2015-01-28, 00:49 | Link #35581 | |
AS Oji-kun
Join Date: Nov 2006
Age: 74
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Japanese police raid amazon.co.jp
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2015-01-28, 02:48 | Link #35582 | |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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It's a safe borrower's market, which Greece won't even try to pretend to be. |
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2015-01-28, 02:59 | Link #35583 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Isekai
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Call me a layman if you want, but wouldn't it be better to pressure Greece into stopping their load of bull policies? As far as I see it, Brussels has been rather nice to them and could have donenworse things. They're being ignored already so why not?
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2015-01-28, 04:58 | Link #35584 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Seriously speaking though, most Japanese girls have the ability to look below 18. Heck even the guys are able to look like below-18 girls! Wait a minute......
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2015-01-28, 05:38 | Link #35585 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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Greece is officially economically worse than the United States during the Great Depression. Just about the only thing they can punish Greece with is military invasion. The fact is the EU still isn't ready to cause a Greece Exit, and that's why they kept half assing threats.
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2015-01-28, 06:01 | Link #35586 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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2015-01-28, 06:19 | Link #35587 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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You are free to discuss morality, but as far as politics is concerned, the new PM is just doing his job. As I say, this is blackmail, but this isn't unusual or illegal for politicians.
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2015-01-28, 06:31 | Link #35588 |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Speaking of which, looks like the prophecy fulfilled itself.
Nobel Prize Winnig Economist Says Now It Is Time To Buy Greek Stocks Solace, you see this?
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2015-01-28, 07:02 | Link #35589 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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And that Greece have not complied is crystal clear. Today Tsipras undid several of the few measures that were agreed in the bailout plan. Tsipras is going on full confrontation course. Quote:
It's brinkmanship of the purest kind. There are first reports of Syriza voters having buyer's remorse, since he 1) forged a coalition with a party of right-wing xenophobes with good connections to the Greek "ruling class" 2) is openly courting Russia as alternative creditor to the EU Let's talk again in half a year when his grand schemes and dreams have collided with reality. Last edited by Mentar; 2015-01-28 at 07:21. |
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2015-01-28, 07:38 | Link #35590 | ||
(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2006
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2015-01-28, 08:08 | Link #35591 | |
AS Oji-kun
Join Date: Nov 2006
Age: 74
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2015-01-28, 08:15 | Link #35592 |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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Yea, but that was before Tsipras' announcement to roll back the reforms, and coupled them with the implicit threat of defaulting on their public debt.
But hey - whoever feels like investing in this political climate, more power to you. It will make buying Greek long-term bonds look like total bluechip investments! |
2015-01-28, 09:05 | Link #35593 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
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It's a bit comparable to airplane crash investigations and climate studies. The principal mechanisms are often well understood but the lack of data and the number of variables make interpretation of any particular event and forecasting difficult. Policy making and advise is a whole different ballgame and has often little to do with the field of study as political interests and other fields like law interact. Some of the more visible economists do make the faux pas of claiming certainty, even outside of their field of expertise, this is aggravated by the desire of politicians and management for the "one handed economist". That said, there is also a certain blindness (or should I say laziness) by the general public when it comes to check facts. The invisible hand is a nice example. It refers to a mechanism which only works under a very specific set of conditions, like in physics an apple and a feather will accelerate at the same speed in a field of gravity when there is vacuum. Remove the vacuum and it wont work, most people understand the physics example with ease, yet voters en mass believe that free markets work under any condition. |
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2015-01-28, 10:33 | Link #35594 | ||
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Greece looks pretty delicious, but I wouldn't want to put my money there until the goverment gets their act together. Quote:
Manufacturing is highly based on demand, and probably the largest sector of employment in any economy. Not only just that, the industrial production for the past 15 years has been declining even as Greece adopted the Euro in 2000. The attitude, if judging by data, is that the Greek government or people simply has little or no intention of growing their economy through manufacturing, despite the GDP expansion between '06 to '10. Top heavy economies like these are risky as service is easier to provide than actual blue-collar, due to the illiquidity (and in certain places, the legal roadblocks) of capital investment forcing businesses to stay put and not move overseas. It is a basic building block of any economy. And currently the low minimum wage is putting a chokehold on domestic demand, which means that there isn't much of an incentive or market to set up a business there. It is up to the Greek government right now to decide what it wants to make as a mainstay export; I'd say plastic/rubber powder for 3D printers for the Eurozone area is a good way to start. * - The above analysis is subjected to limitations caused by McNamara's Fallacy and 20/20. Please do not shoot me.
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2015-01-28, 14:13 | Link #35595 | |
Not Enough Sleep
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 48
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2015-01-28, 14:30 | Link #35596 | |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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Markets in Greece are tanking. The Bank of Greece has lost 50% of its value, the rest of the banks over 30%. Greek bond yields has jumped to over 10%. This is pretty amazing stuff, I'm awed. What Tsipras is achieving with his policy of pissing in each European leaders' faces as quickly and massively as possible is that the other EU states will have less and less wiggle room to let him save face when they will reject Tsipras' demanded haircut. Because by then the blackmail attempt has been so blatant that they CANNOT go along with it even if they wanted, without being voted out of office at home. I seriously wonder how many Syriza voters will wake up in 1-2 months and wonder if this is really what they voted for. |
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2015-01-28, 15:04 | Link #35597 | |
(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2006
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This is the difference between the science of economics, where you study data and plot logical theories based on hypothesis, and the pseudo science of economics, where people spout off opinions as if they know what the hell they're talking about because they have street cred. Sure, he's a nobel prize winning guy, so he deserves some mention in the headlines, right? But that also means he should be held under even more scrutiny than someone like me. Instead, people are buying into the bull him and others like him preach because his credentials "make him smart". This is what I meant by economics being defined by politics. All of the actual scientific work means nothing when the platform is given to people who can be so influential by saying so little. It doesn't help the average person understand economics at all, and it does more harm than good because it's just so easy to manipulate those sound bites to support anything you want. I'm not trying to hate on the guy, and I'm sure he's got plenty of charts to show his associates and think tank friends, but it's not difficult to understand that anyone talking about investing in a nation with an increasingly unstable future either has an agenda or is full of shit. If his advice is that good, then everyone should be racing to dump money into Greece, or he's telling certain people to invest for the quick buck and pull out before they get burned. There's no long term investments to be made in Greece if you're looking to generate short term profits. Not unless you're good at manipulating the outcome in your favor.
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2015-01-28, 16:18 | Link #35598 | ||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Speaking of investing in Greece - does someone know how one goes about investing in organized crime? Because if it really all breaks down... |
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2015-01-28, 16:33 | Link #35599 | |
AS Oji-kun
Join Date: Nov 2006
Age: 74
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His advice isn't directed at you, an ordinary investor, but at professionals trying to decide where to invest in equity markets. Perhaps his models indicate Greek assets are undervalued right now, which isn't all that implausible to me. I don't have the capital or the risk-acceptance to act on that notion, but others can. I tire of hearing broadbrush rejections of economics based on ideological debates about macro policies. Microeconomics is based on an impressive mathematical structure that can predict behavior in many market situations. Macroeconomics, the kind of thing that dominates discussion in the public media, is much more contentious and has a weaker theoretical basis. Humans have formed and used markets for millennia. We have only tried managing complex mixed economies with fiscal, monetary, and regulatory policies since the War using theories that largely date back only to Keynes.
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Last edited by SeijiSensei; 2015-01-28 at 16:43. |
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2015-01-28, 17:52 | Link #35600 | |
Banned
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hamburg
Age: 54
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I have 2 Greek friends that I regularly discuss with. One of them was a Syriza sympathizer, and he told me that he feels very queasy, also based on what he heard from his relatives who are still in Greece. The other one emigrated to Germany to run an (excellent) restaurant, and he always lamented that he offered a dozen of his jobless relatives in Greece a decent job over here, and he was regularly denied. "Disability rent" and well-operating "black jobs" provided almost as much. He said that he is heartbroken, because he is sure that Syriza voters will flip out when they realize that they're suckered AGAIN, which he is sure will happen. |
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current affairs, discussion, international |
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