Kamen Rider General Discussion

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by justavisitor

I think Gotchard is just slow (and the sloppiness of ep 1 doesn't help). Put this show into showa and it will be golden (hey the bad guy is planning something), but in 2023, where in 01 the MC destroyed the terrorist group in ep 14?? and it's natural we feel gotchard is not as inspiring.

I see the staff is trying to add some characteristics into some characters. For example, the secondary rider is a good cook and enjoys the food even tho the cook is bad (or it is not that bad but he just likes trolling); Rinne enjoys hanunted house and may not have a lot of common knowledge since her life is focused on alchemy (she had trouble in choosing cake order)...of course, any staff can add random characteristics into any characters, but if the staffs can use those characteristics again in the latter part of the story, to the point we can expect how the characters will behave and indeed they behave this certain way, then there will be a bond between audiences and the characters (or we chalk it off to character development)

Regarding to the MC, somehow I can tolerate him more than the MC in Fourze . Both have very idealistic belief. Usually these kind of MCs have two paths, either they have a major setback then grow beyond it (old 90s show), or somehow their belief change everyone beside the MC (MC in Fourze). MC in Fourze has more authority somehow so it was easy for him to change everyone.

This MC's image is a lot weaker, so I expect him to get a major setback. Problem is that I don't see many shows use this formula anymore. If he ends up doing what the MC in Fourze did, I don't see it as a correct fit .

Just my 2 cents, and is probably wrong XD

Yeah, that's why I don't mind with others dropped it even with faith to Hasegawa.

Zero-One to Geats all started with plot thrown to your face (Metsubojinrai and Caliburn terrorism, etc.) with one surprise per episode to keep your excitement.
Four years then Gotchard is opposite of that, it gave you just enough (there's an evil sister trio tried to cause chaos) and wanted you to understand characters better than plot.

I disagree with some people idea about Houtarou being failed effort to create second Gentarou.
He argue to Rinne about alchemist is magic, so he's not an idiot. He toned his voice down to Riku and acknowledged Minato knew better sometimes so he's not deaf to criticism. Him triggered by Spanner for being better chef not a deliberate writing to make him interesting, we do saw him proud helping his mother, alas Rinne and Kajiki consider Spanner the cool senpai while his mother wished Spanner want to work there in single episode; all of it actually speaks to how he's only child with missing father and only one friend, a nerd, fact that people tend to overlook.

Funnily somehow there are people that think Spanner is worst written secondary.
Like, did they pay attention or not? Spanner is A-Rank Alchemist like Minato, unlike Houtarou who is newbie and lucky things going well so far.
Nothing wrong with "Why should I lowered myself to their (Houtarou, Rinne, etc) level by helping others?" assessment; in a way it also speak about what kind of people on top of Alchemist community, gave a gist about why Minato prefer to be neutral or why Rinne father is branded as traitor and believes an outsider chosen by Hopper and Liner deserved Gotchard better than them.

[Dengar]

Originally Posted by Kanon

The problem with Gotchard is that the characters are obnoxious, especially the MC. I want to punch his face every time he starts talking. It's the first KR series I'm considering dropping in 10 years of watching KR weekly. That shit is even worse than Ghost.

This is what made me drop Saber. I could not stand the characters. This has similar energy but the urge to drop isn't as strong. I like the shy one with the AI. I guess this will be like Ghost where there will be the occasional brilliant episode.

...Also Lachesis is kinda hot.

How is Houtarou even remotely similar to Gentarou? Gentarou is awesome. Houtarou is just weird. I don't hate him, but his energy doesn't make me believe in him the way Gentarou does. Which is fine if that's the character they want to write, but with Gentarou, his demeanour just makes you feel like you know he can do what he sets out to do.

By the way I just randomly did some reading up on the Greek Fates. Apparently, Atropos, while being the eldest, was significantly shorter than the other two.

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by Dengar

How is Houtarou even remotely similar to Gentarou? Gentarou is awesome. Houtarou is just weird. I don't hate him, but his energy doesn't make me believe in him the way Gentarou does. Which is fine if that's the character they want to write, but with Gentarou, his demeanour just makes you feel like you know he can do what he sets out to do.

Because some people can't understand there are various type of shounen protagonist.
For me, Gentarou is like Ichigo (Bleach, well Sota Fukushi is live-action Ichigo. LOL) while Houtarou is like Naruto. Both are shounen protagonist but clearly the way they're doing things are different despite same school setting.

Not a surprise given modern KR fans tend to unable to accept idea that good KR doesn't need MC to have Ace / Tendou / Tsukasa personality. Must be a torture for that kind of people if they watched Showa Riders.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Dengar

...Also Lachesis is kinda hot.

She really is.

Originally Posted by Dengar

How is Houtarou even remotely similar to Gentarou? Gentarou is awesome. Houtarou is just weird. I don't hate him, but his energy doesn't make me believe in him the way Gentarou does. Which is fine if that's the character they want to write, but with Gentarou, his demeanour just makes you feel like you know he can do what he sets out to do.

They're both shounen protagonist types, but Gentarou was a lot more awesome.

[GDB]

Lachesis is so damned hot. I really hope she becomes a mainstay of the show even after the trio's time as enemies ends (which I assume will be in the next month or two).

Also, as much shit as I've given this season thus far, this week's episode was legit really good (other than the bad CGI mech fight, but you gotta expect that at least once a season in KR nowadays). Gotta give props where props are due.

[Dengar]

It seems Rinne is a stiff character by design. Her reaction to all the scary stuff was endearing.

[justavisitor]

Originally Posted by Dengar

How is Houtarou even remotely similar to Gentarou? Gentarou is awesome. Houtarou is just weird. I don't hate him, but his energy doesn't make me believe in him the way Gentarou does. Which is fine if that's the character they want to write, but with Gentarou, his demeanour just makes you feel like you know he can do what he sets out to do.

Well, I mean both Houtarou and Gentarou are passionate enough to change others and this is probably also the direction that this show wants to go, but obviously Gentarou has way more charisma

And Gentarou has an easier path too I would argue. He wants to be friends with everyone, which is just a different perspective on life from different individual

Houtarou, on the other hand, wants Chemy to roam free in this world while he has zero exp and knowledge on these things!!! That's why I think he will get a huge setback, and he should get one imo. But whether the staffs wanna go to this route, or does Toei even allow it, we will have to see. I hope Houtarou won't get an easy way out and just be able to change everyone easily like Gentarou

And Lachesis makes me want to cheer for the dark side seriously

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by justavisitor

Well, I mean both Houtarou and Gentarou are passionate enough to change others and this is probably also the direction that this show wants to go, but obviously Gentarou has way more charisma

And Gentarou has an easier path too I would argue. He wants to be friends with everyone, which is just a different perspective on life from different individual

Houtarou, on the other hand, wants Chemy to roam free in this world while he has zero exp and knowledge on these things!!! That's why I think he will get a huge setback, and he should get one imo. But whether the staffs wanna go to this route, or does Toei even allow it, we will have to see. I hope Houtarou won't get an easy way out and just be able to change everyone easily like Gentarou

And Lachesis makes me want to cheer for the dark side seriously

In a way, indeed Gentarou got it easier thanks to being transfer student.
He got some leeway from teacher under assumption he's not used to new school rules and student yet (e.g. KR Club survive for a while because he befriend Kengo).
When his introduction time over, Ryusei (Meteor) come in, extending it just enough to Emoto and Principal reveal as Zodiarts; it helps that Gentarou never really violates rules and people around him never oppose his idea of befriending others.

Houtarou is ... opposite to that. He's newcomer to a secret society and actively tried to prove the secret society is wrong for not befriending Chemy.
Renge and Sabimaru see no harm supporting him because they wanted playing safe for their grade, Rinne wouldn't want to help him without connection to Fuga.
Outside that he's single child with only one friend and missing father so he have to help her mother since young; somehow, he's closer to Ultraman Nexus MC, Komon.

Originally Posted by GDB

Lachesis is so damned hot. I really hope she becomes a mainstay of the show even after the trio's time as enemies ends (which I assume will be in the next month or two).

I doubt the sisters will met their demise that soon. They're priestess of Geryon so they can stay until Geryon revival, under assumption Geryon is the final boss.
I suspect we're moving to Alchemist community higher-ups first as seeds planted are enough (Boruto challenge Spanner for instant rank-up, Spanner attitude, Minato and Fuga not fully trust them to wield Gotchard power) also Houtarou transform into mecha visible to entire Kyoto should be enough to make a secret society facepalm.

[GDB]

I didn't say they'd meet their demise, but with the exception of Saber none of the Reiwa series initial enemies have stayed enemies past the first arc. And even in Saber, they basically became irrelevant until the very end, and it was only one of them.

[Dengar]

MetsuBouJinRai went in and out of relevance throughout the show and did represent the faction of the eventual final boss.

[GDB]

Okay, and that can be the same with the witches' faction, but like Metsuboujinrai it wouldn't be the same characters as the first arc.

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by Dengar

MetsuBouJinRai went in and out of relevance throughout the show and did represent the faction of the eventual final boss.

I'd say it also applied to Metsubojinrai.

Metsubojinrai only truly became enemy on first quarter. By third quarter, they present but Ark-One is the real enemy;
Jin, Ikazuchi and Naki agreed that Ark-One didn't care about Metsubojinrai interest while Horobi being indecisive caused him to become the final boss, carrying Ark-One remains; IMO not necessarily represent Metsubojinrai given the fight itself basically Aruto and Horobi arguing to each other about who suffers most from Ark One malicious intent.

Megido is weird but it explainable.

First quarter, Daichi knowledge carried them (they didn't know how to upgrade book before) so when Daichi defeated, their threat level reduced.
Legiel and Storious tried making comeback by stealing Primitive Dragon from base. Failed, Legiel asked Storious to upgrade his book which Storious reluctant to do because being Megido it grant them powers at cost of their sanity (he likely lose an ally). It lack overarching progress but at least there's good reason why Storious and Desast gone for one quarter, they're not on Dragonic Knight level and looking for free, no-risk significant power up.

[GDB]

...Why did they take a break in the middle of a 2-parter for this multi-part crossover with this Legend fool? Should've either started it last week or next week.

[Tactics]

Originally Posted by GDB

...Why did they take a break in the middle of a 2-parter for this multi-part crossover with this Legend fool? Should've either started it last week or next week.

Gothcard vs. Legend is Youtube special, it doesn't count as series.

Last week is break for Koshien. All tokusatsu aired on morning affected by it. Always been like this, it more visible for Gotchard because two-parter compare to Revice-Geats (IIRC Zero One-Saber got no Koshien break due to COVID).

[Dengar]

Right, King-Ohger isn't airing either.

[GDB]

Gotchard Kyoto pt2 wasn't nearly as good as pt1, sadly. Fell back into its usual pace and feeling. Getting tired of these Alchemy laws.

[justavisitor]

It's not that bad...the unexpected second meeting at the end was sweet. It would be awesome if that female character became a quarterly regular guest (not even expecting to be semi regular...)

Tho you have to wonder how many times the brain of MC's friend will get reset XD Poor him...will he even have a side effect due to too many rewrites ??

And the evil oni-chan all of a sudden became a caring brother when his life was on the line was indeed a bit forced

[Tactics]

I personally like how they wrapped up first arc.

In wrestler case, memory loss is better for both sides. The wrestler admit if it continues, at some point he will relies on G-Wrestler, no different than Malgam.
In Riku and Sabo case, it still possible to argue with Minato about memory erasure being unnecessary as Riku father negative perceptions partly affected by Lachesis.
This time, can Houtarou really said memory erasure is a bad thing? This time its his best friend, his bro relationship indirectly affected by Malgam. Maybe better like this.

Unlike Nexus where Komon never have problem about memory erasure as he mostly deal with traumatic experience; Houtarou wanted Chemy co-exist with human, he oppose it but latest episodes told the Sisters surely will increase the difficulty. Look forward to second arc hurdle because obvious setup on Kajiki and Rinne aside, at some point it have to tackle on Alchemist community.

The brother actually good person deep inside and Kamen Rider treated like a savior with power of bond is so Showa I'm looking forward to see more from Kajiki in future.

[justavisitor]

12 episodes in and gotchard already has the strongest power among the good side. This is like the saiyan saga in DBZ. Good guys are way too weak and you got to wonder the bad guys could have finished them at any moment.

And Dread looks so much cooler. Man can I cheer for the bad side this time around??

[GDB]

Well... Legend was ultimately boring as hell and wasn't even really all that fun other than the single neat attack by Legend-DenO.

Gotchard is definitely getting interesting now. Hoping that it'll maintain this and doesn't just go back to being crap once Gotchard gets his upgrade next episode.