2021-07-02, 18:51 | Link #61 |
Ancient Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Really enjoyed this one, mostly for its production values (visually and audio wise it’s amazing), and because it is based on a classic Tomino story that’s adapted by more competent directors / writers it feels like a very polished classic Gundam story. I tend to agree it feels a little slow but I like the buildup. The only complain I have is spending so much time on a terrible character like Hathaway and making him the POV of the audience which makes it harder to connect with, but that’s a fault of the original novel I guess, and knowing the ending this isn’t necessarily a bad thing.
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2021-07-02, 18:57 | Link #62 | |
Operation sneaky sneaks
IT Support
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Hic et ubique
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I have noticed that one of our number is his best to try and lecture the rest of us again on morality. For his benefit, I present what a useful and well-reasoned analysis looks like.
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Last edited by Infinite Zenith; 2022-11-03 at 11:37. |
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2021-07-02, 20:29 | Link #63 | |
Black Steel Knight
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Indonesia
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Btw, it's interesting to see Gundam newcomers' reaction on HF:
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Last edited by Obelisk ze Tormentor; 2021-07-03 at 16:35. |
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2021-07-04, 19:12 | Link #64 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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That CG Mobile Suit intro reminded me of those ending credit scenes of Superhero movies. I didn't realize part of it was recapping Char's Counterattack before I saw Nu Gundam fighting the Alpha Azieru .
To be honest Hathaway going terrorist and trying to usurp the Federation to carry out the ideals Quess jumped ship for as a means of becoming the man he thinks she'd be interested in...is very Hathaway. Kensho Ono does well with emotional subtle yet complicated characters, and I think that fit Hathaway here. He realizes that his terrorism isn't necessarily the best way to go about it, and the average joe on Earth doesn't want to get dragged into space any more than the space colonists want to be held at the whim of the Earth, but it's all Hathaway can think to do . Kenneth seems like a decent guy, honestly, even if he's on the opposing side of our protagonist. Compared to Junichi Suwabe's other roles he's pretty refreshingly earnest and kind of sweet. He seems like someone driven by his instincts, for better or for worse, but isn't necesarilly sincere about them, but he's not a malicious or bad person. Really the only evil act he committed in the film was torturing Gawman, a prisoner, and using him as a hostage . Gigi is absolutely gorgeous. Like, every part of her is absolutely alluring and perfect, right down to being voiced by Reina Ueda. She comes off as this free-spirited, aloof, young woman with her own thoughts about the world but who seems passionate partially because of how unfulfilling her life is. You're never sure quite what she's thinking, and that seems to also play into her romantic interests as she flirts with both Hathaway and Kenneth while at the same time keeping them both at a distance. But as much as she involves herself with dangerous men, she's not prepared for witnessing killing and destruction . Is Gigi a Newtype? It seemed like she psychically connected with Hathaway for a second there . Hathaway comes off all unassuming and nice until suddenly he's John Wick with a gun in his hand . So the official record is that Hathaway was a "hero" for stealing a Mobile Suit and managing to kill an enemy in his first sortie which is why he wasn't punished too severely for it...but, like, what was the report of Chan's death? Did Hathaway not tell anyone what actually happened? Did he go down as the one who took the Alpha Azieru out? I forget if he killed a Neo-Zeon grunt during the battle. Y'know, kind of bothers me that Hathaway is still obsessed with Quess but doesn't seem to have PTSD over killing Chan . At least Hathaway has finally realized that becoming enamored with, shall we say..."special" girls never ends well. Not that it stops him from still thinking about Quess . Gigi looks good in absolutely anything, be it a dress, pantsuit, bikini (with her top off ), or even sweats and a t-shirt from a secondhand Federation store . Gigi sleeps in the nude because of course she does . Hathaway and Gigi run into a seemingly random couple involved in an affair? Like, it seems like they were waking up naked and trying not to get caught and she came right out of the shower...I dunno, it had no bearing on the plot but they paid attention to it . Mafty's people use units that look more like they'd fit with Zeon. I guess if Mafty is really carrying on Char's will... The protagonist doesn't actually get into a Gundam until the climax, so instead we get to meet the antagonist Gundam firsthand when the Penelope turns up. Seeing Hathaway and Gigi have to survive during a Mobile Suit battle was pretty refreshing. Honestly seemed like the Federation were causing more collateral damage than Mafty's people were . I thought Kenneth would end up being the classic Gundam rival for Hathaway and pilot the Penelope, but instead it's a guy named Lane Aim (sounds like Lame Aim). Hathaway compares Lane to what he used to be like, so I guess that's supposed to factor into their rivalry? Although Kenneth is pretty critical of Lane's piloting and Lane didn't stand a chance against Hathaway in their fight at the end, so maybe Kenneth will take over . Mafty's crew all turn up at the end and we get pretty casual introductions to them. I guess the second film will possibly go more into their personalities, characters, and motivations because they seem like an interesting bunch just from a design standpoint and what little we see. Although I know there's only so much a movie can develop such a large group, and the core story is obviously centered around Hathaway, Gigi, and Kenneth . Well, Hathaway was right that Gigi wasn't going to intentionally give him away and that Kenneth would figure it out...all he needed was to hear her say she wasn't Hathway's Goddess of Luck after Kenneth brought up what soldiers believe in to understand that, to her, Hathaway came off like a soldier. Like, it was so subtle probably anyone else would've missed it, but Kenneth is perceptive . I'm honestly kind of surprised Kenneth didn't arrest Gigi when he clued in that she knew or had an inkling that Hathaway was Mafty. Well, okay, maybe he didn't have any hard evidence and was just assuming she had really good instincts to be able to tell and that's no proof that she knew for sure he was Mafty...and maybe he was thinking a little with his pants. But I guess knowing there's a connection between her and Hathaway/Mafty is why he was partially keen Gigi was sticking around to be in the middle of Kenneth and Hathaway's battle . So Gigi is a...companion to a baron, and that's where she gets all her money from? I mean, the implication is she's basically his mistress, although I'm not sure if their relationship is that crass, but it feels like there's a lot of ambiguity there, especially with how old he is . The one thing Amuro tells Hathaway is death doesn't come when you're prepared for it, basically warning him that he can't decide his own death... The Xi Gundam and Penelope are honestly giving me Zeta/ZZ vibes, although the Penelope feels more like a Gundam fused with a dragon. Actually, why call it Penelope though? All in all, not my favorite Gundam designs but that might be because we don't really get a good look at them during those night fights . I was wondering which of the girls in the organization were into Hathaway and then Kelia turns up and...yeah, she totally wants to get into his pants. Even Hathaway gets a little flustered around her. Oh, and Saori Hayami once again returns to Gundam, and time will tell if she's voicing yet another Best Girl (although she has stiff competition with Gigi) .
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2021-07-05, 17:15 | Link #65 | |
Kana Hanazawa ♥
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 37
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Finally got to watch it. I liked it, but they really didn't pack much into this movie. All of it was just build up.
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The highlight of the movie, other than the gorgeous visuals, was probably Gigi. She's the kind of woman (girl? At some point someone mentions she looks underage) that is fascinating and incredibly seductive... as well as dangerous. She's the kind of character I love to watch, but if I ever met a girl like her I'd run away as far as I could. Oh, and there is no doubt she's fucking that old count, she pretty much spelled it to Kenneth. And this is Tomino, he doesn't shy away from stuff like that.
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2021-07-05, 23:19 | Link #67 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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Yeah, the torturing prisoners thing was pretty bad, especially using them as a hostage. Do we really want people to think the Titans are back ? Even Gigi could tell his feelings weren't really sincere or serious, he's just flippant and sees her on a surface level. Like she was utterly bored by him at the beginning and only starts throwing herself at him to make Hathaway jealous. Quote:
That being said, Hathaway's burgeoning infatuation (or something to that effect) with her is already causing him more trouble than it's worth. And she's sticking around to be in the middle of a war between Hathaway and Kenneth, which I don't see ending well for anyone... Quote:
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2021-07-06, 02:00 | Link #68 |
Haven't You Heard?
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: South-east Asia
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I personally like Kenneth, he managed to be my favorite character for this series.
I love how he reeks of confidence from being "smart through experience" since his introduction, very refreshing compare to Suwabe usual roles of "smart because he is smart" character. We also rarely have this kind of casual smooth talker within Gundam franchise so its definitely a treat. He treated Gigi like trophy but not without reason. As he said, battlefield can be frustrating so every soldier would like a "reward"; that's a good way to motivate oneself. Of course, as time goes he also noticed that he managed to provoke both Hathaway and Gigi by acting like that so he keep rolling with it considering they were on his suspect list in regards to Mafty activities. I don't think its fair to blame him for casualties on Davao because casualties is inevitable since the attack launched (seriously, expecting no casualties from 40 floors building that get shot by mobile suits rifle?). He scolding Lane is correct move as well with how Lane's pride as pilot of Penelope taking control over minimizing damage within one movie; rare kind of well-written secondary lead in Gundam, I'd say. Using chair for interrogation is pretty minor damage in comparison to "burn a city except our boss because we're going to space". Aside that I found it intriguing they didn't try to put Hathaway on good light. Back then in Code Geass, Lelouch got all the justification about 'terrorism for greater good' while Suzaku treated with 'government is bad and there's no cure for it'. Here Kenneth made it clear that 'sure, government is corrupt but there's always competent person like me and your dad (Bright)' compare to Hathaway who easily lose an argument against taxi driver and being buddy to everyone on Mafty base as if implying no real leadership within the organization, just band of youths being reckless.
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2021-07-06, 07:12 | Link #69 | |
Kana Hanazawa ♥
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 37
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2021-07-06, 09:52 | Link #72 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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And then there's where Hathaway almost outright says he's doing this to try and be more like the kind of guy Quess was into (Char), and that...probably isn't going to end well . I think they're an arm of the Federation (and basically like immigration officials in the US?) but not directly under Kenneth.
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2021-07-07, 05:11 | Link #73 | |||||
Black Steel Knight
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Indonesia
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You know, after watching this movie for the 3rd time in the best home-video format possible (so far), I'm actually really glad that Tomino didn't direct it. There's just so much natural facial expressions, facial shots, gestures and little details in this movie that would've lost in Tomino's direction. If Tomino were to direct, we would've gotten some over-the-top body language instead (see G-Reco) .
There are people out there who are questioning the choice of the night setting for both MS battles. I'd say they both made sense & logically sound in-universe even if the latter battle is not easy for the eyes. The first battle in Davao functioned as a diversion so that Hathaway can easily sneak out at night. The second battle in the Halmahera's airspace also happened at night because it was originally a secret Gundam retrieval mission. So of course they did it using the cover of the night (too bad that it didn't help much, but at least they still got the Gundam, with Gawman as a bonus ). The best BD-rip that I have actually made the battle between Xi & Penelope looks clearer. Quote:
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It's funny how Mafty & the Feds almost want the same basic thing: cleaning up Earth from the overgrown human population. But Feddie's goal is a lot more selfish, forceful & capitalistic while Mafty supposedly do not discriminate when it comes to people who must get out of Earth (pretty much everyone must go). At least Mafty don't plan to drop an asteroid on Earth (so far). Quote:
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As a first in a planned trilogy, I'd say the movie established the characters & plot well. We saw Hathaway being conflicted about what his organization has been doing through his interactions with the common people and worried about the safety of his Mafty Erin identity being discovered by the Feds through Gigi at first. But after going through some events, he finally gained more confidence and decided to "fuck it" and back into his "Mafty"-mode. He knew that Kenneth will finally figured out his identity no matter whether or not Gigi outright tells him. So he severed his ties with Gigi and went back to Mafty before all that happens and he was right to do it. We also saw Kenneth established as a character. Every dialogue & act that he's done tells us more about him. He looked like a suave smoothtalker at first but as the movie went on, we also saw how much of a bitter realist he is aside from him being a dedicated Feddie officer. The more time we spent on him the more we know about him, and that's a good characterization showcase. And Gigi is established as such an enigmatic girl until we learned her background as a mistress of an old rich guy who was just on a trip to get her new apartment in Hong Kong (not gonna say spoilery stuffs), and she bounced off between Kenneth & Hathaway pretty well and a pretty good plot device to set almost all the events in this movie.
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Last edited by Obelisk ze Tormentor; 2021-07-07 at 06:19. |
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2021-07-07, 20:00 | Link #74 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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Oh man, he really is the next Char .
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2021-07-08, 08:29 | Link #75 | ||
Black Steel Knight
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Indonesia
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Let's change the perspective a bit. Imagine if Hathaway was Bin Laden, and you got one of his terrorist boys in custody. If he doesn't cooperate, roughing him up until he spill some info is pretty much standard procedure for dealing with such terrorist. Using him as a hostage in order to lure/catch/kill Bin Laden sounds like a great idea too. Same thing with Hathaway & Gawman's situation. Quote:
If Mafty is doing what a terrorist do, they need to prepare themselves to be treated as such terrorist. Even Gawman was prepared for the consequences when he got captured. He was lucky that Lane Aim had too much pride in him and let Gawman go (probably naively so). Maybe, maybe not. But a good MS pilot is always preferrable than a bad one. Hopefully he'll cause less collateral damage.
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2021-07-08, 10:48 | Link #76 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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2021-07-08, 12:51 | Link #77 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
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Gundam: Hathaway Film Sells Over 90,000 Blu-ray Discs Just in Theaters : https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/new...eaters/.174933
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2021-07-08, 13:03 | Link #78 | |
Haven't You Heard?
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: South-east Asia
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Debunked? Not really, just change of priority AFAIK as physical abuse became alternative to psychological abuse.
So actually there's nothing wrong with physical abuse to Gawman because you can interpret it under two understandings: First, its following source material that way before psychological abuse became more reliable. Second, investigation to Gawman is considered impractical by Kenneth for many reasons (e.g. incomplete information; efforts spent to made it effective likely not worth it, time constraint) so Kenneth is quick to resort to physical abuse; if we going to nitpick about moral standing, its just like what Obelisk said, Gawman is a terrorist and the one who made first move, so whatever Kenneth do is justified to prevent future casualties. If Kenneth did it for fun, feel free to accuse him but you can see he's a responsible person, committed on finding Mafty ASAP as soon as he's in uniform, understand value of prisoner and happy to know he found bread crumbs to Mafty on Hathaway and Gigi. Still better than, "You can shot the hotel, its all good because politicians there will die; of course, as long Hathaway is not dead". Quote:
For me that as good as Hathaway lose an argument in terms of scene delivery, especially when its done after how he's opt to "There's no other way, government is wrong" treatment to Gigi when she told him how she disagree with Mafty method; my favorite scene in this movie as rarely we saw touch of idealist (going to space) vs. realism (I'm old, have job, have family and friend here, the atmosphere is nice, why the hell someone like me need to go to space? Sounds like pain) which often ignored when it comes to this kind of talk.
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2021-07-08, 17:43 | Link #79 | |
Black Steel Knight
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Indonesia
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2021-07-08, 22:29 | Link #80 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
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