The Syria Crisis

[KiraYamatoFan]

Originally Posted by vasya(russ)

Don't worry. Our government is not that reckless. It may ban turkish products or tourism or even cease diplomatic relations at worst case, but they won't resort to power, becase Turkey is a NATO member and Putin despite his cool image doesn't really have balls to seriously clash with the West.

I hope you're right. It's just that people could have the impression that Putin still lives in the Cold War though.

Just going to the logistics part alone, I wonder why the Russian military command didn't send the aircraft carrier on the way towards just off the Syrian coastline if the plan to deploy attacking planes was so important. I look at the map of the region, and it was obvious that any direct military flight from Russia to Syria would always be tricky considering what airspace belongs to whom in the area (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, etc.). Any attack with planes coming from a carrier would be unimpeded by airspace issues.

[Ithekro]

They have been defending that border for a long time and have added protection for most of the Cold War.

[Xero8420]

Originally Posted by KiraYamatoFan

I hope you're right. It's just that people could have the impression that Putin still lives in the Cold War though.

Just going to the logistics part alone, I wonder why the Russian military command didn't send the aircraft carrier on the way towards just off the Syrian coastline if the plan to deploy attacking planes was so important. I look at the map of the region, and it was obvious that any direct military flight from Russia to Syria would always be tricky considering what airspace belongs to whom in the area (Turkey, Iraq, Iran, etc.). Any attack with planes coming from a carrier would be unimpeded by airspace issues.

As are a number of Western politicians. Cold War mentality remains.

Kuznetsov's carrier-borne jets aren't well-equipped for airstrikes just yet. Ordering it to head back Syria would worsen its already cumbersome condition.

Originally Posted by vasya(russ)

Russian su-24 shot down near the turkish border. Both pilots dead. This kind of thing was expected, but it doesn't make the show less entertaining. Our officials are already considering ban on traveling to Turkey.
http://theaviationist.com/2015/11/24...own-by-turkey/

It'll be funny how other media sources dismissed that claim, nor even buying it or don't care at all.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Turkey isn't Ukraine or Georgia.

Even without NATO, Turkey probably got enough military muscle to slap around any Russian invasion force.

Don't want to break it to you, but Russian have about twice in manpower, about 3 times in military spending and the same different magnitude in airplanes...

...oh... and tactical nuke

[Anh_Minh]

Which is why Turkey isn't going to invade Russia any time soon. It doesn't mean Russia can invade Turkey.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Which is why Turkey isn't going to invade Russia any time soon. It doesn't mean Russia can invade Turkey.

Russia can invade ANYONE. Even Jupiter.

What matters is what Putin thinks he can get away with. And we don't know Turkey's position in NATO is all that strong at the moment.

[Ithekro]

If people want a war, I suggest invading Mars, the planet of war. So the conflict is ironically harmonious.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

If people want a war, I suggest invading Mars, the planet of war. So the conflict is ironically harmonious.

The ironic thing is... what you saidcould actually be true. Like if we can spend all these military budgets on space program, we could have already colonise Mars by now

...according to Neil Degrasse Tyson at least

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Turkey isn't Ukraine or Georgia.

Even without NATO, Turkey probably got enough military muscle to slap around any Russian invasion force.

Nahh....It's Saudi Arabia...

Sitting in NATO of all places



The irony

[SaintessHeart]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Which is why Turkey isn't going to invade Russia any time soon. It doesn't mean Russia can invade Turkey.

It is thanksgiving season. Everyone NEEDS a Turkey during Thanksgiving.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by risingstar3110

Don't want to break it to you, but Russian have about twice in manpower, about 3 times in military spending and the same different magnitude in airplanes...

and how many commitments does the Russian army have? Last time i count there is Georgia, Ukraine and Chechnya. Ukraine would love for Russian to pull it army out and attack Turkey.

Turkey isn't as strong as Russian but it is no push over.

...oh... and tactical nuke

only if Putin is completely insane.

[SaintessHeart]

Then what about thermobaric warheads.

Heck they even built shoulder fired versions for it (RPO-A).

[lateumn]

Watching Putin's live speech now, he says 'we informed our American friends about where, when, and how high our planes are going to fly, and this is exactly where our plane was attacked. So either the US doesn't know how to control it's allies, or (...)'

Turkey did push itself into a corner with this really, and not only itself, but the entire NATO coalition.
It's questionable whether the Russia plane violated Turkish airspace or not, but even if it did, in this case Turkey violated the basic interception protocols. So the shooting down was by all means an illegitimate act and quite possibly illegal as well, despite all the 'sovereignty and defending airspace' talk. NATO should really review Turkey's membership in the alliance.

[Cosmic Eagle]

That's why I say Turkey is Saudi Arabia... They have a hand in this as much as them


Attacking Kurds....Backing the Turkoman militants....Trying to topple Assad...


They dumped as much fuel into the fire as the West and the Saudis and Iranians

[lateumn]

in latest Russian MoD press briefing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdtQpfwOoSg) it was stated that Turkish officials refused to provide official records of the "warnings" that the Turks have supposedly issued. When asked about whether the recording of "warning" that recently appeared on the net was released by the Turkish side and was legit, the Turks replied that they made no such leaks.

[Haak]

Actually, the Turkish military officially released them on Wednesday.

[lateumn]

Originally Posted by Haak

Actually, the Turkish military officially released them on Wednesday.

The press briefing is from Thursday, so I suppose it addresses the Wednesday fakes

[Haak]

Probably not if they're only talking about unofficial leaks. The Turkish army later released recordings officially.

[lateumn]

Originally Posted by Haak

Probably not if they're only talking about unofficial leaks. The Turkish army later released recordings officially.

Any credible sources?
Also, based on ANNA News footage, the trail of the missile fired seemed to have been inside Syrian airspace. So again, this whole story is weird if we were to take the Turkish perspective.
No radio warnings. (debatable)
No visual warnings. (confirmed by Turkey itself, as they later claimed they had no idea it was a Russian plane)
Attacked based on 17 seconds violation. (debatable)
Yet debris and missile trail is inside Syrian territory/airspace. (confirmed)

[Haak]

Originally Posted by lateumn

Any credible sources?

The Guardian