F/SN UBW TV - Episode 8 Spoiler Discussion / Poll

[Subarunyon II]

Originally Posted by Dengar

Well, there's that, and also, Rin, just like most people her age, isn't actually used to seeing these kinds of things. Really you should focus your attention on Shirou, he's the weird one for not batting an eye.

I've never played UBW, but I think ufo should've gone with what the original VN did with the melting student faces, that'd be enough to show that Rin is acting in character (I buy my own explanation though, so what they did is enough for me).

[Rising Dragon]

The scene was meant to highlight Shirou's distortion. But of course people only care if female characters are shown as "inferior" to male characters, so of course people are bothered by that scene for all the wrong reasons.

[Rev Okkin]

Originally Posted by Subarunyon II

My take on why Rin was shaken is because she was indirectly responsible for Blood Fort hurting the students. She let Shinji do as he pleases and left archer at home. Things might not have turned out differently if she hadn't, but I guess she still feels the guilt from her mistake underestimating the enemy.

I've never played UBW, but I think ufo should've gone with what the original VN did with the melting student faces, that'd be enough to show that Rin is acting in character (I buy my own explanation though, so what they did is enough for me).

Well, Rin IS acting in character. She underestimated Shinji which led to the mess. She does try to not involve innocent people and seeing those that she regularly sees in such a horrid state, she will feel guilty about it.
There's the TV censorship to worry about so they can't have that. Plus the fanon explanation to the absence of melting faces was that Rider was killed before the Bloodfort actually started melting people. Remember the attacked girl in Ep 5? They're all in that state of mana drained from them. The Bloodfort is supposed to take that further and take in even the physical bodies of the students but Rider was killed before that got to that point.

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

The scene was meant to highlight Shirou's distortion. But of course people only care if female characters are shown as "inferior" to male characters, so of course people are bothered by that scene for all the wrong reasons.

Heck if people ARE paying attention to Rin, they would have seen Rin taking a step back when she saw Shirou's PTSD face which clearly shows Shirou is really out of the norm.
There's a lot of reviews putting down Rin's tsundere act as "lazy writing" and "inconsistency of character". Then there are those who are questioning Shirou's "I am used to dead bodies" when it was clearly gone over in the FIRST episode. Then there's the aforementioned "plot hole" of leaving Shinji alive.

The thing about this series is that it is meant to be marathoned. ufotable takes the subtle approach which flies over people's heads when there's a week in between episodes. The lack of narration and monologues is carried over via body language and such but it doesn't work with the airing setup. They are easily picked up and stitched together in a marathon as details are still fresh. Heck, I would recommend this set up:
UBW->HF->Zero->UBW->HF
Just to make sure everything gets through. Sure, ufotable's making this hard for basically anyone, but heck it's hella lot more rewarding when all things are said and done.

[dmaxzero]

And that people bitch about everything these days and try to force everything under their particular point of view. Just ignore them, there is no reason to even respond.

[Dengar]

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

Then there's the aforementioned "plot hole" of leaving Shinji alive.

Aforementioned?

What plothole? And when was this mentioned?

[Lorhand]

http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...40#post5354540

It's just JesuOtaku from ANN who says that. Ignore her rants.

[Dengar]

Ok, because I find it kind of hilarious that UBW route's key character surviving is called a plothole. XD

[Rev Okkin]

Well, people wants everything upfront and explained from the getgo. That's why FZ was so popular outside its grim and edgy tone. FSN relies on mystery and the audience piecing everything together so if something flies over their heads or seems to be a perfect bait, things more or less fall apart for that kind of audience.
And yeah, this'll be the last of me bringing in stuff from other sites.

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

Well, people wants everything upfront and explained from the getgo. That's why FZ was so popular outside its grim and edgy tone. FSN relies on mystery and the audience piecing everything together so if something flies over their heads or seems to be a perfect bait, things more or less fall apart for that kind of audience.
And yeah, this'll be the last of me bringing in stuff from other sites.

I actually think that is just a VERY, VERY VOCAL minority.

Even though we are not even at the good parts yet, UBW is already at #18 on MAL, while F/Z "season 1" is at #72 and F/Z "season 2" is at #26.

UBW "season 2" has a great chance to to grow up into TOP 10 when it airs.

[Rev Okkin]

I tend to avoid MAL, but that gave me some peace. If UBW part 2 does get to the Top 10, then the HF movie(s) better get to Top 5. But there's gonna be the problem of people being able to view it so the ones scoring it would be the ones actively trying to find a good video/stream of the HF movie(s).
But, screw it. I won't look at any reviews outside animesuki until about a year when BD of both cours of UBW are out so that I can find actually decent reviews of the show.

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

I actually think that is just a VERY, VERY VOCAL minority.

Ignoring them is the best option. They already resent having to go through the effort to download it from a torrent site (God forbid they cough up the dough for a CR subscription), so of course they're going to be upset that every aspect of every plot point isn't spoon fed to them by 30 seconds into the first episode. They don't want to commit to it unless they know they're going to like it (it's taking away time that they could spend writing another SAO fanfic, after all), and in their minds the only way to know that is to know everything that's going to happen before it does. Perfectly logical, if you're a lazy, entitled idiot... ¬_¬

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

Then there's the aforementioned "plot hole" of leaving Shinji alive.

The more I think about it, the more I've convinced myself that the author did it that way to hint to the audience that Shinji is a fake Master. If he were a real Master, Caster would want to either kill him or strip him of his command spells, like she was going to do to Shirou in just the last episode. The fact that she didn't have her "mysterious proxy" even attempt to do suggests that Shinji's utterly useless to her. The audience will find out in HF how true that is, as he has no inherent command spells. It's something that doesn't make sense unless you have more info than would have been revealed at this point in the VN, but it does get you thinking that something is off about Shinji

[Levani]

Does anyone when this beautiful soundtrack gets released? I can't wait.

[Rev Okkin]

Most likely around March when the first Blu Ray boxset comes out.

[Craxuan]

It's just that people are not used to depth in action-based anime, especially those who started off watching Date-A-Live. The Light Novel was so terrible I had to stop like 1/8 through the story.

[Dengar]

I wouldn't call Fate action-based. It's very philosophical.

[Craxuan]

Exactly. I'm referring to people nowadays being shortsighted.

[Rev Okkin]

I'm understanding both sides here.
First: ufoFSN was advertised with awesome fight scenes. Of course, casual watchers would anticipate for it, especially from the hype from FZ fight scenes. What people tend to forget is that fight scenes are secondary-ish to the narrative and used to highlight external conflict between certain characters.

Second: FSN has the reputation/beginnings of a (typical) shounen narrative. Shounen narratives tend to have just one specific moral/lesson (FMA:B has no pain no gain, HxH has the reluctance to lose is a virtue) and have a lot of fight scenes to pad things or develop that further. FSN or any Type-Moon narrative has more than a few morals or things to think about so time is set to develop those stuff which may or may not be during "cliches", "stereotypical (insert location here) scenes" or in "meandering" conversations.

Third: FSN is a story meant to be marathoned. A lot of the symbolism and cues on subtext for characterization and character development are spread out between episodes. When people tune in for their weekly episode, they want a beginning, a middle and an end. It doesn't work for FSN as it has middle/long beginning, middle/long middle and an adrenaline filled end in which all span for two episodes or more. This is how people are being "shortsighted". As their weekly fill of an episode isn't quenched, they tend to call out an episode to be boring. In comparison to say, Mushishi, each episode is its own arc and its own individual story. You can drop in at any time and you won't get lost but you won't get the initiative to marathon it because you are already satisfied. To compare, FSN is Harry Potter while Mushishi is the Penguin Short Stories. Both are great but the initiative are different as HP and FSN you marathon it while Mushishi and PSS, you can just read one story and be done with it.

In any case, FSN is one to show to people who aren't that well versed in anime tropes but experienced enough to pick up on certain symbolism and cues on subtext or characterization.
Oh and show the BD version because I saw someone say that the TV version is just a glorified overextended preview/detailed synopsis of the final product aka BD version

[quigonkenny]

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

Oh and show the BD version because I saw someone say that the TV version is just a glorified overextended preview/detailed synopsis of the final product aka BD version

Hyperbole. There will be added scenes (maybe one per episode) and cleaned up animation. That hardly makes the broadcast version a "preview"...

[GDB]

Not counting episode 11 of Fate/Zero since it was an outlier, I don't think any episode had more than 2 minutes of animated added compared to the TV broadcast, and even 2 minutes is on the high side. So really, there's maybe a 5% total difference in run time between the two. Definitely not a "preview" discrepancy.

[Dengar]

Originally Posted by Rev Okkin

especially from the hype from FZ fight scenes.

Except F/Z wasn't really action-based either. There was still way more talking/investigating/expoisition than actual fighting.