2008-04-28, 08:00 | Link #1201 |
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Among others, even in the DVD version, in which the far-off shots are more forcefull and faster, there is still the 'acute deceleration' whenever we get a close-up on the face, so unless Fate and Tre can decelerate and re-acelerate in the timespan of zero seconds (and why the hell would they do that?), this again proves my point.
Last edited by Keroko; 2008-04-28 at 09:03. |
2008-04-28, 09:31 | Link #1202 | ||||||
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Join Date: Jul 2007
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Anyway, something has to bend. "Shocking speed". For what? For 99% of the battle mages (remember that we are tracking the story of the 3 top mages, so we'll see a disproportionate percentage of "absurd" or "shocking" abiliities)? For a round of such power? For a round that has to reach the "extreme" distance? Maybe it is just the opinion of the writer of the Magical Dictionary? If the "battle vet" Vita can be excused for not thinking a shot can be made that far at all, could not the Dictionary's writer be excused for using overly optimistic adjectives* for the speed? *The Dictionary's writer is explicitly known not to be omniniscent - not the author, for example. Regularly appearing in both the A's and StrikerS' dictionary are terms like "X is thought to be" and even "completely unknown" (see the bottom of the same page you are looking at). While it makes it an authority in SoD terms, it also says that on any item, it can simply be wrong, especially if the anime clearly shows otherwise... "But you are just shafting the Dictionary instead of the Anime!" Maybe, but since we are explicitly told that the Dictionary is imperfect, it is automatically subordinate to the nominally perfect anime if they conflict anyway. At least I'm trying to give it some SoD context, unlike Keroko, who is eager to shaft the anime. In short, Keroko might have a King, but I have an Ace in my hand By the way, in being very eager to score a blow on stadia ranging - even though the best his argument could hope for is to score a blow on timing, Keroko missed a chance to win the Ace as well, thus taking a jackpot which includes something I know he wants. If the answer is not obvious, do spend a few minutes before clicking "Show spoiler" if you wish to see it: Spoiler for The answer:
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2008-04-28, 09:47 | Link #1203 | |
Blazing General
Join Date: May 2006
Location: CA
Age: 38
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More to the point, if the conditions of victory are damaging her barrier jacket and half the people involved in the training (and the two most likely to penetrate her barriers in the first place) use physical weapons, under the 'barrier jackets are tissue' view she's designed a test that is almost impossible to complete without killing or seriously wounding her. (Of course, there was the 'avoid all her shots' alternate victory condition, but like Teana said the timing of the test makes that the much more difficult option)
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2008-04-28, 10:45 | Link #1204 | |
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Join Date: Jul 2007
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It is virtually certain that had Nanoha put slightly more force into her BB and activated it earlier (that is to say, if this is her wish), she could have bounced Erio off without Erio touching her jacket, so it clearly wasn't meant to stop him completely. So why bother doing that half-a*sed job with the BB? Unless the BJ is not really that protective, so she has to blast Erio so he gets to just graze the jacket. Erio wasn't even sure that he actually hit anything, though there should be some feedback had he struck something in significant strength. Of course, for the last point, I'm sure Keroko will have a better idea than me. |
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2008-04-28, 11:06 | Link #1205 |
Once and Current Subber
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Keep in mind that Elio's also using a down-powered Strada, without all of its capabilities unlocked. It could be that a full-power Strada, outside of a practice match, would have been able to do the job in that circumstance, and thus Nanoha gave him credit for a proper approach and execution.
Why'd she bother? She's training them, not bullying them. Setting challenge after challenge that the trainees have no chance in hell of accomplishing would be disastrous to morale, after all. We also know from other episodes that Nanoha isn't afraid to take a cut to make a point if she feels she has to (or, for that mattter, has any compunction about kicking the ever-living hell out of one of the trainees if they go off the rails...) |
2008-04-28, 15:31 | Link #1206 | ||
Blazing General
Join Date: May 2006
Location: CA
Age: 38
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2008-04-28, 15:35 | Link #1207 | |
He Who Smites Shippers
Join Date: Mar 2008
Age: 37
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2008-04-28, 18:42 | Link #1208 | |
Sword Wielding Penguin
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Give him JUST enough give to make it to the jacket, but blow off enough energy to stop him from hitting harder, so that they can gain a little confidence that "Hey! We can do this!" |
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2008-04-28, 19:36 | Link #1209 |
Blazing General
Join Date: May 2006
Location: CA
Age: 38
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I'm completely with you on her letting him hit the jacket to build their confidence. I just think letting it hit makes way more sense if the line between 'complete deflection' and 'spear through the chest' isn't micron-thin.
But yeah, I guess if the device is doing most of the work that kind of precision becomes more believable. I recall Ark saying that the thing she used at the end of episode 1 was supposed to work like that, using the device to work out an appropriate counter-force... though I also recall that he wasn't too happy about it.
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2008-05-03, 10:41 | Link #1210 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
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Many dimensions or one?
Here's something new from a discussion on the IRC channel. Are all the different worlds seen in Nanoha so far in the same universe or not?
From Yuuno's explaination in season 1's ep 8, it's possible. But with seasons 2 and 3, I think not. The most important evidence, to me, is the Wolkies teleporting to other worlds to collect Linker Cores in A's. They do it so casually, teleport out, whack the target, get home for dinner. If all those worlds were in the same universe, ours, that would mean they can teleport light-years, with ease! Given that they're working on an energy budget (or they wouldn't need to collect Cores in the first place) and even teleporting the BoD's defense program a few hundred kms above the Earth required considerable effort, that strikes me as unlikely. However, if those worlds are across the dimensional sea and seperated by a "virtual distance" of only a few thousand to a few million km, I feel the energy levels are more in line with what we've seen so far. Opinions? |
2008-05-03, 11:16 | Link #1211 |
Adeptus Animus
Author
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Hmm? I don't see why its even questioned that the events happen in different dimensions. After all, what is the use of basing a show around multiple dimensions if everything happens in the same dimension? For that matter, what is the proof that everything is happening in our dimension?
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2008-05-03, 12:11 | Link #1212 |
Blazing General
Join Date: May 2006
Location: CA
Age: 38
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I've always taken for granted ever since the first season used the term 'adjacent dimensions' that the dimensional sea isn't just a plain hyperspace analogue- either its very warped and rearranges the universe into a very different topography for those who use it to travel, or it connects what we would consider different universes entirely.
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2008-05-03, 12:16 | Link #1213 |
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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Well, some were wondering if "many dimensions" was a mistranslation. It isn't , by the way.
Then, there are those in the OC discussion that are setting parts of their stories specifically in different parts of the galaxy. This, I think, is a violation of canon. The Bureau has never shown FTL starship travel within a dimension before. Evidence within the show suggests that Midchilda's civilization, and the destroyed civilizations before it, did not possess FTL interstellar travel and instead colonized habitable worlds in other dimensions within interplanetary distances across the dimensional sea. |
2008-05-03, 12:36 | Link #1215 | |
Truth Martyr
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Doing Anzu's paperwork.
Age: 38
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*me headdesks* Sorry guys, but screw this all. I'm going to go and sleep.
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2008-05-03, 12:44 | Link #1216 | |||
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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Yet, if interstellar teleportation was this easy, it would have a significant impact on the Bureau's operations. For one thing, they wouldn't really need starships in the first place! Therefore, I feel that having all the worlds shown in Nanoha being in the same universe is actually more difficult than having them in different universes. Last edited by Jimmy C; 2008-05-03 at 13:46. |
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2008-05-04, 03:05 | Link #1218 | |
Blazing General
Join Date: May 2006
Location: CA
Age: 38
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Plus I think I remember it being stated somewhere that the Wolkenritter's interdimensional transference is an unusual ability that they were granted by the Book.
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2008-05-04, 03:15 | Link #1219 | ||||
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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2008-05-06, 03:02 | Link #1220 | |||||||||||||||||||
Adeptus Animus
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 36
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Pardon the double post, but once again a conversation popped up in the OC thread.
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All right, so I grant you that scene. Where does that bring us? At a controdictionairy point. Barrier Jackets are worn for defence, but apparently they are useless defending against puffs of wind from flying bugs. Whgich brings us where? Quote:
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Anyway, my point of these scenes was to show the existence of bullet time in Nanoha, not break your voice-lock. I'll start looking for scenes that do that in a minute. Quote:
18:20 in episode 9 shows Nanoha dodging lightning bolts, which are obviously slowed (heck, in later scenes they apear and disapear instantly) and this scene was also voiced. 6:18 in episode 11 is another, in the middle of a Flash Move -which we know goes fast- Nanoha is yelling, again showing the inexistence of Voice-Lock. 6:45 in the same episode shows faster then normal magic rounds (as well as instantly raised shields. Interesting notion, very usefull.) 15:46 in 11 has a nice slow motion scene of a grunt being knocked back by Precia. Voiced. Episode 12 also has a scene that shows why Voice-lock is useless. At 11:55 a sword is headed for Nanoha, after which we cut to a shot of Bardiche. If we count that scene as chronoligically accurate, then Nanoha should have been cut in half by that time. Obviously she wasn't, so despite the scene being voiced, it was still faster then it should have been. Whew, well that's all I could pick out when speed-watching S1. Haven't started A's yet, much less StrikerS, but with so many examples lining up in the first season alone, I'd say its safe to say Voice-Lock is busted. Quote:
That aside, during the novel debate you were so insistent that he most recent source of canon is the one we should believe. With the booklets being the most recent source of canon, and the scenes explainable instead of outright changing, doesn't that sort of counter your earlier statements? Quote:
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It's like how in many shounen anime, the characters are supposed to move 'faster then the eye can see' and yet we can still see them. Heck, they're even talking to eachother while moving at those speeds. Why? Because it'd make for a boring watch if we weren't able to see them fight. Quote:
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You know, the most biggest difference between your logic and mine is that I don't discard scenes. I explain them. You, however, just blatantly said 'this scene is useless, it never happened' And the part of it not being a representation of reallity is cute. Especially since I've been saying that all along. This is anime, animation, something created to entertain, to look cool, to look cute. It is not created with 'reallity' foremost in mind, ergo, comparing it with reallity is inherently flawed. Quote:
... Actually, I should stop doing this at all. How many times have we had this discussion now? Every time I plan to stop, something comes up and I start all over again. Last edited by Keroko; 2008-05-06 at 03:26. |
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