(L+CR) Overlord Season 3

[pervypig]

Originally Posted by Tak

Why are you guys debating the morality of an ‘OVERLORD’?

- Tak

Hush, Tak. Just ignore them all and talk about stuff that're really interesting. Feeding a dumb thing that just won't go away is a really bad way of driving it off.

I'm surprised that people don't find the what the Emperor mentioned: about that dragon descendant Queen who's well nigh immortal, or that Imperial Knight babe that seems ready to run away at the first notice (lol)... Jeezus, there so many other things out there to talk about if you'd just look beyond the Tomb.

Btw, did Demiurge's form changed from the first time he appeared, flying beside Ainz while he monologued about "grasping the stars"? I've forgotten about it, but he looked so much like a praying mantis now.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by pervypig

Hush, Tak. Just ignore them all and talk about stuff that're really interesting. Feeding a dumb thing that just won't go away is a really bad way of driving it off.

Can't say I understand the concept/reasoning behind imposing morality onto someone who has... none. Or at least very little of it.

Originally Posted by pervypig

about that dragon descendant Queen who's well nigh immortal,

It is mentioned that the Dragon Queen is only maintaining her youth through magic. [mod edit: remove spoiler]

Originally Posted by pervypig

or that Imperial Knight babe that seems ready to run away at the first notice (lol)... Jeezus, there so many other things out there to talk about if you'd just look beyond the Tomb.

They weren't really Knights, but mercenaries. [mod edit: Remove Spoilers]

Originally Posted by pervypig

Btw, did Demiurge's form changed from the first time he appeared, flying beside Ainz while he monologued about "grasping the stars"? I've forgotten about it, but he looked so much like a praying mantis now.

Nah, still a toad, just a tad smaller, imo. There is a reason he transformed in the hall, but nobody is talking about that, either...

- Tak

[pervypig]

Ima actually surprised that that female knight actually got so much scene in Ep. 9, showing those yellow pus when she wiped her face. I didn't get as much impression of her reading that from the book, but now I'm more curious.

I for one would really want to see how the Dragon Queen look. The Emperor seems really disgusted by her (loli-baba maybe?)

[Tak]

Originally Posted by pervypig

Ima actually surprised that that female knight actually got so much scene in Ep. 9, showing those yellow pus when she wiped her face. I didn't get as much impression of her reading that from the book, but now I'm more curious.

Yep, been waiting for her to show up again. Although like everyone else, she unceremoniously pissed her pants when she saw the Tomb's denizens for the first time, almost rendering her existence as trivial.

Originally Posted by pervypig

I for one would really want to see how the Dragon Queen look. The Emperor seems really disgusted by her (loli-baba maybe?)

Won't be surprised if that was the case. But if that was the case, Shalltear won't be happy...

I also wonder how she compares to Fluder, as the latter is currently the strongest mage in the new world, even if he cannot maintain his own youth.

- - - - -

Remember the trio of Elves in episode 8 kicking their master's dead carcass? They were actually spared and put to work, lol.

- Tak

[pervypig]

Originally Posted by Tak

Yep, been waiting for her to show up again. Although like everyone else, she unceremoniously pissed her pants when she saw the Tomb's denizens for the first time, almost rendering her existence as trivial.

- Tak

Ah, that's one scene that I actually found a pity it got axed. The book went into much detail about how the knights actually tried to so hard to fight Demiurge's control. I remembered being surprised at why the guy carrying that noble scapegoat's head did not drop the jar.

Originally Posted by Tak

Won't be surprised if that was the case. But if that was the case, Shalltear won't be happy...
- - - - -
I also wonder how she compares to Fluder, as the latter is currently the strongest mage in the new world, even if he cannot maintain his own youth.

If that queen actually meet up with Ainz and throws herself around him, Shaltear might actually go berserk again. It makes me wonder whether immortality is actually a spell among the circles from the game that Ainz came from. Why would gamers need a spell to maintain youth anyway.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by pervypig

Ah, that's one scene that I actually found a pity it got axed. The book went into much detail about how the knights actually tried to so hard to fight Demiurge's control. I remembered being surprised at why the guy carrying that noble scapegoat's head did not drop the jar.

That is the thing with episode 9. Everything was fast paced. I understand they need the remaining episodes for the 'big one', but episode 9 is crucial because it showed, for the first time, where an actual negotiation took place between two parties.

The Emperor tried to negotiate from a very disadvantageous position. By most standards of the new world, he is considered brilliant, and went through a series of considerations before finally reaching the conclusion that there is nothing he could do but submit. Even if submission was not something Ainz demanded. Unfortunately, episode 9 does not portray his mental anguish well enough. A bit of a shame, really.

Originally Posted by pervypig

It makes me wonder whether immortality is actually a spell among the circles from the game that Ainz came from.

On one hand, Ainz's friends, or the 41 supreme beings were all beings that had no mortality. On the other hand, the creatures they created, particularly the maids, are all immortal.

- Tak

[Klashikari]

I initially believed this debate could remain civil and interesting, but the recent passive aggressive comments on both sides don't help at all. The thread is locked while I'm cleaning this mess.

While you are free to resume this debate to a certain degree, please know mods will be less forgiving this time around.

[Yan3242]

Episode 10 is out i can see they follow the same formula from episode 8 (or is it 7?)

Here's the episode of some character from the kingdom side showing their daily life routine with their hope and happy moment.... before they all going to get wipe out in the most one sided battle on next episode

On more depth, i was kind of hoping gazel voice his opinion about ainz more strongly, at least he said it strongly when he talk with brain and climb.

Other than that, its pretty laid back episode overall, basically calm before storm (or in this case, masacre)

[Fwarlord]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Or... he could have just not let the troll attack the village.

But the attack was necessary to test and strengthen the village's defense.

Does it not occur to you that the reason he was still willing to fight was because Ainz already demonstrated an unnerving willingness to kill people? A certain level of intimidation is necessary to not get looked down on, but too far and you create unnecessary resistance.

Actually, no. No where in the show the emperor showed any sign that he tried to scheme against Ainz because Ainz killed people. That whole idea is just silly since NWers are barbaric and take killing as a norm. The emperor himself is call Bloody Emperor for a reason. He only resists because of his arrogance and racism, which prevents him to obey an undead.

Except your safety isn't 'guaranteed'. There's nothing stopping Ainz from killing you or risking your life in the name of what he deems as beneficial. He did the same thing with Carne.

Please view things from a broader standpoint. Ainz may sacrifice a few for the benefit of many, but as a whole, the majority of people under his rule get a better life, far better than what they could hope for from any shitty noble or lord. No way they would dislike his reign.

Exactly, that's the problem with empires.

Can you tell me what problem?

When did I say you had to convince everyone? You work with who you can work with. When you work with them, their influence expands and allows them to do things they couldn't have done on their own.

Because in a non-violence scenario, you actually have to convince everyone to conduct a radical social reform. And please do tell by what method you think you can expand the influence of those who you work with? Before you say anything, bribery is a no-no. It won't work in long term and is the antithesis to any stable societies, let alone a utopia.

Painting himself as a saviour when he's the one that creates most of the problems affecting people is making people think he's someone he's not.

I don't see a problem when he actually solves problem he may create and through that process, he becomes their savior by making their life better.

Reducing casualties means that if a situation occurs where casualties are likely, you work so as to reduce the number of people that die. You can't just not kill people and then say you've reduced casualties.

The situation here is a guild of human-hating heteromorphs suddenly emerged in a human land and mass casualties would have been very likely in a few days if Ainz hadn't acted the way he did. He actually saved millions of human lives by giving his NPCs a goal instead of letting them go amok.

And who decides what that law is?

If Ainz creates a law saying everyone has to give up their firstborn for Demiurge's experiments, they should give up their kids for the sake of the utopia then?

Just remember, Ainz hates giving counterproductive orders and likes to keep his subjects happy. The only scenario he will do something extreme is when the benefit really outweigh the cost. But even then, it is for the benefit of his whole group/country, not himself.

That's the problem with fascism. When only one person makes the rules, it's not about what's good for everyone, but what's good for that one person, and we already know that Ainz is willing to do just about anything for what he perceives as benefit.

Except Ainz is a good boss who links his subjects' benefit to his own so whatever benefits him will benefit those under him as well.

See above.

Not applied in Ainz's case, since he really is incorruptible.

If Ainz was really trying to reduce casualties, he'd have told Lupusregina to protect the whole village, but prioritize Nphirea, Enri and Nemu, like AC_Pheonix said. Or better yet, stopped the troll to begin with.

Like I said, that attack had its own merit, thus he let it happen, but also made sure to reduce casualties.

Even if he could get the same benefit and kill less by putting in more effort, he doesn't do that.

Please give me an example of a way to achieve some of Ainz's goals with less deaths.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Yan3242

Other than that, its pretty laid back episode overall, basically calm before storm (or in this case, masacre)

I am hoping, all the $ they saved by glossing over episode 9 would not disappoint.

Or, it better not disappoint, because there is no turning back from the acts committed in the last act of volume 9.

- Tak

[~Yami~]

at this rate.... if somehow you're rooting for other characters beside Nazarick one, please root for those who might not die
in the end, I think the surviving people might be Karna (or Karla or whatever) villagers, Princess Renner, Climb... and most likely EvilEye (?)

Gazef is dead for sure.. that is death flag right there... Drinking together after war? the one who promised to treat is dead for sure

I feel really sad for some sensible people in the kingdom... Renner factions (or I should said those who involved closely in Jabbadaoth incident) should aware about this trap that laid by Nazarick and the Empire... but they still need to obey and follow the flow
Gazef and that leading Marquis are not deserved to die because they have good brain, however they need to fulfill their duty..

I guess.. Ainz would betray the empire and destroy the kingdom at the same time
It is obvious that he should gain some advantages in this war by conquering two strongest sides
If he is aware of his bad reputation as betrayer in the future, it would not be a problem since he would get so many resources if he managed to take both countries

I would be pretty hyped to see Death Knight go rampant in next episode
but it would hurt me when I imagined how brutal Gazef is going to be butchered

[pervypig]

If there's actually a 'hero' in this entire story, I think that might be Climb. ima mean, just look at the guy! He fits it like a T

[Tak]

Climb? You mean the Princess’ pet!?

Holy crap I forgot about him. Poor bastard doesn’t even know he is being played.

- Tak

[SilverGlavenus]

Red flags are sprinkled all over the place.

[pervypig]

^^ eh, there's joy in ignorance. Besides, the princess actually really wanna put him on a leash too...

[Tak]

Don’t forget Gazef, he is a hero too, if only a bit stiff with the thinking...

- Tak

[Nymene]

Originally Posted by ~Yami~

at this rate.... if somehow you're rooting for other characters beside Nazarick one, please root for those who might not die
in the end, I think the surviving people might be Karna (or Karla or whatever) villagers, Princess Renner, Climb... and most likely EvilEye (?)

Gazef is dead for sure.. that is death flag right there... Drinking together after war? the one who promised to treat is dead for sure

I feel really sad for some sensible people in the kingdom... Renner factions (or I should said those who involved closely in Jabbadaoth incident) should aware about this trap that laid by Nazarick and the Empire... but they still need to obey and follow the flow
Gazef and that leading Marquis are not deserved to die because they have good brain, however they need to fulfill their duty..

I guess.. Ainz would betray the empire and destroy the kingdom at the same time
It is obvious that he should gain some advantages in this war by conquering two strongest sides
If he is aware of his bad reputation as betrayer in the future, it would not be a problem since he would get so many resources if he managed to take both countries

I would be pretty hyped to see Death Knight go rampant in next episode
but it would hurt me when I imagined how brutal Gazef is going to be butchered

No, I don't think Ainz will betray the Empire. Remember, Albedo herself stated before in episode 9 that they don't really need the alliance at all, as they only need the alliance with the Empire to serve as a public relations stunt to all the people Ainz will rule in the future that Ainz is a benevolent ruler that doesn't conquer only by force, but can also accept a peaceful solution.

That's the only reason they need the alliance, since Nazarick themselves could conquer the entire New World easily by themselves unless a group of LV100 players transported to the New World too, backed by a few of their own World Items, challenged them. So it's just a public relations move to show the world that they can accept a diplomatic solution too, as well as "Hey we may be a bunch of monsters, but we do have human allies too, so we're not the big bad evil Demon Lord that some of you might think"

[Tak]

One thing for certain is that at this point, Ainz has not betrayed anyone, even if most of his favors to the denizens of the new world come at a price. When he makes a promise or issues a threat, he keeps it.

- Tak

[pervypig]

Actually it's fine too if he does betray everyone. Heck, I'd rather he betray 'em! Screw the frigging world! Might MAKES RIGHT!

On the other hand, there's still the existences of so many hidden unknowns out there that it does make things bad if he does go about it too blatantly... yeah, those "irrelevant" unknowns that we ignored...

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Fwarlord

But the attack was necessary to test and strengthen the village's defense.

It wasn't necessary. Even if it was, he should have sent one of his subordinates with instructions to not kill more than necessary and asked Lupusregina to protect them, not send in an enemy to simply attack.

Actually, no. No where in the show the emperor showed any sign that he tried to scheme against Ainz because Ainz killed people. That whole idea is just silly since NWers are barbaric and take killing as a norm. The emperor himself is call Bloody Emperor for a reason. He only resists because of his arrogance and racism, which prevents him to obey an undead.

Why do you think he was willing to ally with his enemies and called it a fight for humanity? Because he believes that Ainz wants to kill everyone.

Please view things from a broader standpoint. Ainz may sacrifice a few for the benefit of many, but as a whole, the majority of people under his rule get a better life, far better than what they could hope for from any shitty noble or lord.

The ends don't justify the means, especially when said means aren't absolutely necessary to begin with.

No way they would dislike his reign.

Because they don't know what he's doing behind the scenes.

Can you tell me what problem?

The idea of oppressing the minority to bring benefits to the majority

Because in a non-violence scenario, you actually have to convince everyone to conduct a radical social reform. And please do tell by what method you think you can expand the influence of those who you work with?

You don't need to convince everyone. You convince the influential people, change policy and trends and the rest fall into line when that method becomes profitable.

Before you say anything, bribery is a no-no. It won't work in long term and is the antithesis to any stable societies, let alone a utopia.

You're fine with mass murder to create a utopia, but bribery is a no-no?

I don't see a problem when he actually solves problem he may create and through that process, he becomes their savior by making their life better.

So you admit he's deceiving them.

The situation here is a guild of human-hating heteromorphs suddenly emerged in a human land and mass casualties would have been very likely in a few days if Ainz hadn't acted the way he did. He actually saved millions of human lives by giving his NPCs a goal instead of letting them go amok.

Most of them had no interest in the outside world until Ainz led them there.

Just remember, Ainz hates giving counterproductive orders and likes to keep his subjects happy. The only scenario he will do something extreme is when the benefit really outweigh the cost. But even then, it is for the benefit of his whole group/country, not himself.

Except Ainz is a good boss who links his subjects' benefit to his own so whatever benefits him will benefit those under him as well.

Ainz only cares about the benefit of Nazarick. If he had to choose between killing 100,000 normal folks and the life of one of those Level 1 maids he has, he'd kill the 100,000 in a heartbeat. How can someone like that be trusted with the lives of normal people.

Not applied in Ainz's case, since he really is incorruptible.

No one is incorruptible, especially not Ainz. Even if he were, that doesn't mean his subordinates are. We've seen Demiurge and the rest of them go off script, and Ainz cares more about coddling them than the lives of others.

Like I said, that attack had its own merit, thus he let it happen

Was that merit worth their lives, or the damage done to their village?

but also made sure to reduce casualties.

No he didn't. If he did, he would have ordered Lupusregina to make sure none of them died.