2012-07-11, 21:34 | Link #43 | |
Organic Mecha
Join Date: May 2012
Age: 31
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Spoiler for Muv Luv:
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2012-07-11, 21:34 | Link #44 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
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Which makes it more imperitive that limited resources be expended responsibly, right?
We are getting some indication of the cost of fielding a unit - couple years of training, the machines themselves, support staff. So what's the typical contribution of a TSF on the field of battle? 10? 100 BETAs? How many will be required to make the overall investment a meaningful exercise? |
2012-07-11, 22:06 | Link #46 |
Truth Martyr
Author
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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Also, don't forget pilot training costs - i was quoted a figue ten years ago that it cost the USN 2 million dollars to train a pilot. Sure, you could skimp on training, but then you end up withncannon fodder like Yui's flight, and this isn't a war where you can afford to use cannon fodder.
Also, i have to wonder if part of the problems the Imperial Japanese were having during the Fall of Kyoto is due to the fact that for the most part, their forces are using 1st-gen TSFs, while the rest of the industrialised world is using primarily 2nd-gen ans 2.5 gen TSFs, and working hard to field 3rs Gen TSFs in large numbers (IIRC the Type-94 Shiranui was the first 3rd gen TSF, but the F-22 is deployed in larger numbers).
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2012-07-11, 22:23 | Link #47 |
Princess or Plunderer?
Join Date: May 2009
Location: the Philippines
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That's what I was wondering about. Japan is severely trying to take out these BETA like all the other countries, but with their current tech, they'll just end up with more BETA fodder and less money.
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2012-07-11, 22:35 | Link #48 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
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Biggest factor, from history in winning a war is the prevailing doctrine and it's fit to the usage. The doctrine is an envolving beast and often times lags behind the technologies. The factors that won US the pacific war was a combination of specific technology - radar + decoding, tactics - squad flying manuvures that maximizes advantages and expose enemy's weaknesses, and strategic - the organisation of of task forces around navel strike power, rather than the outdated doctrine of battleships (surface action) and airpower as support.
If it costs $ dollars to train a pilot, then what's the marginal return on training the pilot an extra $ dollars in terms of survivability? If the answer is 'x minutues', then it makes sense to go make more babies rather than spending a couple years + $ for a couple extra minutes. |
2012-07-11, 22:51 | Link #51 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
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Upon further observation of the Unlimited/Alternative universe, I have began to speculate that one of the largest factors behind the BETA's success, and the state of humanity, is that the latter seems to be unable to stop killing themselves.
In many other stories with similar premises, you usually find humanity united under a common banner; with a unified chain of command and military structure. Not in Muv Luv; the UN appears lucky to be able to acquire any form of resources, the only reason why anyone supports the UN is because notions of nationalistic and cultural pride have been proven to be quite ineffective against the BETA, and in the Unlimited Day After, the UN is completely abandoned. Everyone seems to act as if they beat the BETA on Earth, they could go right back to the Cold War; the US even dumped a TSF designed to fight BETA in favor of a TSF designed to fight other TSFs, who knows what the Soviet Union is doing. |
2012-07-11, 23:03 | Link #52 |
Truth Martyr
Author
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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To an extent, throughout the series, it does seem as though the Americans are a bit better at the whole business of fighting BETA compared to the Japs, what with the use of terrain and tactics. The larger industrial base, as well as the wholescale deployment of the teen fighter series of TSFs, doesn't hurt any.
To put things in perspective, the Shiranui is apparently a limited production model assigned to aces. The F-22 is assigned to battlions. In all fairness to the F-22, it is good at fighting BETA - it's just that it's also very good at fighting TSFs. Making a God Mode Sue was the whole point of Advanced Tactical Fighter program IRL as well.
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2012-07-11, 23:03 | Link #53 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Can battleships hold the line of BETA? no and they would be the target of Laser class if there are no TSF. Artilery support deals the heavier damage to BETA but they need TSF to cover them from BETA direct assault where they will be defenseless once the TSF squad annilihated.
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2012-07-11, 23:07 | Link #54 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
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2012-07-11, 23:21 | Link #55 | |
Banned
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2012-07-11, 23:40 | Link #56 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
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BETA would traverse anykind of land terrain if they are given enough time and what's the worst scenario for Battleship? Fort class coming out of nowhere carrying Laser class with them and engage for direct battle. Also Battleship's cannon can be also shot down by Laser class
TSF halts or prevent the BETA from breaking the defensive line where they mainly engage Grappler, Destroyer or tank class which provide them natural cover against Laser class unless they fly too high. They also serve as Decoy to certain extent as they become high priority target for BETA which at least allow the artilery shells not to be shot down much. If the line is broken, BETA could even deploy their forces beyond the line which Laser class may even be deployed.
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Last edited by YaminoSeigi; 2012-07-11 at 23:51. |
2012-07-11, 23:50 | Link #57 | |
今宵の虎徹は血に飢えている
Join Date: Jan 2009
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Quote:
Unless you pull a Gunbuster style Black Hole bomb or something...
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2012-07-12, 00:08 | Link #59 |
Truth Martyr
Author
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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It's kinda like Starship Troopers the movie: we're all really hosed. Also, unfortunately for what good the Americans can do, they can't be everywhere and saving the day: the Theodore Roosevelt sorties her Tomcats (Jolly Rogers ftw) and the rest of her air wing, but they won't be enough to turn the tide. But it's a brave gesture.
And rather refreshing, compared to common portrayals of Americans in anime.
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2012-07-12, 00:10 | Link #60 | |
Storm Vanguard
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Type-00
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but wow. I didn't know the Type-94 is the first 3rd generation TSF in the world... D: As for America, I like how they managed to keep being on the lead when it comes to TSF development and not Japan. It's unfortunate that the latter beat them in creating the first 3rd gen TSF, but at least the Black Widow and Raptors turned out better in the end. lol. Still, the Type-0 is still the number one in my book when it comes to design. <3 Last edited by Silvance; 2012-07-12 at 00:29. |
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military science fiction, visual novel |
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