No Game No Life - generic discussion thread (NO SPOILERS)

[Solace]

That. was. amazing.

Seriously, I couldn't believe how fast the time went, I was sucked right up into the pacing. Everything was awesome. By far my favorite show of the season.

[kukuru]

Originally Posted by Eclipze

I don't see it being any more awkward than what they did for the Janken in the previous episode. I expected more of that, but alas, the story seems to be heading towards the direction of randomness and cheating as much as possible.

Then again, not explaining the rules allows them to simply write off any notion of rules to begin with, from things like absolutely destroying the whole "alternating turn" part of the game and the silly side-switching fest we have from obvious cheats (and words of the MC being as effective as an elf's spell).

Its also convenient that the general rules of games in the world does not include a clause like "if there are obvious signs of cheating the game is cancelled/restarted". Next thing you know we'll probably have dragons flying around attacking our MCs in a horse-race and it being totally fine because they could not prove that cheating had occurred.

The challenger dictates the rules and the game, not the receiver. You can say what we you want, but no game will happen.

You catch more flies with honey, and there's no way around it. You can make any stupid rule you want, but acchentte has to happen for the game to start. Didn't jenkenpo showed that?

Also this is the technique the bandits used in the missing scene in the beginning. Something along the lines of " you can't go until you played my rigged game"

[Random Wanderer]

Originally Posted by kukuru

The challenger dictates the rules and the game, not the receiver. You can say what we you want, but no game will happen.

You've got that backwards. Rule 5: The challenged party has the right to decide the rules of the game. That's what happened here: Sora made the challenge, Clammy/Kurami set the rules. In the Janken game Sora both challenged and set the rules, but that was simply because Steph didn't choose to exercise her right to set the rules herself. She could have decided to have had nothing to do with his way of playing, and decided to use her own game to settle things between them.

[kukuru]

Originally Posted by Random Wanderer

You've got that backwards. Rule 5: The challenged party has the right to decide the rules of the game. That's what happened here: Sora made the challenge, Clammy/Kurami set the rules. In the Janken game Sora both challenged and set the rules, but that was simply because Steph didn't choose to exercise her right to set the rules herself. She could have decided to have had nothing to do with his way of playing, and decided to use her own game to settle things between them.

Not quite sora provoked Steph to challenge. That's why the pledges are so trickly. Remember the line "We settle things with with playing a game don't we?" Is a taunt not a request.

[Xacual]

Originally Posted by kukuru

Not quite sora provoked Steph to challenge. That's why the pledges are so trickly. Remember the line "We settle things with with playing a game don't we?" Is a taunt not a request.

No Sora was the challenger, there's a reason it was brought up that Steph basically gave up her rights because she thought the game was fine. It was probably more clear in the LN and manga.

[Gundamx]

Originally Posted by hai_san

Well mmh... there was no strategy or tactic in the game just pure crap/cheating... i had hope for brilliance but they are just made up.

it's real time strategy battle not chess
think of it like Europa Universalis -> you can attack A and B without waiting for them
+ bribe + ally + ally might back-stab you and not join you or worse join your enemy in war...etc

[Nork22]

Originally Posted by hai_san

Well mmh... there was no strategy or tactic in the game just pure crap/cheating... i had hope for brilliance but they are just made up.

It wasn't chess the moment Clammy said the pieces have a will of their own, and she was ordering them to move forward instead of moving them like regular chess pieces.

[Gan_HOPE326]

Originally Posted by hai_san

Well mmh... there was no strategy or tactic in the game just pure crap/cheating... i had hope for brilliance but they are just made up.

Well, it's absolutely true that it didn't go the "clever" way I thought it could... but I'm fine with it . I'll be happy if they ever make a proper sports manga/anime about chess (Hikaru no Go style), but chess is hard to nail down without true expertise - it'll come out either as boring to non players, or as stupidly naive to players. This episode ditched that trap and went just for the silly fun route . It wasn't interesting strategy-wise, true, but it totally cracked me up, so personally I'm perfectly happy with it. I'm taking this as a comedy/fantasy anime in the vein of something like Hataraku Maou-sama, blending a somewhat serious plot with lots of jokes and silly references and parodies.

[Hmm....]

Originally Posted by Gundamx

it's real time strategy battle not chess
think of it like Europa Universalis -> you can attack A and B without waiting for them
+ bribe + ally + ally might back-stab you and not join you or worse join your enemy in war...etc

Actually, EU series or any RTS for that matter do follow their own fixed rule.

The game in this episode follow none so far. Whether it is because none exist or it is because Kurami didn't bother to explain and Sora didn't bother to ask.

Kurami: I can move my piece however I like !
Sora: I can skip your turn as well !!
Kurami: I can also brainwash your pieces too !!!
Sora: Howabout I use brainwashed piece to brainwash yours, hah !!!!

Things keep being made up and there is no limit in sight lol

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

I'm not getting why this would be controversial to anyone (maybe it's something that happens at the end of game?), but I would damn if wasn't fun to watch!

I personally enjoy it. However, I can see why this is not for everyone. Those who expect an intelligence mind game would be disappointed. Things keep magically popping up in middle of the games all the time. This series is not about exploiting the game rule. Both side outright cheat each other in every game they play.

This series is different from Liar game, Death Note or HxH. It is not to be taken too seriously, at least in gameplay aspect. The anime even take an even more comedic route than LN which is great in itself. I enjoy it greatly.

[Tenzen12]

Key point is pieces have own mind, everything else is just natural consenquence.

-It does have mind on it's own - it can be conviced
-It does have mind on it's own - it can be brainwashed
-It does have mind on it's own - it can disobey artificaly established rules, like turns or moves

Sora won that game because he realised that. It's perfectly logical and fair and considering it was stated on VERY BEGENNING, It's far from ass pull as well.

It's pretty clear that in this show most important thing for chalanger is not to win in clearly established games, but realise what kind of game they are forced play in first place witihout getting misleaded by superficial similiarities with already existing ones.

[Azure King]

am i the only person to find this epi abit too random?

[Hmm....]

Now, now, It's not like I have a problem with the show.
If you believe "pieces have their own mind" is enough to rationalize everything that happen so far, then so be it.
It is entertaining for me nevertheless. However it is far from intelligence and I can see why some people may not like it.



EDIT:

Originally Posted by Azure King

am i the only person to find this epi abit too random?

It is fucking random and it is fucking hilarious. That's why it is fucking awesome !!

[AC-Phoenix]

Rationalize it with 'elven cheating magic that backfired'

[Tenzen12]

But it didn't backfired at all, elven cheating magic worked exactly how it was supposed work, but it wasn't enough enslave pieces mind completely.

[Craxuan]

Yep. The point of this game is to prove one's potential as a king.

The game was disguised to look like chess, but was in fact not one. This is the first step - to realize that your people aren't just pawns and pieces to be used and abused like toys.

The second step is to realize that as the king, you are the one who has to direct your people and make them listen to you, or they'll just listen to their own survival instincts and be destroyed by the enemies' massive and more united forces. Charisma comes in play here. The fact that Sora instantly saw through that with exception to the queen all other chess pieces are 'male' (duh) and brought up an important fact: men will ALWAYS fight for their women, lol. In an instant he turned the tide around when the chess pieces started moving on their own accord and fought.

I don't need to mention basic intellect, do I? Don't think of this as a chess game since it's not, think of it like a 16 on 16 FPS or MOBA game of sorts. There were basic strategies like flanking and surrounding and such, but in general they're complex enough that presenting it on anime format is not easy.

Anyway, to the next point, courage. Sora took his chance with the glimpse of inspiration and risked his own life to protect his chess pieces. Remember, Kurami used magic to control her chess pieces, so that means it IS possible for the chess piece to break out of the mind control as long as its will was strong enough. His gamble paid off. He proceeds to convince the enemy Queen to be freed of the tyranny of Kurami, and from that point onwards that Queen became a symbol of hope and freedom, something like a saint or goddess.

By forcing Kurami to make a move first (instead of the Queen making her move, which could be seen as an act to CONTROL, instead of LIBERATE), the black pieces were forced to slay their own beloved queen, and as you can see they cannot do it. Choosing a female to be the proxy had an even bigger effect, because what kind of normal man would kill a woman in cold blood, especially when they're in the wrong? Hence, the state of the game you're seeing now.

Though obviously, Kurami still has a way out. She could use a number of troops to stall the queen and try to wipe out Sora's remaining forces as quickly as possible - after all, the only one who can convert the troops was the queen, and she's only one person. Alternately, she can increase the power of her brainwashing magic and attempt to stop the conversion. Not sure how Sora's going to deal with that really.

Also, the anime removed some elements that were in the Light Novel:

Spoiler for Light Novel:

The Queen was supposed to be a 3rd, neutral party of her own with the color of red. Here she's white because she's practically helping Sora anyway, I guess.

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

But it didn't backfired at all, elven cheating magic worked exactly how it was supposed work, but it wasn't enough enslave pieces mind completely.

Kurumi's facial expressions tell other tales though.

[Archaic]

Originally Posted by Craxuan

Also, the anime removed some elements that were in the Light Novel:

Spoiler for Light Novel:

The Queen was supposed to be a 3rd, neutral party of her own with the color of red. Here she's white because she's practically helping Sora anyway, I guess.

Spoiler for Light Novel:

Actually, she turned white in the light novel as well, at least initially. She only turned to Red after Sora gave an additional little speech about how he couldn't order her to turn her and her fellows to turn their weapons on their own people, and how she should lead her own people in place of the mad king. I expect we'll see that at the start of next week's episode.

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Kurumi's facial expressions tell other tales though.

Probably because she wasn't expecting Sora to use her own schemes against her.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

Kurumi's facial expressions tell other tales though.

She was loosing. Her expression is totaly unrelated to elven cheating magic.

[Gundamx]

Originally Posted by Hmm....

Actually, EU series or any RTS for that matter do follow their own fixed rule.

The game in this episode follow none so far. Whether it is because none exist or it is because Kurami didn't bother to explain and Sora didn't bother to ask.

Kurami: I can move my piece however I like !
Sora: I can skip your turn as well !!
Kurami: I can also brainwash your pieces too !!!
Sora: Howabout I use brainwashed piece to brainwash yours, hah !!!!

Things keep being made up and there is no limit in sight lol

that simple
because they don't know the fixed rules
it's like someone said lets play game
it look like chess
but' its not chess =they don't know rule = so Sora try to find them and to find hole in them

in war game like EU I don't wait for enemy to build army to attack me but attack all his land/pieces at same time without giving him any chance to reset
(when I started playing EU for first time -> I just send one army to one enemy land to fight his army and conquer that land-> till I find out I can just built more armies ->split them -> fight all enemies armies and conquer all of their lands at same time)

that what happened when you start game without knowing it rule or you think you know it but you don't

for example they only wait for each other because they though it was rule but it was not since it was real time battle instead of turn phase battle

I guess she herself don't know everything about this game and treat it like chess with hacker code
after all it was elf game not human game