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View Poll Results: Claymore - Chapter 118 Rating
Perfect 10 18 22.78%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 16 20.25%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 19 24.05%
7 out of 10 : Good 7 8.86%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 10.13%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 4 5.06%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 3.80%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 1.27%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 1.27%
1 out of 10 : Painful 2 2.53%
Voters: 79. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-09-08, 18:33   Link #841
Claymore!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rafael1932 View Post
There are only 2 countries in the world and they are not going to send trained warriors in their unique reseach that may save their lifes ?

I wonder how many of soldiers the usa had when they were development their atomic bomb ? or they were human servants too ?
These are not trained warriors, these are more like hired goons (and there are a lot of them). Raki is far better than them so he can beat them easily. The organization used claymore warriors for protection.

Quote:
Yes it is.
No, it is not.

Quote:
It is belong human something like that. unless raki is no longer human. humans are intelligent animals not brute creatures. If the wood must be for military use ( of course there is wood more easy to break than this of course), but since they all are military they must use some wood more hard to break. A human could only break 1 and forces 2 wood sticks to fall from other ninjas guys. Unless raki is a claymore, then he can do anything at all.
I highly doubt that they made Raki a claymore, mostly because he would've been unstable. He could have awakened and destroyed the entire Organization, like Luciella did. We have seen that Raki is a strong as a claymore by when he easily defeated that yoma in his hometown (chapter 80?). For Raki it is not impossible to say that he can shatter two wooden spears in a row.

Quote:
Yagi made the ghosts having 99% of dying probability, now he is trying to make the scientists into dumb and military guys into civilians with weapons just to see if he can pull out the ghosts alive
I don't think that Yagi did that. If the Ghosts die it would ruin the story. The scientists probably just had the Mib ninjas drag her off and then they were going to throw her body somewhere to die when Raki showed up and saved her.
Quote:
seriously. Do you really think that in that facility where their best scientists working in their last and only hope to survive they would not have expert military guys like those ninjas ? we are talking about 1 country that has half of the world into his hands.
Again, they used their claymore warriors for protection, but now they don't have any left (other than the 3 #1s) so all they have are the Mib ninjas which are more like bandits, or weak guards, not meant for real combat.

Quote:
if you are ok with this is ok by me but i just want to see the next lame excuse that yagi is going to pull out just to make sure that the ghost come out alive from a scenario where they had no chance at all to survive
What is wrong with that? I want the ghosts to survive. If you think that is illogical thats to bad. I don't think that Yagi wants to kill off characters that he has been drawing for 60 chapters. He might make some characters die like audrey or rachel, but that is fine because they are not important to the story. Unlike the ghosts who are directly connected to the main plot of destroying the organization. ( I mean main plot other than Clare killing priscilla, which really is the main plot. but i meant like the second main plot)

Quote:
It is the same sword from before, a training sword made to not cut
I know that. But Raki is so strong that even with a dull sword he can shatter those spears.


I'm not saying that the Mib are stupid, they might not be thinking very clearly because they are under attack. They could be under a good deal off stress and therefore they might be making mistakes.

One last thing, Raftella most likely wont be alive for much longer so you really dont need to put so much hate on that subject. she will either die from her wounds or be killed by a Mib ninja, Roxanne, Cassandra.
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Last edited by Claymore!; 2011-09-08 at 18:59.
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Old 2011-09-08, 19:02   Link #842
rafael1932
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Claymore!

Ryus made a huge post saying every little thing saying why raki can be a claymore. You still can’t say for sure that he is a human. I am simple too lazy to do something like that.

«Again, they used their claymore warriors for protection, but now they don't have any left (other than the 3 #1s) so all they have are the Mib ninjas which are more like bandits, or weak guards, not meant for real combat.»

You are running from the main point.

They, the mib, have possibility to choice to have expert soldiers because they are on the same situation that the usa were when they were building their best weapon. Do you think that the mainland is not going to send their best material to the only research that will save their lifes ?

It does not need to be elite warriors, only normal warriors. If raki was humans than he cant beat normal warriors. Don’t forget that yagi never made humans to do inhuman things before, so, why now ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Claymore! View Post
One last thing, Raftella most likely wont be alive for much longer so you really dont need to put so much hate on that subject. she will either die from her wounds or be killed by a Mib ninja, Roxanne, Cassandra.
Can you please stop saying hate like in that way ? I am just saying that the story must make sense and not become cheap. Is not like I want to see blood and guts. This is the same argument that people says that I hate raki because it does not make sense the way he is right now or that I don’t want to see male guys in the story fighting. 1 thing does not implies the other
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claymore! View Post
I'm not saying that the Mib are stupid, they might not be thinking very clearly because they are under attack. They could be under a good deal off stress and therefore they might be making mistakes.
Yes I know that, just saying the ones that usually call them that. I know that you didn’t say that

Last edited by rafael1932; 2011-09-08 at 19:24.
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Old 2011-09-08, 19:20   Link #843
Korinov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rafael1932 View Post
There are only 2 countries in the world and they are not going to send trained warriors in their unique reseach facility that may save their lifes ?

I wonder how many of soldiers the usa had when they were development their atomic bomb ? or they were human servants too ?
I don't know if you sometimes don't understand what other people write here, or if you just don't even bother reading and prefer to make assumptions out of thin air. The Org uses hybrids (a.k.a. "Claymores") as their one and only fighting force in the island. They seem to be pretty sure it's enough... after all, why bother training and equipping some humans if you have hybrids superior to them in every single way?

Well, of course a whole scale rebellion wasn't exactly on their plans. But that's not the point here. The point is: the MiBjas are not warriors: they don't behave like well trained and experienced warriors, they certainly are not very skilled at fighting and also they're not properly equipped to fight at all.

Quote:
Yes it is.
For the 1000th time, no it's not. It's been explained here (in various threads) several times that a blunt great sword can be an extremely lethal weapon in the hands of a strong and skilled enough fighter. I've just said that a big, strong and skilled warrior like Raki should be able to tear whole limbs off his enemies; not cutting, just tearing them apart. So I see no problem if he breaks some wooden spears, weapons which were never designed nor made to be able to block the swing of a claymore.

Quote:
It is belong human something like that. unless raki is no longer human. humans are intelligent animals not brute creatures. If the wood is for military use ( of course there is wood more easy to break than this of course), but since they all are military guys, they must use some wood more hard to break. A human super strong could only break 1 and forces 2 wood sticks to fall from other ninjas guys. Unless raki is a claymore, then he can do anything he wants
They are not military guys (at least they don't behave like soldiers at all) and they don't have any kind of magical unbreakable wood. If you don't know what a strong and skilled enough person can do with a greatsword, don't act like you do.

Quote:
seriously. Do you really think that in that facility where their best scientists working in their last and only hope to survive they would not have expert military guys like those ninjas ? we are talking about 1 country that has half of the world into his hands.
We don't know how much of the world they're currently holding. And the ninjas aren't exactly "expert military guys". They relied too much on the hybrids.

Quote:
(According miria there is only 2 countries and rubel confirmed this to her)
Yeah, Rubel "confirmed" it, so it has to be true. </irony>

Quote:
It is the same sword from before, a training sword made to not cut
If you've read or understood explanations from previous threads, you'll know actually no greatsword is really made to cut. Only the tip of the sword is truly sharpened, in order to let it thrust its armored targets. The rest of the blade doesn't need to be really sharp, since in the hands of the right warrior it will be able to tear off limbs without difficulty.
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Old 2011-09-08, 19:34   Link #844
Claymore!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rafael1932 View Post
Claymore!

It does not need to be elite warriors, only normal warriors. If raki was humans than he cant beat normal warriors. Don’t forget that yagi never made humans to do inhuman things before, so, why now ?
Ok if the ninjas are normal warriors then it still doesn't matter. Raki is just that strong that he can defeat them easily. He is the only one in this story that is that way. We actually don't know what is the "human limit" in this story because it is a fictional manga. like in many other mangas the "human limit" is questionable. Raki is just strong now and people just can't except it because he is the only male character who is actually usefull.



you know what forget it. i am tired of debating Raki with Raki haters. it is like telling apples to be more like oranges, it will never work for either side.
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Last edited by Claymore!; 2011-09-08 at 19:49.
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Old 2011-09-08, 20:22   Link #845
Shiek927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korinov
We don't know how much of the world they're currently holding.
Let me put some perspective -- The Organization side is the losing side; that's why they are making warriors to begin with.

For someone (Rafael) to say they hold half the world is overly-presumptious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafael
Don’t forget that yagi never made humans to do inhuman things before, so, why now ?
Why 'now'? Humans have been apparently been able to do "inhuman" things since Renee confirmed that humans can kill yoma.

So people need to update themselves and their own definition of what is and what isn't inhuman. Just because we see humans being bad-asses doesn't mean their is anything inhuman about them.
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Old 2011-09-08, 22:55   Link #846
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i've been browsing this section for over a year now
and i swear to god everything that rafael1932 types makes no sense at all...
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Old 2011-09-08, 23:11   Link #847
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Both Cid and Galk have performed rather inhuman feats before. Particularly Galk jumping around on roof top in full plate.
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Old 2011-09-08, 23:30   Link #848
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Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri View Post
Both Cid and Galk have performed rather inhuman feats before. Particularly Galk jumping around on roof top in full plate.
Now that you mention it. When Clare was little she managed to jump off a cliff, and she turned out great!
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Old 2011-09-09, 07:59   Link #849
Shiek927
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Originally Posted by Fenrir_valindri View Post
Both Cid and Galk have performed rather inhuman feats before. Particularly Galk jumping around on roof top in full plate.
Maybe it's because we aren't seeing it animated that it appears inhuman; while jumping around may be difficult, I don't see why one couldn't do it if they weren't strong enough.

I think, largely, what this confusion is, is like this: Cool=Inhuman; apparently if you see a character doing something cool, then it must be inhuman, which means they have to be a hybrid or something.

That's obviously laughable.

One may question why, if the ninjas are so useless if fighting, why they are even there -- perhaps they are their for the trainees, fresh from the transformation, who don't know a single thing about fighting to keep them in line -- thus, they are equiped with light non-lethal weaponry to pelt them into obedience.

The thing is, is that their is very little suggesting that the Organization has "expert military guys" on the island because the hybrids really just train themselves -- the training, from what I recall from Extra Chapter 4, is really just the Hybrids surviving on their own. Their is no one-on-one training or any such thing (that would probably be considered "excessive" or such nonsense)...they are all lumped into one group, and sent off on excersizes -- if you want to live, you better figure it out your own way, very fast. The last trial against that Yoma is essentially just that: you don't know what the heck is going on, nobody's prepared you for anything, but their's a giant man-eating Yoma lurking around, so if you're going to survive, you'd better find a way now. The cold cruelty of it all is extremely dog-eat-dog which has always been the way things work on the island.

That's a part of why their is such independence and isolation in the warriors, since they have been taught since day 1, not to rely on anybody -- The Organization doesn't baby them whatsoever, and the other warriors (alongside the other trauma and heart-ache they've been through) learn quickly that the person next to them may end up awakening and they'd have to kill them, so they keep to themselves and away from everybody.

At the very very most, the Organization teaches them basic techniques, but even then, the warriors do everything on their own, which is why so many warriors are so unique from eachother in terms of techniques, abilities; you think they actually spend time with the warriors, learning about them and trying to bring out their full potential? Hell no -- even if they are prodigous warriors like Teresa, Luciella/Rafaela, Priscilla etc....the Organization has always shown a extremely strong uncaring attitude because that's just the way they are -- if somebody dies, they'll get another; if a whole generation dies, they'll get another.

Point blank, No; I could go on, but I'll just sum it up right here -- their are no highly-trained human military men on the island. That's part of what has always made the Organization so weak in that perspective, because all they had was their hybrids -- the MiB's themselves are all scientists, and essentially corporate people, who are now even cut off from eachother, that they are splintering from the inside out. The warriors themselves are always almost entirely self-trained which is an explanation (from small to big) on several things -- for one, why they are so unique from eachother and why their is often a large "strange" gap between warriors often who aren't that far apart from eachother (the reason could be several, such as experience, potential etc...we know the Org doesn't look into or care enough about these kinds of things), and why, again, their are (partly) so distant from eachother. One (again, small) reason why the Ghosts are so close to eachother is because they can fight and spar with eachother - to them, it's like a form of social bonding; being able to fight together and help eachother raise their skills. Everyone's naturally unique in personality, but warriors still usually aren't the most vocal or happy bunch -- even the Ghosts, with all the time they spend, still have a rift between eachother in the skeletons they all keep in their closets and secrets from eachother (up-front, Miria going to the Org alone is probably the biggest we've seen) -- the affection between them is a silent one, and a small part of that probably stems from the fact they can duel with eachother and help everyone survive better.

If anything, that could, beyond the other-side having the DoD's, why they are losing -- they are simply too corporate, cold, and indepedent -- it's one thing for the leadership to be cut off from everyone below you working for you, but if the leadership even includes other members who are secretly working against eachother for their own ideals....then it's no wonder why Rubel has managed to stay hidden for so long; being a sleazy guy who's only out for himself is part of being an MiB.
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Last edited by Shiek927; 2011-09-09 at 08:15.
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Old 2011-09-09, 10:43   Link #850
Elandyll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XenoY View Post
i've been browsing this section for over a year now
and i swear to god everything that rafael1932 types makes no sense at all...
Nothing personal against him/her, but with the poor english grasp and spelling (and that's coming from someone -me in this case- for whom English is not the main language), I have stopped reading his/ her posts to be frank, as they are generally overly opinionated but also at the same time either not making sense or revealing a profound misunderstanding of what has been previously said.

/shrug.

About the soldiers and their spears, it seems to me as well that they are there mostly to do menial every day tasks and handle the trainees, whom before the "indoctrination" might in some cases cause problems (remember that most of them are not there out of their own will, and have been sold/ given to the org by their own parents or villages.
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Old 2011-09-09, 12:43   Link #851
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Nothing personal against him/her, but with the poor english grasp and spelling (and that's coming from someone -me in this case- for whom English is not the main language), I have stopped reading his/ her posts to be frank, as they are generally overly opinionated but also at the same time either not making sense or revealing a profound misunderstanding of what has been previously said.
Roflmao, yeah, but nothing personal right?

Don't be rude guys, their's no need for it.

Quote:
remember that most of them are not there out of their own will, and have been sold/ given to the org by their own parents or villages.
Most? as far as we know, Claire is the only one who actually joined willingly.
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Old 2011-09-09, 13:22   Link #852
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Originally Posted by Shiek927 View Post
Don't be rude guys, their's no need for it.
I'll start to get rude if you keep writing that again and again. I mean, really
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Old 2011-09-09, 14:32   Link #853
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Well it’s time I shared my opinion on this chapter. We got to see Cassandra’s infamous technique and it is as cruel and merciless as it is useful and practical. Roxanne called it ugliest and saddest technique a number one ever had but IMO willingness to do ugly stuff like that is what separates those who get to be number one like Cassandra from those who get stuck on lower ranks like Galatea. Also I think that the fact that Roxanne’s chose not to learn that technique will come back to bite her.

Raftela is alive. Well of course she is. I would have been more surprised if she really was dead. I mean come on just a couple of holes is not likely to kill a warrior. Apparently the Organization chose not to finish her off while she was down. Why? To be perfectly honest, I really don’t care. I’m not going to ask every little thing to be explained to me. And I know for sure that they knew she was alive because they disarmed her (she doesn't have her sword in this chapter). Anyway Raftela is currently messing with Cassandra’s head which, if my predictions are true, will become crucial for the future events.

I understand the concept behind Miria's "beyond limit" phantom but as many had said before what happens when Hysteria decides to release her yoki? I guess we’ll just have to wait and see. Anyway I still give Miria thumbs up for being the first one to successfully hurt her opponent.

Spoiler for What might happen in future chapters:
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Old 2011-09-09, 15:09   Link #854
Elandyll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiek927 View Post
Roflmao, yeah, but nothing personal right?

Don't be rude guys, their's no need for it.



Most? as far as we know, Claire is the only one who actually joined willingly.
Nope, not personal Just facts. I wasn't trying to insult him/ her, simply to explain that yes I too find rafael's posts pretty hard to read/ understand "most" of the time.

As per "most", with Clare being one exception (that we know of, there might be more and for various reasons), yep, that sounds therefore accurate
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Old 2011-09-09, 15:18   Link #855
Claymore!
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Yes i find his/her post difficult to understand, But interpret them the best i can. I am pretty sure they don't like Raftella or Raki.

As for who teaches the trainees, Who really does train them? is it the ninja guys or do they have someone special to train them? maybe it is another claymore that teaches them, a claymore whose purpose is only to train them.
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Last edited by Claymore!; 2011-09-09 at 15:30.
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Old 2011-09-09, 15:34   Link #856
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Originally Posted by Korinov View Post
I'll start to get rude if you keep writing that again and again. I mean, really
Korinov, I'm done with There/Their/They're -- I'm gonna be an old man and I'm still not gonna be able to get that right, so I don't even care anymore

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elandyl
As per "most", with Clare being one exception (that we know of, there might be more and for various reasons), yep, that sounds therefore accurate
Well, as you say, there might be more that we don't know of - we don't know the full history of all the warriors so there might very well be more that have joined willingly. Claire however, thus far, is written to have been the first and only person to knock on Staff's door willingly; time will tell if that's as true as it says it is.
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Old 2011-09-09, 15:40   Link #857
Claymore!
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Originally Posted by Shiek927 View Post
Korinov, I'm done with There/Their/They're -- I'm gonna be an old man and I'm still not gonna be able to get that right, so I don't even care anymore
Now thats the right attitude.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dj0rel View Post
Raftela is alive. Well of course she is. I would have been more surprised if she really was dead. I mean come on just a couple of holes is not likely to kill a warrior. Apparently the Organization chose not to finish her off while she was down. Why? To be perfectly honest, I really don’t care. I’m not going to ask every little thing to be explained to me. And I know for sure that they knew she was alive because they disarmed her (she doesn't have her sword in this chapter). Anyway Raftela is currently messing with Cassandra’s head which, if my predictions are true, will become crucial for the future events.
Well good, someone is not angry that Raftella is still alive. What i see happening now is that because Raftella is penetrating Cassandra's mind, it might trigger Cassandra's memories to come back to her. Then Cassandra can attack Roxanne and fight her for a while.
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Last edited by Claymore!; 2011-09-09 at 15:52.
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Old 2011-09-09, 15:48   Link #858
irvinethearcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elandyll View Post
Nope, not personal Just facts. I wasn't trying to insult him/ her, simply to explain that yes I too find rafael's posts pretty hard to read/ understand "most" of the time.

As per "most", with Clare being one exception (that we know of, there might be more and for various reasons), yep, that sounds therefore accurate
Some of them make sense. Falcor translated one in readable english and
it seemed even quite good what rafael came up with.
But as long as you have to translate them first from rafael1932 to english it is no use.
He should put more effort into it.
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Old 2011-09-09, 22:14   Link #859
Fenrir_valindri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiek927 View Post
Maybe it's because we aren't seeing it animated that it appears inhuman; while jumping around may be difficult, I don't see why one couldn't do it if they weren't strong enough.

I think, largely, what this confusion is, is like this: Cool=Inhuman; apparently if you see a character doing something cool, then it must be inhuman, which means they have to be a hybrid or something.
Actually, we have seen in animated thanks to the Claymore anime. Galk moves better then most people do without armor on rooftop.

That aside, being able to move around like that in full plate mail is definitely on the level of "inhuman" that people are putting Raki into. You'd be lucky to jump 3 feet, much less around on rooftops, in a full set of armor like that.

Keep in mind that Galk also proved strong enough to prevent a particularly large yoma from pulling its fingers out of him. Not to mention how far the Rabona Guard seem able to throw full fledged Halberds (those were not spears) at Agatha.

Simply, rule of cool takes precedence in this case. The only way to portray Raki's extreme level of ability is to have him perform actions beyond a "normal" person, but that doesn't necessarily make him a hybrid.

Basically he is a "normal" shounen hero in a world populated by "inhuman" shounen heroines. His abilities are impressive, but I highly doubt he can take a hybrid of any real strength if they got serious.

The possibility he is some sort of "demi-" hybrid certainly exist, but until it is explicitly stated or shown that he can use Yoki, I don't believe he has portrayed a level of ability that puts him in the same category is the Organization's warriors.
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Old 2011-09-09, 23:22   Link #860
Double_friedman
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Some guessings
People, please stop being bitchy to other users.
No, Raki is not an hybrid, semi-hybrid, semi-trainee, and Clarice could mop the floor with him if her life depended on it.
Someone (whose user name I will not read, because I do not want to) said that it was natural for Raftella not to die. Indeed, it was. I remember when she was allegedly killed, many users commented how weak/stupid/ridiculous was that she was murdered that way and that easily. However, once you have attacked her, it is obvious you have to finish her off. Otherwise, she will kill everyone. That's the stupid and illogical thing! That the org didn't finish her off.

Yeah, Miss Cassie of the horrible technique will remember how her beloved friend Roxie of love and hate killed her. That's soo predictable that I hope if she remembers, she won't go against her, or just do something completely unimaginable.

What else are you talking about? I have been so inmersed in my work, that I cannot do anything else.

Last edited by Double_friedman; 2011-09-10 at 16:03.
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