste her design. This is the result. Kazuya got money, so she wasn't a gold digger if she ditched him after a month. I think Kazuya was just a creep in her eyes, or it became apparent for her that he is lecherous as heck with barely any redeeming qualities. It became personal for her when she saw that he actually puts effort into dating Chizuru, started changing. Why not her then? And Chizuru lied to her when she started investigating, so psycho bitch probably just wants to destroy both of them for insulting her feelings and intelligence like that. Ruka as well for that matter, but she protected her tweets, so nothing to use against her.

[AndrewR5D4]

Originally Posted by WingedAccelerator

Multi-layered problem. Ruka is not gonna just accecpt that Kazuya wants a breakup, since she didn't do anything really to offend him. I mean as his girlfriend and clinginess aside. Kazuya can't counter her usual argument about rental and client, plus aspiring actress, so it looks like he is walking in for a rejection because of circumstances, different worlds. So why would she just let him do that and burn up everything behind him in his delusion? He doesn't have a spine to say that he rather end up being all alone assuing a rejection (despite saying he wants a girlfriend when he has one already) than to lead her on (when he did all this time). He not even tried to make it tactful that every other guy would be happy with her or something, it's not her fault, it was just "Sorry, break up with me, I lied, but I need to hurry up to confess to my Chizuru!". Then there is also the heart problem. She is not using it for pity points, which is good, but it certainly would help Kazuya understand why she is so obtuse in not letting him go. Just for fun, I also say that the complaint or excuse that she is minor will be null next year as legal adulthood in Japan will be changed from 20 years to 18 years. Padding it is, said the author.

Now Mami. I read a comment some time ago that the author said he didn't plan anything with Mami beyond Chapter 1, but he felt he shouldn't waste her design. This is the result. Kazuya got money, so she wasn't a gold digger if she ditched him after a month. I think Kazuya was just a creep in her eyes, or it became apparent for her that he is lecherous as heck with barely any redeeming qualities. It became personal for her when she saw that he actually puts effort into dating Chizuru, started changing. Why not her then? And Chizuru lied to her when she started investigating, so psycho bitch probably just wants to destroy both of them for insulting her feelings and intelligence like that. Ruka as well for that matter, but she protected her tweets, so nothing to use against her.

Took a look back, and it seems Chizuru actually told him not to date Ruka, and openly stated it would be bad to keep her around knowing she would potentially cause them major trouble. Chizuru changed her mind after seeing Ruka crying in the streets and making a scene in public.

Harsh... I find Kazuya to be a relatively normal guy, and no more perverted than any other man his age. Dialogue and flashbacks show he was very attentive towards Mami, and practically held her up on a pedestal. Later interactions lead me to believe she never liked Kazuya at all, and saw him as a passing fancy. The Sumi spinoff shows that Mami is a man-eater who apparently enjoys charming men and tossing them aside, so its likely whatever she needed Kazuya for simply ended, and she had no need to keep him around. That still doesn't explain why she's so intent on wrecking his life.

[Chiibi]

Chapter 201 is out....and I've said it over and over but I fucking HATE Ruka....the girl is a goddamn malignant tumor.


Seriously, she is the most annoying, selfish, unreasonable, detestable brat of a harem character I've ever seen.

And that's saying something because I've seen and watched a lot of them. I really hated Haru in Nisekoi too but I'd take 50 clones of her over ONE Sarashina Ruka

[Lex79]

Yeah, Ruka has been trash since the beginning.

[Chiibi]

202 is out.

Ooof, any stuff between Chizuru and her grandma is really sad now. I just lost mine this past summer too so the scenes hit even harder. I'm going to be a freaking MESS if the hospital ones get animated.