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Old 2021-09-09, 10:56   Link #421
Obelisk ze Tormentor
Black Steel Knight
 
 
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Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
I mean, different franchise and I think it was because Clayman was focused on fighting Rimuru, and Shion couldn't do decisive damage so I assume his healing is stronger than her fists.
Back to my original complaint: Clayman is sill weaker than what I originally anticipated this episode.

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Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
I don't think he was even all that aware that he was being attacked by Rimuru's side by this point.
He was literally the one who turned that cocky Finger into Caryb-whatever monster in the middle of the battle some episodes ago (the one that Rimuru recorded). How can he not be aware? Your argument is also getting sloppier like Clayman.
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Old 2021-09-09, 11:13   Link #422
Frontier
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Back to my original complaint: Clayman is sill weaker than what I originally anticipated this episode.
I guess this is basically establishing the different power levels and structure of the Demon Lords.
Quote:
He was literally the one who turned that cocky Finger into Caryb-whatever monster in the middle of the battle some episodes ago (the one that Rimuru recorded). How can he not be aware? Your argument is also getting sloppier like Clayman.
I think he's just not aware of the exact level his forces are contending with because he's assuming it's Carrion's leftover forces and not Rimuru's. I think that was the plan?

Sorry for being sloppy, I guess ?
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Old 2021-09-09, 11:35   Link #423
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Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
I guess this is basically establishing the different power levels and structure of the Demon Lords.
Heh, Clayman the "dead man walking" thanks to the plot. He has become a boring idiotic waste of time in the last batch of episodes. They better end him fast so that we can directly confront the one who have manipulated him. Gimme a good villain for a change.

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Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
I think he's just not aware of the exact level his forces are contending with because he's assuming it's Carrion's leftover forces and not Rimuru's. I think that was the plan?

Sorry for being sloppy, I guess ?
Rimuru's general (Benimaru) & Gobta's squad were there fighting Caryb-whatever. How can you say Clayman mistook them for Carrion's people? Again, sloppy argument.
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Old 2021-09-09, 14:48   Link #424
Frontier
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Heh, Clayman the "dead man walking" thanks to the plot. He has become a boring idiotic waste of time in the last batch of episodes. They better end him fast so that we can directly confront the one who have manipulated him. Gimme a good villain for a change.

Rimuru's general (Benimaru) & Gobta's squad were there fighting Caryb-whatever. How can you say Clayman mistook them for Carrion's people? Again, sloppy argument.
I think Takehito Koyasu is doing a good job performing him and the content is interesting enough to keep me entertained. But that's just me .

I'm not sure how aware he's supposed to be of those battles aside from Yamza trying to turn on him.
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Old 2021-09-09, 15:20   Link #425
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Clayman made some sort of semi-reasonable hypothesis to explain how a slime came out of nowhere and became a Demon Lord overnight: Rimuru somehow manipulated Veldora into being his muscle and used him for self-aggrandizement. (He projected a lot, it seems.) And then he just accepted it as true without any evidence and refused to budge or consider any other possibility, because how could he be wrong? I can kinda accept that. It's just the overconfidence, the arrogance that define a smug snake.

But then he expected that he could use that to make the rest of the Demon Lords into his patsies? Has he met any of them before?
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Old 2021-09-09, 16:42   Link #426
Metaneo
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
But then he expected that he could use that to make the rest of the Demon Lords into his patsies? Has he met any of them before?
He was appointed to the Demon Lord council, meaning he had to have been recommended by one of them, stood before them and gotten accepted, so yes, he had to have met all of them before.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Heh, Clayman the "dead man walking" thanks to the plot. He has become a boring idiotic waste of time in the last batch of episodes. They better end him fast so that we can directly confront the one who have manipulated him. Gimme a good villain for a change.
Clayman is the villain that's been behind every conflict besides the Wolves vs Goblins at the start. The Ogre Village being destroyed: Clayman. The Orc Lord: Clayman. Charybdis: Clayman's doing. Falmuth invading Tempest: Clayman. Hinata attacking Rimuru, Clayman had a hand in that too. Quite literally the only reason why Clayman has gone from Cunning Manipulator to Desperate Idiot is because he is out of cards to play besides is supposed control over Milim and another factor, this is 100% believable.

The only reason why his plan didn't succeed to this point is because of one tiny fact that Clayman had absolutely no way of knowing: Rimuru isn't just a slime, he's a reincarnator. If you notice, monsters have a tendency to fight to the death, had Rimuru not been a reincarnator he would have likely died fighting Hinata to the very end, but instead he played dead, throwing a wrench into the entirety of the rest of Clayman's plans.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Rimuru's general (Benimaru) & Gobta's squad were there fighting Caryb-whatever. How can you say Clayman mistook them for Carrion's people? Again, sloppy argument.
Clayman didn't mistake anyone for anyone as he wasn't even there. He gave the orders for his men to destroy the rest of Eurazaniaz by the time his army and Rimuru's forces came into conflict he was already at Walpurgis. Clayman had zero clue about what happened to his armies as Rimuru's forces cut off communication to him and he's too busy trying to salvage what was left of his plans at Walpurgis.

Clayman is not nearly as dumb as you are trying to paint him, but rather he's a victim of 2 things every and any Strategist/Tactician can fall for: Unknown Unknowns and False Assumptions.

Unknown Unknown: There is ZERO way for Clayman to know Rimuru was a reincarnated human in a slime body with Isekai perks. There's no way for him to expect human behavior from a monster.

False Assumptions(twice over): Clayman was given bad information to work with, twice. First: Falmuth needed to be invaded at the same time Hinata fought Rimuru, Rimuru dies, Tempest and Falmuth fight a bloody war. Stopping here because I cant remember if any more than this hasn't been revealed or skipped by the anime. Second: Rimuru killed the Falmuth army himself, not Veldora. This one is debatable whether it was dumb on his part or not. Anyone who manages to survive a battle with Hinata should be assumed to be strong, strong enough to kill an army of humans, but Veldora killing the Falmuth army is completely believable and is the more likely of the two possibilities.

Seriously, give the guy a break, everything he was doing was going flawlessly until some guy with Isekai Perks gets reincarnated into the world, and you know what? The irony here is that you are doing the exact same thing Clayman is: Not working with all the needed information. Cool your jets and let the story be told.
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Old 2021-09-09, 17:36   Link #427
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
Clayman is the villain that's been behind every conflict besides the Wolves vs Goblins at the start. The Ogre Village being destroyed: Clayman. The Orc Lord: Clayman. Charybdis: Clayman's doing. Falmuth invading Tempest: Clayman. Hinata attacking Rimuru, Clayman had a hand in that too. Quite literally the only reason why Clayman has gone from Cunning Manipulator to Desperate Idiot is because he is out of cards to play besides is supposed control over Milim and another factor, this is 100% believable.
So you actually confirmed my complaint that Clayman's methods has become stupider & stupider by the episode. Also, a truly good tactician should know when to stop when he's already running out of cards to play, not keep forcing himself until he falls off a cliff.

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Clayman didn't mistake anyone for anyone as he wasn't even there. He gave the orders for his men to destroy the rest of Eurazaniaz by the time his army and Rimuru's forces came into conflict he was already at Walpurgis. Clayman had zero clue about what happened to his armies as Rimuru's forces cut off communication to him and he's too busy trying to salvage what was left of his plans at Walpurgis.
Wait, Clayman was the one that turned Yamza into Caryb-whatever during the battle. How can he not be aware of who his opponent is?

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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
The only reason why his plan didn't succeed to this point is because of one tiny fact that Clayman had absolutely no way of knowing: Rimuru isn't just a slime, he's a reincarnator. If you notice, monsters have a tendency to fight to the death, had Rimuru not been a reincarnator he would have likely died fighting Hinata to the very end, but instead he played dead, throwing a wrench into the entirety of the rest of Clayman's plans.

Clayman is not nearly as dumb as you are trying to paint him, but rather he's a victim of 2 things every and any Strategist/Tactician can fall for: Unknown Unknowns and False Assumptions.

Unknown Unknown: There is ZERO way for Clayman to know Rimuru was a reincarnated human in a slime body with Isekai perks. There's no way for him to expect human behavior from a monster.
Rimuru already became a leader of Jura before the conflict with Falmuth. At this point, he should've known better that Rimuru is not an ordinary Slime. What kind of idiotic tactician is he for not expecting something extraordinary from a slime who rules an entire forest and build a society out of it?

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False Assumptions(twice over): Clayman was given bad information to work with, twice. First: Falmuth needed to be invaded at the same time Hinata fought Rimuru, Rimuru dies, Tempest and Falmuth fight a bloody war. Stopping here because I cant remember if any more than this hasn't been revealed or skipped by the anime. Second: Rimuru killed the Falmuth army himself, not Veldora. This one is debatable whether it was dumb on his part or not. Anyone who manages to survive a battle with Hinata should be assumed to be strong, strong enough to kill an army of humans, but Veldora killing the Falmuth army is completely believable and is the more likely of the two possibilities.

Seriously, give the guy a break, everything he was doing was going flawlessly until some guy with Isekai Perks gets reincarnated into the world, and you know what? The irony here is that you are doing the exact same thing Clayman is: Not working with all the needed information. Cool your jets and let the story be told.
It was dumb on Clayman's part to just brush off Rimuru and assume that Veldora killed the army. Rimuru had the motive and the power to do it after surviving Hinata & witnessing how Falmuth destroyed his kingdom.

Also, why is Falmuth needed to be invaded by the time Rimuru fought Hinata? During that time, Falmuth was still busy doing their sudden attack to Jura.
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Old 2021-09-09, 18:02   Link #428
Metaneo
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
So you actually confirmed my complaint that Clayman's methods has become stupider & stupider by the episode. Also, a truly good tactician should know when to stop when he's already running out of cards to play, not keep forcing himself until he falls off a cliff.
Uh, yes, he has fewer and fewer cards to play, less options to fall back on, and something else going on so yes, his plans are going to become more desperate and less thought out, this is completely normal in storytelling. He also couldn't back off, Rimuru had already set his eyes on whoever was causing all the problems in Jura and the invasion that was supposed to be successful, failed, exposing him as the prime target for vengeance. His only option right now is to appeal to the other Demon Lords to bail his ass out. Yes, it's a dumb idea, but he has very little choice left.

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Wait, Clayman was the one that turned Yamza into Caryb-whatever during the battle. How can he not be aware of who his opponent is?
It was an automatic thing, Yamza was planning to abandon Clayman, this tripped the trap Clayman set up on him.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Rimuru already became a leader of Jura before the conflict with Falmuth. At this point, he should've known better that Rimuru is not an ordinary Slime. What kind of idiotic tactician is he for not expecting something extraordinary from a slime who rules an entire forest and build a society out of it?
*insert spoilers*

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
It was dumb on Clayman's part to just brush off Rimuru and assume that Veldora killed the army. Rimuru had the motive and the power to do it after surviving Hinata & witnessing how Falmuth destroyed his kingdom.
Like I said, that part is debatable, should he have brushed off Rimuru? No, he shouldn't, but a better explanation was presented from a reliable source.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Also, why is Falmuth needed to be invaded by the time Rimuru fought Hinata? During that time, Falmuth was still busy doing their sudden attack to Jura.
Falmuth invades too soon, Rimuru is in town and can teleport straight there.

Hinata kills Rimuru too soon, Tempest finds out, and starts openly fighting against the humans in vengeance.

The monsters of Tempest only suffered as many (temporary) casualties as they did because they didn't fight back only tried to only defend themselves as much as was necessary.
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Old 2021-09-09, 18:02   Link #429
Kanon
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
Wait, Clayman was the one that turned Yamza into Caryb-whatever during the battle. How can he not be aware of who his opponent is?
He slipped him the orb thingy with a pre-recorded message long before he went to war. I don't remember what he said, but I'm going to assume that's how it goes. The war and Walpurgis are happening at roughly the same time, and Clayman doesn't have a nearly omniscient entity inside his head like Rimuru to keep constantly updated inside a different dimension.

Personally, I always assumed Clayman was weak, because the strong have no need to scheme, at least not to the extent he did.
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Old 2021-09-09, 18:05   Link #430
Metaneo
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He slipped him the orb thingy with a pre-recorded message long before he went to war. I don't remember what he said, but I'm going to assume that's how it goes. The war and Walpurgis are happening at roughly the same time, and Clayman doesn't have a nearly omniscient entity inside his head like Rimuru to keep constantly updated inside a different dimension.

Personally, I always assumed Clayman was weak, because the strong have no need to scheme, at least not to the extent he did.
Very weak, it's why he works from the shadows, and why his title is Marionette Master.
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Old 2021-09-09, 18:31   Link #431
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
Uh, yes, he has fewer and fewer cards to play, less options to fall back on, and something else going on so yes, his plans are going to become more desperate and less thought out, this is completely normal in storytelling. He also couldn't back off, Rimuru had already set his eyes on whoever was causing all the problems in Jura and the invasion that was supposed to be successful, failed, exposing him as the prime target for vengeance. His only option right now is to appeal to the other Demon Lords to bail his ass out. Yes, it's a dumb idea, but he has very little choice left.
When Clayman is running out of cards, he doesn't need to keep pushing. For example, take a look at Orochimaru. He wouldn't make a move until he had all the cards or at least an insurance that he will survive the ordeal. The only things that ever surprised or beat him was some surprise jutsus, greater intelligence or ultimate power. He never made a stupid move on his own.

Orochimaru was also hunted down by the forces of Konoha. But he just calmly hid himself until he can make his next move which is the smart thing to do.

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It was an automatic thing, Yamza was planning to abandon Clayman, this tripped the trap Clayman set up on him.
Ok then. The anime made it so that it looks like Clayman actually was there and spoke to Yamza with his image overshadowing Yamza and all

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Like I said, that part is debatable, should he have brushed off Rimuru? No, he shouldn't, but a better explanation was presented from a reliable source.
Again, a truly good tactician should do better.

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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
Falmuth invades too soon, Rimuru is in town and can teleport straight there.

Hinata kills Rimuru too soon, Tempest finds out, and starts openly fighting against the humans in vengeance.

The monsters of Tempest only suffered as many (temporary) casualties as they did because they didn't fight back only tried to only defend themselves as much as was necessary.
If Clayman planned all of those, how can many things have gone wrong from the get go from the Hinata & Falmuth sides?

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Very weak, it's why he works from the shadows, and why his title is Marionette Master.
Ah, thank you for clarifying that. There is your answer, Frontier. Clayman is weak.

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Personally, I always assumed Clayman was weak, because the strong have no need to scheme, at least not to the extent he did.
Orochimaru & Aizen were also great schemers, but they were hella strong themselves.
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Old 2021-09-09, 19:02   Link #432
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
When Clayman is running out of cards, he doesn't need to keep pushing. For example, take a look at Orochimaru. He wouldn't make a move until he had all the cards or at least an insurance that he will survive the ordeal. The only things that ever surprised or beat him was some surprise jutsus, greater intelligence or ultimate power. He never made a stupid move on his own.
You mean like a surprise person from another world with abilities that are unknown to everyone, even said person's allies? Like that kind of surprise? And to be quite honest, Orochimaru
Spoiler for Another series:


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Orochimaru was also hunted down by the forces of Konoha. But he just calmly hid himself until he can make his next move which is the smart thing to do.
Clayman stays in his castle, he rarely ever leaves it, I think the scene from season 1 that introduced Milim, Clayman, Frey, and Carrion was in his castle, or Carrion's. It's not like he's running around out in the open.

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Again, a truly good tactician should do better.
It's a recognized fact that the very best, most well laid plans can be derailed by a freak accident or something happening that no one could predict, you're looking for any reason to deride him. I'll say it again, the ONLY reason Clayman isn't successful anymore is because a Broken Isekai Protagonist with a Demi-god Dragon in his stomach started mucking up his plans by accident.

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If Clayman planned all of those, how can many things have gone wrong from the get go from the Hinata & Falmuth sides?
Only one thing went wrong, Rimuru played dead, that was literally the only thing that wrong. Falmuth's invasion of Tempest went off without a hitch, and this was partially Rimuru's fault though by absentmindedly saying he didn't want his people to fight with humans. And as before, I have to stop here because of potential spoilers.
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Old 2021-09-09, 19:33   Link #433
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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You mean like a surprise person from another world with abilities that are unknown to everyone, even said person's allies? Like that kind of surprise? And to be quite honest, Orochimaru
Spoiler for Another series:
.
In the Naruto-verse, there are plenty more weird things. But Orochi only made a move when he understood the situation. He successfully...
Spoiler for Naruto plot points:

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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
Clayman stays in his castle, he rarely ever leaves it, I think the scene from season 1 that introduced Milim, Clayman, Frey, and Carrion was in his castle, or Carrion's. It's not like he's running around out in the open.
Then why can't he just calmly hid in his castle or somewhere else instead of ordering around attacking Carrion's party (using Milim & Frey) and declare the Walpurgis only to look for more trouble with Rimuru that he doesn't fully understand?

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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
It's a recognized fact that the very best, most well laid plans can be derailed by a freak accident or something happening that no one could predict, you're looking for any reason to deride him. I'll say it again, the ONLY reason Clayman isn't successful anymore is because a Broken Isekai Protagonist with a Demi-god Dragon in his stomach started mucking up his plans by accident.
As a so-called tactician, Clayman should not be looking for trouble and try to mess with something that he doesn't fully understand like Rimuru in the first place. Even more so when he knows that Veldora is on his side.

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Only one thing went wrong, Rimuru played dead, that was literally the only thing that wrong. Falmuth's invasion of Tempest went off without a hitch, and this was partially Rimuru's fault though by absentmindedly saying he didn't want his people to fight with humans. And as before, I have to stop here because of potential spoilers.
And he should've stopped there. After receiving the news that Rimuru became a demon lord and has Veldora on his side, why even look for bigger problems with Rimuru's party knowing that he had no evidence to convince other lords? And I had this impression that Clayman is not well liked by other lords anyway.
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Old 2021-09-09, 20:00   Link #434
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Then why can't he just calmly hid in his castle or somewhere else instead of ordering around attacking Carrion's party (using Milim & Frey) and declare the Walpurgis only to look for more trouble with Rimuru that he doesn't fully understand?
You are correct.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
As a so-called tactician, Clayman should not be looking for trouble and try to mess with something that he doesn't fully understand like Rimuru in the first place. Even more so when he knows that Veldora is on his side.
Correct again.

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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
And he should've stopped there. After receiving the news that Rimuru became a demon lord and has Veldora on his side, why even look for bigger problems with Rimuru's party knowing that he had no evidence to convince other lords? And I had this impression that Clayman is not well liked by other lords anyway.
Correct on all accounts. There is a reason you are right that justifies all his actions,
Spoiler for Snip:
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Old 2021-09-09, 20:27   Link #435
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Seriously, give the guy a break, everything he was doing was going flawlessly until some guy with Isekai Perks gets reincarnated into the world, and you know what? The irony here is that you are doing the exact same thing Clayman is: Not working with all the needed information. Cool your jets and let the story be told.
Still doesn't explain how he expects every other demon lord to go with his plans based purely on his concocted story. Arrogance might be a part of it, but if he's as cunning as he's portrayed to be when not against Rimuru (who has been pointed out basically has cheat codes and isn't behaving as a typical slime) then he wouldn't have gone to Walpurgis with only a story.

He's supposed to be this cunning genius puppeteer/manipulator behind the scenes who isn't as physically or magically strong as the other demon lords, but the moment he walked into that meeting he made everyone hate him by hitting Milim (for no discernible reason other than to say "Milim's with me" I guess) and he didn't bring anything with him apart from his version of events, I mean, how hard is it to fake evidence of anything he said? He could've at least made the minimum effort.

Rimuru only has to point out the fact that Clayman has no proof of his claims to demolish the entire thing, I kinda expected more, even the giant was able to point out an inconsistency in his explanation that easily, and Clayman instantly panicked when it was pointed out smh.

Of course the in world explanation for this might turn out to be that he's being taken advantage of by Yuuki and that reincarnated demon lord, but that's just my guess. Still wouldn't explain why he's such an idiot so far though
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Old 2021-09-09, 20:33   Link #436
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Still doesn't explain how he expects every other demon lord to go with his plans based purely on his concocted story. Arrogance might be a part of it, but if he's as cunning as he's portrayed to be when not against Rimuru (who has been pointed out basically has cheat codes and isn't behaving as a typical slime) then he wouldn't have gone to Walpurgis with only a story.

He's supposed to be this cunning genius puppeteer/manipulator behind the scenes who isn't as physically or magically strong as the other demon lords, but the moment he walked into that meeting he made everyone hate him by hitting Milim (for no discernible reason other than to say "Milim's with me" I guess) and he didn't bring anything with him apart from his version of events, I mean, how hard is it to fake evidence of anything he said? He could've at least made the minimum effort.

Rimuru only has to point out the fact that Clayman has no proof of his claims to demolish the entire thing, I kinda expected more, even the giant was able to point out an inconsistency in his explanation that easily, and Clayman instantly panicked when it was pointed out smh.

Of course the in world explanation for this might turn out to be that he's being taken advantage of by Yuuki and that reincarnated demon lord, but that's just my guess. Still wouldn't explain why he's such an idiot so far though
The answer you're looking for is Irony.
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Old 2021-09-09, 20:54   Link #437
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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I mean, if it turns out that there is a party or a (strong) reason that forced Clayman to do every single stupid decision that he did, I may give his character some slack.

But if we talk in the context of this episode only, Clayman sure looks like a dumb-dumb.
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Old 2021-09-09, 22:51   Link #438
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Originally Posted by frodonk View Post
Still doesn't explain how he expects every other demon lord to go with his plans based purely on his concocted story. Arrogance might be a part of it, but if he's as cunning as he's portrayed to be when not against Rimuru (who has been pointed out basically has cheat codes and isn't behaving as a typical slime) then he wouldn't have gone to Walpurgis with only a story.

He's supposed to be this cunning genius puppeteer/manipulator behind the scenes who isn't as physically or magically strong as the other demon lords, but the moment he walked into that meeting he made everyone hate him by hitting Milim (for no discernible reason other than to say "Milim's with me" I guess) and he didn't bring anything with him apart from his version of events, I mean, how hard is it to fake evidence of anything he said? He could've at least made the minimum effort.

Rimuru only has to point out the fact that Clayman has no proof of his claims to demolish the entire thing, I kinda expected more, even the giant was able to point out an inconsistency in his explanation that easily, and Clayman instantly panicked when it was pointed out smh.

Of course the in world explanation for this might turn out to be that he's being taken advantage of by Yuuki and that reincarnated demon lord, but that's just my guess. Still wouldn't explain why he's such an idiot so far though
He *doesn't* expect them to believe it. He is desperate. His actions are those of a desperate person. Clayman is the sort of person who likes to strike from the shadows against the (relatively) weak and unaware. If Rimuru wasn't Rimuru, his plans would have worked. The point of failure, almost every time, was his ignorance of Rimuru's true nature, as has been stated before.

Heck, one could argue that his using that orb on Milim was also out of desperation as I'm pretty sure his original plans did not call for doing something so risky that his friends warned him over it. But his operations and choices are undergoing a domino effect and he is reduced to using increasingly blatant and less ideal methods in order to try to recover. Even if he were to objectively realize that he *can't* recover, he still needs to try because that's the sort of person he is.
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Old 2021-09-10, 11:28   Link #439
mickbis
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: ARKS Ship
Clayman is weak and desperate to be strong, despite his title as demon lord.
Once he got a power (Milim) he couldn't even hope for he end up exploit it like a little kid that just got cheat code in game

Basically he believe plan is not that necessary when a cheat code is on his hand
combine with the fact that he bite all the fake news Rimuru pull and totally underestimate his opponent
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Old 2021-09-10, 18:52   Link #440
AndrewR5D4
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Join Date: Aug 2016
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I find it ironic... Kazaream knew Clayman was by far the weakest of the Moderate Harlequin Jesters, but chose him to inherit the title of Demon Lord. They believed his intelligence made him the ideal man for the job, but in the end, Clayman dropped the ball once he became overconfident.
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