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GDB · 2012-06-24, 08:48

I think he can restore them just by using mana, same way as how he "retrieves" them after firing. However, his pride and ego wouldn't allow him to restore the ones he fired at Caster.

Ragna92 · 2012-06-24, 12:24

Spoiler for Kiritsugu time stop:

chaos_alfa · 2012-06-24, 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ragna92

Spoiler for Kiritsugu time stop:

Kiritsugu never used Time Alter on Gil in the light novel and if he did it would work.
Time Alter doesn't really stop time, it just creates a Reality Marble inside Kiristugu's body which increase or decreases his body functions. This makes it look like to him as if time has stopped.

Morisato · 2012-06-24, 16:40

So how was Saber killed/defeated at the last episode? Didn't really get that. Kiritsugu ordered her to excalibur the grail and all of a sudden she's sent back to her time prison...

mAc Chaos · 2012-06-24, 16:44

She used up all of her mana to fire Excalibur, and disappeared. No mana ~> no Servant. Went over her limits.

Haak · 2012-06-24, 16:44

Both the Great Grail and a master hold on to a servant. Once she destroyed the grail, there was nothing to for her to hold on to keep herself in that timeline. Kiritsugu's mana alone isn't enough.

DragoZERO · 2012-06-24, 16:49

The Grail is what makes it possible to summon the Servant so, no Grail = no Servants.

Vicious108 · 2012-06-24, 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haak

Both the Great Grail and a master hold on to a servant. Once she destroyed the grail, there was nothing to for her to hold on to keep herself in that timeline. Kiritsugu's mana alone isn't enough.

Then why didn't Gilgamesh instantly disappear as well?

I believe Kiritsugu's mana alone would have been enough (temporarily), he just stopped providing her with any after using up all of the Command Spells. And then making her fire Excalibur in that essentially Master-less state finished the job.

At least that's how I saw it, but it's probably explicitly explained in the novel.

GDB · 2012-06-24, 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endless Twilight

Then why didn't Gilgamesh instantly disappear as well?

Independent Action Skill.

mAc Chaos · 2012-06-24, 16:54

He could have kept giving her mana but he didn't care. The Grail was destroyed, the job was done.

Haak · 2012-06-24, 16:55

Gilgamesh got mud immortality and has an A+ in Independant Action so he's fine.

Vicious108 · 2012-06-24, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haak

Gilgamesh got mud immortality and has an A+ in Independant Action so he's fine.

There were still a few seconds between Saber destroying the lesser Grail and Gil being bathed in the mud, so that wasn't it.

But yeah, forgot about Independent Action.

Haak · 2012-06-24, 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endless Twilight

There were still a few seconds between Saber destroying the lesser Grail and Gil being bathed in the mud, so that wasn't it.

Why not? Saber had more than a few seconds to say goodbye to Shirou when she destroyed the grail in Fate.

DragoZERO · 2012-06-24, 17:07

I think they just didn't show her leave due to time constraints.

whatbob1 · 2012-06-24, 17:08

From the LN, the 2 command spells forced her to use up all her mana. She couldn't even maintain her physical form in the world anymore.

Spoiler for Lines from the LN:

Vicious108 · 2012-06-24, 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haak

Why not? Saber had more than a few seconds to say goodbye to Shirou when she destroyed the grail in Fate.

The point is that Gil's mud immortality had nothing to do with him not disappearing after the lesser Grail was destroyed, because he only became like that after being bathed in the mud.

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatbob1

From the LN, the 2 command spells forced her to use up all her mana. She couldn't even maintain her physical form in the world anymore.

Spoiler for Lines from the LN:

As I thought, Kiritsugu could have made her stay if he really wanted to. But of course he wouldn't. Being Kiritsugu is bullying Saber.

mAc Chaos · 2012-06-25, 00:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrya

Someone brought a question to me, and I realized I didn't know the answer to it, so I'll ask you guys.

Spoiler for Fate/Stay Night anime spoilers?:

It's because there's two parts to the Grail. The vessel, which is basically the key, and the Grail energy itself.

In F/Z they shot the key, which left the "door" to the Grail mud open, letting stuff spill out. In FSN they removed the vessel, which stopped the flow, and then blew up the mud. In other words, instead of destroying the cup, they should have shot at the big black hole.

Kimidori · 2012-06-25, 00:38

why didn't Archer use UBW to fight Berserker from the start instead of when it's already too late? would he win if he used UBW from the start?

d-one · 2012-06-25, 00:47

The game itself never mention how Archer fight Berserker in Fate route. Only the anime ver. show him use UBW. Fighting Berserker with full strength itself is really hard so I don't think he can really defeat him (in HF, Shirou defeat a weaker Berserker and even with that, without Illya stopping Berserker in the end, Shirou will never win)

mAc Chaos · 2012-06-25, 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimidori

why didn't Archer use UBW to fight Berserker from the start instead of when it's already too late? would he win if he used UBW from the start?

Well, at the very least he needs time to build up the chant.

And it looks like he would've lost either way, so he was probably just trying to stall so the others could get as far as possible.

I think he was still hurt from Saber slashing him in the beginning too.

2012-06-24, 12:24	Link #3682
Ragna92 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011	Spoiler for Kiritsugu time stop: I heard that Kiritsugu uses time stop in Fate/Zero but it doesn't work on Gil. It didn't happen in the Fate/Zero anime. So can anyone tell me if that really did happen, and when it happened?

2012-06-24, 16:44	Link #3686
Haak Me, An Intellectual Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: UK Age: 33	Both the Great Grail and a master hold on to a servant. Once she destroyed the grail, there was nothing to for her to hold on to keep herself in that timeline. Kiritsugu's mana alone isn't enough. __________________ MAL \| AnimeSuki Choice Awards 2020 Winners

2012-06-24, 16:49	Link #3687
DragoZERO Spoilaphobic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: USA Age: 38	The Grail is what makes it possible to summon the Servant so, no Grail = no Servants. __________________ • Anime List \| Manga List \| Manga Thread Template •

2012-06-24, 16:55	Link #3691
Haak Me, An Intellectual Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: UK Age: 33	Gilgamesh got mud immortality and has an A+ in Independant Action so he's fine. __________________ MAL \| AnimeSuki Choice Awards 2020 Winners

2012-06-24, 17:07	Link #3694
DragoZERO Spoilaphobic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: USA Age: 38	I think they just didn't show her leave due to time constraints. __________________ • Anime List \| Manga List \| Manga Thread Template •

2012-06-24, 08:48	Link #3681
GDB Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Age: 38	I think he can restore them just by using mana, same way as how he "retrieves" them after firing. However, his pride and ego wouldn't allow him to restore the ones he fired at Caster.

2012-06-24, 16:40	Link #3684
Morisato Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	So how was Saber killed/defeated at the last episode? Didn't really get that. Kiritsugu ordered her to excalibur the grail and all of a sudden she's sent back to her time prison...

2012-06-24, 16:44	Link #3685
mAc Chaos King of Heroes Join Date: Feb 2009 Age: 38	She used up all of her mana to fire Excalibur, and disappeared. No mana ~> no Servant. Went over her limits.

2012-06-24, 16:54	Link #3690
mAc Chaos King of Heroes Join Date: Feb 2009 Age: 38	He could have kept giving her mana but he didn't care. The Grail was destroyed, the job was done.

2012-06-24, 17:08	Link #3695
whatbob1 huh Join Date: Mar 2011	From the LN, the 2 command spells forced her to use up all her mana. She couldn't even maintain her physical form in the world anymore. Spoiler for Lines from the LN: "In truth, she never did open her eyes again. The Noble Phantasm, that had been forcibly executed in opposition to her own intentions, had already consumed all Saber’s remaining prana; she could not even maintain her physical Servant form any more. Saber had lost the strength and the will to remain in this world. Of course, this was also because her Master, who was also part of the contract, did not intend to let her stay."

2012-06-25, 00:38	Link #3698
Kimidori The Opened Ultimate Gate Join Date: Dec 2011 Age: 30	why didn't Archer use UBW to fight Berserker from the start instead of when it's already too late? would he win if he used UBW from the start? __________________

2012-06-25, 00:47	Link #3699
d-one Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007	The game itself never mention how Archer fight Berserker in Fate route. Only the anime ver. show him use UBW. Fighting Berserker with full strength itself is really hard so I don't think he can really defeat him (in HF, Shirou defeat a weaker Berserker and even with that, without Illya stopping Berserker in the end, Shirou will never win)