2006-04-19, 21:16 | Link #81 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
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the mines are small in size and signature, they can be built to provide stealth and... um... stealth... hard to target til you get close, and if you are clear enough they just rocket towards you and detonate their (perferably nuclear) payload, if you ahve them in a stationary minefield the enemy would only know the location of them at best, if you deploy them before a battle it might make for a nasty surprise...
of course sending random junk their way might work, unless they are spread out far apart and only home in or signatures of large ships (we arn't talking about passive mines here, then you really need ALOT, these mines need to have a single burn booster which go towards the target's predicted position) alternatively you can have shotgun type weapons or large area effect weapons to blow your way through... if you hide them in asteroids sooner or later the enemy will just start blowing up every asteroid that cross their path.. heh |
2006-04-19, 22:32 | Link #82 | ||
Umeboshi!
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Really it's just a never-ending circle.
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2006-04-20, 06:33 | Link #83 | |
Vampie Walrus. Big fangs
Join Date: Oct 2004
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I thought about the whole mine thing too (again reminding me of why the Kor-Ah in SC2 were dangerous) but I figure there'd just be too much crap up there to set one off. And when one goes off it'd make more debris that could set off other mines, detonation sensativity depending. As for them harming the planet, if a mine can survive reentry then it's not gonna blow up when something runs into it. I wanna see them make two animes. One that's hyper-realistic in the space combat physics and one that just throws it all out the window. |
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2006-04-20, 08:09 | Link #84 |
we girls arnt safe!
Artist
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: In the space between your walls
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You know I have sean some anime that they use bullets in space. I was wondering how well would a bullet travel in space (no gravity, no wind resistance.) and would super armored space hulks even be scatched by bulets...
another thing is how well would robots work in space. I mean astronaus have a time floting around trying to grab stuff and you dont realy need legs and the idea of fighter bays letting out ships and bots to the vacume of space from in your ship is just unrealalistic. I also think the best way to defeat an enemy ship is to send bording partys to take it for your own. |
2006-04-20, 10:46 | Link #85 | |
Banned
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Except for the one thing that mechas will never ever make sense in being an efficient weapon of war. Not in space, not wherever. |
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2006-04-20, 12:27 | Link #86 | |
Not Enough Sleep
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2006-04-20, 12:29 | Link #87 | |
Umeboshi!
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2006-04-20, 14:13 | Link #88 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2006
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low gravity and no wind resistance means bullets travel nice and straight in space and won't slow down at all Armor can be pierced if your bullet has enough energy and is designed for it, a modern sniper rifle is fully capable of piercing a tank, there's nothing stopping you from loading armor piercing bullets into a machine gun, as long as it can handle the shock and weight of the bullets @robots: if you are talking about robots in gundam, they DON'T work. The space battles in most (not all) gundam series are hideously unrealistic. the fact that most space robots you see have legs is either because the artist cant' think outside the box or that they are actually convertable for land use. @fighter bays: for huge fighter bays they always give the excuse of some force field keeping the air in.... we cant' do that currently or in the forseeable future.... the closest thing we have to a forcefield is to use belts to generate a large electrostatic field that'd trap particels in it... to be a tad more realistic fighters should be stored in small individual bays w/ airlocks, that way can be depressurized without pumping out a football field of gas. (i'm thinking those fighter launch tubes in battlestar galactica) @boarding parties: That's actually the first tactic the romans did when they didn't have adequate weaponry to sink a ship, but if you have a fat cannon that can launch nukes and enough information to get it pretty close to the enemy, then there's no reason to endanger marines for capturing. |
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2006-04-20, 14:52 | Link #89 |
Deadpan Snarker
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Neverlands
Age: 47
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Sure, a 2 year old can go around a mine, a skilled pilot can go around a 100 mines
but how many fleets actually can go around 100.000 mines loaded with detection/contactsensors and linked with eachother to blow around the first triggered mine Wanna go through there with "stealth"? it better not hit one of them, because it would be toast so maybe you could get a few spies in but a ship/force large enough to take on/out a planet? So you wanna blast your way through a minefield? Great, at least I'll know your coming and be ready to throw everything at you including the kitchen sink Or do you guys think it's a coincedence that 100000 tonnes of spacegarbage just happens to put a hole in your field? "Gee wizz Joe, 20 just went off again, that makes 500 now, must be nothing huh?" WWII had minefields still taking out ships years after the war ended Iraq had radar,......
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2006-04-20, 15:38 | Link #90 | |
Not Enough Sleep
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2006-04-20, 16:26 | Link #91 | |
Blob
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Age: 34
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Well actually...
As the current estimate stands, there are over a million pieces of man made debris orbiting just earth, and that's just the amount detectable by radar and such. (More then a centimeter wide etc.) Consider a time in the future when you could construct a mine field in space...and I'm sure you can imagine the exponential increase in the amount of debris floating out there. It's only been 50 years and we've already started to turn earth's backyard into a garbage dump. The estimate does not count all the other pieces of junk dumped by various intergalactic probes, satellites, or landing crafts that have left earth's orbit for other places. A pea-sized ball of space debris moving at orbital speed is equivalent of a 400-lb safe travelling at 60 miles per hour. Getting hit by a tennis ball sized piece of debris would be comparable to being blown up by 25 sticks of dynamite...I think that would be enough to trigger any mine. Above examples obtained from the web, since all I could think up of was 'space debris can put holes through spacecraft walls' and that's not very impressive. Also you need to take in account natural structures speeding around up there, there are millions upon millions of small and medium sized asteroids in just out galaxy that pinball around, it's just our atmosphere that renders of oblivious of these things. Not to mention that the Milky Way is pretty stable compared to the conditions in other sections of the universe. Quote:
Space isn't just a giant vast black landscape, think of it more as a very condensed electron cloud. Edit: Sorry NSW! I edited my post lol, just in case someone believed that a 400-lb safe wouldn't trigger a mine I decided to add the dynamite part. Last edited by Asphyxiate; 2006-04-20 at 16:56. |
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2006-04-20, 16:30 | Link #92 | |
Weapon of Mass Discussion
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Location: New York, USA
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2006-04-20, 16:43 | Link #93 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
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If you are interested in "Hard" sci-fi space warfare, try the following site
http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/rocket3t.html Tons to stuff to educate yourself in. |
2006-04-20, 17:05 | Link #94 | |
Deadpan Snarker
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Neverlands
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to make it change direction if the "pea story" was true, no spaceshuttle or satellite would survive more than a day in space I know, a minefield big enough to protect an entire system would need to be huge with numbers in the billions but compare the cost and resources ant time to create a minefield to a systemwide detection network one can say "technical advances bla, bla" but the same goes for mines it's not like these mines need to be light and flimsy like the tinfoil we send up now
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2006-04-20, 17:23 | Link #95 |
Blob
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Alright, if you visit the official NASA site, it proclaims that space shuttles are built to withstand impact from debris, and can survive impacts from objects of less then 10 cm in diameter.
They also track and use sensors to detect major pieces of debris those larger then 10 cm in diamter, and the space shuttle is programmed to automatically maneuver out of the way if the chance of collision is greater then 1 in 10,000. Now turn that around and imagine doing that type of maneuvering with a field of mines. Not to mention that mines are built to detonate and are not built to take repeated abuse from flinging objects. Edit: Mua...I'm forgetful...but... How exactly would redirecting a 400-lb safe matter in a mine field? Let's not forget that it wouldn't just be one 400-lb safe, there are thousands and thousands of these little things hurtling around. |
2006-04-20, 17:23 | Link #96 | |
Weapon of Mass Discussion
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2006-04-20, 18:40 | Link #97 | |
Yuuki Aoi
Join Date: Jul 2004
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Thanks, guys, for this thread. Really interesting. I've read elsewhere the thought that the distances make space warfare almost impossible, and that future wars might be an exchange of unstoppable planet-razings. I guess that depends on how effective the minefields are. Knowing the depths of our human incompetence, I suspect friendly vessels would sometimes take wrong routes through badly-charted minefields. Perhaps one method of war would be cordoning off a planet by disarranging its minefields. And I expect a mine stealth/detection arms race would be a continuing thing.
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2006-04-20, 19:41 | Link #98 |
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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Several things:
1. Minefields are not showstoppers. But they have their pros - they stall enemy forces. While the defender assembles/prepares/maneuvers his forces for battle. 2. A determined force will not have any problems clearing a minefield. The minefield is only effective if defending forces are on station to exploit the enemy mine-clearing endeavor. 3. These mines use IIR sensors (at least) or some advance variants of passive optical sensors which do not react to space junk. Upon identifying a valid target, they propel themselves along a precalculated intercept course, probably making minor corrections with their limited maneuverbility. Given the massive relative velocities of cruising warships, if they miss their intercept, they probably can't maneuver to intercept again, so they will explode in proximity with a frag warhead. 4. Due to the vastness of space, mines are deployed near strategic locations like bases, depots, transit lines, etc. But this affects civilian shipping, since IFF codes can't be issued to civilian vessels. |
2006-04-20, 20:54 | Link #99 | |
Umeboshi!
Join Date: Dec 2005
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I agree with Kaoru, this has been my favorite thread all week, I've learned a ton from researching things that were mentioned here.
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2006-04-21, 12:45 | Link #100 | |
Deadpan Snarker
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Age: 47
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Mines are a great and very nasty early warning system unlike listeningposts, you can't take 'em out with 1 shot, easily replacable, they don't take ages to build and they don't need lots of power you don't have to keep them secret As "stupid" as mines are they are quite foolproof and even when they're old can still pose a threat They may not discriminate, but anyone not knowing where they are are not your ally
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