Needless

[neko mata]

Originally Posted by Soji

First of all welcome.
Returning to the topic ,you are right that scene and their relationship can be seen as that of Cain and Abel,but Cain and Abel exist or better they will exist in Needless in Needless 1.5 we see Cain and Abel should be his sister from what I read on this topic.

Well, I haven't read needless 1.5 yet. So I didn't known there is going to be a Cain and Abel in the future. But, in the manga "Hells angels" they have a different version of Cain and Abel story. (It help coming up with the idea). Since, in Hells angels instead of Cain killing Abel because god look favor to his younger brother. It was because Able closer to Eve then him. Just like Cruz is with Eve, but I don't think Aruka cars about that tho. But, I still think Aruka wants a relationship with her little brother.

[neko mata]

Originally Posted by Deathscyther

Wow, I never knew topic of the Needless manga had this many pages =o

Spoiler for chapter 85:

It looks like Cruz is in big trouble. Last time Blade came to save him when he was all alone against an enemy, but it seems he won't be rescued this time. Blade and Saten both have their hands full with Strom.

Will he rely on his brains to win this fight or will he have to show us his 'power'? Seeing as he's being held by those creatures, running and thinking of a plan is out of the question. So I'd have to say this is the perfect time to show us what he can do.

Maybe AnN will show up again? AnN might be his own power which is trying to come out. AnN might be a reaction from the Eden seeds entering his body when he was revived. This 'power' saved him several times (PF zero blast, falling of a cliff, during his Mozes action in the memory world).

She might be some kind of messenger of God as well though, who might is trying to lead Cruz towards something. If this is true maybe not Eve but God and AnN saved Cruz when his sister 'killed' him. AnN saves him when he comes close to dying or straying from his path, so that he'll continue down his path. Maybe God has chosen him to be the new 'son of god'.

Either way, I think all Cruz needs is a little push before he truly 'awaken'. Be it a fragment or some kind of godly power.

Anyways, nice meeting you all.

Or it could be the Eden seed in him that will awaken his needless powers. Since in page 4 and 5 of chapter 75 Saten and Ishiyama talked about how it change the body, And help create needless.

Spoiler for picture:

Also in page 16 of chapter 75. We figure out that Ishiyama has one also, and he beat Mio pretty easily with it's help.

Spoiler for picture:

[Avvesione]

Welcome to both neko mata and Deathscyther! It's always nice to see more people posting here.

I like the idea of Aruka and Cruz being like Abel and Cain (the letters match in english!) since that hasn't been thought of yet. It was mentioned maybe a year ago now but there's another theory about the relationship between Aruka and Cruz.

Using Christian terms, this theory says that Aruka is like the Ark of the Covenant (the old covenant) between God and the Moses's followers, whereas Cruz is like the new covenant, Jesus Christ. The names are similar here as Aruka is Ark and Cruz is Cross (which I'm sure some would say is a lasting sign of the new covenant). That also plays into their personalities a bit, although that's a harder argument to make. Your idea seems to play into their personalities more. Cain is the older, eviler one who kills Abel when he becomes jealous. Aruka did just that when she saw Cruz with all his friends protecting him in the Third Shelter.

If you want to go more off this theory, Abel is a shepard, which is another popular symbol in Judaism and Christianity. Cruz acts like a shepard, gathering his flock (of Needless) for him. Now, Cruz is trying to gather his friends back together. That's just something to think about.

Originally Posted by Deathscyther

Spoiler for chapter 85:

Maybe AnN will show up again? AnN might be his own power which is trying to come out. AnN might be a reaction from the Eden seeds entering his body when he was revived. This 'power' saved him several times (PF zero blast, falling of a cliff, during his Mozes action in the memory world).

She might be some kind of messenger of God as well though, who might is trying to lead Cruz towards something. If this is true maybe not Eve but God and AnN saved Cruz when his sister 'killed' him. AnN saves him when he comes close to dying or straying from his path, so that he'll continue down his path. Maybe God has chosen him to be the new 'son of god'.

Either way, I think all Cruz needs is a little push before he truly 'awaken'. Be it a fragment or some kind of godly power.

I do hope ANn appears in the next chapter, although I wouldn't be disappointed if she didn't and Cruz was saved some other way (like him using a fragment). If ANn does reappear, I'm expecting to get more clues about her relationship with Cruz, links to past events, and the extent of her powers. What I'm most interested in is her relationship with Cruz, mainly because of how she dealt with him earlier on in this arc.

If you look at when she first appears in the manga (Chapter 82), she isn't even looking at Cruz. She's looking at that mass of emptiness in Blade's memories. She then floats down and examines Cruz for a bit before adding that light to his legs. She doesn't really interact with him but gives him the details of how to proceed and then just disappears. Since she was invisible to everyone but Cruz, she obviously has some special relationship with him but not a personal one. I wonder what's the meaning of that if she's been the one saving him this whole time.

[neko mata]

Originally Posted by Avvesione

Welcome to both neko mata and Deathscyther! It's always nice to see more people posting here.

I like the idea of Aruka and Cruz being like Abel and Cain (the letters match in english!) since that hasn't been thought of yet. It was mentioned maybe a year ago now but there's another theory about the relationship between Aruka and Cruz.

Using Christian terms, this theory says that Aruka is like the Ark of the Covenant (the old covenant) between God and the Moses's followers, whereas Cruz is like the new covenant, Jesus Christ. The names are similar here as Aruka is Ark and Cruz is Cross (which I'm sure some would say is a lasting sign of the new covenant). That also plays into their personalities a bit, although that's a harder argument to make. Your idea seems to play into their personalities more. Cain is the older, eviler one who kills Abel when he becomes jealous. Aruka did just that when she saw Cruz with all his friends protecting him in the Third Shelter.

If you want to go more off this theory, Abel is a shepard, which is another popular symbol in Judaism and Christianity. Cruz acts like a shepard, gathering his flock (of Needless) for him. Now, Cruz is trying to gather his friends back together. That's just something to think about.



I do hope ANn appears in the next chapter, although I wouldn't be disappointed if she didn't and Cruz was saved some other way (like him using a fragment). If ANn does reappear, I'm expecting to get more clues about her relationship with Cruz, links to past events, and the extent of her powers. What I'm most interested in is her relationship with Cruz, mainly because of how she dealt with him earlier on in this arc.

If you look at when she first appears in the manga (Chapter 82), she isn't even looking at Cruz. She's looking at that mass of emptiness in Blade's memories. She then floats down and examines Cruz for a bit before adding that light to his legs. She doesn't really interact with him but gives him the details of how to proceed and then just disappears. Since she was invisible to everyone but Cruz, she obviously has some special relationship with him but not a personal one. I wonder what's the meaning of that if she's been the one saving him this whole time.

Hmm, never though of it like that. But, it make sense why Cruz is the kinder/ smarter sibling.

But I hope Ann shows up in the next chapter to. I'm also hoping by the end of arc it will explain her and Cruz relationship more. Plus, this is the most perfect time for it. Since, I don't think Saten, and Blade can help him with his current situation. So, most likely Ann is going to help out, or Cruz is finally going to awaken his fragment. Also, we can't forget Cruz still have some of the Eden seed inside of him. So, that might help awaken his hidden fragment.

[neko mata]

hey, can anybody mind sending me a link to the the raw chapter of 85?

[Om Nerabdator]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Wait a second, could Blade/Eve use Doppleganger to permanently change Cruz into a girl?

oh i bloody hope so ^^

i know its weird but cruz being a girl just seems right.....

[Soji]

First of all welcome to Deathscyther!
Back to the topic.
I like the theory say by Deathscyther and what Avvesione say as well...but it seems you are forgetting something important is true that Needless use more Christian topic..like the second ,Adam ,Eve ecc.
but also in various other legends to the various fragment, then you can't stop only to Christianity to make theories, especially with an author so clever.
I mean that we have Voras with Gorgon hair and Aruka with Agnishwattas(Flame God Breath )talking about Aruka fragment is interesting which legend is .

Spoiler for Agni:

Agni (Sanskrit: अग्नि) is a Hindu deity, one of the most important of the Vedic gods. He is the god of fire[1] and the acceptor of sacrifices. The sacrifices made to Agni go to the deities because Agni is a messenger from and to the other gods. He is ever-young, because the fire is re-lit every day, and also immortal.
Agni, the Vedic god of fire who presides over the earth, has made the transition into the Hindu pantheon of gods, without losing his importance. With Vayu and Indra, who presided over the air and sky, he is one of the supreme gods in the Rig Veda. The link between heaven and earth, he is associated with Vedic sacrifice, taking offerings to the other world in the fire. His vehicle is the ram.
He is one of the Guardians of the directions, representing the southeast. Agni stands for knowledge for it is seen by the learned people, covering all things that move and do not move and because it summons the Devatas endowed with knowledge the light Agni emits is the light of knowledge, therefore, it is also known as the illuminator of knowledge who lights up the path leading to Truth. Agni reveals the true nature of one's own self because it is the innermost light that shines ever so brightly in all things living and nonliving as their inner consciousness (impeller) .

Surely suit her and she is one of the four heavenly Knights of Arclight.
And Aruka has the reputation of being cruel and merciless killer even among the same components of Simeon.
In any case it would be interesting if Cruz had a fragment like Aruka but linked to Varuna.
For those who do not know is the same religion of Agni.

Spoiler for Varuna:

Varuna is an ancient Vedic chief deity and the most important asura in the Rigveda. He is the god of the sky, rain, the celestial ocean, law and the underworld. He is usually seen in the form of a man, but can take the form of a woman or be androgynous depending on his needs. Some sources credit Varuna as the creator of the Three Worlds.
Despite the fact that Varuna is an asura, he is more concerned with social and moral affairs than the destruction of nature, leading to his personification as supreme keeper of law and order. He is also paired with the god Mitra as god of the oath or twinned with Indra.
Varuna is also a god of the sky, usually associated with the dark half of the sky known as the celestial ocean, and in that sane respect is considered a god of the waters and rain. He would later become the keeper of the souls of the drowned, making his a god of the dead and able to grant immortality.
In Hinduism, he is one of the four directional guardians of the Lokapala and represents the west. He is a lunar deity that is attended by the naga race.

Of course it was only to make a wild guess but the similarities are there and if AnN is a part of Cruz it would make sense if the fragment of Cruz would be something like this.
And of course I also hope that AnN will reappear in the next chapter and in this metting I hope they will talk, finally clarifying their relationship to us.

[Sayo A.]

Originally Posted by Avvesione

I like the idea of Aruka and Cruz being like Abel and Cain (the letters match in english!) since that hasn't been thought of yet. It was mentioned maybe a year ago now but there's another theory about the relationship between Aruka and Cruz.

Using Christian terms, this theory says that Aruka is like the Ark of the Covenant (the old covenant) between God and the Moses's followers, whereas Cruz is like the new covenant, Jesus Christ. The names are similar here as Aruka is Ark and Cruz is Cross (which I'm sure some would say is a lasting sign of the new covenant).

I was hoping this would come up again sometime. Equating Arca and Cruz to God's old and new covenants (and having a conflict between them) is a nice theory, and it makes a lot of sense... but I found something interesting on Imai's website that might put a few holes in that.

Here's what he has to say about the names:

「クルス」はスペイン語で「十字架」の意味。
「アルカ」はラテン語で「方舟」。

This tells us Cruz is Spanish for "cross". Which we knew already. Also, Arca is Latin for "ark" (which is why I prefer that spelling to "Aruka", btw). OK, we knew that too. So what? Well, here's the interesting part. I looked up the characters used for "ark" (方舟), and it turns out they refer not to the Ark of the Covenant, but to Noah's Ark. In English, it's basically the same word - a container or vessel that keeps its contents safe. But in Japanese they're apparently quite different words, written with different kanji.

So the question is, is there some meaning behind this reference? Or did Imai just think "Arca" was a nice name? I have no answers. (Except... The name "Arclight" could equally well be transcribed as "Arkwright", i.e. a builder of arks. Which would make him Noah. I have no idea what that means, though. I'm probably overthinking this now...)

Spoiler for ch 85:

That thing on page 30 is almost certainly an HR Giger reference. What do you think?

[Ynot]

Hmmm, I can appreciate the link to Aruka and Noah's ark. It prevented total extinction of every living thing according to the bible, but pretty much anything or anyone who wasn't part of the solution was left to die. I can easily associate that unforgiving attitude with Aruka. The willingness to sacrifice what's dear to you for a "higher" purpose.

[Om Nerabdator]

i have learned already from needless : Expect the unexpected!

All you guys have good arguments but once the next chapter is released most of them will fly out the window, which is one of the best things about needless, its never predictable

When does these usually come out?

[Soji]

Originally Posted by matty543

i have learned already from needless : Expect the unexpected!

All you guys have good arguments but once the next chapter is released most of them will fly out the window, which is one of the best things about needless, its never predictable

When does these usually come out?

You are right and it is for this reason that Needless is so pleasant to read.
As for your question usually the new chapter comes out the 19th of every month or so at least I know.

[Ynot]

Since things are a little slow here atm I thought I'd mention what might be a small inconsistency in chapter 85.

Spoiler for needless:

Look, no circle arrow on his hand. The first panel on the same page(17) also doesn't show a sign of an arrow but I guess that can also be because it's obscured by his fingers.

[Avvesione]

Originally Posted by Ynot

Since things are a little slow here atm I thought I'd mention what might be a small inconsistency in chapter 85.

Yeah, there's always going to be inconsistencies like that in every anime/manga. That's the problem with reading the same chapter over and over and over again. And it doesn't help that we have to wait a month between chapters. As long as they're minor details in the art, I don't mind.

The one I noticed has to deal with that iron gate. When Saten grabbed that iron gate, he felt an electric shock. Blade grabbed the gate twice (once in 84 and later in 85) and was never shocked. Then again, it could be because Blade is more resistant to electricity due to some of the fragments he's learned? So it's not really an inconsistency...

[Nvis]

Just how is an iron gate stopping 2 of the most powerful Needlesses?(Stigmata)

[neko mata]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Just how is an iron gate stopping 2 of the most powerful Needlesses?(Stigmata)

It wouldn't have, since Saten could have froze it then took it out in a second. So that is the reason why the trap door is there.

[Avvesione]

Originally Posted by Nvis

Just how is an iron gate stopping 2 of the most powerful Needlesses?(Stigmata)

Well, it's gotta be a pretty strong gate to keep Toria and other monsters from escaping Mengroze's room.

---

And this was brought up a while ago but I never thought to mention it during its discussion but... Blade is encased in Strom's ice and that doesn't look good. People have said that he still has Doppelganger and will be able to repair himself. The only problem with that is... how will he get out of that ice?

This is Strom's ice, which isn't exactly normal ice. This stuff could only be melted by Aruka's fragment. I don't see how Blade's body will last in encapsulated in that ice tree. I can see them salvaging Blade's brain for the operation and then using that to create his body from several organs and metal.

I just don't see Blade surviving this battle intact... and I'm having trouble seeing how me might survive (even though we know he does).

[neko mata]

Man, I can't till 86 DX
But, I been wondering. What will happen when Saten and Yamada when they get out of blade's memoirs. Since, after reading the the latest manga chapters of Rosario+Vampire season 2. And, in both mangas they are in the same Situations. But, I'm also thinking that both Saten and Yamada bodies had to be teleported to Blade's memoirs. Since, on page 20 on chapter 76 you can see Saten reaching for Yamada hand when he was stab.

Spoiler for picture:

I don't think he will do that on less he knew Yamada was going to be teleported. Plus, if it like Rosario+Vampire season 2 then Yamada does fall unconscious with his soul traveling to blades memories just for being stab by the door. Then I don't think just touching him will make Saten follow suit after him to Blades memories.

[Soji]

Originally Posted by Avvesione

Well, it's gotta be a pretty strong gate to keep Toria and other monsters from escaping Mengroze's room.

---

And this was brought up a while ago but I never thought to mention it during its discussion but... Blade is encased in Strom's ice and that doesn't look good. People have said that he still has Doppelganger and will be able to repair himself. The only problem with that is... how will he get out of that ice?

This is Strom's ice, which isn't exactly normal ice. This stuff could only be melted by Aruka's fragment. I don't see how Blade's body will last in encapsulated in that ice tree. I can see them salvaging Blade's brain for the operation and then using that to create his body from several organs and metal.

I just don't see Blade surviving this battle intact... and I'm having trouble seeing how me might survive (even though we know he does).

Honestly, I have the same concerns after reviewing the raw, I hope the translated chapter will not confirm this, but how it is Blade seems completely hibernate which means any function of his body is suspended.
One thing that worries me is how much Blade can stand in that state of hibernation,if I am right now all the vital functions of Blade are stopped working which makes me think that his own heart has stopped .. if someone does not quickly release him ... I am afraid he will not survive in retrospect probably not in danger of dying be frozen but under the blows of strom.
Strom seems to want to demolish Blade piece by piece and the problem isSaten is blocked as well then wait for him to help blade is not an option.
Now I have a hypothesis about how the next chapter will take place with what we know but is a crazy theory.

Spoiler for just in case:

Im almost sure that the next chapter will begin with Yamada and probably only a page or two will tell us that happens to Blade and Saten.
Returning to Yamada I have the impression that when DemonToria hit him he will end up in the cage with the other mengroze's esperiment and they will be free as well. (As Kurusu had assumed).
The thing I find interesting is .. if this happens no one will see what will happen to him even mengroze which means that anyone who acts to help or whatever happens no one other than Yamada, us and Mengroze's experiments will see what will happen.
The thing that is certain is that some Mengroze's experiments will continue to attack Yamada inside the cage while the other probably DemonToria begin to unleash hell on Lifiaburg.
Now if Yamada ends up in this situation while Mengroze's trying experiments try to finish him of.. He will probably start to feel helpless and disappointed for not being able to help Eve and Blade which will probably lead to the reappearance of AnN (as Avessione and I hope).
Now I see 3 possibilities if sincerely Ann reappears over a conversation between the two.
1.ANN itself starts to fight invisible or not helping Yamada is probably at the end of Arc herself will be back in the real world with Yamada which would result in different scenes ironic knowing blade (in case Ann will remain visible at all) and if she are more with Yamada has since been shown to have a relationship with him. In the case remains invisible is always funny situation because others will think that Yamada is crazy talking to himself.
2.Ann Yamada helps to awaken his Fragment probably something opposite to that of Aruk (as I suggested a few posts ago, taking it from the same religion to Aruk) .. if this happens in the next Arc Yamada probably try to find AnN in the real world and he already have 666 at the end of arc , which can always inquire if he knows something about ANN (obviously not that he answers it.)
3.After a lengthy explanation of their link the two together, probably after the body of Yamada and was severely damaged by the various Mengroze's creations . If this happens will be interesting to see the reaction of his comrades in the real world once you come back and I say especially the reaction of Blade and Eve (especially that she does not see Yamada a long time).
In any case, whatever happens Im pretty sure the chapter will end with Yamada sees Blade in that state and the final battle against Strom to happen.

Well this was just a theory that I came up with the excitement as the next chapter have more or less 10 days to come out.

But, I been wondering. What will happen when Saten and Yamada when they get out of blade's memoirs. Since, after reading the the latest manga chapters of Rosario+Vampire season 2. And, in both mangas they are in the same Situations. But, I'm also thinking that both Saten and Yamada bodies had to be teleported to Blade's memoirs. Since, on page 20 on chapter 76 you can see Saten reaching for Yamada hand when he was stab.

Yeah you right that arc is like this..but at least Yamada and Saten is not likely to die standing too long in Blade's memories .. pity this memory can kill them though.

I don't think he will do that on less he knew Yamada was going to be teleported. Plus, if it like Rosario+Vampire season 2 then Yamada does fall unconscious with his soul traveling to blades memories just for being stab by the door. Then I don't think just touching him will make Saten follow suit after him to Blades memories.

So what do you think Saten has impaled himself with the same shards of memories?
I doubt this...but seeing how much is determined to protect Yamada is an option to not discard.

[Homura7]

Guess I wasn't the only one who thought about the severity of the situation. Glad to know.

Spoiler for spoiler:

Sure Blade has the Doppelganger, but what he can do when his whole body is frozen, wich makes the fragment nonfuctional.

I dunno if Blade is gonna survive, but one thing I know for sure, he won't come from this unscathed.

Guess Saten was telling the truth this time, if Blade dies it's all over.

[Soji]

^Obviously you have not been the only one who thought about the situation.
thinking back to all the chapters read so far .. the current situation is even worse during the third shelter Yamada was put in a situation so horrible.

Spoiler for spoiler:

and as you said if you die blade is the end not to mention that there is still Eve to save ,even more .. I think the current arc is perfect for Yamada to do something really exceptional, especially after the last chapter not only because he is trapped, but also because the same blade is in a desperate situation. Which brings the two people closest to him (now) both in a deadly situation ... even if this time awakens a fragment or if it turns ANN is really a part of him ... I think will never happen again. This is the moment in which Yamada has to act once and for all and not thinking.