(L) Paprika - movie by Satoshi Kon, adapted from novel by Yasutaka Tsutsui

[kujoe]

I have a feeling that there's more of the story's love subplot in the original novel. As I was watching the movie, I had this nagging feeling at the back of my head that made me think that something was inexplicably missing. Whether it's a certain quality within the story or missing content itself, I'm not so sure... In fact, I thought for a while that something was building up between the detective and Atsuko, and it was only towards the end that I sort of guessed that Atsuko had hidden feelings for someone else.

All in all, I still enjoyed the movie. But my favorite Satoshi Kon movie so far is still Millenium Actress.

[TinyRedLeaf]

Originally Posted by kujoe

All in all, I still enjoyed the movie. But my favorite Satoshi Kon movie so far is still Millenium Actress.

I agree.

I was watching the movie, I had this nagging feeling at the back of my head that made me think that something was inexplicably missing.

Emm........ok, I'll admit it. I did indeed have great fun with this movie, but only after my second viewing. Like I was telling someone else, I think this is one of those stories that makes sense only if you know how it would end beforehand.

Atsuko did drop hints of a previous relationship with Tokida at various points of the story. For example, her annoyance at being called "At-chan", and her lack of dreams. The detective and Dr Shima, on the other hand, were attracted to Paprika rather than Atsuko per se. Paprika was literally the girl of their dreams.

In the end, while I do agree that the story was somewhat thin -- especially when compared to Millenium Actress -- I feel that the artwork more than made up for it.

[NoSanninWa]

Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

In the end, while I do agree that the story was somewhat thin -- especially when compared to Millenium Actress -- I feel that the artwork more than made up for it.

Anything comes up a little thin on story and characterization compared to Millenium Actress. While Millenium Actress also had gorgeous visuals, it was basically 87 minutes of non-stop story and characterization. By comparison Paprika had the explicative level of a Shirow Masamune movie. Lots of visually exciting stuff happened, but the only clues as to why those events unfolded took place in the form of unhelpfully vague pretentious portentious pronoucements.

I don't want some bald-headed geezer to spout philosophical without any context, I want to hear what happened in his past to make him believe that dreams need to conquer mankind.

[innominate]

Originally Posted by NoSanninWa

I don't want some bald-headed geezer to spout philosophical without any context, I want to hear what happened in his past to make him believe that dreams need to conquer mankind.

Weren't all the characters to some extent deluded by the notion that they were able to have complete control over all those they were interacting with (as well as themselves)? Like how the female lead thought she had control over manipulating the other party's dream and how the male antagonist spoke of how things worked the way he wanted them to in 'his own space'.

Perhaps the old geezer was simply subject to a more intense manifestation of this delusion. Err.... dunno ^^"

I think I am still drawing a parallel between dreams and the internet here... D: (which was mentioned in the show too iirc)

/oh look change in signature...

[NoSanninWa]

You can say that all characters were to some extent deluded by their dreams, and that does indeed seem to be a theme for the movie, but that doesn't tell me WHY they were all deluded by their dreams. I'd like to believe that they are people as well as plot elements. In all good writing your characters would be well developed people even if they are also plot elements.

Originally Posted by innominate

/oh look change in signature...

That's largely because I got tired of you saying that you were confusing me with Cats. Besides, you're right. It just didn't look like a signature that I'd use despite being very pretty. The avatar though... Cats did a great job for me with it.

[gaguri]

Weren't all the characters to some extent deluded by the notion that they were able to have complete control over all those they were interacting with (as well as themselves)? Like how the female lead thought she had control over manipulating the other party's dream and how the male antagonist spoke of how things worked the way he wanted them to in 'his own space'.

I disagree. I think Atsuko and the blad jeezer had clearly different view towards the idea of having control over others via dreaming. The primary question posed by the movie in the beginning was this; is it really ok for men to abuse their advanced technology to go over the 'forbidden line' of sharing other people's secret, repressed thoughts? Atsuko thought it was ok, as long as men are responsible and use it only for medical purposes. The fat genius only cared about the scientific beauty of it, the fact that science could open up such a wonderful possibilities. The bold jeezer claimed that men had no such rights.

However, things obviously change later. The old jeezer himself abuses the power to manipulate other people, because hs fictional character can be powerful and mighty, unlike his crippled physical self. In reality, he's the only one who likes to abuse power to manipulate dreams for personal gains (and his lackey to some extent). Atsuko, fat guy and the doctor all just wished for methods in which they could all share the same dream. Therefore Atsuko destroys the old man and the system, so people can no longer manipulate and invade other people's dreams. I suppose it's similar to the climax of Lain. Eiri wanted a world where everyone can share thoughts through wired. Lain thought it was wrong to force that system to everyone against their will, so she reset the world back to how it was. True, in both cases, Parpika and Lain exercised control over the system, in order to bring it back to its original state, but they are nonetheless an act that supports the idea 'you shouldn't exercise such control over others against their will'.
Hmm how did I end up sidetracked to Lain...I guess I just need more sleep x_x

[innominate]

Hmm, you have a point there, but on the other side that which I'm looking at, the primary question is not whether it's okay for men to abuse technology and go over the line whatsoever, but where this 'forbidden line' is drawn exactly- At which point do we consider manipulation of technology an abuse?

Because the point I was trying to make was that control over other people via dreaming is already in itself an abuse (bring in human rights whatsoever). Baldy of course takes it to the extreme... etc.

I suppose you got sidetracked to Lain because of the apparent parallel between dreams and the internet (or the wired, in Lain's case)... err... but I mean, the symbolism for this is quite heavy already so... =)

Cheers... and now I'm not sure about myself even... =/

[ZODDGUTS]

Saw the movie a few days ago I thought it was good but not as good as Kon's previous films. Like some posters have said, wish that the characters were more fleshed out. I did think the cop was done well, he was the only character that I felt had well done character development in the film so I felt sympathetic towards him with the "regret" he had in his past.

Also gotta say the music was pretty dam awesome. Hope that both Kon and Susumu Hirasawa keep working together.