Valvrave the Liberator - Episode 11 Discussion / Poll

[Folenfant]

Originally Posted by Moeterum

God I hate NTR...

If I understand the definition of NTR the way it is often used on the internet (and we're talking fan term here so it's a bit touchy but I believe it means something like a female character denying a male character access to their preferred relationship) then I really don't see it at all in this episode. Haruto was the one that called Saki up, Saki was the one that told Haruto to go rescue Shoko and the others, Haruto was the one that seemed to take pity on Saki and made the proposal. Saki seems to like Shoko a lot and considers her a friend, but she also seems melancholic about her because she seems to see her as Haruto's proper counterpart/soul mate (a relationship she's never had but saw the chance for in Haruto when they became wing mates) and is the one driving a wedge between herself and others (aside from Haruto up to this episode at least) as much as possible almost like she's trying to punish herself for what she may now see as a huge mistake or at best has resigned herself to what she sees as an inevitability now that she's made her choice and can't go back. I suppose an argument can be made for self NTR if anything, but that's about it.

If I had to guess (cause she's never direct about anything the way most of the cast is) Saki saw the whole vampire thing as a way to start her life over with more control over her own destiny, but as she has come to realize she has arguably less control over matters as she did when she was human seeing what happened to Haruto last episode and hence the "it's a curse not a blessing" line. She seems to have taken on a fatalist perspective now and Haruto being Haruto has noticed and wants to find a way to make her happy. I don't think he's thought through the matter of how Shoko would react yet as this is indeed all happening on a spur of moment basis.

[Winterson]

what if it's the male side. . . what if?

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Folenfant

If I understand the definition of NTR the way it is often used on the internet (and we're talking fan term here so it's a bit touchy but I believe it means something like a female character denying a male character access to their preferred relationship) then I really don't see it at all in this episode. Haruto was the one that called Saki up, Saki was the one that told Haruto to go rescue Shoko and the others, Haruto was the one that seemed to take pity on Saki and made the proposal. Saki seems to like Shoko a lot and considers her a friend, but she also seems melancholic about her because she seems to see her as Haruto's proper counterpart and is the one driving a wedge between herself and others (aside from Haruto) as much as possible almost like she's trying to punish herself or at best has resigned herself to what she sees as an inevitability. I suppose an argument can be made for self NTR if anything, but that's about it.

You're making it more complicated than it is. The definition has become pretty broad over the years. The person you love gets it on with somebody else = NTR. Reasons don't matter. Shoko is getting NTR'd hard at the moment.

[Folenfant]

Originally Posted by Winterson

what if it's the male side. . . what if?

Again I don't see any of the principal cast doing anything of the sort to each other. If anything most of it is restrictions they've placed on themselves or that have been placed on them by third parties. Haruto's whole "I can only bond with other Magius" and Saki's, "I can't let him apologize, I must never have a normal relationship with anyone even if it's the other person like me" kind of cancel each other out yet we'll see what happens next episode.

Usually in NTR situations at least somebody gets to have some satisfaction at the expense of another, but I don't see how anybody is happy or in anything resembling a relationship here. They're all miserable with their current circumstances except maybe the Valvrave OS who judging by her reactions seems to want and is probably even driving Haruto and Saki into forced relationship. A lot of people seem to be forgetting about that factor in all of this and I wonder exactly how it's going to complicate matters in the future because you just know it will.

Originally Posted by Kanon

You're making it more complicated than it is. The definition has become pretty broad over the years. The person you love gets it on with somebody else = NTR. Reasons don't matter. Shoko is getting NTR'd hard at the moment.

Are you sure you aren't the one that's trying to oversimplify the situation though by making it one of trying to prove NTR as opposed to looking at where the cast is in relation to events and each other. I think there's a little more too the current situation than that, but if that's the perspective you want to go with I wish you the best of luck. I know NTR is really important to a lot of people after all, I just think it's sort of a simplistic way of looking at these things. I'm really not a fan of parring situations down to simplified fan terms, it strikes me as pigeonholing of plot threads and character developments in most cases.

[GreyZone]

What is the "long form" of NTR? I would like to know the nominal definition of this plot device at least.

[Triple_R]

Actually, in a way, the romances in this anime have been handled very well.

They've been given truly minimal screentime and yet clearly a lot of people care a lot about them. So Valvrave's writing staff must be doing something right to get people to care so much about what's a side-issue at most.

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Actually, in a way, the romances in this anime have been handled very well.

They've been given truly minimal screentime and yet clearly a lot of people care a lot about them. So Valvrave's writing staff must be doing something right to get people to care so much about what's a side-issue at most.

The thing here is, that the romances actually have the potential for a huge impact on the storyline that would not happen without the romance.

[finalfury]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

The thing here is, that the romances actually have the potential for a huge impact on the storyline that would not happen without the romance.

It helps that Shouko is a really likeable character, who a good majority of the audience and the cast really like. Saki is also a decent character imo, but her personality and her actions may deter people from liking her.

[GreyZone]

Man I hate when people use shortcuts that I don't understand. Well the show itself was no better though... We needed EP11 + PV of EP12 to finally find out the full name of the Mechas known as "VAmpire Link Vessel Rune Activate Vital Engine".

I know the long form and meaning of "YOLO", but that one you could also simply use google for.

But googling for NTR was not as easy, but after I got through the 1000s of "Nothing To Report" definitions I (luckily) found the meaning used here.
An acronym for the Japanease word "Netorare" which some sites translated as "Cuckhold" and the literal meaning according to wikipedia is taken away by sleeping with.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

The thing here is, that the romances actually have the potential for a huge impact on the storyline that would not happen without the romance.

Maybe that's it. Haruto turning into a stonecold killer in Episode 2 due to how he thought Shoko was dead makes it clear how much these characters matter to each other. So the potential for these relationships/romances going explosive is always there, drawing more attention to them.

[GundamZZ]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

I know the long form and meaning of "YOLO", but that one you could also simply use google for.

Because you are the only pure person in this thread...
It seems everyone else learns the abbreviation from some adult anime.

Also, it's not completely writer's fault. According to the writer's interview(sometimes before the airing), his story is based on the director's guideline. So, the story's direction is already decided. Since the Episode 13 was in production, it's less likely to change the script.

[NeutralZero]

Eh? there's a 13th ep?

[shadow1296]

Originally Posted by NeutralZero

Eh? there's a 13th ep?

thats what i was wondering i thought there was only 12

[DevilHighDxD]

I think he refer to season 2 of Valvrave, since ep 12 is the end of season 1.

[Tokkan]

Season 2 Blu-rays/DVDs start at volume 7, so I'd assume that Season 2 would start with "episode 13".

[shadow1296]

so he was talking about the episode 1 of the second season, and here i was hoping for another episode this season

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Man I hate when people use shortcuts that I don't understand. Well the show itself was no better though... We needed EP11 + PV of EP12 to finally find out the full name of the Mechas known as "VAmpire Link Vessel Rune Activate Vital Engine".

I know the long form and meaning of "YOLO", but that one you could also simply use google for.

But googling for NTR was not as easy, but after I got through the 1000s of "Nothing To Report" definitions I (luckily) found the meaning used here.
An acronym for the Japanease word "Netorare" which some sites translated as "Cuckhold" and the literal meaning according to wikipedia is taken away by sleeping with.

Thank you for that. I was really confused as to what everyone was talking about. ^_^;;

[GreyZone]

@GundamZZ: I thought Ad Hominem arguments are below this forum's niveau... Seems I was wrong.


Back2Topic:
I usually avoid "love triangles" and "love polygons" because they are too often too predictable and boring

The love triangle in Valvrave though is so deeply rooted into the plot, that it actually is quite interesting... then there is also the whole "2 are immortal and 1 is not" problem that does not make it easier for Haruto. It seems this show will end either in a very tragic way, or in a "love overcomes all odds" way. For now I think the former may apply more, but we will have to see.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Man I hate when people use shortcuts that I don't understand. Well the show itself was no better though... We needed EP11 + PV of EP12 to finally find out the full name of the Mechas known as "VAmpire Link Vessel Rune Activate Vital Engine".

I know the long form and meaning of "YOLO", but that one you could also simply use google for.

But googling for NTR was not as easy, but after I got through the 1000s of "Nothing To Report" definitions I (luckily) found the meaning used here.
An acronym for the Japanease word "Netorare" which some sites translated as "Cuckhold" and the literal meaning according to wikipedia is taken away by sleeping with.

Don't worry, you weren't the only one who didn't understand.

I felt awfully old when I had to use google to find out what YOLO meant. No one ever used that term in my high school or college and none of my friends or family used the term. I had to ask my youngest brother who finally clued me in.

[aldw]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

Don't worry, you weren't the only one who didn't understand.

I felt awfully old when I had to use google to find out what YOLO meant. No one ever used that term in my high school or college and none of my friends or family used the term. I had to ask my youngest brother who finally clued me in.

I first saw the term while watching snippets of Mad Men with the song "You Only Live Twice" playing in the background, reading the comments section, so don't feel too bad about not being familiar with these sorts of memes, if in doubt Urbandictionary usually has em.