2012-01-03, 22:34 | Link #26881 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
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Now that you said it, I now wish Ryukishi actually distributed different versions of the booklet. Packaged inside bottles. :lol:
That brings up an idea ... anyone up to make forgeries of Our Confession? (Somehow I can hear Hanyuu saying, "Oniii! Akumaaa!!!) |
2012-01-03, 23:02 | Link #26882 |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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Hopefully whoever uploaded that text intends to put up the rest and we're just waiting on them to type it. I've also posted a request in the C81 thread on /jp/ to see if anyone can rescan it, so we'll see what happens.
By the way, "17-year-old Angels" is up on the wiki too. Just from a quick skim, it appears to be about Ange and Virgilia setting up a BL manga circle for Comiket together and making the other characters suffer through their bizarre pairing fantasies. o_O EDIT: Besides what haguruma mentioned, there's also a new bit where Piece-Beatrice is threatening Krauss and Natsuhi at the beginning. She tells them that there are only two ways to avoid the explosion: 1) disable the timing device using a method only she knows, or 2) escape to the far side of the island through the underground tunnel in the gold room. The tunnel is sealed with a locked iron grid which Piece-Beatrice has the key to. Also, Beatrice tells the 1st twilight victims: "Don't take this the wrong way. You haven't done anything wrong. If you want to blame someone, blame that man who threw away his promise for six long years."
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Last edited by LyricalAura; 2012-01-03 at 23:24. |
2012-01-03, 23:30 | Link #26883 | |
Restless Ghost
Join Date: Sep 2010
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We already knew about Virgilia's love of crack from that other TIP and Ange... Somehow, I'm not surprised. She's more and more like Battler by the second. Weird catchprases, slaughter of english, finger pointing (in the anime, at least), suicidal tendencies, and now, pervertedness. Onichan must be proud. |
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2012-01-04, 00:05 | Link #26885 | |
別にいいけど
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
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Beatrice here's got quite some convincing argument...
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2012-01-04, 01:48 | Link #26886 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
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So time to stop lurking and post my theory on Yasu's motive. I've been honing this on gamefaqs for a bit, so if anyone browses the Umineko topics over there they probably have seen this stuff before. Spoiler'd for length, and also minor spoilers for Our Confessions.
Spoiler for R-prime motive:
Spoiler for stories/game board motive:
Well this is my interpretation. I know it probably seems silly to put so much thought into the motive for the stories when you can hand-wave everything with meta-motives, but I feel it's an important part of the mystery nonetheless, and I wanted to find a decent motive for the real murder interpretation of R-prime. And part of this is probably just thinking for the sake of thinking. Despite typing so much, I still feel like I haven't quite explained all the thoughts I have well enough, and there are still some things I'm wondering about. But there's really nothing to be gained form holding it back, so I'll post it now. |
2012-01-04, 02:31 | Link #26887 | |
Senior Member
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If you consider the idea that EP1 and 2 as well as Our Confession were written by Yasu, quite a bit can be deduced regarding her idea of the characters, especially if you apply the logic told in Our Confession to the actions of characters in those Episodes. Dlanor basically flat out tells us that what created the tragedy was that: Spoiler for Our Confession:
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2012-01-04, 02:38 | Link #26888 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
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"Hideyoshi is Eva's wife" Haha. But honestly, good post Nanaya.
The "everyone is guilty" approach is unorthodox to the point of being unacceptable in a mystery, but in Umineko it makes sense. It explains how everyone in the Golden Land has such equal feelings, none of them blaming each other, everyone feeling responsible and sorry for Ange. The story has taken special care to introduce every character's shortcomings that could lead them to doom, and the situation on the island is so volatile that someone could actually be getting shot. Then it snowballs from there and in the end things are so messy that Yasu looks like a saviour with her bomb switch. There are other options that I've thought about and mostly dismissed, like... accident explosion (lame), a single culprit (not enough evidence), the story authors trying to cover up for somebody (convoluted). It's still difficult to confirm the theory, because we know so little of the key parts of R-Prime. 1. Who knows about bomb switch and who flips it? (plenty of evidence that Yasu controls this) 2. Who solves the epitaph, and do they stay quiet about it? (infinite variations) 3. Why do things get out of hand? (plenty of evidence there's a murder mystery game, trying to hide Kinzo's death, 10 tons of gold needing to be shared) 4. Who is the first one to actually commit a murder and how? (infinite variations) 5. How is it that Battler and Eva end up escaping in seperate ways, and nobody else? (Battler gets escorted out by Yasu it seems, other than that infinite variations) 6. Why are Battler and Eva hiding information? (to avoid prosecution and they don't want Ange to think her family are like something out of Darwin Awards.)
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Last edited by Jaden; 2012-01-04 at 03:16. |
2012-01-04, 02:43 | Link #26889 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
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Was there any particular reason for Ikuko writing stories about Rokkenjima other than the fact that she was an author? I don't really see anything she would have to gain from writing those stories. She says that she's reached the truth, but she doesn't really want to reveal it. She writes the stories giving out some bits of it but not the whole thing.
In the end, she even helps bring down the interest in the Rokkenjima explosion. If she was going to do that anyways, what was the reason for writing out the forgeries? |
2012-01-04, 03:02 | Link #26890 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
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I've been scratching my head for the past few days trying to find out what "Golden Land" actually means. Reading nanaya's view; that helps clear up my confusion.
Not to try to discount the proposed concept, just want to check if I get this right ... Spoiler for Golden Land:
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2012-01-04, 03:14 | Link #26891 | |
The True Culprit
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2012-01-04, 04:01 | Link #26892 |
Dea ex Kakera
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sea of Fragments
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Okay, since people are assuming that Our Confession was written by or applies to Yasu, I'd better point a couple of things out.
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2012-01-04, 04:30 | Link #26893 |
*cackle* *cackle*
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So, basically, what you're implying is that the "meta world" is Tohya struggling with his "Battler memories" discussing with Ikuko (who is represented by Meta-Beatrice) while writing their books?
Just making sure I'm following the same logic line as you. |
2012-01-04, 04:38 | Link #26894 | |
The True Culprit
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2012-01-04, 08:15 | Link #26895 | ||
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
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As for the whole deal with Ikuko & Tohya and the metafiction angle, I have a bunch of thoughts on that as well, but they're hardly organized into a single coherent theory. Spoiler for length and shotgun logic:
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2012-01-04, 10:59 | Link #26897 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
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Well, I don't find anything strange in it...In the second twilight of EP2, Kanon's body is never found as far as I remembered, and I don't think Yasu die in this... |
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2012-01-04, 11:49 | Link #26898 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
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It's true that Kanon's body was found, but Beatrice said he was dead in red to make it look like Jessica and Kanon were the victims of the second twilight.
It's actually a very interesting point that this game seems to use the same person for two twilights. Strange. |
2012-01-04, 12:35 | Link #26900 |
Goat
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Gnawing away at Rokkenjima
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I like your analysis (although I don't necessarily agree with all of it). What do you think of Ikuko=Yasu?
---------------- About the Our Confessions 2nd Twilight. haguruma covered it already. --------------- EP1 4th Twilight was Kinzo. Until Our Confessions, the 2nd Twilight was interpreted in such a way that there were no restrictions on how to kill. |
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