Romance in Macross

[ani_d]

The SherylxGalaxy scenario is a what-if and a very credible ending for Sheryl. Who said that once Sheryl goes back to Galaxy to support the people she wouldn't find a new love? Anything goes by then. It doesn't have to be Alto. Here we are again imagining another negative emotional condition for her. Are we really fans of her?

Originally Posted by crisis

I understand that the Sheryl support may be overwhelming here, and before, like I said, you're pretty awesome for holding the Ranka fort by yourself, but I do have to admit hun, you put too much emphasis on Ranka and too little on Sheryl.

This is the only bias I'm definitely aware of. I talk too much of Ranka than Sheryl. But you know, I do give credit to Sheryl when it's needed and right now, the story clearly doesn't show Sheryl as the one who wants Alto the most. It's us that's concluding that Sheryl will fall into an emo heap if she doesn't end up with Alto.

I'm aware Ranka has her family friends with her supporting her and all that plus having Alto is an overkill, but the show doesn't even point to Sheryl feeling alienated or anything like that with her current status. There are no hints. What the show is pointing at is Ranka realizing her feelings for Alto and feeling alienated by him. Why is this? Because Ranka takes up most of the focus, thus her side is heard more.

The way Sheryl gets defended in this forum, it's like the story is making Sheryl look like the underdog and Ranka is not. Episode 11 clearly made Ranka to look like the likable character here. Despite our opinions on Sheryl deserving Alto more, the current story thinks otherwise.

[justinstrife]

Originally Posted by crisis

You have a long, long way to go sweetie...

Ouch. I've been burned bad.

[Wesley84]

Originally Posted by ani_d

The SherylxGalaxy scenario is a what-if and a very credible ending for Sheryl. Who said that once Sheryl goes back to Galaxy to support the people she wouldn't find a new love? Here we are again imagining another negative emotional condition for her. Are we really fans of her?

Kill Klan and give her Michael. That'd make me happy.

This is the only bias I'm definitely aware of. I talk too much of Ranka than Sheryl. But you know, I do give credit to Sheryl when it's needed and right now, the story clearly doesn't show Sheryl as the one who wants Alto the most. It's us that's concluding that Sheryl will fall into an emo heap if she doesn't end up with Alto.

At this point, I find it hard to imagine Ranka in an emo-heap. She usually takes disappointment in stride, and she's frequently been disappointed. I know I'm not the only one waiting for her to just SNAP from bottling it all up inside.

I'm aware Ranka has her family friends with her supporting her and all that plus having Alto is an overkill, but the show doesn't even point to Sheryl feeling alienated or anything like that with her current status. There are no hints. What the show is pointing at is Ranka realizing her feelings for Alto and feeling alienated by him. Why is this? Because Ranka takes up most of the focus, thus her side is heard more.

Unless we're being spoon-fed Sheryl, the story revolves around Ranka.

The way Sheryl gets defended in this forum, it's like the story is making Sheryl look like the underdog and Ranka is not. Episode 11 clearly made Ranka to look like the likable character here. Despite our opinions on Sheryl deserving Alto more, the current story thinks otherwise.

It didn't make Sheryl unlikeable either. She just seems kind of...there, and does things that foils Ranka without Sheryl actually noticing. One should probably compare Sheryl's TV special canceling Ranka's TV debut to Sheryl's birthday present being picked over Ranka's. Same thing really.

Ranka just isn't really on the radar as a person Sheryl cares to relate to.

[stray]

Originally Posted by ani_d

I guess I'm just wasting time typing here then since noone is taking me seriously. I'm in Sheryl nation. However, the point still stands: The story puts more emphasis on Ranka's character development more than Sheryl's---be it the plot or her feelings for Alto. I'm not the only person who can see this, so I just wish Sheryl people will stop labeling other people as delusional for stating this little fact. Delusion doesn't rely on facts, clinging to Kawamori history to debunk the story IS. If the story is on Ranka's side, then clearly, that character has an advantage. We all should know that, but somehow, it gets ignored and we get all these ridiculous excuses to cheapen her worthiness of Alto.

For the record, Kawamori-san was only the mecha designer for SDFM. DYRL onwards is all him though, albeit with alot of talent mixed in along the way (Watanabe-san, etc.). This series could end the same as before, or... completely different.

Otherwise... This thread is awesome! But... I give up on Sheryl. It's all about Alto + Cathy Glass. Cougary goodness and 2 triangles all f'ed up at the same time.

[cheesie]

Ouch. I've been burned bad.

Originally Posted by ani_d

The SherylxGalaxy scenario is a what-if and a very credible ending for Sheryl.

I don't share that view at all.

Who said that once Sheryl goes back to Galaxy to support the people she wouldn't find a new love? Anything goes by then. It doesn't have to be Alto. Here we are again imagining another negative emotional condition for her. Are we really fans of her?

I'd advise you not to use this approach in the future, as immediately upon first glance, everything you've said up there can be returned right back at you.

I'll be back later to reply if you still want me, as I have my own love triangle to sort out: Me, my boyfriend, and his damn Wii.

[ani_d]

Thank you for giving me a good reply, herbert.

Originally Posted by herbert

Moreover, you have never said a single word about what Sheryl would end up like. It adds more fuel to the fire. This is where you go wrong and why people call you delusional.

lol point taken. As I've stated, I've always seen Sheryl as someone who will most likely go back to Galaxy once it's found together with the rest of the survivors. More explanations on my previous posts.

Originally Posted by herbert

To be fair, your argument makes sense if we only look at your argument; however, in a larger picture, where do you put Sheryl? Is she just a spice added into Ranka's love story? Is she only a stepping stone for Ranka to reach her success? Doesn't matter how much screentime, focus, and whatever has given to Ranka, Sheryl is still one of the heroines of the show.

Personally, I do see Sheryl as a spice added into Ranka's love story, but I never said that's all Sheryl is good for lol Again and again, I never said she's insignificant. There's a lot more to her past, like her earrings, and the fact that Grace is with her. How did they meet? etc... It also helps that Sheryl's influence extends across the universe. The one thing we know for sure about her own issues is that Galaxy is an important place to her. I think the biggest curiosity I have about her plotwise is her mother though and how she got that crystal. Sheryl's not just a decoration or the future Saotome bride just because Ranka is more important to the plot. She will obviously develop feeligns for Alto, but I just want to point out again, it's not going to destroy her if Alto doesn't end up with her. She does have her own mission. Find Galaxy.

Originally Posted by herbert

Sheryl is after same things but the difference is that she is already at peak of career so best she can do is just to maintain it. If Sheryl can't get more from career, she should get love, let Ranka gets career. I don't like his way of argueing because it sounds too much like speaking from a point of view of gods. But I must admit his is better than yours. He addresses places for both heroines; you only care about what Ranka does and what Ranka gets.

With everyone here targeting Ranka, Sheryl doesn't need any more advocate, though I'm kind of grateful that you're pressing me to squeeze my take on Sheryl's character further.

Originally Posted by herbert

And there is another blind point in your argument: why must Ranka have Alto? The male protagonist of the show? A convenient tool to confirm Ranka's status as #1 heroine? Of course you don't think in this way, do you? Then because Ranka loves him? It's the answer to why Ranka must want Alto, to not why must have. I don't see why it must be against all setup for Ranka gives up on Alto.

If I answer why Ranka needs to have Alto then it's gonna be nothing more but an opinion coming from me. That's why I'll based it on the story's narration. If you watch episode 11 and the previous episodes, the one who always gets hurt with the thought of Alto slipping away is Ranka not Sheryl. Ranka is the one who is shown to want Alto the most. This is all because in most SherylxAlto moments, Ranka's either there or clearly knows about it. How about RankaxAlto? How many times was Sheryl present whenever these two have their moment? Please just correct me if I'm wrong, but I couldn't remember any instances. RankaxAlto moments are theirs alone. It's the story that's been pushing Alto and Ranka more than it does with Sheryl and Alto, regardless of the question 'why Ranka needs to have him'. The story is just on Ranka's side, basically.

Originally Posted by herbert

Let me tell you why I think it's consistant to Ranka's growth that she gives up on Alto. If Alto is considered as a symbol of low self-esteem of old Ranka (a girl needs help and push from outside to be able to pursue her dreams), growing out of this crush can be viewed as the birth of new Ranka (a real independent and strong girl). Surely I mean it's Alto to choose a other girl

I think you can only see Alto's influence on Ranka as either positive or negative. I see Alto's influence on Ranka as something positive seeing as she shines the brightest when it comes to Alto. I haven't seen any instances where Ranka's feelings for Alto was portrayed to be bad for her. If anything, her feelings for Alto pushes herself forward like in episode 4,5,10, 11. He's more of her strength than a symbol of Ranka's weakness.

Originally Posted by herbert

It's not far-fetching to call your scenario delusional in my opinion. If you turn your head away and focus solely on Ranka, you are just as biased as I'm, if not more.

I guess this makes me a Super duper uber Ranka biased fan now? lol

*edit

Originally Posted by crisis

I'd advise you not to use this approach in the future, as immediately upon first glance, everything you've said up there can be returned right back at you.

Well, a Ranka ending realizing that Nanase and co. are there for her plus the baby vajra is basically what we're seeing right now. Ranka seems to conclude it's over for her in this episode. Are we going to have a repeat of this scene later on too? Episode 11 seems like a perfect ending scene for Ranka once AltoxSheryl happens in episode 25 in my opinion lol To think that this is just episode 11, it's definitely not going to be like this when we get to the end. Unless they kill off Ranka, then maybe SherylxGalaxy+ Alto ending would finally show up on my radar.

Originally Posted by Wesley84

It didn't make Sheryl unlikeable either. She just seems kind of...there, and does things that foils Ranka without Sheryl actually noticing. One should probably compare Sheryl's TV special canceling Ranka's TV debut to Sheryl's birthday present being picked over Ranka's. Same thing really.

I never said they bastardized Sheryl's character here (or did they lol). This is just another one of those episodes where Sheryl indirectly steps on Ranka's toes without her awareness. It's just that, this time, her intentions looked ambiguous.

Originally Posted by Wesley84

At this point, I find it hard to imagine Ranka in an emo-heap. She usually takes disappointment in stride, and she's frequently been disappointed. I know I'm not the only one waiting for her to just SNAP from bottling it all up inside.

I thought for sure Ranka will cry in episode 11, but instead, she was very positive. Besides, no girl here is going to be an emo-heap just because she didn't end up with Alto.

[justinstrife]

your ending for Sheryl is very depressing ani_d. I really hope the writers aren't going to go your route.

as if I really didn't feel bad enough for Sheryl in the end of 6 when she told Alto how alone she was on Galaxy... For her to go back to that life alone. Ugh.

[ickem]

Latest Sheryl blog entries.

2008-06-18

Title: ...I was tricked.

My sense of direction is perfect.

When I was on Galaxy, I was as good as any guy.

You know the saying, right?
Women don't look at maps. (Interesting since it's the guys that this is quality is attributed to here in the US. Well that and not asking for directions.)

Anyway, who was it that first said this?!
Isn't it just that the girls around them coincidentally did not look at maps?

That's right, one time a TV producer gave me a ride home in his DA-CHAM after work, that was the worse.

Since his nonstop talking was annoying I was a little spiteful as the navigator so we got completely lost.

The reason for that was because we didn't make the U-turn.
I really wanted to show him.
But it was game over.
I got off right there.

Really, I was better off not remembering that.

So, when I came to Frontier I've gotten lost so many times.
The great Sheryl Nome has!
This is a lifetime first!
"No uncertainty! Doing anything I am able to!"
For me, whose motto is this to have this happen!
Why I couldn't recognize any of the roads no matter what.
This was a shock. Quite.

Then I found out...
...in order not to make tourists on Frontier bored,
it seems that the townscape changes periodically!!!?

No wonder that, even though I travel the same street over and over, houses and shops that I had never seen kept appearing...I was dumbfounded.

Really...
...you tricked me, Frontier!!

Just kidding. It's quite wonderful, Frontier.

A very stimulating [entertainer]. (I think it's entertainer, but not sure since it's "tentaateinaa" in katakana. I assume that someone typed ten instead of en by mistake. Damn katakana...)

I'm quite taken with it.

Sheryl


April 2, 2059

Title: Kiss...like... (Kiss is like spelled backwards in Japanese)

"Like" and "kiss,"
I wonder why they are inversely linked?

I suddenly thought this.

Can it be that something that makes us think, "How boring!!!!" can also make us feel wonderful??

I tried it out.

picture caption: This is the "jerig" that I was fond of last year. (no idea what jerig is, if anyone has any clue, please let me know)

Sheryl

July 15, 2059


2008-06-22

Title: School is.

It's just as interesting as I thought it would be!!

School is really interesting, right!?

I am especially taken with the rooftop.

Well, I have memories of diving, but

I can understand why people have the desire to pick things up when seeing them from overhead.

Seeing students going to and from school, thoughts such as "those two are going out" or "they have worries" come to me quite since I can understand the situation quickly.

Is this what they call people watching?

It has never been an interest of mine, but the label

[Hobby: People watching]

might not be so bad.

Sheryl
May 25, 2059

[Tak]

Wow ani_d, it sounds like you prefer the idea of having Sheryl eat sh*t and die would be the best course of action. How sad, how sad.

Sheryl, as it is obviously clear by now, put up a front in front of everyone. In reality, she has major weaknesses only to be barely compensated by her pride. Thus her gradual openness to Alto became a focal point in Frontier, and a very welcoming development for her character.

It'd be dreadfully sad if the writers went by your proposal and to have Sheryl end up lonely by herself in the galaxy at the end of the show.

- Tak

[Wesley84]

Originally Posted by Tak

Wow ani_d, it sounds like you prefer the idea of having Sheryl eat sh*t and die would be the best course of action. How sad, how sad.

Don't know about ani, but that sounds good to me.

Sheryl, as it is obviously clear by now, put up a front in front of everyone. In reality, she has major weaknesses only to be barely compensated by her pride. Thus her gradual openness to Alto became a focal point in Frontier, and a very welcoming development for her character.

Gradual? She was practically sleeping with the guy after their second meeting. Or was it the third?

And I don't know about weaknesses or supposed insecurities. Mostly she just ignores people unless she wants to belittle them in some way. Alto's simply the exception for whatever stupid reason someone can come up with, and it's hard to say if he's actually better off.

It'd be dreadfully sad if the writers went by your proposal and to have Sheryl end up lonely by herself in the galaxy at the end of the show.

- Tak

What's really sad is the treatment she's recieved throughout most of the series, never mind the outcome. I'd rather they simply make her a horrible bitch than the rather boring and predictable loner she's become.

[stray]

Originally Posted by Wesley84

And I don't know about weaknesses or supposed insecurities. Mostly she just ignores people unless she wants to belittle them in some way. Alto's simply the exception for whatever stupid reason someone can come up with, and it's hard to say if he's actually better off.

You must be a big hit at parties.

What's really sad is the treatment she's recieved throughout most of the series, never mind the outcome. I'd rather they simply make her a horrible bitch than the rather boring and predictable loner she's become.

Are you talking about Ranka or Sheryl?

Sheryl is far from perfect; but she is a badass character. You're selling her (and the show really) short if you're only looking that deep. Of course, if in fact it's going to be a Sheryl ending both her and Alto are going to have to figure out how to open up. Or substitute sex.

I will give you one thing tho... If we were talking about Alto's perspective, you'd be dead on right. Pre-birthday present, anyway.

[TwilightHack]

Seems like there's a lot of extremists on the board.

Thats no fun.

Anyways from what we know about the upcoming episodes, they're going to be focusing more on Ranka for now. With this development, I expect the Love Triangle to be going full blow soon. Honestly, later we'll see the story shift back to Sheryl or have it balance out a little.

It's still to early to make real assumptions... but I'm a bit of an Alto x Sheryl fan myself. That being said I don't mind Ranka if Sheryl's given a decent ending. Same feeling goes towards Sheryl in my book... after all, I like Ranka as well.

[Westlo]

Wow Ani_d, your latest posts have hurt your stance far more than I or any Sheryl fan ever could. Your good losers ending for Sheryl is her going back to Galaxy by herself to rebuild it with its citizens? lmfao... if that's the best you could come up with you should know Ranka is screwed since Frontier's most popular character isn't getting a crappy ending like that.

Are we really fans of her?

Why did you include we as in yourself when you're so one sided to Ranka you make me and herbert look neutral? I know your ship isn't near full capacity but that's no reason to act more biased and fanatical than 5 Sheryl fanatics combined.

This is the only bias I'm definitely aware of. I talk too much of Ranka than Sheryl. But you know, I do give credit to Sheryl when it's needed and right now, the story clearly doesn't show Sheryl as the one who wants Alto the most

That's because they are setting it up to be like that later and I am honestly amazed you can't see that. It astounds me that you're being played like a complete sucker and can't even notice what's going on right under your nose, I thought you were better than this. Your precious episode 13 is the beginning and the end for Ranka, I hope you can keep your fangirl delusions under control to notice everything else that happens.

You're like the wrestling mark who goes "Oh yes (insert face challenger) pinned (heel champion) in a tag match on the last raw before the ppv, now he's going to win!!" while the smark (sup, me lol) just rolls his eyes because he knows the heel is going to win after that.

I'm too dumbfounded by most of what you typed to reply to it and the other stuff would just be a pointless waste of time to address, Kawamori himself could start posting and you would disagree.

Kawamori - Sheryl wins
Ani_d - But it's not consistent mr kawamori and you bastardized Sheryl and ranka and alto talk on their mobile phones all the time it's so cute ^__^

[nanatsusaya]

I'm a new fan of Macross Frontier and I really like AltoxSheryl chemistry >___< It's a refreshing pairing in anime nowadays because it felt so natural and interesting.

About Ranka, IMO she wants Alto most but not the one that cares about him most. She's constantly seeking for comfort and encouragement in him but never actually gives him any support or bothers to find out what he thinks and wants. Even her birthday gift proved it: unlike Sheryl who actually thought for a gift that would suit Alto the most, Ranka went for the most typical gift for a schoolgirl crush - homemade cookies and her concert ticket as a thank for his support. So, who do you think that made more efforts here?

Sorry Ranka, I prefer the more mature type ^^

Furthermore, Ranka already has a brother that cares about her, a (girl)friend that almost worships her and many more friends plus a blossoming career; the girls has almost everything except Alto while Sheryl has likely nothing but her stardom. So, I say that Sheryl needs the guy more than Ranka.

[Westlo]

Originally Posted by nanatsusaya

Furthermore, Ranka already has a brother that cares about her, a (girl)friend that almost worships her and many more friends plus a blossoming career; the girls has almost everything except Alto while Sheryl has likely nothing but her stardom. So, I say that Sheryl needs the guy more than Ranka.

Oh wow common sense! But you're forgetting something buddy.. Sheryl has Grace.. oh wait a sec lol.... why is it so hard for a few people to see where they are going to take this triangle, it's so obvious. What they are doing with Ranka now is so they avoid the "serves you right minmei you bitch" reaction to Ranka later in the series since she will be a sympathetic character and one we admire because she has grown. While Minmei (finally) grew at the end of the series her prior actions still pissed people off too much for that to have much affect on people.

[Eidolon Sniper]

Why can't it be a good ending, Westlo? Accepting a good Sheryl end like that must mean you are a true Sheryl fan, as you can take whatever end Sheryl could end up with, if she wouldn't be paired with Alto. ani_d has showed much more tolerance in that she/he can agree to both a Ranka or a Sheryl ending for Alto, which you seem to negate any kind of proof that there could be a possible Ranka ending, or try to "disprove" that a Ranka end cannot happen, even if tehre are hints and instances that Alto hime could possibly like Ranka more than just being a friend or act like her big brother. Also you seem to forget that Kawamori "discovered" Ranka in episode 10. So that MUST mean she has Kawamori's SEAL of APPROVAL!

[Westlo]

I have stated time and time again that there is a high chance of a Ranka ending, ani_d otoh says she cannot see a Sheryl ending period and thinks there will not be a single Sheryl centric episode from here on out. You tell me who has less tolerance, who's more biased and who's more narrow minded.

Why can't it be a good ending, Westlo? Accepting a good Sheryl end like that must mean you are a true Sheryl fan, as you can take whatever end Sheryl could end up with, if she wouldn't be paired with Alto.

Due to her character, circumstances and situation I can't fathom a good ending for her if she isn't. If you think her going back to Galaxy (and let's not mention that Galaxy should be fucked atm and Sheryl's being used by Galaxy figures but hey let's ignore that for now) is a good ending lol @ you.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by nanatsusaya

I'm a new fan of Macross Frontier and I really like AltoxSheryl chemistry >___< It's a refreshing pairing in anime nowadays because it felt so natural and interesting.

About Ranka, IMO she wants Alto most but not the one that cares about him most. She's constantly seeking for comfort and encouragement in him but never actually gives him any support or bothers to find out what he thinks and wants. Even her birthday gift proved it: unlike Sheryl who actually thought for a gift that would suit Alto the most, Ranka went for the most typical gift for a schoolgirl crush - homemade cookies and her concert ticket as a thank for his support. So, who do you think that made more efforts here?

Ranka, hands down. She had to learn how to bake, and spend hours doing those cookies. Hours she no doubt had to wrestle away from her manager. Sheryl only had a few phone calls to make.

Now, if you were to ask who put the most thought into it, you might have a case. But really, it's not like Ranka had the power to fulfil Alto's wish.

[Eidolon Sniper]

Because based on what the show is showing us so far, there is no hope or there is little chance that it could happen. It had always focused on Ranka and Alto a lot. And the only episodes that we have seen that focused on Sheryl and Alto's romance...as in an episode dedicated to the development of that pairing, we have none. Whenever Sheryl is with Alto, Ranka is always in the background. Or is part of the circumstances that lead into it or something. When it is with Alto and Ranka, there's no Sheryl that led to that situation.

Spoiler:

In the birthday episode, Ranka was again one of Alto's choices alongside Sheryl.

Heck, Alto's resolve to defeating Vajra was also because of Ranka's predicament! If there was an episode that clearly devotes development to the pairing with Ranka out of the episode or out of the picture for that matter, then we have cause for Sheryl end to happen. Sheryl's all over the place, I don't deny that, but being all over the place =/= pairing development, unless Ranka is really out of teh picture.

[Westlo]

Oh god there's now two of them, I knew you wouldn't answer my question too lmao.. You guys are utter idiots for now seeing the possibilities of a Sheryl ending. If you can keep your fangirl squeals down in episode 13 you might finally see some. Are you guys going to cry out Canvas 2 at the end of the series? It gets misused so much why not!?