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Schion93 · 2015-06-11, 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowSamurai365

I think that the trainer was talking to Judom about that, wanting Judom to train them to be strong to provide assistance. However, Judom denied it and pointed out many problems about how the King isn't being truthful, along with how the Heroes aren't even serious about "saving the world" (he even stated how he trusted Hiro more than the heroes). The trainer did worry a lot about what Judom stated, but by the encouraging (dumb and stupid) speech of one of the heroes, he completely washed over his doubts and tried to get Judom to train the heroes again (and failed).

As for the King, while I do believe somewhat that he wasn't completely naïve for the contract, I can't say that he's sympathetic nor a nice guy (for some reason, I had a feeling that Karma was going to hit him, and it did).

I agree with you, I don't think he was completely wrong about trusting this contract nor do I think it was completely unreasonable for him to not trust the requests by the Evila for peace talks but when he tries to justify the deaths of his daughters by saying the Evila were the cause of their deaths when he was the one who sacrificed them, that is where I just hate him cause he was trying to shift the blame for his daughters death onto the Evila when he was the one who caused it and even tried to say that he will wipe out the Evila cause he is angry as a father

EDIT: overall, the King is kinda tragic as he bet on summoning saviours in exchange for his daughters lives and instead got useless trash like Taishi and the others

rantaid · 2015-06-11, 22:30

Everything must be blamed on Judom then.

dim1 · 2015-06-11, 22:58

Quick question is Lilyn the main heroine?

Occhio92 · 2015-06-11, 23:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowSamurai365

As for the King, while I do believe somewhat that he wasn't completely naïve for the contract, I can't say that he's sympathetic nor a nice guy (for some reason, I had a feeling that Karma was going to hit him, and it did).

I didnt' say he was a good person, i just said he wasn't as stupid as you guys were trying to pass him off as. He's clearly not a good person. It's explicitly stated in the novel that he would have betrayed and exterminated the Gabranth right after finishing the Evila.

Occhio92 · 2015-06-11, 23:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by dim1

Quick question is Lilyn the main heroine?

She is one of the main heroines, yes.

rantaid · 2015-06-11, 23:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Occhio92

It's explicitly stated in the novel that he would have betrayed
and exterminated the Gabranth right after finishing the Evila.

that make him a bad guy or not a good person?

Ophis · 2015-06-11, 23:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by rantaid

that make him a bad guy or not a good person?

No, no, that makes him a wonderful person. He's such a good person that Madre Teresa would be labeled as the devil incarnate when compared to him. That's how nice a person he is.

Rudolph was never after peace, only pointless, senseless, and unnecessary War, slaughter, and sacrifices.

rantaid · 2015-06-12, 01:14

@Ophis
here is a famous paradox; "If you want peace, please be prepared for war."

s.a.w.. · 2015-06-12, 01:36

That's not the point, genocide automatically makes you the villain, ex. The previous demon lord, the beast king to a slightly lesser degree, Rudolf, Hitler etc.. And even if we accept war as something that is in sentient beings nature, that doesn't justify Rudolf's desire to butcher all sentient life aside from the "harmless" Pheom. The attack on the capital was not battle, nor was it an attempt to commandeer the enemies base, it was a slaughter of civilians. And all sides are guilty of it to an extent depending on the person in question.

rantaid · 2015-06-12, 02:07

maybe. though...there is problem with this part.

Quote:

The attack on the capital was not battle, nor
was it an attempt to commandeer the enemies base, it was a slaughter of
civilians.

it is often done in numerous history that enemy's imperial capital, economic lifelines, crops and granary, water reservoir, supply line are the first priority target of attack. others are considered casualties in war (or collateral damage). so it was all strategic maneuver, not an uncoordinated attack.

Ophis · 2015-06-12, 02:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by rantaid

@Ophis
here is a famous paradox; "If you want peace, please be prepared for war."

Yeah, must've been Hitler's motto. And look, he was a saint too.

Rudolf never wanted peace, but the eradication of any other races aside from humans. If he truly desired peace he would first, and foremost, seriously consider Eveam's peace treat proposal, and only resort to War in case there was no other alternative.

You can call Rudolf anything but a good person.

Occhio92 · 2015-06-12, 02:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by s.a.w..

That's not the point, genocide automatically makes you the villain, ex. The previous demon lord, the beast king to a slightly lesser degree, Rudolf, Hitler etc.. And even if we accept war as something that is in sentient beings nature, that doesn't justify Rudolf's desire to butcher all sentient life aside from the "harmless" Pheom. The attack on the capital was not battle, nor was it an attempt to commandeer the enemies base, it was a slaughter of civilians. And all sides are guilty of it to an extent depending on the person in question.

There are good chances Hajime will commit genocide in the next few chapters of Arifureta, would that make him the bad guy?

s.a.w.. · 2015-06-12, 02:26

That is vengeance, and yes, it makes him the bad guy. However butchering the demon army would be a different story...

rantaid · 2015-06-12, 02:28

@Ophis

okay, "A Good and capable" monarch then. fair point.

actually that was Plato

@Occhio92

no, blame themselves for losing aginst hajime. but anyone who is depicted in later chapter to netorare Yue from him, in my heart.... he will always be a bro. and i salute for him.

@s.a.w.

to remind you; Evillas is a 'demon army'

Occhio92 · 2015-06-12, 02:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by s.a.w..

That is vengeance, and yes, it makes him the bad guy. However butchering the demon army would be a different story...

He said he would exterminate the demon race regardless of man, woman, child, or elderly person if Remia or Miu got hurt. In the last chapter Freed shoot magic at them. All the flags for the event got raised.

s.a.w.. · 2015-06-12, 02:45

@rantaid: He isn't a good or capable ruler, he is just a fool, Judom even stated that he failed as a king... What makes him either good or capable as a ruler? And so what if they have a demon army? They were clearly attacking a primarily civilian area, and in addition it seems like they have a tribal union type of army where each tribe's warriors answer the demon lord's call, and they have a minimal standing army...

@Occio92: So? I think he is more likely to kill Kouki than commit genocide, it just isn't his style. In essence that was just a threat and he protected them anyway.

rantaid · 2015-06-12, 02:47

@Occhia92

Really? yay! finally some action!

@s.a.w.

You believe the words of Judom who repeatedly disobey orders and made refusal to the call?

what makes Rudolf a good and capable monarch? have you seen his kingdom threatened by internal discord except by comparison another monarch like.............. Eveam maybe ? beside some small crime in his kingdom , his kingdom was relatively peaceful internally.

what about it if they have demon armies? well same reason demon army in arifureta and the wave in tate yuusha, aliens in Gantz, and White Walkers in Game of Thrones perhaps?

Ghiest Cid · 2015-06-12, 04:03

@rantaid well Hitler also brought Germany out of recession and prior to the war is relatively peaceful and crime rate is down. Nazi executions and seizures of assets are within their law so it is technically not crimes. How that ended up.

How is that related? They persecute demihuman much like nazi do to Jews, minorities and political opponents.

rantaid · 2015-06-12, 04:15

@Ghiest Cid

well i know of Hitler's greatest achievement. i am just reluctant praising him here would make everyone think i am antisemit. beside i was thinking Plato when i quote that. some people just seems like to fantasize about Hitler.

also there is some account that The Jew via rothschild or Rockefeller do betray and profitted from World War 1... but that is what happened behind the scene, and still up for debate.

Ghiest Cid · 2015-06-12, 04:20

I am not talking about that quote and I already know that. Excluding games it is well known quote. It is Latin (Roman)not Greek as Plato is Greek.

I am talking how you say the kingdom is peaceful and less crime.that is only half the the requirement to be good monarch. The other half is what happen after their reign. If the kingdom isn't divided by succession feud or anything then that means the monarch looks into the future and planned it.

2015-06-11, 22:30	Link #1082
rantaid Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Indonesia	Everything must be blamed on Judom then. __________________ http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2496168/Rantaid https://www.fictionpress.com/~rantaid I like Netorare.

2015-06-11, 22:58	Link #1083
dim1 God of Sleep Join Date: Feb 2012	Quick question is Lilyn the main heroine? __________________ “What are you saying, Shia? We are sane/okay. It’s just that we have awoken to the truth of this world. It’s all thanks to Boss” “T-the truth? What was that?” Having a bad feeling about it, Shia asked while her cheeks twitched, and Kam smiled while confidently declaring. “90% of this world’s problems can be solved with violence”

2015-06-12, 01:14	Link #1088
rantaid Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Indonesia	@Ophis here is a famous paradox; "If you want peace, please be prepared for war." __________________ http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2496168/Rantaid https://www.fictionpress.com/~rantaid I like Netorare. Last edited by rantaid; 2015-06-12 at 01:27.

2015-06-12, 02:28	Link #1094
rantaid Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Indonesia	@Ophis okay, "A Good and capable" monarch then. fair point. actually that was Plato @Occhio92 no, blame themselves for losing aginst hajime. but anyone who is depicted in later chapter to netorare Yue from him, in my heart.... he will always be a bro. and i salute for him. @s.a.w. to remind you; Evillas is a 'demon army' __________________ http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2496168/Rantaid https://www.fictionpress.com/~rantaid I like Netorare.

2015-06-12, 02:47	Link #1097
rantaid Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Indonesia	@Occhia92 Really? yay! finally some action! @s.a.w. You believe the words of Judom who repeatedly disobey orders and made refusal to the call? what makes Rudolf a good and capable monarch? have you seen his kingdom threatened by internal discord except by comparison another monarch like.............. Eveam maybe ? beside some small crime in his kingdom , his kingdom was relatively peaceful internally. what about it if they have demon armies? well same reason demon army in arifureta and the wave in tate yuusha, aliens in Gantz, and White Walkers in Game of Thrones perhaps? __________________ http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2496168/Rantaid https://www.fictionpress.com/~rantaid I like Netorare. Last edited by rantaid; 2015-06-12 at 02:59.

2015-06-12, 01:36	Link #1089
s.a.w.. Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2014	That's not the point, genocide automatically makes you the villain, ex. The previous demon lord, the beast king to a slightly lesser degree, Rudolf, Hitler etc.. And even if we accept war as something that is in sentient beings nature, that doesn't justify Rudolf's desire to butcher all sentient life aside from the "harmless" Pheom. The attack on the capital was not battle, nor was it an attempt to commandeer the enemies base, it was a slaughter of civilians. And all sides are guilty of it to an extent depending on the person in question.

2015-06-12, 02:26	Link #1093
s.a.w.. Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2014	That is vengeance, and yes, it makes him the bad guy. However butchering the demon army would be a different story...

2015-06-12, 02:45	Link #1096
s.a.w.. Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2014	@rantaid: He isn't a good or capable ruler, he is just a fool, Judom even stated that he failed as a king... What makes him either good or capable as a ruler? And so what if they have a demon army? They were clearly attacking a primarily civilian area, and in addition it seems like they have a tribal union type of army where each tribe's warriors answer the demon lord's call, and they have a minimal standing army... @Occio92: So? I think he is more likely to kill Kouki than commit genocide, it just isn't his style. In essence that was just a threat and he protected them anyway.

2015-06-12, 04:03	Link #1098
Ghiest Cid Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014	@rantaid well Hitler also brought Germany out of recession and prior to the war is relatively peaceful and crime rate is down. Nazi executions and seizures of assets are within their law so it is technically not crimes. How that ended up. How is that related? They persecute demihuman much like nazi do to Jews, minorities and political opponents.

2015-06-12, 04:15	Link #1099
rantaid Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Indonesia	@Ghiest Cid well i know of Hitler's greatest achievement. i am just reluctant praising him here would make everyone think i am antisemit. beside i was thinking Plato when i quote that. some people just seems like to fantasize about Hitler. also there is some account that The Jew via rothschild or Rockefeller do betray and profitted from World War 1... but that is what happened behind the scene, and still up for debate. __________________ http://www.fanfiction.net/u/2496168/Rantaid https://www.fictionpress.com/~rantaid I like Netorare.

2015-06-12, 04:20	Link #1100
Ghiest Cid Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014	I am not talking about that quote and I already know that. Excluding games it is well known quote. It is Latin (Roman)not Greek as Plato is Greek. I am talking how you say the kingdom is peaceful and less crime.that is only half the the requirement to be good monarch. The other half is what happen after their reign. If the kingdom isn't divided by succession feud or anything then that means the monarch looks into the future and planned it. Last edited by Ghiest Cid; 2015-06-12 at 04:38.