Romance in Macross (Take 2)

[justinstrife]

Unfortunately Magnuskn I can't give cookies as it says I need to spread them around more. Your essay, and follow-up arguments were spot on IMO. I'll just have to spread more cookies around so you can have some good old Oatmeal Raisin.

[wisteria233]

Spoiler for for length:

Originally Posted by magnuskn

This essay is in response to a challenge made by Dex and justavisitor a few weeks ago to prove ( with charts if possible ) as to why Ranka has no chance at the end of the series to be with Alto. This does take into account the things which actually happened in the series, were said to be canon by Kawamori and what happened in the light novels and tries to extrapolate a pattern of how the relationship between the three plotted out. I will probably judge it totally inadequate tomorrow, since I finished it at 02:30 a.m. in the morning with bleary eyes.

The essay, sadly, contains no charts.

Beto, this is the best you are going to get as character essays from me, I fear. I hope it still tickles your interest.

--------

This analysis mostly takes into account the latter part of the series ( episodes 11 and forward ), since it was there that the final relationship dynamics were defined. However, the way those dynamics were set up necessitate a short look back at the earlier series.

The set-up for the triangle, lopsided as it was, were the encounter of three distinct persons.

Shy, innocent and sweet Ranka Lee
Aloof, yet intense Alto Saotome
Assertive and vivacious Sheryl Nome

Those were the archetypes presented to us at the beginning of the series. The first ten episodes continued in that mould, setting up the relationships between the three mains.

Ranka was enchanted by the beautiful Alto who saved her from danger, yet not sure what exactly she was feeling for him. She felt in awe of Sheryl, her idol for some time and took Sheryls good advice. While developing her career, it was implied that she felt overshadowed, yet she didn't develop overt antagonism towards her.

Alto seemed to embrace the task of protecting Ranka, yet reluctant to get to know her too personally. His reluctance to enter into her fan-club was very peculiar in that regard. It is difficult to say if this reluctance was due to his aloof personality or lack of interest.
He was combative with Sheryl for most of the ten first episodes, yet seemed very affected by her overt attempts to push past his barriers. His shtick, to be abrasive to avoid people getting too close to him, were battered down time and time again by Sheryl. It was clear that her teasing was bringing him out of the shell he had built up for himself with his other friends.
It should be noted that the only person he showed a part of his private interests was Sheryl, when he took her by his own initiative to the Formo shopping mall.

Sheryl took the role of mentor in her relationship with Ranka. She seemed touched by the shy admiration that Ranka was giving her, yet never abused that trust to establish social dominance ( Of course that social dominance was still obvious to everyone). She respected Ranka enough to ask Alto if he was with Ranka before taking him out on the date in episode five.
Sheryl battered relentlessly against Altos outer defenses to get to know him better. The cause of her early interest was clearly established in episode five, since it was obvious that she had a disdain of sycophants and was intrigued by Altos defensive brashness. It is unclear how early she had made the association of Alto with his famous father, so it is possible that early on she recognized a kindred soul in him. All in all, the factors leading to her interest are numerous, some from happenstance ( her getting trapped on Frontier ) and some from their interaction. In total, they are vastly more complex than Rankas motivations ( Alto being bishi and her getting saved a lot by him ).

--------

The end of episode 10 marks a cut in the build-up, with Ranka realizing that she loves Alto ( although the exact nature of her love is a matter to be discussed further down ) and Sheryl noticing that she couldn't play Alto forever (it was quite noticeable that her kissing him had more of an effect on herself than she had bargained for).

Episode 11 started the relationship dynamics which would define the high-point of the Alto / Ranka relationship, lasting until episode 15. It also changed the mentor / pupil relationship between Sheryl and Ranka into something which could best be described as "friendly rivals". Although both were aware that the other wanted Alto as boyfriend, they never let it affect their relationship as friends.

The change in the relationship between Alto and Ranka was that a.) Alto was forced by Michael to notice Ranka as more than a friend he had to protect and b.) that Ranka actually took action to get a relationship with Alto started.

However it must be noted that those actions, even while mayor, were few. The first was the decision to go to Gallia IV and rescue Alto ( and, incidentally, Sheryl. While it may sound a bit mean-spirited, Ranka wasn't shown as giving a thought to Sheryls well-being ).
The second action was in episode 15, when she "fought back" against Sheryls song-love-attack on Alto. If Ranka had continued to show this evolution towards a more mature and confident person, she might as well have been a real contender for Altos heart.

This was not to be, however, because with episode 16 Ranka began de-voluting into a worse person than she had been at the very beginning of the series. And it was at this point that she lost her chance to end up with Alto.

--------

To put into context why this was the turning point not only for her character development but also for the romance triangle, we once again have to look at the character development up to that point of the other two members of the triangle.

By this point Alto had made peace with Michael and seen that Sheryl was not only teasing him along but did truly care about him ( I maintain that the bedside scene in episode 12 was the exact moment in which he knew that Sheryl was in love with him and fell really in love with her. ). After that point, he left behind most of his antagonizing behaviour towards his friends ( yelling at others or coldly brushing them off ) and began to be a truly better and more mature person.

Sheryl, after her rough start in the first two episodes, was always in an upward trajectory for her character development. Most of that came through our eyes, as we began to know this amazing woman more intimately. But episode 12 to 14 were her also first high-point, because she went the step ahead from being somewhat of a determinator to being truly self-sacrificing. There were several moments in the span of episodes 12 to 15 when she put Altos happiness and Rankas safety ahead of her own feelings and safety.


It can therefore be said with certainty that at the point of episode 15 all three main characters had evolved into better and mature persons from where they had started in episode one.

--------

As I said above, in episode 16 Ranka began regressing in her behaviour. The first obvious hint was letting Grace bulldoze all over her, not protesting more than with a single "meep" when Elmo was thrown away like a used chewing gum.
It is episode 17, however, which ends up being the biggest bucket of ice water for whatever romantic relationship Alto and Ranka were developing. In episode 17, Ranka calls on Alto for some advice about the military use of her music. It would have been the perfect point to fan the embers of the romantic development which happened in episodes 12-15, but to the contrary, there was absolutely no development on the romantic front. Whatever slight tension there was from Alto entering Rankas room through the window, was deliberately dissipated and directly afterwards we got a focus on Rankas room looking like it belonged to a ten-year old girl. And at the end of the episode, we had another reminder by Ozma of her being still a little girl.

How anybody can think that this was not deliberate by the writers is frankly beyond me.

After that, Alto and Ranka did not meet for two entire episodes. The next time they saw each other directly is at the very end of episode 19.

Meanwhile, however, the relationship between Sheryl and Alto got kicked into overdrive in episodes 18 and 19 ( and 16 wasn't too shabby, either ). Both Sheryl and Alto noticeably matured in those two episodes.

While for Sheryl most of it came through her sudden knowledge of being afflicted by the V-Type disease and her looming death, she obviously was willing to sacrifice her last chance at happiness to spare Alto from having to watch her die.

Alto was forced from his complacency through Michaels prodding and his own sense of worry about Sheryl. He abandoned his oath to never return to his families home, shedding another vestige of his prior immaturity.

At the same time, Rankas motivation reached rock bottom. Any development we had seen in regards to her music and motivations was thrown overboard by herself, to make place for a total focus on one sole motivator: Alto-kun. I would say that the contrast between her and the two other main protagonists could not have been more clearer, but there was worse yet to come.

As we all know, the rooftop meeting ended in catastrophe. Frontier got mauled and Michael was dead. However, it should be noted that even in all that chaos there was time for one little romantic scene between Sheryl and Alto. None for Ranka, making the last time anything romantic happened between Alto and Ranka 5 episodes ago.

During the whole ordeal it was very noticeable that of the three mains, two behaved as adults, while one regressed into child-like behaviour. Sheryl and Alto did their level best to help the people they could, while Ranka needed to be prodded into using her talent while her home burned around her.

--------

After the dust settles, Ranka then departed Frontier. Her meeting with Alto at Griffith Park ended up being dramatic, but once again utterly devoid of any romantic reciprocation of Rankas very obvious feelings by Alto.

It once again showed, though, that Ranka utterly failed at reading Altos feelings and motivations, since she seemingly sincerely believed that Alto would take her up on leaving Frontier to go on a wild goose chase-slash-suicide mission, to bring back Ai-kun to his people ( which was the stated mission goal for what Ranka wanted ).

The other interpretation of what happened that night at Griffith Park is more damning, being that Ranka had premeditated her departure with Brera, knew that Alto was unlikely to go with her and just petulantly wanted him go with her to the very people who just killed his best friend, leaving Sheryl and his home behind.

Yet premeditated malice were not shown to be a part of Rankas personality make-up. Immaturity and obliviousness to other peoples motivations, however, were two of her defining traits. So the first interpretation of the scene at Griffith Park was probably the right one.

It should be noted that Ranka departing Frontier in that way, taking herself out of the triangle equation, did have all the symptoms of the writers putting her on a bus. In any case it ended up removing her as an interfering factor in the relationship between Sheryl and Alto.

The relationship between those two came to fruition in the next four episodes, with both sides willing to sacrifice for the other, for Ranka, for their friends and for the people of Frontier.

Also, sex.
Probably much of it, since the V-Type infection didn't seem to be such a forbidding factor as so many people thought.

At the same time Ranka kept stumbling onwards. And while she meant good, her plan was almost suicidal, depending on the application of a power which already had failed her once to catastrophic results. It ends up being pure luck that everything falls into place for her.

--------

To conclude this essay, a last assessment of the development of the characters at the end of series is necessary.


Sheryl overcame her initial self-centeredness to be truly selfless, being willing to sacrifice whatever life-span she still had ahead for the good of Macross Frontier. And she learned that being able to accept the help of others did not mean giving up being self-reliant.

Alto took the leap into adulthood with both feet, getting over his hang-ups with his father, coming to terms with himself over his acting career, evolving his need to protect from Ranka to the whole of Frontier and being willing to commit himself to the protection of Frontier and, last but not least, being at Sheryls side.

At the end of episode 25, Ranka seemingly got rid of all the accumulated baggage of episodes 16 - 24 1/2.
Or did she? When she suddenly developed a backbone and begins fighting back against Grace, it pretty much came from outside sources, those being Alto and Brera. She admirably fought against Over-Grace and helped win the day, but in her case this sudden return to episode 15 levels of perkyness didn't feel earned, since she lacked the development the other two had, for whom both it was shown, in the show, how they matured into the persons they were at the end of episode 25. Ranka seemingly just got a power-boost which restored her personality to pre-devolution levels.

--------

Now, to the conclusion. After the battle, in the now proven absence of Alto getting polygamous in the sound dimension, when Ranka issues her silly challenge to Sheryl, she has no clue of the vast gulf of she would have to bridge, in maturity, in getting to know Alto and in the sheer difference of personality between the two ( Alto and Ranka ) of them.

Not to mention Altos honor and integrity, which would simply not allow him to just ditch Sheryl, even if he were so inclined. Not that he should be, because he and Sheryl grew up. Together. At the end of the series, Ranka has nothing to offer him as a romantic partner.

They are very, very far away from each other in terms of maturity, Alto hasn't shown any inclination for a romantic involvement with Ranka since 10 episodes of shown plot and he has shown, numerous times even, that he cares about Sheryl romantically. Also, sex. Probably lots of it.

So, Sheryl can easily accept that silly challenge, and I think she knows it. Because at the end of that day, she is the one that takes Alto to their mutual home.

Wow nicely written, though I would like to add that the fact that Alto and Sheryl apparently live together so in order for Ranka to get in between that she'd have to be incredibly bold, and its just in her personality.

I myself was put off by Ranka in the last episode. She was just crying 5 episodes ago, about the fact that Alto "can't hear her song", she doesn't talk to him directly at all for 4 episodes. But he saves her life in episode 25 (with help mind you, and much coercing from Sheryl) and suddenly she's willing to "fight for his love" again, as though her revelation in episode 21 didn't happen. It was like she took one step forward and 20 steps back.

You don't have to be in love to save someone's life.

[karice67]

The teacher who taught me how to structure an essay would have a field day with all of us calling your analysis an essay. However, although I feel that at least the following part:

Spoiler for quote from original essay:

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Sheryl, after her rough start in the first two episodes, was always in an upward trajectory for her character development. Most of that came through our eyes, as we began to know this amazing woman more intimately. But episode 12 to 14 were her also first high-point, because she went the step ahead from being somewhat of a determinator to being truly self-sacrificing. There were several moments in the span of episodes 12 to 15 when she put Altos happiness and Rankas safety ahead of her own feelings and safety.

should probably have one or two concrete examples of what Sheryl actually did rather than what viewers can infer from her actions, you've made some excellent points. I especially liked the (later) argument you made about Alto making an adult decision (rather than a GAR one).

I've never really thought about this in that much detail, and the arguments seem to be scattered all over this forum, so I'm glad you've put it all in one post to consider. Nice work!!

[sweetgirl121]

*applause*
magnuskn your post reflect exactly the way I view the love triangle.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by justinstrife

Unfortunately Magnuskn I can't give cookies as it says I need to spread them around more. Your essay, and follow-up arguments were spot on IMO. I'll just have to spread more cookies around so you can have some good old Oatmeal Raisin.

Thanks, can't wait.

Originally Posted by wisteria233

Wow nicely written, though I would like to add that the fact that Alto and Sheryl apparently live together so in order for Ranka to get in between that she'd have to be incredibly bold, and its just in her personality.

Damn, I forgot that at the end? Well, as I look over it, I see that I wrote that Sheryl takes Alto home to their mutual home, so I kind of had it in there.

Originally Posted by wisteria233

I myself was put off by Ranka in the last episode. She was just crying 5 episodes ago, about the fact that Alto "can't hear her song", she doesn't talk to him directly at all for 4 episodes. But he saves her life in episode 25 (with help mind you, and much coercing from Sheryl) and suddenly she's willing to "fight for his love" again, as though her revelation in episode 21 didn't happen. It was like she took one step forward and 20 steps back.

You don't have to be in love to save someone's life.

Indeed.

Originally Posted by karice67

The teacher who taught me how to structure an essay would have a field day with all of us calling your analysis an essay.

Yeah, analysis may have been the better name for it, it was a bit short for an essay.

Originally Posted by karice67

However, although I feel that at least the following part:

Spoiler for quote from original essay:

should probably have one or two concrete examples of what Sheryl actually did rather than what viewers can infer from her actions, you've made some excellent points. I especially liked the (later) argument you made about Alto making an adult decision (rather than a GAR one).

You want examples of her being a determinator or of her putting Altos happyness and Rankas safety ahead of her wishes?

As for the first:

- Episode three, her big speech to Alto and Ranka about making your own destiny, which served as a prime motivator for the other two mains for much of the series.
- She cajoled Alto into their date.
- She got a place in Altos school, probably with absolutely no former school credentials.
-etc etc.

As for the second:

- The bedside scene, with her almost literally knocking herself out, because she wants to give Alto his present.
- Her telling Alto to "bring Ranka back, even if it costs you your life" in the air battle above Gallia IV.

Originally Posted by karice67

I've never really thought about this in that much detail, and the arguments seem to be scattered all over this forum, so I'm glad you've put it all in one post to consider. Nice work!!

I am sure there is a lot of stuff I missed, but that would have required serious research, instead of just going off the top of my head.

Originally Posted by sweetgirl121

*applause*
magnuskn your post reflect exactly the way I view the love triangle.

Thank you!

[Swampstorm]

magnus:
While your essay is an interesting read, I don't think that you actually addressed your original point: namely, to prove that Ranka doesn't have a chance of ending up with Alto. To do so, you would need to be able to prove what Alto's feelings were for each girl.

Your post seemed to be much more focused on discussing the character development and maturity of the protagonists. Those are both interesting topics, but I think they belong to a different essay.

Note: I've been observing this weird "Link to the Past" effect lately, where I see people make posts in the "Light World," but I read the replies in the "Dark World" instead. How mysterious.

Mei19:
I'm always a bit wary when I hear the word "bias" thrown around. I'm yet to meet someone who isn't biased towards his/her own opinion. Likewise, the claim that a particular post is "unbiased" really is nothing more than an appeal to authority.

I've always found the exchange between Alto and Ozma to be an interesting one. For one, it represents a shift in Ozma's thinking about Alto. In episode eighteen, Ozma recognizes that he can't protect Ranka as he is and entrusts her safety to Alto. In episode twenty-two, Ozma takes his role back again, telling Alto that he never intended to let Alto in on the plan, since Alto is inflexible.

Up until now, Alto has been simply following orders. But as Ozma points out, Alto needs to choose his own path, as both Ranka and Ozma have done. By deciding that his wings are for Frontier, Alto is no longer Leon's puppet; as we see in the final episode, he is even willing to work alongside Leon's enemies (the Vajra included) to protect the home that he now loves.

There actually is no mention of Alto deciding to between being "an adult" or "a man": the original question is directed towards Ozma. But I would have thought that the answer was obvious by now.

Alto is a woman.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

magnus:
While your essay is an interesting read, I don't think that you actually addressed your original point: namely, to prove that Ranka doesn't have a chance of ending up with Alto. To do so, you would need to be able to prove what Alto's feelings were for each girl.

Your post seemed to be much more focused on discussing the character development and maturity of the protagonists. Those are both interesting topics, but I think they belong to a different essay.

No, I think those are exactly the pertinent points. As you said, Altos feelings weren't clearly stated in the end.

In absence of that, logical progression of what would happen after the last credits roll has to be extrapolated by different measures.

a.) Prior behaviour patterns
b.) History between the characters
c.) Emotional state and state of development of the characters

My point was to "prove" or at least approximate to proof that Sheryl and Alto, due to their prior behaviour patterns, their shared history and their state of delopment ( i.e. maturity ) were so far ahead of Ranka, that Alto would have no inclination to get into a romantic relationship with her and would be drawn to Sheryl, who shared much more of what he had gone through in the harrowing experiences of the last half of the series.

There are still pertinent points about Rankas state in the end which I could have made ( and forgot to add due to bleary eyes in the night ), such as that she doesn't even have the personality to start an aggressive campaign to woo Alto away from Sheryl, neither in energy nor in ruthlessness.

As for Alto, what exact reason would actually have to choose Ranka? He doesn't seem to be the type to want someone as partner who is as easily cajoled and subservient as Ranka has been shown to be.

[DeX-kun]

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

Mei19:
I'm always a bit wary when I hear the word "bias" thrown around. I'm yet to meet someone who isn't biased towards his/her own opinion. Likewise, the claim that a particular post is "unbiased" really is nothing more than an appeal to authority.

I don't believe there is such a thing as being "unbiased" especially when it deals with something as sensitive as this, but I do believe there is a way to prove a point without being too heavily biased.

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

I've always found the exchange between Alto and Ozma to be an interesting one. For one, it represents a shift in Ozma's thinking about Alto. In episode eighteen, Ozma recognizes that he can't protect Ranka as he is and entrusts her safety to Alto. In episode twenty-two, Ozma takes his role back again, telling Alto that he never intended to let Alto in on the plan, since Alto is inflexible.

Up until now, Alto has been simply following orders. But as Ozma points out, Alto needs to choose his own path, as both Ranka and Ozma have done. By deciding that his wings are for Frontier, Alto is no longer Leon's puppet; as we see in the final episode, he is even willing to work alongside Leon's enemies (the Vajra included) to protect the home that he now loves.

There actually is no mention of Alto deciding to between being "an adult" or "a man": the original question is directed towards Ozma. But I would have thought that the answer was obvious by now.

Alto is a woman.

This is a very interesting take on the subject but I don't believe that it is the home (i.e. - Frontier) that he now loves but rather the experiences and the people he cared for that he loved. Alto's decision to be an adult rather than a man was made because his circumstances won't allow him to be a man, at least in my opinion. Mei's question was "which one did Alto truly want to be, without causing him grief?" and I believe that he might of wanted to be a man but he realized that the wants of many outweighs his wants.

Alto being as indecisive as always, Ozma had to take the initiative to rescue Ranka considering the danger she was in. Then we have the conversation with Klan in episode 23 which I believe also coincides with his decision between being an adult or a man. Obviously Alto chooses to be an adult but, was that what he truly wanted?

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by DeX-kun

Alto being as indecisive as always, Ozma had to take the initiative to rescue Ranka considering the danger she was in. Then we have the conversation with Klan in episode 23 which I believe also coincides with his decision between being an adult or a man. Obviously Alto chooses to be an adult but, was that what he truly wanted?

Is that want any man truly wants? Being a hot-blooded fly-by-the-seat-of-your pants shoot-from-the-hip guy is what most guys want. But as you said, the need of the many supercede the need to be a macho. For adult people, at least.

[Death Header]

she doesn't even have the personality to start an aggressive campaign to woo Alto away from Sheryl, neither in energy nor in ruthlessness.

And yet, if Ranka would ever do that, she would probably be considered an antagonist in the series instead of the protagonist solely on the fact that she is trying to cause a problem for the protagonist (Alto).

This is assuming that Alto and Sheryl have gotten together. Hats off to you magnuskn.

[MichiNekoChan]

Very good job Magnus

Although your being watched

Yea! I can lurk too. Muahahaha! So I guess if you want to see more replies to your post Magnus, just look there.

Though really, should I be adding more fuel to the fire?


PS - People may think its mean to link that, but I find it to be more fair for people to know what others are saying about their post... even in a different forum. Especially where there are counter arguments to it. It lets the original poster be able to defend their points and the commenter to theirs.

[raile]

LOL, it was only a matter of time for someone to link that.
Miki, you are a brave soul. XD

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Death Header

And yet, if Ranka would ever do that, she would probably be considered an antagonist in the series instead of the protagonist solely on the fact that she is trying to cause a problem for the protagonist (Alto).

This is assuming that Alto and Sheryl have gotten together. Hats off to you magnuskn.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by MichiNekoChan

Very good job Magnus

Although your being watched

Yea! I can lurk too. Muahahaha! So I guess if you want to see more replies to your post Magnus, just look there.

Though really, should I be adding more fuel to the fire?


PS - People may think its mean to link that, but I find it to be more fair for people to know what others are saying about their post... even in a different forum. Especially where there are counter arguments to it. It lets the original poster be able to defend their points and the commenter to theirs.

Yeah, okay. NOT discussing with BleachOD, that'd hurt my head more than what it is worth. I really can't take more rounds of "Sheryl is a needy weakling blobber globber globber smiley-bombs!" The original ones one year ago were too much.

Honestly, if someone wants to discuss, come to this forum. I am not talking with the crazy person again.

[Mei19]

Originally Posted by Swampstorm

Alto is a woman.

I KNEW IT. I knew someone will say this.

Everyone has bias for they have opinions. But me is sure you've also met people who don't let their bias talk for them. Tis impossible that they don't exist.

Arigatou for the mixed explanations. I've shaped my own interpretation of the scene too after reading some responses.

[BetoJR]

Originally Posted by DeX-kun

Alto being as indecisive as always, Ozma had to take the initiative to rescue Ranka considering the danger she was in.

What danger? I mean, really, did anyone in the show even think she actually was in some kind of danger, so that she needed to be rescued?

The Quarter crew didn't really seem all that concerned about poor Ranka, IMHO... so, another notch off the "indecisive Alto" schtick, for me.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by BetoJR

What danger? I mean, really, did anyone in the show even think she actually was in some kind of danger, so that she needed to be rescued?

The Quarter crew didn't really seem all that concerned about poor Ranka, IMHO... so, another notch off the "indecisive Alto" schtick, for me.

Not to mention that the Quarter crew didn't really go after Rank, per se, but went off and gathered incriminating information on Grace.

[Death Header]

Yeah, okay. NOT discussing with BleachOD, that'd hurt my head more than what it is worth. I really can't take more rounds of "Sheryl is a needy weakling blobber globber globber smiley-bombs!" The original ones one year ago were too much.

Honestly, if someone wants to discuss, come to this forum. I am not talking with the crazy person again.

If there's one thing that OD got right, it's that images are worth more than words. OD's argument worked to an extent (they were good arguments, to me anyways), but unfortunately he got swamped later on.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Death Header

If there's one thing that OD got right, it's that images are worth more than words. OD's argument worked to an extent (they were good arguments, to me anyways), but unfortunately he got swamped later on.

I'd rather say that they were a incoherent mess since the start. But let's agree to disagree.

[DeX-kun]

Originally Posted by BetoJR

What danger? I mean, really, did anyone in the show even think she actually was in some kind of danger, so that she needed to be rescued?

The Quarter crew didn't really seem all that concerned about poor Ranka, IMHO... so, another notch off the "indecisive Alto" schtick, for me.

Ranka left a letter explaining what her plans were so I'm pretty sure Ozma and the Quarter crew knew she was in some sort of danger but that's besides the point, the Quarter crew has nothing to do with Alto being indecisive.

The point I was trying to make was that Alto was still in dire straits about Ranka's decision to leave but he wasn't going to abandon Frontier because of something he wanted to do.

[wisteria233]

Originally Posted by MichiNekoChan

Very good job Magnus

Although your being watched

Yea! I can lurk too. Muahahaha! So I guess if you want to see more replies to your post Magnus, just look there.

Though really, should I be adding more fuel to the fire?


PS - People may think its mean to link that, but I find it to be more fair for people to know what others are saying about their post... even in a different forum. Especially where there are counter arguments to it. It lets the original poster be able to defend their points and the commenter to theirs.

Having read some of the responses there it kinda solidifies my views on most Ranka fans. I kinda LOL'd at some of the responses honestly. It seems like they like like AruRanka there without needlessly bashing Sheryl. Then again I've already been warned away enough from that forum that I would never think to join it.