Character Discussion - Suzaku

[Aquaman OS]

Actually the Lost Colors game and the DS game have alternate endings where it does work more or less. The area prospers under Euphie's leadership for at least a few years. That's as far as we find out and the rest of world is still the same but its at least a start and the Black Knights are still around in case something does go wrong.

And yes I do think Lelouch will have problems if he wins with Britannian's like himself and his friends and sister being persecuted now by angry Japanese and other numbers. He himself might get a free pass (or at least Kallen would try to save him) but his friends and most importantly Nunnally might not.

The eye for an eye mentaility doesn't really work out well in the end. If they continue to settle things by force if Suzaku and Britannia win then the numbers get persecuted but if Lelouch and the knights win then its just the above situation in reverse and Japan is abusing the Britannians. Either way neither of those will make a peaceful world for Nunnally.

[greyhawk]

@War_Lord: If you want to understand why they'd lose independence, look @ my previous posts (so tired of repeating myself), anyway it was nice that Toudou agreed with me.
Why I threw in that spoiler tag you asked? Just for fun.
It's anime, they can write whatever they want. I was relying on my common sense and connecting it with real-life events and came to the conclusion it wouldn't have worked in practice (not in a million years). You can try to be idealistic and imagine how it would've worked, it's your choice. And I agree with orangejuicetang: "there is no point in arguing about whether SAR would have worked or not, for the sole reason that it never happened"--> so we now come back to my original statement: stop criticising Lelouch for the SAR incident (I would've done the same thing), it's just proof that you're trying to be a retard
@Aquaman: Perhaps some time after Britannia's been defeated, colonialism will come to an end and Lelouch will build a wonderful country for Nunally to live in? Or perhaps another new Britannia will emerge? Either way it doesn't prevent me from enjoying the show.

[Blue_Mercy]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

No it came through the spoilers talking about the Knights of the Round (With the corresponding magazines). Though I can't find it anymore now that it's been dug in deep.



Well the Japanese were content enough to have their own region within Area 11 made up by Euphie.

In this case it'll be under Suzaku himself though they'll still be discontent and distrust there so he would have a long way to go to make it a better place.

And don't forget, he's a knight of the Emperor. To go against Suzaku would be the equivalent of opposing the Emperor (Which no one would dare).

This turned out to be true, Suzaku's goal is to become the Knight of 1 and take control of Japan.

[Airi]

Originally Posted by greyhawk

it's just proof that you're trying to be a retard

If you want to bash someone, do it somewhere else.

[War_Lord]

@Greyhawk: I already understand your reason, and I'm refuting those reasons based on my theory. It's really just a matter of opinion of what we think is grounds for threat. I gave you my reasons and you gave me yours. There is no absolute standard as to what counts as a threat, so on that regard let's just agree to disagree. I'll respect your reasons, so please respect mine as well.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Blue_Mercy

This turned out to be true, Suzaku's goal is to become the Knight of 1 and take control of Japan.

To be frank, I will trust in Suzaku's capacity to rule as much as I trust in Lulu's capacity to win a 100 meter dash.

Just as Lulu is stupid enough to try physically fighting Suzaku in a Knightmare, Suzaku is stupid enough to think he can be a good ruler of Japan.

What would happen in a Japan ruled by him, is that Suzaku would be given daily reports that 11s are being treated well, while the oppression goes on as normal. There would be regular "Inspections" of areas preplanned by government officials to confirm that everything is fine.

And why should Suzaku doubt his officials? He's been taking everything Britannians say at face value hasn't he?

(Essentially, I would have more faith in Suzaku's new plan if he had someone he can trust who actually possess any political acumen. Making Suzaku a leader is as bad an idea as putting Lulu on the frontlines.)

[Ice_Bullet]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

To be frank, I will trust in Suzaku's capacity to rule as much as I trust in Lulu's capacity to win a 100 meter dash.

Just as Lulu is stupid enough to try physically fighting Suzaku in a Knightmare, Suzaku is stupid enough to think he can be a good ruler of Japan.

What would happen in a Japan ruled by him, is that Suzaku would be given daily reports that 11s are being treated well, while the oppression goes on as normal. There would be regular "Inspections" of areas preplanned by government officials to confirm that everything is fine.

And why should Suzaku doubt his officials? He's been taking everything Britannians say at face value hasn't he?

(Essentially, I would have more faith in Suzaku's new plan if he had someone he can trust who actually possess any political acumen. Making Suzaku a leader is as bad an idea as putting Lulu on the frontlines.)

agree in a sense that he believes he can run japan properly. FAT HOPE. if he were to rule japan. and give the japanese equal privillages everywhere, sure the japanese would be happy. but what will the britinnians think? he can't satisfy both sides..

[Ruvixur]

Originally Posted by Ice_Bullet

agree in a sense that he believes he can run japan properly. FAT HOPE. if he were to rule japan. and give the japanese equal privillages everywhere, sure the japanese would be happy. but what will the britinnians think? he can't satisfy both sides..

there is no need to satisfy both sides. If he is the ruler, his opinion is absolute, and only emperor may change it. And its not like britannians are going to lose much from giving equal rights to japanese

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Ice_Bullet

agree in a sense that he believes he can run japan properly. FAT HOPE. if he were to rule japan. and give the japanese equal privillages everywhere, sure the japanese would be happy. but what will the britinnians think? he can't satisfy both sides..

Suzaku wouldn't actually run around Japan and change the laws. He would delegate this job for some official to do. And that someone would most likely be more interested in keeping the status quo than re-writing the lawbook. In the end, it is easier to keep Suzaku in the dark than actually following his orders.
(Suzaku wouldn't understand most of the documents they make him sign anyway.)

I am reminded of the "12 Kingdoms" anime, when a certain new king spent months trying to do good but ended up doing nothing. Unlike Suzaku though, that King had people she could trust to guide her through the rough times.

[Ice_Bullet]

Originally Posted by Ruvixur

there is no need to satisfy both sides. If he is the ruler, his opinion is absolute, and only emperor may change it. And its not like britannians are going to lose much from giving equal rights to japanese

good point. i overlooked that part..

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Suzaku wouldn't actually run around Japan and change the laws. He would delegate this job for some official to do. And that someone would most likely be more interested in keeping the status quo than re-writing the lawbook. In the end, it is easier to keep Suzaku in the dark than actually following his orders.
(Suzaku wouldn't understand most of the documents they make him sign anyway.)

I am reminded of the "12 Kingdoms" anime, when a certain new king spent months trying to do good but ended up doing nothing. Unlike Suzaku though, that King had people she could trust to guide her through the rough times.

lol at the documents. if he didnt understand.. he could sign a kill all elevens document.. x_X

hmm i heard of that anime.. and your right.. suzaku has noone. noone trusts him as he was a former eleven. thus people will definately look down on him..

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Ice_Bullet

lol at the documents. if he didnt understand.. he could sign a kill all elevens document.. x_X

I was Elected to lead, not to read.

[Ice_Bullet]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

I was Elected to lead, not to read.

*off topic*

simpsons movie ftw! xD

[DarkLordOfkichiku]

Originally Posted by Ruvixur

there is no need to satisfy both sides. If he is the ruler, his opinion is absolute, and only emperor may change it. And its not like britannians are going to lose much from giving equal rights to japanese

His opinion may be "absolute"... but in no way unchangeable, IMHO. After all, remember that the emperor favors comptetion, sorta (rule of the strong/the victor, remeber?), so if someone "took care of" Suzaku either way among the Brittanians, the Emperor wouldn't be likely to do much than shrug and think that he was too weak to keep his place... . And if anything, Suzaku is more naive than Lelouch, meaning that he might not be very good at reading between the lines or be suspicious in general even - so it might be an easy enough thing for the Brittanians to keep him in the dark. Besides.. There's the matter of willingness to cooperate. He can for example as ruler of Area 11 in theory tell all Brittanian policemen to help any elevens being threathened/beaten up by brittanians - but if, say, 90% of the police aren't interested in doing that and instead choose to turn a blind eye to any such events they encounter, then the situation haven't improved much for the japanese...

[hero147]

Originally Posted by Ruvixur

there is no need to satisfy both sides. If he is the ruler, his opinion is absolute, and only emperor may change it. And its not like britannians are going to lose much from giving equal rights to japanese

Except for the Puriests I guess, they have wayy too much pride.

Originally Posted by greyhawk

L: By which time the hostages will already be six feet under. For example there are two persons, each one is suffering from a serious illness which can only be cured by some very rare herbs, I know you're the type of guy that'll try and save both of them, but they both end up dead and you won't feel bad about it, reasoning at least you've tried your best. Me, I'll choose which one to save and let the other go to hell. Whether you like it or not hardly concerns me.

LMAO, Lelouch and his proness and his fast and sick verses.

Originally Posted by DarkLordOfkichiku

His opinion may be "absolute"... but in no way unchangeable, IMHO. After all, remember that the emperor favors comptetion, sorta (rule of the strong/the victor, remeber?), so if someone "took care of" Suzaku either way among the Brittanians, the Emperor wouldn't be likely to do much than shrug and think that he was too weak to keep his place... . And if anything, Suzaku is more naive than Lelouch, meaning that he might not be very good at reading between the lines or be suspicious in general even - so it might be an easy enough thing for the Brittanians to keep him in the dark. Besides.. There's the matter of willingness to cooperate. He can for example as ruler of Area 11 in theory tell all Brittanian policemen to help any elevens being threathened/beaten up by brittanians - but if, say, 90% of the police aren't interested in doing that and instead choose to turn a blind eye to any such events they encounter, then the situation haven't improved much for the japanese...

WE should kill the emperor and say "Survival of the fittest"

[Ice_Bullet]

Originally Posted by hero147

Except for the Puriests I guess, they have wayy too much pride.



LMAO, Lelouch and his proness and his fast and sick verses.



WE should kill the emperor and say "Survival of the fittest"

lol. then people will start saying suzaku is a backstabber... the emperor gave him this and that... (which he is )

[DarkLordOfkichiku]

Originally Posted by hero147

WE should kill the emperor and say "Survival of the fittest"

Bet that at some point, Suzaku is going to ally himself with Schneizel in a coup against the emperor - probably in exchange for a higher post (Knight of One, probably) this time around as well

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by hero147

WE should kill the emperor and say "Survival of the fittest"

That's pretty much it, though. From what we know about the Emperor, he wouldn't let anyone have the throne unless the successor is stronger than him. And the only way to prove you are stronger than him, is to kill him. Wakamoto takes his own mandate seriously.

Bet that at some point, Suzaku is going to ally himself with Schneizel in a coup against the emperor - probably in exchange for a higher post (Knight of One, probably) this time around as well

Suzaku should have allied himself to Schneizel by now, instead of wasting time being a Knight of 7 with the Emperor. It would be quicker, and Schneizel can offer political skill which Suzaku obviously lacks. You can't ally with the Emperor; the Emperor has no need for friendships.

[Blue_Mercy]

Yeah, we definitely don't need Suzaku as ruler, it's weird enough already with Rolo saying "Yes, my Lord" to Suzaku and the Glaston Knights being forced to show respect to him.

[Ice_Bullet]

Originally Posted by Blue_Mercy

Yeah, we definitely don't need Suzaku as ruler, it's weird enough already with Rolo saying "Yes, my Lord" to Suzaku and the Glaston Knights being forced to show respect to him.

yeah that was extremely disturbing to me.. yeah yeah hes the KOS. big deal..

btw... KOS - knight of seven.. but.. it also means... KOS - KILL ON SIGHT.

[DarkLordOfkichiku]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Suzaku should have allied himself to Schneizel by now, instead of wasting time being a Knight of 7 with the Emperor. It would be quicker, and Schneizel can offer political skill which Suzaku obviously lacks. You can't ally with the Emperor; the Emperor has no need for friendships.

Well, they should have allied by now. Schneizel's actions so far in this season (few as they have been) shows that he's strongly supportive of Suzaku and Suzaku probably has more to gain by siding with him than staying with the emperor. Schneizel can offer Suzaku Japan as well as the support necressarilly for him to stay in power and in return Suzaku becomes the most loyal and important retainer of Schneizel.

I think that Suzaku's plan to have Nunnally become the govenor of Area 11 will fail one way or another- leaving only one option for him: to become Knight of One and rule Japan that way. Since he'll most likely want it done quickly, he and Schneizel will probably act quickly - which I suppose might lead to a short civil war - but it's hard to say what'd happen then, althrough one could make a few guesses. It'd make things interesting though...