Fate/ Series Q&A

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by bhl88

If you saw the fight... Gilgamesh used the weapons one by one vs Saber.

I'll have to go back and read it again. Is this the end of Fate?

[Grey]

Random thought: F/Z Berserker used spirit form when he retreated, but the F/Z Assassins didn't use it to try and escape. Why?

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by Grey

Random thought: F/Z Berserker used spirit form when he retreated, but the F/Z Assassins didn't use it to try and escape. Why?

They were in the Reality Marble. Game over, and they knew it too.

[TwilightsCall]

Spirit form isn't a 'get out of fail free' card. Berserker escaped in Spirit form because no one pursued him. The Assassins were not only being pursued by who knows how many Servants, but they were also trapped inside Rider's Reality Marble, so even if they HAD gone spirit form and not been pursued, there wouldn't have been anywhere to go.

Its also explained a bit better in the LN, where you see

Spoiler for LN stuff, but already happened in the anime:

the Assassins were split into as many copies as they possibly could have (I believe 80 or so?), meaning each one of them was only as strong as a normal person, maybe a bit stronger, since Assassin's abilities and presence as a Servant are reduced depending on the number of copies he's split into. When they got attacked by Rider's Reality Marble, they just went into a panic as would any mob of peasants being attacked by an army, and probably weren't in the best state of mind for making a cool, calculated escape.

Basically, Assassin probably couldn't have escaped anyways, but even if he had tried he had alread gimped himself by splitting into so many parts. His goal was to win at any cost simply by the sheer force of numbers, but when Rider used Ionian Hetairoi, he didn't even have that advantage and so was easily wiped out.



As far as Gilgamesh using a sword, I remember seeing it at the end of the F/SN anime but I don't remember him doing it in the VN. Even ignoring that, while Gilgamesh could use a sword, and by all means was probably quite skilled with one, his attitude and fighting style are more fitted to the Archer class, and the only sword he could be considered as having 'mastered' is Ea, which isn't really a sword. By the same logic you would expect Archer to be better suited to the Saber class, but a combination have having stats that are too low and capabilities more appropriate to the Archer class means that no matter how skilled he may or may not be with a sword, he'll still never be a Saber.

[Grey]

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

Spirit form isn't a 'get out of fail free' card. Berserker escaped in Spirit form because no one pursued him. The Assassins were not only being pursued by who knows how many Servants, but they were also trapped inside Rider's Reality Marble, so even if they HAD gone spirit form and not been pursued, there wouldn't have been anywhere to go.

But they can't be seen in Spirit Form, right? So just hop into Spirit Form and run around like crazy until Iskander/Waver runs out of mana. You'd think "go invisible" would be the first reflex.

I guess it would be less dramatic that way through. And maybe some of them did do that but weren't shown.

[TwilightsCall]

In the end, people have to lose eventually, so we'll keep coming up with reasons as to why they didn't just go invisible and escape Its an area I'm a little skeptical about in cannon, since Assassin not only can go into spiritual form to avoid being seen by humans, but he also has Presence Concealment which should've been capable of hiding them.

In the end, I don't think there will be a satisfying answer other then it just didn't happen lol.

[Haak]

Who the hell is Higashide Yuuichirou?

Other than the fact that he wrote the Post-face for Fate Zero Vol 2 and was involved in some of the designs of the canceled Fate/Apocrypha, I can't find a damn thing about him.

[TwilightsCall]

Apparently he wrote Kemonogari, Bullet Butlers, Princess Waltz...

Not that I'm familiar with any of those lol

EDIT: There's a list of his works on this page if you are familiar with Japanese

[Ragna92]

Originally Posted by giorno

they are all servants. Meaning they are all as strong as servants.

IMO, they're probably not on the level of saber, but most of them would probably be around average servant level, meaning, around diarmuid's level i guess...

Spoiler for Riders army:

No way, I'm pretty sure Diarmuid can take out a 1/4 of that army.

[giorno]

diarmuid is pretty much an average/slightly above average servant with two B rank NPs(though they're not average NPs)

no way he can take 1/4 of Alex's army. Heck, two of Alex's generals should be enough to take him out...

[Ragna92]

Originally Posted by giorno

diarmuid is pretty much an average/slightly above average servant with two B rank NPs(though they're not average NPs)

no way he can take 1/4 of Alex's army. Heck, two of Alex's generals should be enough to take him out...

Spoiler for Diarmuid:

Those guys were riding on horses, Diarmuid is much, much faster. He would speed blitz them most likely. Diarmuid was fighting on par with Saber.

[giorno]

...those horses are hardly normal horses, you know...

seriously, they're heroic spirits, and each of them is likely individually stronger than the assassins

really, even if they had archer's shitty stats, 2 of them would still be enough to fuck up diarmuid...

[Ragna92]

Originally Posted by giorno

...those horses are hardly normal horses, you know...

seriously, they're heroic spirits, and each of them is likely individually stronger than the assassins

really, even if they had archer's shitty stats, 2 of them would still be enough to fuck up diarmuid...

Well they were moving pretty slow. Atleast from what I saw in the anime. I don't know how they're described in the light novel. How would they be able to keep up with Diarmuds speed?

[giorno]

because they're servants...even if they're not quite as fast as diarmuid, they would still be fast and skilled enough to fight him, because they are servants...

[Guernsey]

Can anyone tell me why Kotomine is the way he is?

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by Guernsey

Can anyone tell me why Kotomine is the way he is?

I think that was never explained.

Spoiler for FSN visual novel:

trying to figure out why god created such a person as wrapped as him is one of his main motivations in FSN

[Vicious108]

Originally Posted by Guernsey

Can anyone tell me why Kotomine is the way he is?

If you're watching the Fate/Zero anime and don't know yet you should probably wait and find out for yourself as the series progresses, but since this is a general Stay Night Q&A thread and I can't be sure of your circumstances, I'll go ahead and elucidate you.

Spoiler for Fate/Stay Night Visual Novel and Fate/Zero Episode 12:

Kotomine suffers from schadenfreude. That is to say, it is in his inherent nature to derive pleasure from the misfortune of others. Things like family, friendship and affection do nothing for him and he can only find happiness in inflicting pain on others and witnessing their misery.

But since he received a strict religious upbringing, where the dichotomy of "good and evil" is gospel, he has come to the conclusion that his very existence is "wrong" and has thus rejected his very being, becoming an empty and hollow shell of a man plagued by doubt as to why he is even allowed to exist. Since nothing but sin can bring him pleasure, he has intrinsically correlated the two and deemed pleasure itself to be sin. All in order to deny himself and not fall into the temptation of being happy at the cost of others' well-being.

Gilgamesh, being quite the sadist himself, sees through to that struggle and, due to his own rather amoral nature that doesn't bother to differentiate pleasure derived from good deeds from pleasure derived from evil deeds, tries and make Kotomine accept that which he truly is and seek out happiness for himself, instead of being shackled by the moral values imposed on him.

So if you ask why he is the way he is, then the answer may surprise you that he was simply born that way and has no choice but to deal with it.

[Auria]

Originally Posted by Endless Twilight

If you're watching the Fate/Zero anime and don't know yet you should probably wait and find out for yourself as the series progresses, but since this is a general Stay Night Q&A thread and I can't be sure of your circumstances, I'll go ahead and elucidate you.

Spoiler for Fate/Stay Night Visual Novel and Fate/Zero Episode 12:

Kotomine suffers from schadenfreude. That is to say, it is in his inherent nature to derive pleasure from the misfortune of others. Things like family, friendship and affection do nothing for him and he can only find happiness in inflicting pain on others and witnessing their misery.

But since he received a strict religious upbringing, where the dichotomy of "good and evil" is gospel, he has come to the conclusion that his very existence is "wrong" and has thus rejected his very being, becoming an empty and hollow shell of a man plagued by doubt as to why he is even allowed to exist. Since nothing but sin can bring him pleasure, he has intrinsically correlated the two and deemed pleasure itself to be sin. All in order to deny himself and not fall into the temptation of being happy at the cost of others' well-being.

Gilgamesh, being quite the sadist himself, sees through to that struggle and, due to his own rather amoral nature that doesn't bother to differentiate pleasure derived from good deeds from pleasure derived from evil deeds, tries and make Kotomine accept that which he truly is and seek out happiness for himself, instead of being shackled by the moral values imposed on him.

So if you ask why he is the way he is, then the answer may surprise you that he was simply born that way and has no choice but to deal with it.

Just want to add a little.

Spoiler for interpretation blabla:

Since I always look for (want to enforce?) a connection how a character could've been 'formed' by a past rather than "being born this way", I want to suggest that, given that he had a strictly religious upbringing, his senses deriving joy from "morally righteous" things that he was exposed to again and again "dulled" starting in his early childhood, leaving him with the emptiness of never being able to satisfy his dark side even in the slightest way (like everyone has a light and dark side moderate amount blabla). But maybe a discussion along these lines should be saved for the character discussion threads, as it is mostly speculative.

[Vicious108]

Originally Posted by Auria

Just want to add a little.

Spoiler for interpretation blabla:

Since I always look for (want to enforce?) a connection how a character could've been 'formed' by a past rather than "being born this way", I want to suggest that, given that he had a strictly religious upbringing, his senses deriving joy from "morally righteous" things that he was exposed to again and again "dulled" starting in his early childhood, leaving him with the emptiness of never being able to satisfy his dark side even in the slightest way (like everyone has a light and dark side moderate amount blabla). But maybe a discussion along these lines should be saved for the character discussion threads, as it is mostly speculative.

Spoiler:

That's an interesting take on it and not so different from my own. Since I was just explaining the matter to someone with no knowledge of it, I stuck to what's factually presented in the story and didn't go into any personal input on the matter, but yes, I too find it interesting to speculate and come up with theories that could explain his condition outside of it having simply been there from the start. And his soul almost unconsciously rebelling against that which was so vehemently forced upon him and thus swaying towards that which he was deprived of entirely definitely seems like a valid possibility to me.

[Knightrunner]

How many magical circuits does Rin have? and what is the average for a magus?