2012-12-31, 19:14 | Link #1262 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
|
Quote:
Anyhow, my point really is that all anime requires a high degree of technical skill to reach its potential as a medium. For SoL, everything is hitting the right emotional registers and atmospherics, and animation is a crucial part of that, because the visuals must match the writing, music, and voice acting. I can't agree that Kyoani is somehow wasting it's animation chops on SoL shows where animation is somehow less important. |
|
2012-12-31, 23:19 | Link #1263 |
Anime Snark
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Singapore
Age: 41
|
The thing is, we have seen what KyoAni is capable of in animating an action-heavy anime. Two things are preventing them from doing so again.
1) Lackluster sales, although this could be due to lack of marketing. KyoAni didn't really reach the status of "Global-Midas" till SHnY. 2) The people in KyoAni personally stated that they found it challenging to animate action mecha, but considering the resultant quality... you could argue that it wasn't wasted effort AT ALL. If re-released today, it would still beat the tar out of most current anime in technical merit. ~~~~ ~~~~ Also, it's kinda like the episode from Hyouka... about "expectations". In particular, the Student President who was a genius artist, but only did one manga before calling it quits. He doesn't actually /like/ doing it, but hot damn was he talented at it. So while we get watered down versions from other studios, this particular darn studio refuses to do any more. We bay for more, but the answer is no, and we whinge about it. Cheers.
__________________
|
2013-01-01, 01:13 | Link #1264 | |
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
|
Quote:
They haven't done anything action oriented. I personally like that. KyoAni isn't ONLY skilled as animation, they have a lot of skill with creating atmosphere and manipulating emotions, both of which tend to take back seat to raw animation quality in more action oriented shows. |
|
2013-01-01, 01:37 | Link #1265 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Subjugating animation to the perceived "necessity" of it by certain genres is a limited mindset. Animation, be it acting, action choreography, abstract or whatever, can and will shape the perception of any work. Kyoani's anime are not top sellers because of some unspoken magic, they're top sellers (partly) because they're leagues beyond most other productions in the technical department, and this carries over to how the viewers perceive characters and situations. If people over at Kyoani weren't so dedicated to character acting animation, their characters wouldn't feel half as real and charming as they do. I know I certainly wouldn't care for something like Hyouka if it was a throwaway production with barely any expression and two standard face poses for every character.
|
2013-01-01, 01:38 | Link #1266 | |
Anime Snark
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Singapore
Age: 41
|
Quote:
Yes. I know. There's mecha in Chuunibyou's DVD extras. It mocks me.
__________________
|
|
2013-01-01, 09:39 | Link #1268 | ||
Senior Member
Author
|
Quote:
A lot of the animation in Nichijou is great (at least at a purely technical level), but much of it is hardly realistic. I mean, there's insane sci-fi-esque stuff going on in Nichijou, which means that "realism" isn't exactly the aim here. You're right that there's often a suspension of disbelief with action anime, but that certainly doesn't mean that people don't want to be left in awe by the action-y visuals. And leaving people in awe of the action-y visuals is at least partly a matter of animation quality. When I hear fellow anime fans talk about their favorite anime action scenes, 9 times out of 10 a well-beloved action scene also has above average (if not downright great) animation. And the action scenes that people dislike are often marred by cheap animation (this being the key reason why people disliked that scene). But when fellow anime fans talk about their favorite anime romance scenes, or their favorite anime character drama scenes, or their favorite slice of life scenes, the animation quality of the scenes in question are more variable. Here's the reason why - For action scenes, the quality of the visuals is obviously key. But for other types of scenes, something else (such as the dialogue, or the BGM) may be what's key. Good animation can help everywhere, but it is essential in great action scenes. I certainly appreciate what KyoAni did with Hyouka, but I'd probably appreciate even more KyoAni pulling that quality of animation off with, say, a property like Kara no Kyoukai. Quote:
Plenty of action oriented shows are great at creating atmosphere and manipulating emotions. Gurren Lagann resulted in more than a few manly tears being shed, and there are plenty of other mecha shows with lots of great atmosphere and very emotional moments. But probably the key series to list here is Madoka Magica, an anime show widely praised for its frequently great atmosphere and very emotional moments. And before anybody questions if Madoka Magica is an action oriented show or not, here is something to keep in mind: Each and every episode of Madoka Magica had at least one scene of combat in it. And many of Madoka Magica's episodes had heavy quantities of combat and/or had its key moments be action scenes. Proof of my statements in spoiler space below Spoiler for Madoka Magica action scenes, very spoileriffic:
Now, after reading the above... Can you imagine what an equally action-packed KyoAni-made magical girl show would look like? Now that would be interesting to see, wouldn't it?!
__________________
|
||
2013-01-01, 13:17 | Link #1269 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Why are action sequences so important? Good animation is good animation, regardless of everything else. It's okay if 80% of the fandom doesn't care for animation and only thinks of it in regards of how it affects the narrative, but for people that appreciate animation purely as a craft, there's not a problem with what Kyoani animates. To be certain, they're the only studio that truly focuses on minute character acting in TV anime, and they've been setting the standard for it since at least Clannad. There are action-focused studios, BONES for example. There are mecha-focused studios, Sunrise. So why should we criticize Kyoani for what they don't do, instead of appreciating what they do (which is a unique feat)? It's a double standard I see everywhere and it stems from the fact that most western fans have a prejudice against low-key stories or, how they call it, "moeshit". BONES and Gainax are (were) okay at always doing the same and always animating the same stuff, because that stuff has cred and is accepted as is. But when someone focuses on low-key animation and realistic expressions, instead of flashy Kanada-esque action full of impact poses and explosions, they get shit for it.
|
2013-01-01, 13:51 | Link #1270 | |
Me at work
|
Quote:
An episode like episode 4 of Shin Sekai Yori is fine already as it is,but put kyoani level realistic expression animation on it and it'd take another level. Same with Kara no Kyoukai,it has some action but what's it's really known for is being an atmospheric thriller,it could certainly use some Kyoani expression animation as well.
__________________
|
|
2013-01-01, 13:54 | Link #1271 | ||||
Senior Member
Author
|
Because many people find them entertaining in and of themselves? And if they're well-contextualized, people tend to love them even more?
Quote:
Quote:
With Nichijou, for example, I honestly think that it's explosive animation made some of its jokes less funny. Quote:
And I've read Sunrise get criticized for "only doing mecha" (which isn't exactly true, mind you, but I digress). So there's really no double-standard here. Quote:
Like totoum wrote, KyoAni has done wonders for a certain genre of anime - Why should the other genres get left out?
__________________
|
||||
2013-01-01, 17:58 | Link #1272 | ||
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 42
|
Quote:
Quote:
In the end, there's no prize awaiting Kyoto Animation if they branch out and explore all sorts of other genres, even though some people might wish they would just to see what would happen. It's not like they need to prove themselves or are looking for more work. If you think of Kyoto Animation as a community of artists, perhaps they're on a journey to perfect and refine their craft, and they're specializing in certain styles. The more they stay in that style (while still challenging themselves) the better they get at it, both in terms of time spent and quality achieved. You might even say that this mentality of perfecting an idea through countless iterations and refinements is a rather "Japanese" way of approaching the situation (whereas "pioneering/innovation" is a stereotypically-"American" approach).
__________________
|
||
2013-01-01, 20:06 | Link #1273 | ||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
|
Quote:
Quote:
I agree that action sequences rely more on animation than dialogue-driven scenes, but good character animation pays off, probably more than you think. Something like Letter to Momo would be a run of the mill mediocre movie if it weren't for Okiura making sure that every bit of movement felt as vivid as real life. There's a whole new layer of depth added when people pay close attention to what expressions their characters are making and why. Quote:
Quote:
They shouldn't. I said in this thread that I would love to see them branch out and play with settings, aesthetic styles and narratives. But that's purely a decision of the directors and producers. If they only want to make light-hearted shows, I can't fault the studio for always making the best of those shows. It's not that other genres are being 'left out' as if they are being refused the entrance to an elite club. |
||||
2013-01-06, 10:59 | Link #1274 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
|
Quote:
IIRC that mecha intensive episode(ep 4) choked them really hard in the production.. So Takemoto let Kigami cut any material off the script for that episode but alas, Kigami kept everything. Anyway this whole thing came from a thread regarding the TSR extras.
__________________
Last edited by rulfo; 2013-01-06 at 11:20. |
|
2013-01-06, 12:18 | Link #1275 | ||
Also a Lolicon
Join Date: Apr 2010
|
Quote:
Remember, Chuu2 had a lot of "fight" scenes and a lot of very important moments happened in them as well. A lot of Nichijyou gags relied on beautifully done over the top action. They are just action heavy, action scenes were numerous and were very important, but they aren't primarily about action. Quote:
-Nichijyou (comedy) -Hyouka (mystery/SoL) -Chuu2 (drama/romance) Nichjyou was completely new territory for KyoAni, Hyouka wasn't quite as bold, but still pretty experimental. It's not that KyoAni isn't giving other genres some love, it's just that said genres just aren't mecha and fighting. |
||
2013-01-07, 01:06 | Link #1276 | |||
Lets be reality
Join Date: May 2007
|
Quote:
Probably TSR being their worst selling series apart from Nichijyou (don't know if you can count Munto since the first half of it is the old OVAs anyway...) and that even if KyoAni did another season it wouldn't matter since there's so many more LNs after that. Same problem Spice and Wolf has, sure a 3rd season would be fantastic, problem is you would need 7 seasons since the first 2 only covered 4 out of 17 novels. Quote:
Quote:
Secondly in some ways yes, when some company produces one well produced and animated show (and I'm not even going to get into how they're nothing like KyoAni's level of animation) and people act like KyoAni have been equaled, it shows clear under appreciation.. like Jay-Z said "I held you down for 6 summers, damn, where's the love?". Last edited by Westlo; 2013-01-07 at 01:16. |
|||
2013-01-31, 08:44 | Link #1277 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Brazil
|
Randomly winging in here..
I have read, and a lot, regarding the Surprise 2013 project for Gatoh, and, ok, speculations and speculations. Does anyone have any news from a tweet, or anything at all from Aya Hirano regarding her project, or any statement regarding the Haruhi franchise? It's that 3 year time lapse again, if I'm not mistaken, wich means I sorta believe that a new season might be popping up, but I can't speculate more due to failing on japanese translation. |
2013-01-31, 09:04 | Link #1278 | |
Nyahahahaha♥
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2013-02-01, 08:29 | Link #1279 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Brazil
|
But considering all there is up to the moment (and most of all I've read of speculations around here and other sites), The probability of another season for Haruhi coming this year is pretty high, no? There's talk about the 3 year gap the series always had, and if I remember correctly this year is a 10 year anniversary for the franchise.
Anyway, I'm just one of these guys looking for more hope for this year, as the last 2 ones have been of complete void due to the animation, and I couldn't have myself migrating from the animated version to the Novels, sadly. |
2013-02-01, 09:17 | Link #1280 | |
Nyahahahaha♥
|
Quote:
You are correct that this year marks 10 years for the novels, but Kadokawa has already revealed two plans regarding publication promotions (new Ito artbook/collaboration with BakaTest). No further evidence has been given that leans towards a new season.
__________________
|
|
Tags |
studios |
|
|