Code Geass - Spoilers & Speculation (take 3)

[Amaterasu Gate]

Originally Posted by Baixinho

How has this anything to do with her learning the truth or not?

I base my reasoning that she will learn the truth on :
- her gumline
- her chara song
- her plot which was developped for a whole season
- my experience in anime regarding these kind of plots

Now please tell me where it is stated that Suzaku needs to not die on the battle field for Zero's Requiem to be completed?

Oh, and since my opinion is an opinion, it is biased by definition. But so is yours.

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

You mean the summaries which state, "Farewell Lelouch and farewell Suzaku? This is the promise and it is all for Zero Requiem?"

They made the plan, therefore it makes sense for them to see it to the end at the very least.



You mean aside from Lelouch telling Suzaku that he must live for Zero Requiem?

If I tell you, Baixinho, to live on in order for Plan A then you'd better make sure your butt that you don't die along the way until you enact this plan.

I think Soldier summed it up pretty nicely.
Her gumline is the only thing keeping her alive at this point but everything else has no relevance to the plot at hand just her character nothing more nothing less. I 'm not saying she'll die of course I'm just saying they should said some light on the situation for her since at this point she's intruding n a very noble cause.

[Eliarine]

Originally Posted by Baixinho

Now please tell me where it is stated that Suzaku needs to not die on the battle field for Zero's Requiem to be completed?

Said that before, but while Suzaku might not be needed for the completion of Zero Requiem, dying on the battlefield to Kallen would take him out of the real finale and some us just don't see that happening. Lelouch and Suzaku's relationship has always been at the center of the series, it needs a decent resolution too.

[Baixinho]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

You mean the summaries which state, "Farewell Lelouch and farewell Suzaku? This is the promise and it is all for Zero Requiem?"

They made the plan, therefore it makes sense for them to see it to the end at the very least.



You mean aside from Lelouch telling Suzaku that he must live for Zero Requiem?

If I tell you, Baixinho, to live on in order for Plan A then you'd better make sure your butt that you don't die along the way until you enact this plan.

When did he say that? And what did he mean by it? If Zero Requiem includes all he has been doing since episode 22, he may have meant that Suzaku had to stay alive for the last battle.


The episode summary is very vague, I don't know how you can conclude from it that they will necessarily have to be together or to do something together in the very end. We can only conclude from it that they made a promise, and that they will make their farewell.


Please, mind that I am not saying that Suzaku is not needed, just that we can't be sure that he is.

[Amaterasu Gate]

Originally Posted by Baixinho

- my experience in anime regarding these kind of plots

Now please tell me where it is stated that Suzaku needs to not die on the battle field for Zero's Requiem to be completed?

Oh, and since my opinion is an opinion, it is biased by definition. But so is yours.

Bravo, you watch anime, good for you
Get a dictionary and look up bias because you seem to be very confused on it's meaning, since your assuming that Kallen's development this season is more important than the actual plot itself which has be going on until this very moment is an extremely biased opinion.

[Baixinho]

Originally Posted by Eliarine

Said that before, but while Suzaku might not be needed for the completion of Zero Requiem, dying on the battlefield to Kallen would take him out of the real finale and some us just don't see that happening. Lelouch and Suzaku's relationship has always been at the center of the series, it needs a decent resolution too.

I don't think he will die on the battle field, don't worry. I just think that Kallen may get through him, maybe just for a few minutes.

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

Suzaku, "Yes for Zero Requiem, I cannot lose."
Lelouch, "therefore, you must live"

IIRC, this was said when he fought Bismark. So he could have meant that he needed him alive for
- taking over the UFN
- fighting during the final battle

No actually the idea is that the two came up with the plan so it makes sense for them to see it to the end which Lelouch and Suzaku stated themselves.

Besides Kallen is so gung-ho in killing Lelouch I don't see her even saying the line if she breaks through Suzaku. What's wrong with her saying it later on in the episode?

What is wrong is that if she says it to Lelouch (what makes the most sense), she has to see him. And I don't think she will have a better chance later on in the episode : to me, once ZR will be completed, Lelouch and Suzaku will disappear (hence the saraba Lelouch, saraba Suzaku). So she would have to get to Lelouch before the completion of ZR.

[metronome]

actually, to me, the suzaku 's "live on" geass is like seed mode from gundam seed(with twist and additional adrenaline to survive)

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by Baixinho

When did he say that? And what did he mean by it? If Zero Requiem includes all he has been doing since episode 22, he may have meant that Suzaku had to stay alive for the last battle.

Now Lelouch may be a smart cookie but I highly doubt he can plan THAT far ahead in time.

The episode summary is very vague, I don't know how you can conclude from it that they will necessarily have to be together or to do something together in the very end. We can only conclude from it that they made a promise, and that they will make their farewell.

Uh yeah we know they made that promise like since episode 22....

Please, mind that I am not saying that Suzaku is not needed, just that we can't be sure that he is.

What? All based on a freakin Gumline that could easily be said after everything's been dealt with? This gumline seems more like something said after she's calmed down which she hasn't.

I don't think he will die on the battle field, don't worry. I just think that Kallen may get through him, maybe just for a few minutes.

Yes and watch Albion grab and drag her screaming back into a hole in the ground.

[Amaterasu Gate]

That gumline is all Kallen and to a lesser extent her supporters have at this point Darkness

[Baixinho]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

Now Lelouch may be a smart cookie but I highly doubt he can plan THAT far ahead in time.

Huh?
The plan did begin at the Ashford academy, and he knew about Damocles. Do yo really think that he didn't plan ahead to fight Schneizel? Even I could have forshadowed it

Uh yeah we know they made that promise like since episode 22....



What? All based on a freakin Gumline that could easily be said after everything's been dealt with? This gumline seems more like something said after she's calmed down which she hasn't.



Yes and watch Albion grab and drag her screaming back into a hole in the ground.

Yes, we know about the promise since ep 22. But what does it change to the fact that the summary is vague?

Concerning the gumline, it's actually the opposite : the use of the word aishiteru points rather to a very emotionally intense context. And from the summary, I get that once Suzaku and Lelouch will have completed the ZR, they will disappear. So to me, she needs to see him before the completion of ZR.

Please, no need to go that mad just because I said that imo it's Kallen who has a slight plot advantage. It's just an opinion, please calm down.

Anyway, we'll know soon enough now.


If you want I also replied to your last post about the dialogue between Suzaku and Lelouch in my previous post.

[Freya]

So who thinks Lelouch is going to die?

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by Baixinho

Please, no need to go that mad just because I said that imo it's Kallen who has a slight plot advantage. It's just an opinion, please calm down.

No I get annoyed when people start using "Ifs" and "maybes" in order to support their argument because then anyone can argue the direct opposite and you don't even need any facts to back it up.

But what does it change to the fact that the summary is vague?

What's so vague about it? They are enacting the plan together and say their farewells. What's so hard to understand?

And from the summary, I get that once Suzaku and Lelouch will have completed the ZR, they will disappear. So to me, she needs to see him before the completion of ZR.

Which I've already pointed out the gumline can be said after the whole fight's been done and everything's calmed down because I do not see Kallen saying it if she breaks through Suzaku in that rage.

[zalem]

Originally Posted by Freya

So who thinks Lelouch is going to die?

After them bringing back Cornelia and Guilford solely to give them their happy ending I'm starting to think they don't have the guts to kill off any of the major characters. At most, maybe Toudou will die or some other unimportant characters. Lelouch will likely just go off into the sunset.

That "Continued Story" from the OST just screams epilogue to me and since that music is fairly positive, I'm guessing we're getting a somewhat happy end at least.

[Baixinho]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

No I get annoyed when people start using "Ifs" and "maybes" in order to support their argument because then anyone can argue the direct opposite and you don't even need any facts to back it up.

But I don't know how one can possibly make a speculation without using any if or maybe actually

And I think I based my arguments on facts from the show actually, so I think you're not being very fair with me here.

What's so vague about it? They are enacting the plan together and say their farewells. What's so hard to understand?

What is vague about it is that it tells us pretty much nothing about what is going to happen
The fact that they did all this for their prmoise does not mean necessarily that Kallen will not win against Suzaku. And the context where they say their farewells is completely unknown.

Which I've already pointed out the gumline can be said after the whole fight's been done and everything's calmed down because I do not see Kallen saying it if she breaks through Suzaku in that rage.

As I already told you, the aishiteru (I love you) is a word that is used in Japanese under very rare circumstances, and it would need a situation quite emotionally intense for Kallen to say it. So it would rather points to her emotional state at the beginning of the episode than to when she has calmed down.
Also as I said, the farewell Lelouch, farewell Suzaku from the summary makes me think that once ZR will complete, Lelouch and Suzaku will disappear : they will not have time to say their goodbyes. So in that case, when would Kallen have the time to say her line to Lelouch once ZR is completed?

Ans also, see here you're saying that her line can be said after everything calmed down. It's the same kind of argument than me saying that Suzaku may not need to get back to Lelouch. So if you're allowed to tell me based on nothing but opinion that there is another scenario possible than the one I have in my mind, it would also be fair that I am allowed to say there is a possible scenario different than the one in your mind. Don't you agree?

[Guilford]

Originally Posted by zalem

At most, maybe Toudou will die or some other unimportant characters.

Toudou was last seen in "his girl's arms" so I guess he won't die... His Zangetsu is destroyed, so what should be do? Ougi might have a chance to die since we don't know what he is doing right now and he was talking about having to take the responsibilty...

[zalem]

Ah, that's right Ougi keeps spewing that crap about how since he acknowledged Zero he has to take responsibility...so he is another one that could die. But he is currently out of commission because the BK ship was shot down. He was still on it last we saw. Though I suppose he could get on a spare Knightmare and get into the battle.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by zalem

After them bringing back Cornelia and Guilford solely to give them their happy ending I'm starting to think they don't have the guts to kill off any of the major characters. At most, maybe Toudou will die or some other unimportant characters. Lelouch will likely just go off into the sunset.

That "Continued Story" from the OST just screams epilogue to me and since that music is fairly positive, I'm guessing we're getting a somewhat happy end at least.

I am with you their, the only really important character to die was Euphemia. I can't imagine anyone else dying since Sunrise hasn't had the guts in a while.

There's only 6 conceivable who can die: Lelouch, Nunally, Kanon, Schneizel, Suzaku, and Kallen.

The only people I can see dying is Kanon.

[demon_god04]

Originally Posted by zalem

After them bringing back Cornelia and Guilford solely to give them their happy ending I'm starting to think they don't have the guts to kill off any of the major characters. At most, maybe Toudou will die or some other unimportant characters. Lelouch will likely just go off into the sunset.

That "Continued Story" from the OST just screams epilogue to me and since that music is fairly positive, I'm guessing we're getting a somewhat happy end at least.

Cornelia and Guilford were hardly Major Characters. Cornelia have not really done anything of note this season, other then some cool moments that have the fans screaming. At this rate, I dunno if they even have the guts to kill off Tamaki...

[Shuuda]

Originally Posted by Charred Knight

I am with you their, the only really important character to die was Euphemia. I can't imagine anyone else dying since Sunrise hasn't had the guts in a while.

There's only 6 conceivable who can die: Lelouch, Nunally, Kanon, Schneizel, Suzaku, and Kallen.

The only people I can see dying is Kanon.

If I did not know better (which I do not actually) I'd say you only watch this show in the hopes of some bloodbath, in which case you may as well just piss off and stop being an annoying little worm, since some of us people care more about just how many people have died.

Oh, and you forgot about Shirley, V.V., Charles and his bitch.

[lade]

The emphasis on her gumline is over exaggerated, can't she learn the truth from others after ZR is completed like from sayoko delivering his true feelings to her as his final tetament if he does die completing Zr or must disappear, why the need to see him. She isn't that important to the plot and her having her way at this critical juncture can only result in the failure of ZR, It would serve no purpose but to leave a bad taste in the mouth of many fans , That after overcoming all odds , Lelouch and suzaku fell to kallen

No she will be defeated and find out the truth from others or through their actions.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Amaterasu Gate

No I'm not your assuming Kallen's unstoppable which is not the case in battle so you believe that since she has a superior stance he'll have to resort o using it and clearly your making Bismarck seem weaker than he is.

You're missing the point entirely. Suzaku had a ninth generation frame. This is why Bismarck used his Geass. He could not keep up. Kallen has a ninth generation frame. He could still not keep up. It has nothing to do with this stance BS you're trying to create.

Originally Posted by lade

The emphasis on her gumline is over exaggerated, can't she learn the truth from others after ZR is completed like from sayoko delivering his true feelings to her as his final tetament if he does die completing Zr or must disappear, why the need to see him. She isn't that important to the plot and her having her way at this critical juncture can only result in the failure of ZR, It would serve no purpose but to leave a bad taste in the mouth of many fans , That after overcoming all odds , Lelouch and suzaku fell to kallen

No she will be defeated and find out the truth from others or through their actions.

Just because Suzaku falls does not mean Kallen will kill Lelouch. She's already suffering over the thought of it. Given the opportunity, and some words from Lelouch, she will not go through with it.