Persona 4 The Ultimate in Mayonaka Arena

[Soji]

SilverSyko@ Some of them remind me the one that you find in Blazeblue . No wonder knowing that they help in this....still .

[Kirito]

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

Just a list of the game's trophies/achievements for those curious:

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/g.../achievements/

Looks like you can't farm them in VS with a second controller. Not to mention some of these look incredibly difficult.

Challenge accepted!

Some of them are going to be difficult but they look fun and rewarding to do. I like the conditions behind unlocking them.

[hyl]

Those achievements look pretty easy if you play arcade mode or online alot. The majority of those are simiar to blazblue's and some of blazblue's achievements were alot harder.

[Kirito]

That's my plan!

Just like Blazblue I'm going to play the living daylights out of this game both online and offline.

[FlareKnight]

While I may not worry too much about achievements it should still be fun to see which I'll pick up along the way. Regardless, even though I'm not big on fighting games will have to check this out. Might be easier to get into them with a cast I'm already so familiar with.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

While I may not worry too much about achievements it should still be fun to see which I'll pick up along the way. Regardless, even though I'm not big on fighting games will have to check this out. Might be easier to get into them with a cast I'm already so familiar with.

The game is alot more input friendly when it comes to combo's and some other movies with easy inputs (like the guard cancel attacks (character specific reversal moves)and the all out attacks are just 2 button combinations) compared to Arkys' other fighting games because most likely this game targets both the regular fighting game players as well as the fans of the persona series (who normally play rpg's).

[Kirito]

Originally Posted by hyl

The game is alot more input friendly when it comes to combo's and some other movies with easy inputs (like the guard cancel attacks (character specific reversal moves)and the all out attacks are just 2 button combinations) compared to Arkys' other fighting games because most likely this game targets both the regular fighting game players as well as the fans of the persona series (who normally play rpg's).

Aksys System Works tend to do that to a lot of their games so that people who are new to the genre can come in comfortably and learn how to play something not to simple but not to difficult. Since it's an easy input game with different characters and unique game only engine, it'll be simpler for people to just jump on and play at a casual level.

[SilverSyko]

Originally Posted by hyl

The majority of those are simiar to blazblue's and some of blazblue's achievements were alot harder.

Nope. Most of BlazBlue's trophies were obtainable by just setting up a preferred situation in VS mode with an idle second character and then doing the inputs correctly or multiple times. It doesn't look like you can do that here.

And BlazBlue didn't have that "beat Score Attack with every character" trophy either. I can barely beat it with a single character using cheap tactics, so if you ask me, that one is just downright cruel.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Kirito

Aksys System Works tend to do that to a lot of their games so that people who are new to the genre can come in comfortably and learn how to play something not to simple but not to difficult. Since it's an easy input game with different characters and unique game only engine, it'll be simpler for people to just jump on and play at a casual level.

I disagree that Arksys was already being beginner's friendly. While blazblue is simplier than guilty gear was, it is still way too technical for beginners. Things like frame advantage/disadvantage on normals/specials on block or whiff , more variation on blocking by also having barrier and instant guarding, most regular attacks being air unblockable (to prevent easy "chicken blocking"), increased hitstun on counterhit and fatal counter hits (thus enabling otherwise not possible combo's), lot's of different meters that are character specific (rachel having wind gauches, tager and lambda having a gauge that enables them to use one specific move, valkenheyn, relius and carl having a unique meter that drains upon usage of some of their attacks etc. ) , teching throws, certain moves having an a specific type of invulnerabilty, attacks with guardpoints etc.
Persona 4 arena still retains some elements of both blazblue and guilty gear but in a more simplified form.

[Kirito]

Originally Posted by hyl

I disagree that Arksys was already being beginner's friendly. While blazblue is simplier than guilty gear was, it is still way too technical for beginners. Things like frame advantage/disadvantage on normals/specials on block or whiff , more variation on blocking by also having barrier and instant guarding, most regular attacks being air unblockable (to prevent easy "chicken blocking"), increased hitstun on counterhit and fatal counter hits (thus enabling otherwise not possible combo's), lot's of different meters that are character specific (rachel having wind gauches, tager and lambda having a gauge that enables them to use one specific move, valkenheyn, relius and carl having a unique meter that drains upon usage of some of their attacks etc. ) , teching throws, certain moves having an a specific type of invulnerabilty, attacks with guardpoints etc.
Persona 4 arena still retains some elements of both blazblue and guilty gear but in a more simplified form.

I know, but what I was trying to imply is that since the button layouts are simple, people who put in work and time can learn the techical aspect of the games overtime. I play with someone who's casual and didn't know how to play, but after taking the time to learn the simple button layout and technical mechanic he did decent. I understand that Persona 4 will be simplified because I play Blazblue and Guilty Gear and understand and notice the fundamental difference in simplicity and learning curve between the upcoming Persona game and those two already existing fighters.

Persona will be beginner friendly like you said, but will be technical and creative just like Blazblue, Guilty Gear, Arcana Heart etc.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

Nope. Most of BlazBlue's trophies were obtainable by just setting up a preferred situation in VS mode with an idle second character and then doing the inputs correctly or multiple times. It doesn't look like you can do that here.

And BlazBlue didn't have that "beat Score Attack with every character" trophy either. I can barely beat it with a single character using cheap tactics, so if you ask me, that one is just downright cruel.

let's compare it with extend's achievements

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/g.../achievements/

mars mode is pretty hard for people who are not used to blazblue, because you are only fighting the unlimited versions of the characters.
Abyss mode is not that hard for me, but it can be daunting for the average player. Especially with the final few levels having unlimited bosses in it.
Filling the gallery was a real pain, because you needed to get over 300k points to fill roughly 60% of it and the rest was unlocked by doing the whole story and arcade mode for every character.
Some of the character specific achievements are not that easy, unless you know how to play that character very well like for example for Mu, you had to place 4 steins in a single combo (which can only be done using an optimal fatal corner combo)

[SilverSyko]

Originally Posted by hyl

mars mode is pretty hard for people who are not used to blazblue, because you are only fighting the unlimited versions of the characters.

I'd agree with you if there was a trophy that required you to beat that mode, but there isn't. You only have to attempt the mode 10 times and even then you can just quit after starting and it'll count. Plus, the fight with Taokaka is the first one in the mode.

Abyss mode is not that hard for me, but it can be daunting for the average player. Especially with the final few levels having unlimited bosses in it.

Okay this one I'm not sure about as haven't even tried Abyss mode, but I imagine getting at least the first two of the 3 related to abyss mode aren't too tough. Just like challenge mode.

Filling the gallery was a real pain, because you needed to get over 300k points to fill roughly 60% of it and the rest was unlocked by doing the whole story and arcade mode for every character.

That's not hard. It's just tedious and time-consuming. There's a difference.

Some of the character specific achievements are not that easy, unless you know how to play that character very well like for example for Mu, you had to place 4 steins in a single combo (which can only be done using an optimal fatal corner combo)

Again, you could just set up a fight with an idle 2nd character in VS mode and use it as a dummy to get the achievement/trophy. In P4A's case, it needs to be done in Arcade mode or Online, which means unless you have an online friend who agrees to idle for you, you need to try and achieve it with another player or CPU trying to defeat you.

And btw, Mu's was painfully easy to obtain through an exploit with one of her Unlimited form's exclusive Distortion Drives.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

Okay this one I'm not sure about as haven't even tried Abyss mode, but I imagine getting at least the first two of the 3 related to abyss mode aren't too tough. Just like challenge mode.

Abyss mode is similar to survival mode (you regerate a small % of your health every few battes) but with abilities and stat boosts (which are randomly obtained from fighting a boss every 20 stages). Also level 999 can be pretty long depending on what bonuses and character that you choose.
Also enemeies get's higher stats and some skill as the levels progresses.

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

That's not hard. It's just tedious and time-consuming. There's a difference.

To get most of your points you have to play arcade mode on hell, mars, abyss mode or win online ranked matches. Besides being tedious they can be quite hard. Other options of getting points are very very slow.

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

Again, you could just set up a fight with an idle 2nd character in VS mode and use it to get the achievement/trophy. In P4A's case, it needs to be done in Arcade mode or Online, which means unless you have an online friend who agrees to idle for you, you need to try and achieve it with another player or CPU trying to defeat you.

As if that is supposed to be hard. Most of these things happen in actual matches if you play online anyway. Instant blocking 50 times, some characters have a multi hit attack so if blocked the first hit the rest are easily instant blocked .
20 bursts? Can be done in 7-10 matches unless you are stupid enough not to use them.
10 persona breaks? Fight against characters like shadow labrys, yukiko or elizabeth (or other characters who have very unsafe persona moves) with a rushdown character or a pure zoner like naoto. Easy enough.
As for score attack, the score attack in blazblue was dumbed down to 8 rounds without an unlimited (because they were moved to mars and abyss mode). So if we follow the same tradtion with p4, the score attack should be easy.

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

And btw, Mu's was easily obtainable through an exploit with one of her Unlimited form's exclusive Distortion Drives.

Well how fun trying to get trophies where do need to learn the character like Ragna .

As for p4's trophies, which one do you consider to be hard? None of them seem remotely hard from what i can see.

edit: i was already using the easier achievements from the more recent extend as an example. CS1/2 had much harder achievements
http://www.xbox360achievements.org/g.../achievements/

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by hyl

The game is alot more input friendly when it comes to combo's and some other movies with easy inputs (like the guard cancel attacks (character specific reversal moves)and the all out attacks are just 2 button combinations) compared to Arkys' other fighting games because most likely this game targets both the regular fighting game players as well as the fans of the persona series (who normally play rpg's).

Good to hear that it'll be more input friendly in that respect. Have to say looking forward to this game more than I expected. Will be interesting to see which characters I end up being better with.

[Frailty]

Originally Posted by SilverSyko

Nope. Most of BlazBlue's trophies were obtainable by just setting up a preferred situation in VS mode with an idle second character and then doing the inputs correctly or multiple times. It doesn't look like you can do that here.

And BlazBlue didn't have that "beat Score Attack with every character" trophy either. I can barely beat it with a single character using cheap tactics, so if you ask me, that one is just downright cruel.

Score Attack on the PSP and PSVita are easier compared to the console versions.
maybe they've toned down the difficulty here

[Kirito]

Originally Posted by Frailty

Score Attack on the PSP and PSVita are easier compared to the console versions.
maybe they've toned down the difficulty here

With handhelds being more convenient for on the road, I guess it's to make it more easier, fluent, and more enjoyable. Which sucks because it takes away the challenge aspect of the game in general.

[Frailty]

well, if they wanted challenge they could've just played the console versions

I don't know much about the AI's of the handhelds, but you could exploit some commands the AI's do when you do a certain move. If you know them, do a move that would make them whiff a move then punish.

[Kirito]

This is a day old but I have to share this. Pre-order Persona 4 Arena and you'll get the original soundtrack. Looks like I'm going to have to change my pre-order! I hope down the line we get illustrations or figurines to go with it.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/pres...-north-america

[Kirito]

Originally Posted by Frailty

well, if they wanted challenge they could've just played the console versions

I don't know much about the AI's of the handhelds, but you could exploit some commands the AI's do when you do a certain move. If you know them, do a move that would make them whiff a move then punish.

I guess it's to make it easier for those who can't play on consoles often. The consoles have a bit more "spice" compared to handheld due to graphics, content, and space. Handheld have them but can't really do justice compared to consoles because a majority of people play on them.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Frailty

Score Attack on the PSP and PSVita are easier compared to the console versions.
maybe they've toned down the difficulty here

It was dumbed down on any console or handheld in Extend (i am not sure if it was already made easier since cs2 that also came out on the 3ds and the psp though).