Suisei no Gargantia - Spoilers & Speculation

[Triple_R]

Dark Speculation Time:

1) Ledo was thrown back in time.

2) Time travelers from the future actually end up fulfilling their futures rather than changing them - i.e. the timeline already factors in the effect of time travelers before they go back in time.

3) The whalesquids are a peaceful but protective species. They tend to fight back if threatened, or if one of their number is killed. Otherwise, they are quite willing and able to co-exist peacefully with humans. The reason they didn't retaliate against the humans in Episode 7 is because the humans shutting down their power was correctly taken as an olive branch of peace. If the humans hadn't done that, war would have happened right then and there.

4) Ledo will actually end up starting the human/whalesquid war. He will fulfill his own future. And in the process, the peaceful and serene lives of the humans of Earth will be forever changed.

5) At some point, Ledo will have a deep, dark realization of just what he has done. He will realize what humanity has lost due to his actions. Yes, this anime will be about a young man trying to adjust to wider society... by showing the disastrous results of a young man ultimately failing at it. It becomes a cautionary tale.


This anime could be a Greek Tragedy with a superb sci-fi edge.

Now, if Gen decides to go full NGE on us...

6) Civilization on Earth completely collapses, as the whalesquids prove truly overwhelming in the human/whalesquid war. Ledo manages to save himself, Chamber, and Amy at the last second. They abandon the planet, and search the stars for a habitable world. They finally find one, and humanity is forced to start anew with Ledo and Amy as the forebears of future generations of humans. Ledo's philosophies end up shaping the Galactic Alliance to come, and he essentially becomes the founder of the GA.


I'm not sure I'd want the show to be that dark. But on the other hand, it would be incredibly bold and masterful if this is what Gen does. And this time, he could even say that he legitimately did fool a lot of viewers.

[ReddyRedWolf]

I don't think time travel is involved. As both their histories match up to a point. Which is after Ledo's ancestors left Earth.

If anything this increases the chance of mt theory that Hideauze feed on most forms of energy.

Ledo confirmed that. Being low-tech allows the Earther to be under the Hideauze's radar.

Humans didn't lose technology due to the ice age it was a survival strategy to save themselves from aliens attracted to their energy producing nanotechnology.

[Suzuku]

So do we know this is going to turn grim dark or something?

[zztop]

What does everyone suppose the whalesquid/Hideauze truly are? Maybe some kind of science experiment/genetic mutations gone wrong?

[bastek66]

Why we didn't notice earlier: THERE IS NO MOON

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Dark Speculation Time:

1) Ledo was thrown back in time.

How do you explain the fact that both Gargantia and the Alliance know that Earth froze, but only Gargantia knows (obviously) that the planet unfroze and became a water ball?

You can probably speculate some kind of explanation but so far everything suggests that humanity fled the planet before it unfroze.

Originally Posted by bastek66

Why we didn't notice earlier: THERE IS NO MOON

Really? Uh... but how? Why?

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

How do you explain the fact that both Gargantia and the Alliance know that Earth froze, but only Gargantia knows (obviously) that the planet unfroze and became a water ball?

Given that the Alliance doesn't know the co-ordinates for Earth (going by what Chamber says, anyway), it stands to reason that they left Earth a loooong time ago. Let's say it was 1,000 years ago that they left.

Now, let's say that Earth unfreezes 250 years after they left, and that the events of this anime is taking place 500 years after they left. So Ledo would be sent 500 years into his past, but still long after the Alliance left Earth. So Ledo could still be in a position to fulfill his own future, and be the catalyst of the human/whalesquid war starting in the first place.

You can probably speculate some kind of explanation but so far everything suggests that humanity fled the planet before it unfroze.

Sure, but that's not incompatible with my main speculation. Admittedly, fitting the 6th part of that speculation (which I separated out from the rest because I think it represents the extremes to which this "dark twist" could go) in with this would be rather tricky. But the first 5 parts can fit with what you're pointing to here without much difficulty.

[Jan-Poo]

Better, but then you are basically saying that the initial human diaspora from planet Earth was unrelated to the Hideauze.

Even though it is hinted that the planet freezing was caused by a solar anomaly and we know that Hideauze create their nests near stars.

[Kanon]

There's two different directions I can see the show take at this point.

1. Ledo finds ruins of the previous civilization and discovers the truth about the Hideauze and the how the war started. That truth will be that the Hideauze are actually rather peaceful creatures (perhaps engineered by the humans) and co-existence with them is possible. The war started because humans attacked/hunt them first. It's entirely the Alliance's fault. He will realize his whole life is a lie and will have to look for a new purpose. He will find it on the Gargantia and live happily ever after with Amy. Good end.

2. Ledo discovers he is right about the Hideauze: they will attack the humans if their technology reaches a certain level. That will lead to a bleak ending, as Ledo alone cannot possibly exterminate them all. His only hope would be to contact the Alliance, but even that wouldn't lead to a good ending, since the Gargantians would be drawn into the conflict and their peaceful lives would come to an abrupt end. Another possibility is that Amy or somebody else manages to convince Ledo that co-existence is possible with the Hideauze if they abandon their quest to recover lost technology. I don't think this would sit well with him or the viewers however. That would mean the series has a luddite hippie theme... which I doubt would be received very well. Depending on your point of view, this could be a bad ending as well (humanity submits to their hideauze oppressors...).

I think 1 is more likely. The show has been trying pretty hard to paint the Alliance in a bad light, and I doubt that's a red herring. They're probably responsible for the conflict.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by bastek66

Why we didn't notice earlier: THERE IS NO MOON

Are you sure? Wow, the destruction of the moon would definitely cause a calamity large enough to cause the wide spread death of millions and have the Earth become flooded.

They say it was caused also by the fluctuations in the sun. I have a feeling that too might link back to the Hideauze. In the first episode we see that the Hideauze are gathered around a giant yellow star. Since they're not burning up, it's obvious that they have not only become very durable, but are possibly around the star for a reason, most likely feeding off its energy. What if the Hideauze had begun to do the same to our sun and in doing so caused the fluctuations that destroyed the moon and made the Earth uninhabitable for a time?

Here's my theory:
The advanced humans of the distant past on Earth, needed more energy and decided to harness the energy of the sun using a different means. The created a biological, adaptable large flower plant using nanites and other tech that could gather energy and they put it near the sun (since plants are the primary autotrophs, it makes sense). However, the project went wrong and the organism mutated because of the cosmic and solar rays, causing it to take too much energy away from the sun causing the star to go haywire. The humans are able to destroy the organism, but the damage has been done. The nanites from the destroyed flower fall to earth and begin to affect sea life, and with the destruction and flooding of the Earth, the animals can go wherever they wish further infecting them.

These mutated animals and plants become the first Hideauze, that like the first created organism, their primary function, their food, is energy. When the humans left earth, and the waters began to freeze over they no longer has a food source and adapted themselves to survive in space and followed the humans. However there were still nanites and some Hideauze who stayed on Earth and survived, just as some humans did.

I know it's a little out there, but it's just speculation.

[mikeomni]

Looking at 21:57 of Episode 1, there was no moon in the solar system map!

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by mikeomni

Looking at 21:57 of Episode 1, there was no moon in the solar system map!

I noticed that too, but it could simply be that the map that omits moons, For example there are supposed to be four moons around Jupiter and two small ones around mars, but they rarely appear in solar system maps.

I find it more unsettling the fact that the moon doesn't appear in any shot of the sky. There's still the possibility that this is simply a coincidence and we just never happened to see it, but I guess it's more likely that something happened to the moon.

Oh... wait...

Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Could it be that the Hideauze took it away to create their nest near the sun?

[mikeomni]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I noticed that too, but it could simply be that the map that omits moons, For example there are supposed to be four moons around Jupiter and two small ones around mars, but they rarely appear in solar system maps.

I find it more unsettling the fact that the moon doesn't appear in any shot of the sky. There's still the possibility that this is simply a coincidence and we just never happened to see it, but I guess it's more likely that something happened to the moon.

Oh... wait...

Could it be that the Hideauze took it away to create their nest near the sun?

UFO Discovery! That does look suspiciously moonlike. They've been throwing in so many little details in this anime, it's odd that the moon would be out of frame all the time. An artistic choice perhaps? Makes all the stars stand out maybe? In Ep 3 I chalked it up to perfect attack time for pirates.

[MeggieMay]

Originally Posted by bastek66

Why we didn't notice earlier: THERE IS NO MOON

Actually, I noticed it a few episodes back, that is that we've never seen the Moon in any night time long shots. However, I haven't seen anything 100% conclusive that it's missing or not. If it's missing it would help add into any explanation of what's going on with all the water but it would also mean some other things that might not be survivable (just Google the subject of "what would happen if the Moon disappeared" for more on the subject).

[Revolutionist]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

Are you sure? Wow, the destruction of the moon would definitely cause a calamity large enough to cause the wide spread death of millions and have the Earth become flooded.

They say it was caused also by the fluctuations in the sun. I have a feeling that too might link back to the Hideauze. In the first episode we see that the Hideauze are gathered around a giant yellow star. Since they're not burning up, it's obvious that they have not only become very durable, but are possibly around the star for a reason, most likely feeding off its energy. What if the Hideauze had begun to do the same to our sun and in doing so caused the fluctuations that destroyed the moon and made the Earth uninhabitable for a time?

Here's my theory:
The advanced humans of the distant past on Earth, needed more energy and decided to harness the energy of the sun using a different means. The created a biological, adaptable large flower plant using nanites and other tech that could gather energy and they put it near the sun (since plants are the primary autotrophs, it makes sense). However, the project went wrong and the organism mutated because of the cosmic and solar rays, causing it to take too much energy away from the sun causing the star to go haywire. The humans are able to destroy the organism, but the damage has been done. The nanites from the destroyed flower fall to earth and begin to affect sea life, and with the destruction and flooding of the Earth, the animals can go wherever they wish further infecting them.

These mutated animals and plants become the first Hideauze, that like the first created organism, their primary function, their food, is energy. When the humans left earth, and the waters began to freeze over they no longer has a food source and adapted themselves to survive in space and followed the humans. However there were still nanites and some Hideauze who stayed on Earth and survived, just as some humans did.

I know it's a little out there, but it's just speculation.

I actually like this as it seems more plausible than time travel, although when dealing with black holes that's also not too far fetched either.

[rbsaito]

I have a theory about the relation between hideauze, ledo & whalesquid.

First, I think Ledo didnt only travel to Earth phisically but also through time. We know that he got into some sort of "worm-hole" and "Worm-hole" theories are pretty common in sci-fis. They are often used to support time travel stuff. The time-travel theory could also explain why Chamber is having problem to localize Earth.

We know that hideauze and whalesquis are genetically similar and I think thats natural, because the first is the evolution of the latter. By means of natural selection & mutation, whalesquid became inteligente. The pinnacle of the whole theory: why suddenly they were "selected"? Because of Ledo. Maybe Ledo will try to exterminate them all and this forced "selection" could potencialize their evolution.

There are many problems with this theory and one of them is the "grandpa paradox". If we course assume an universe "steins;gate" like with multiple worlds this could be avoided.

I can even imagine an "Urobochi-ending" like Ledo realizing that his death would stop this endless cycle.

Of course all of this can be bullshit, but I think its something worth thinking.
Read more at http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topici...kyDk2pDPQw0.99

[Toreno]

Spoiler for Hideauze:

Do you see what I see?

[Gravitas Free Zone]

Hidden secret fanservice?

[Beltane70]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I noticed that too, but it could simply be that the map that omits moons, For example there are supposed to be four moons around Jupiter and two small ones around mars, but they rarely appear in solar system maps.

Just to be a bit technical, Jupiter has four large moons, plus over 60 small moons. But, I get your point!

[duckroll]

Originally Posted by Toreno

Spoiler for Hideauze:

Do you see what I see?

Dat ass. Lol.