Clannad ~After Story~ - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll [END]

[Ithekro]

That or maybe the hints and threads where spaced out over too great a period of time for some people to remember.

Or it was mentally cataloged as useless filler and disreguarded early on and thus never left an impression on a portion of the viewers.

(Or as some have said, they hate magical stuff and it gets on their nerves)

(EDIT: As for Haruhi, there are established air times starting Thursday, April 2nd on multiple stations. Be it new or rerun...there will be something to watch on Thurdays from KyoAni along with K-On!)

[SageGaiGar]

Looks like I'll need to break the (^_^) out while reading this thread. It looked like a reset, but they did atleast move it in the direction of "What if Nagisa survived?"

...To any angry shippers... once again. (^_^). And Chibi is correct. Clannad is being Clannad. If that's good or bad.. your call.

[Proto]

As I said before, this is one problem in general why Magical Realism is always viewed with some skepticism. One, because one of the premises of the genre is that the magic should not be explained, it must be accepted as just an intrinsic part of the world. From 1 we induce 2, the line between magic and 'reality' is not well defined, since it is all presented as a single reality. For the viewer/reader to be able to see the line one has to effectively, read between the lines. Which does not mean its impossible. Just that it is sometimes on the subtle side of the balance. and people who brush over the subtleties will cry foul at the top of their lungs

[SageGaiGar]

Yeah, it's like trying to prove faith. You can't. The very purpose of faith is belief without fact.

There are elements to realism but the show has hinged a lot on magical elements in the background.

[Leo_Otaku]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

That or maybe the hints and threads where spaced out over too great a period of time for some people to remember.

Or it was mentally cataloged as useless filler and disreguarded early on and thus never left an impression on a portion of the viewers.

(Or as some have said, they hate magical stuff and it gets on their nerves)

(EDIT: As for Haruhi, there are established air times starting Thursday, April 2nd on multiple stations. Be it new or rerun...there will be something to watch on Thurdays from KyoAni along with K-On!)

I agree completely with you.

Originally Posted by alu546

It is because we dont get whats happening that we have a problem with the ending. I mean, many posts in this thread are confused as to whats happening, or why it is, or even the events that led up to it happening regardless of whether they liked the ending or not.

Apparently, its not obvious, the mere fact that a goodsized portion are confused reaffirms my claim that the anime wasnt expansive enough on the topic.

Well why don't we try and put the pieces together and look around in the spoiler section and figure it out or watch the illusionary scenes again. To me it is like some people are complaining about it without asking why or how.

I miss things too but I look for the explanation of it.

[typhonsentra]

And no, I didn't pick up anything from those episodes. How could you possibly begin to care about these characters when you know from the beginning that everything's going to be reset in the end? They foreshadowed too heavily prior to the events of episode 16, it kinda gets arid of any tension.

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by Master Chibi

If I want to stay true to what I said last week, the result is that I liked this ending (more so that I accepted it actually). Ushio is alive and kicking, which is what I wanted.

If I want to stay true to what I feel right now, the result is that I don't like the ending at all. I've never connected with the other magical world angle, and I've been watching since they started using the gimmick since the first episode. It was never appealing, I always considered them the most boring, repetitive, distracting portions of the episodes they were shown in, and now that it's all come to climax in this final episode it's done one thing and one thing only for me.

Nothing.

All I got were feelings of cop out, and I had to control myself from rolling my eyes so far back into my skull that I would have pulled a muscle somehow.

Even if you sit here and tell me that the show is deeply rooted in magical bullshit, it's still a reset, and that's 100% the lamest way to treat any story. You don't make me feel for the characters so damn hard and then just throw some pixie dust all over the damn situation while hitting your heels three times together to fix it all. With these type of endings you don't actually enjoy it, you just accept it or you don't, and again, that's a horrible thing to put upon your audience, isn't it?

Gah.

I'm happy to be mad, and I'm mad that I'm happy.

Clannad is being Clannad.

God damn it.

Wouldn't that make this a 1? At least according to this: http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=288

[NoOneKnowS]

^
The anime should be a standalone series, w/ or w/out help from the visual novel. The audience must be able to understand what is happening or why/and or grasp the whole situation just by watching. Now most can't get that. Including me.


/comments on teh EP.

Ok, so we can say that "everything was just a bad dream then". Right so, nothing actually happened IRL in clannad?

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by typhonsentra

And no, I didn't pick up anything from those episodes. How could you possibly begin to care about these characters when you know from the beginning that everything's going to be reset in the end? They foreshadowed too heavily prior to the events of episode 16, it kinda gets arid of any tension.

Which really begs the question just why you continued to watch through those episodes anyway.

I think I'll classify the initial comment as a 1 from Proto's 5 Types of Reactions to the CLANNAD ending.

[alu546]

Originally Posted by Proto

As I said before, this is one problem in general why Magical Realism is always viewed with some skepticism. One, because one of the premises of the genre is that the magic should not be explained, it must be accepted as just an intrinsic part of the world. From 1 we induce 2, the line between magic and 'reality' is not well defined, since it is all presented as a single reality. For the viewer/reader to be able to see the line one has to effectively, read between the lines. Which does not mean its impossible. Just that it is sometimes on the subtle side of the balance. and people who brush over the subtleties will cry foul at the top of their lungs

Lol, well, this is probably the most accurate depiction of whats going on. Although what I have been trying to say that I did not brush over the subtleties, its that I never foresaw such a direct development being produced from that, and am calling foul anyway



I just want people to atleast bother to recognize my complaint of it as a legitimate one whether or not the agree with it, rather than simply dismissing it as an afterthought.

[typhonsentra]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Which really begs the question just why you continued to watch through those episodes anyway.

I think I'll classify the initial comment as a 1 from Proto's 5 Types of Reactions to the CLANNAD ending.

By the time I realized what was going to happen I figured I might as well finish it. I watched Simpsons for years too before I finally had to give it up last year.

[Master Chibi]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Wouldn't that make this a 1? At least according to this: http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=288

Not really.

Again, maybe I would have accepted the other worldly crap if they had bothered to implement it in a better fashion, because as is I think it was far, far, far out there, even in the realm of super natural, spiritual nonsense this show established itself into.

They either shoved it into the the very begining of the episode or the end, and lord knows if they could have made it work in some other manner, but I don't think it worked this way, that's for sure. They kept developing the characters, and then the other worldly bit reared its head to detract from whatever came before it (or was to come after it).

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by typhonsentra

By the time I realized what was going to happen I figured I might as well finish it. I watched Simpsons for years too before I finally had to give it up last year.

Congratulations, you just wasted what amounted to almost two hours of your life on a show you detested. Pat yourself on the back.

Kidding aside though, if you have to air your complaints, don't hate on the adaptation, but give criticism on the source material. And the scenario writer who came up with it.

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by Master Chibi

Not really.

Again, maybe I would have accepted the other worldly crap if they had bothered to implement it in a better fashion, because as is I think it was far, far, far out there, even in the realm of super natural, spiritual nonsense this show established itself into.

They either shoved it into the the very begining of the episode or the end, and lord knows if they could have made it work in some other manner, but I don't think it worked this way, that's for sure.

Well, the problem isn't the adaptation in that case, but the actual source material -- remember, CLANNAD as a visual novel was multi-path, plus had this hidden Easter egg hunt (for the light orbs) to boot, where you really HAD to go through all the myriad paths to get to a 'true end'.

And of course, Jun Maeda's style of heavy-handed writing.

I couldn't find the post that better explains this, but game players knew what we were getting into, as the game REALLY bludgeons you with these so-called hints.

[Nosauz]

The ending in the anime is by far more blunt then the game, the game really just pussyfoots most of this illusory world where as the anime SPECIFICALLY connects it to tomoya with the girls final words: papa. Some of the other hints are less pronounced but there are so god damn many that its pretty obvious.

[Master Chibi]

Well to be blunt if I have to play a game to better enjoy another form of media then it practically feels like I'm doing homework, especially when it should be standard fare that either form of the series should be fine on its own. One can lead to being enjoyed from the other, but one should not be enjoyed better by having it be a prerequisite.

:P

[typhonsentra]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Congratulations, you just wasted what amounted to almost two hours of your life on a show you detested. Pat yourself on the back.

Kidding aside though, if you have to air your complaints, don't hate on the adaptation, but give criticism on the source material. And the scenario writer who came up with it.

A faithful adaptation doesn't make it any less stupid.

But you know, I can see how this could work for the game. After all, you have to play through the sad endings to get to this. You can view it as a reward for getting 100% or whatever. Here it's just... there.

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by Master Chibi

Well to be blunt if I have to play a game to better enjoy another form of media then it practically feels like I'm doing homework, especially when it should be standard fare that either form of the series should be fine on its own. One can lead to being enjoyed from the other, but one should not be enjoyed better by having it be a prerequisite.

:P

Haha, be glad you never experienced DOT.HACK.

I gave a 1 reaction to the ending as well, but you have to take into account the fact that I'm taking up a Master's degree course in Creative Writing, so most of my peeves were about the execution and buildup, and non-climax rather than themes.

[Myssa Rei]

Originally Posted by typhonsentra

A faithful adaptation doesn't make it any less stupid.

But you know, I can see how this could work for the game. After all, you have to play through the sad endings to get to this. You can view it as a reward for getting 100% or whatever. Here it's just... there.

That's one of the limitations of adapting multi-path games, ESPECIALLY ones where there's a 'Normal' ending, and a 'True' ending that usually only becomes available after doing all the OTHER routes. Heart de Roommate for example...

[Master Chibi]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

I gave a 1 reaction to the ending as well, but you have to take into account the fact that I'm taking up a Master's degree course in Creative Writing, so most of my peeves were about the execution and buildup, and non-climax rather than themes.

Dude, that's also been my biggest problem with this series, where have you been?