2011-07-16, 12:59 | Link #23221 |
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Ep 7 confused me a lot on that matter, not too much, just confused me of the direct order of things.
Yasu is real, Shannon is fake, who is Yasu's ideal> Yasu lets scary stories of witches get to her head, imagines a new Beatrice and blames her failures on her> Kumasawa doesn't really believe this is true, but being the adult she is offers her advice which wouldn't crush her dreams(attaching strings to her keys)> Yasu starts enjoying the idea of being a witch, because lets face it, being a servant sucks> Yasu pulls the keychain prank on Berune(I think that was it, their names confuse me so much)> Yasu thinks witches kick ass> Yasu abandons herself, and leaves Shannon, basically making Shannon the dominant personality(or whatever term you want me to use), which is why she in turn doesn't really add up to what Yasu once thought she was> Shannon interacts with Battler, while ''Yasu-Beatrice'' stays up at night to pull massive pranks to affirm her existence> Battler, for some reason, does not mail her back> She gets crushed and then leaves her emotions to Beatrice, while Beatrice in turn creates the personality of Kanon to make up for her loneliness> Beatrice is born> Battler comes back after she gets over her fixation on Beatrice> Old memories are awakened in whatever way, and Yasu can no longer control her emotions and starts the epitaph, or whatever actually happened on R-Prime. Everything here is correct right? |
2011-07-16, 14:11 | Link #23222 | |
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Anyway, as for the software thing... well... in that same paragraph, he said: "Even though the clothes belong to Shannon, if what’s within is another being then that person would surely be able to kill George. Clothes are not a personality. And so, even though the cloths and the hairdo might be Shannon’s, but there is the possibility that it was another person, when she started asking questions about George." That screams DID to me. Super Shannon is a creation of Yasu's imagination, but Yasu's servant name may indeed be Shannon.
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Last edited by Used Can; 2011-07-16 at 14:27. |
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2011-07-16, 14:12 | Link #23223 | |
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Yasu-Shannon starts to forget Battler and begins falling for George -> gains a new motivation in life The complete Beatrice (endless witch + golden witch + lineage of Beatrice's) is born when Yasu finds the gold Yasu becomes the heir to the headship but refuses to take that place as she prefers to lead her life different from what she witnessed in the family Wants to run away with anybody she likes (trial of love) but is too scared to take that chance herself because of her damaged body (creates the concept of the devil's roulette) Holds some grudges against those who made her lead the life she had so far Beatrice (as a person) becomes basically obsolete as she has equal power in all her areas of life (this is basically the scene in front of the portrait in EP2 where Shannon receives the broach) Yasu-Shannon tests the bomb to know if she has sufficient power to free herself (be with anybody she likes) Her initial plans are destroyed when she learns of Battler returning to the island, because she does not know what's right and wrong anymore That's at least how I interpreted the different pieces of information we got during the final portions of EP7. |
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2011-07-16, 21:43 | Link #23224 | |||
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Mind you, her having a grudge makes more sense in my opinion. With the exception of a few people, Yasu had reasons to hate everybody in that family. Quote:
You know, this makes me think about Battler showing up. Battler's situation with his parents was, for all we know, exactly the same in Lion's world. However, he wasn't in the island during the conference of 1986 in that world. This makes me think Yasu may have had some involvement on him going back. I'd say he may have "somewhat" remembered about his promise, but then I remembered he seemed to have completely forgotten about it when Shannon mentioned it during EP3.
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2011-07-16, 22:03 | Link #23225 | |
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2011-07-17, 02:37 | Link #23227 | |
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I mean... think about it. Anyway my main objection to Actual DID is that it would be completely impossible to execute any plans whatsoever if one actually had a crippling mental illness, let alone function in a job or write a story in a couple days. Not that I wouldn't love a forgery where the obvious consequences of this come to light: Spoiler:
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2011-07-17, 06:02 | Link #23231 | |||
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You're right, Beatrice never vanishes. But I'd say her importance is taken to another level when Yasu finds the gold, because through that her Shannon persona (and through that also Kanon) actually gains the power to do something. And yes, the love for George has to precede the solving of the epitaph. Wasn't the time when she actually noticed her feeling for George sometime in 1983 (either at the spring or autumn meeting)? And solving the epitaph was in November 1984? That at least explains why Beatrice made that pact with Shannon (as seen in EP2) where it says that if she's strong enough to release Beatrice's powers she would be able to fullfil her love. In the end it would boil down to Yasu subconsciously thinking: "With all this I have enough power to force that bitch Eva to submit!" Quote:
The whole scheme of plotting against Krauss, the idea that Kinzô was long dead, the individual plans of the parents to make a fortune and their individual perspective of cutting their ties with the rest of the family had no chance to surface that extremely in Lion's world. And apart from that it was a plot device serving as a metaphor... But yes, I also doubt the real reason why Battler was taken to Rokkenjima that year and why exactly Ange wasn't. These are those small instances which make me doubt Kyrie a little more than anybody else...especially considering how "mentally stable as a rock" her sister is. |
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2011-07-17, 08:34 | Link #23232 | |||||
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In addition, I don't see how Battler would fit in the whole deal with the Epitaph. As long as Rudolph and Kyrie solve it, the inheritance belongs to them. And if they also want to keep the headship and pass it, then there was Ange. Mind you, I think it's likely that in EP1 and EP2 the Epitaph got solved before the 1st Twilight, in a similar fashion to what we saw in EP7. That'd help the idea of proxy murders and how Yasu was able to kill 6 people so easily. It'd also work with the scene in EP2 when all the parents meet Beatrice and "acknowledge" her. Then we have "Kinzo" in EPs 3-4. So, it's possible someone else solved the Epitaph in those episodes. Of course, we've also got our fair share of accomplices, like Hideyoshi in EP1, Rosa - quite likely - in EP2 and the possibility of Kyrie and Krauss in EP3. Of course, all of these are just fictional stories. So, whilst they may have huge hints to what could have happened in Rokkenjima Prime, the events in them are not necessarily real, and even probably very far from what actually ended up happening. That's how Yasu is easily the master planner and murderer in the fictions, but in R. Prime, while she may still have planned the whole setting, things may have gone out of her control (probably even before the conference itself) and then we have the possibility of how we saw things happen in EP7's Tea Party with Rudolph and Kyrie becoming the main murderers - which probably has a lot of true to it, considering Ange's reaction after reading Eva's diary (especially if you go through the "Trick" ending). Quote:
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2011-07-17, 15:48 | Link #23233 |
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Another few questions. Why does Beatrices form in EP 7 look different from how we usually see her? I thought that was Claire's form? As for Battler, was what he learned about Beatrice at the end of EP 5 similar to what Bern told Ange in Ep 8 about finding the truth?
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2011-07-17, 16:30 | Link #23234 | |
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2011-07-17, 17:25 | Link #23235 |
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Clair is basically how Yasu imagined Beatrice originally, since there was no hints to what the human Beatrice looked like at the time. Later, however, there was the portrait, plus Battler saying he liked blonde babes..
As for what Battler learned at EP5, he learned EVERYTHING. The entire Truth.
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2011-07-17, 17:29 | Link #23236 | |
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2011-07-17, 21:16 | Link #23238 | ||
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I thought the general idea was that Battler probably remembered his promise in R-Prime, which is why he didn't return in Lion's world, what with the promise not existing there. It doesn't make sense to think that Yasu MADE Rudolf get Battler to return, because Clair says pretty openly that it was pure bad luck that Battler happened to return in 1986, which turned what would've been a small incident into a 2km crater of an incident. Quote:
Yup, Jessica didn't see anything besides the missing doll afterwards. She probably would've been wearing her white getup, though, anyways. |
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2011-07-17, 23:27 | Link #23239 |
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On the Battler coming to the island thing, considering that it was probably Rudolf and Kyrie who asked him to come, it was probably something inheritance-related, nullified by Lion being the heir. Or perhaps they're in on Yasu's game thing, again negated by Lion. Battler himself doesn't have to experience any internal change.
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2011-07-17, 23:29 | Link #23240 |
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Why would someone who left the family be important to the inheritance? If anything, Kinzo would be PISSED to see him come back(if Kinzo is how he is portrayed.) Unless they like, knew about Yasu and how she liked Battler and thought they could use him.
I think Rudolph wanted him back out of pure emotional feelings, nothing financial. |
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